Help With Registering Hits

cortex · July 2004

<div class="IPBDescription">D:</div> Is there anyway to prevent or reduce the chances of your hits to be ignored?

i.e you bite hear a sound but the marine doesnt take damage etc.

ive been having huge problems with registering my hits (mainly skulk bites) lately i hear the crunching sound of making contact with a marine yet they seem to take no damage. Yes i know it happens every now and again but 1 in every 2 rines i bite i get a non-rego <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' />

can anyone help ??/??

God_Killer · July 2004

Same thing here...it's annoying.

Later today I'll try messing with ex_interp settings in the config file...
Some ppl say ex_interp "0" makes better regestering of bites.

I'm kinda busy, but try <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />

Just add ex_interp "0" to your config.cfg or autoexec.cfg

DJ_Niems · July 2004

Could this be a result of the hitbox lag bug by any chance?

This also happens to me as rines with shotguns: point blanc shot into skulk in my face, blood, skulk pain, no dead skulk...

The biting thing happens when I got focus, and I bite a rine with lvl 1 armour, but just as i bite, he pops me with a shottie, I die and he takes no damage, but this only really happens when I have a higher ping than him.

Hmmm, maybe this will be fixed in the new patch???

btw I think this topic needs to be moved to support -->

ekent · July 2004

I've found that changing the ex_extrapmax value to a higher value than the default makes a big difference in NS. This is particularly true on servers where you ping 100-150. I set mine at 2.5 but I move it down to 1.5 on servers where I ping under 70.

This value may be too high for you if you have a better ISP, though.

stingavandal · July 2004

whats ex_extrapmax?

cortex · July 2004

ya, an explanation of ex_extramax would be useful.. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />

and yes i also get shotgun problems some of the time but not as often <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />

i was already using ex_interp 0, it helped but not alot <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' />

crypt · July 2004

A higher ex_extrapmax will smooth the movement of models more, this is needed to compensate a low ex_interp setting, so ppl will not look that laggy. The problem is, that the hitbox will not be more accurate (if you set low ex_interp/high cl_updaterate and ex_extrapmax to 0 you'll see why you hardy hit anything on most servers). If you use a really high ex_extrapmax setting yyou'll not see if a players is lagging or not.
My suggestion is to try out values between 0.5 and 2 for ex_extrapmax (I'm using 1.2 atm).

cortex · July 2004

thnx crypt, appreciated <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />

Dantemss · July 2004

What exactly is the benefit of trading interpolation for extrapolation? (lol)

cortex · July 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>What exactly is the benefit of trading interpolation for extrapolation? (lol) </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

wth is that supposed to mean? D":

BulletHead · July 2004

You don't have to understand it... just do it... lol

Pithlit · July 2004

So may someone post the EXACT text that should be pasted in the config?
Im getting trroubles with the " and whatnot

stingavandal · August 2004

someone answer the poor boy!

cortex · August 2004

O.o how are you meant to "lag hitboxes" and if you can how do you set it up soe the hitboxes are where they should be ? :/

Lito · August 2004

'Lagged hitboxes' are a result of:
1. You fiddling with the interp settings
2. Major lag.
3. PSHB

1. If you set your interp settings too high/low, the interpretation of the hitbox in relevance with the model will not be syncronized, and will make you miss alot of hits that you thought you landed on the model, when the hitbox is farther ahead of it.

2. Lag is basically the same idea, but instead of the interp settings, the lagger is not sending information to the server fast enough to get an acurate reading on its precise location, and you get a tele-skulk/marine. Or the player lags little enough for the server to get a precise position, but since he still lags, the hitbox may not be exactly where the model is.

3. If the player is the last slot on the server, s/he is most likely bugged. the hitbox is AHEAD of the model. Of course, this doesn't matter if you are infront or behind the person, but if s/he starts side-steping around you, s/he becomes harder to hit. This makes aliens much harder to kill due to their speed, and marines much harder to bite when they circle straife

first one is obvious, set the interp settings in accordance to your connection/computer speed.

second one is to get a better connection/join a server with better ping if you're lagging, or just leave the server if someone else is lagging.

third one you can't really do anything about it unless you have a server that has the PSHB fix (which is really just a plugin that blocks the last slot; you can just add another slot onto the server and make it invisible and it essentially does the same thing), and wait for the steam PSHB fix.

Necrosis · August 2004

A good tip is just to lead your target a little, that is, aim a little in front of wherever its going.

Second, know where you're meant to shoot -

<a href='http://www.clandlc.com/Articles/NaturalSelectionDissection' target='_blank'>http://www.clandlc.com/Articles/NaturalSelectionDissection</a>

To be honest it breaks down like this -

Skulk - Hindquarters
Gorge - Big fat hindquarters
Lerk - Big fat body
Fade - Ignore the head and aim for the lower torso
Onos - Squarely in the middle

Now, I THINK those problems were fixed long ago, but it won't hurt to focus on those areas. Ignore the damage scale stuff, just learn the boxes. Remember than it'll change if your firing from another angle than the side, so always be aware of where your shots will "pass through", ie shooting an onos from the front you want to aim right between its eyes because the shots will pass through the middle.

Again, this is very likely obsolete info, but I use it and it works, so I can't complain. If you're having trouble hitting despite aiming at these spots, then simply aim a little forward in the direction of travel, ie you're shooting at Onos from the side as it passes from left to right. You would aim at its shoulders, so that you've the most amount of leeway in case of lag (if you aim at the shoulders then you can lag a shot all the way to the back of the hitbox, whereas if you aim at the middle or rear of the hitbox you've more chance of a laggy miss).

Practice practice practice.

Cypher · August 2004

Yeah, that link is way out of date Hitbox wise, as well as the obvious stuff...

Im pretty sure every single one of those hitboxes have been changed, except maybe the gorge

stingavandal · August 2004

how do you go about adjusitng it anyways? figuring whats right for you

degamer106 · August 2004

OK HERE IT IS..first you need a decent connection i.e. cable modem//dsl//college internet connection (t1-t3). When you ping servers look for the ones with the LEAST latency and select that one. You'll get the most hit registries the lower your ping is i think..

Necrosis · August 2004

You failed to answer his question degamer, that was a pointless post.

Stinga, you find out by trial and error. It'll alter depending on whats happening onscreen, whats happening to the server, what the ping of the other players are, if anyone is hitbox bugged, etc.

Play around with it and see what works best. Alternatively, dont.

degamer106 · August 2004

all i have to say is this hitbox issue is just some simple excuse that people make up to accomodate for their crappy connection or their aim.

HarmlessCreature · August 2004

On my basis of halflife netcode based games I have come to following things. You should chek your framerate and compare it to cl_cmdrate. The netcode in NS&HL&CS etc games is following: host computer sends own data to the server to analyze was the "shot/bite" a hit. This is done by sending "frame data" to the server, which locked on the cl_cmdrate, now if you have cl_cmdrate 20, and have fps constantly at 100... well, you get the idea. There is a chance that your having a bad timing on this, though it is a quite small change afterall, but anyway, it MIGHT happen.. and this is very frustrating with focus bite.

so you should check your cl_cmdrate and compare it to your framerate..

another change here is packetloss, the data you send to server might just be lost, so, to resolve this is to check your net activity, net_graph. Adjusting your rate (depending your netspeed, this should be quite high) cl_cmdrate (around your fps), and cl_updaterate. The idea here is to keep the "green line" (indicate good connection) as straight as it can be. Lowering cl_updaterate should help on this one, but you might want to consider lowering your max fps&cl_cmdrate too (this is true, sorry but without prober net connection, you might want to choke your computer a bit, or the data it's sending just wont get there without dataloss)

these COULD help, but they wont/cant remove a bad netconnection.. but I hope there was some use of this. for example, I have cable connection, I use rate 10000-40000 depending whether I play on my homecountry servers, or foreing, cl_cmdrate 100, cl_updaterate 70. I have a rather good&reliable&fast network connection... well...

oh and another thing, ex_interp means that how much the lag will compensate. Because you receive player movement on packets, depending how fast your net is and how often the packets will come (updaterate!!) the characters move on your screen. ex_interp compensates the lag, so that the running would look smooth instead choppy running with a bit lag, I hope you get the idea.

ex_interp as 0 might help a bit, but I dont recommend it, since it's set to default value on steam (NS is a 3rd party game, so it doesnt really affect on it... YET) so dont get too used to it, I suggest you leave it be, because, anyway.. it's not a much of a change.

well, I hope I could help someone with this... it's a bit messy, I know.. but it's 6.30am <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /> well, GL and happy hunting to everyone

degamer106 · August 2004

just get a decent internet connection and a good computer with a really good graphics card. and stop manipulating in-game variables.

HarmlessCreature · August 2004

even if you have very good net/comp/graphcard/all, it never does harm to tune up a little, to take it all of the game. More is better, heh <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />

seriously, there is nothing wrong within tuning the settings a bit, it only takes a bit of a time, and almost <-- NOTICE! ALMOST everybody does it anyway (yea, you and your friend doesnt, that still doesnt make you almost everybody, now does it?)

so feel free to tune in, it's more fun to play anyway to have NOT missed bites due packetloss or unsended framedata.. aye?

Lito · August 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (degamer106 @ Aug 5 2004, 10:29 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> just get a decent internet connection and a good computer with a really good graphics card. and stop manipulating in-game variables.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Yet another quality post.

You do realise that some of us don't live on the support of others, right? People like that need to work hard just to have a roof to cover their head much less a decent internet connection and computer.

Manipulating variables helps low-end computers play ns as smooth as possible. My computers are constantly 4 years behind. NS eats up my memory. Thats right; all 128 MB of it. Tweaking the variables are all I got.

Necrosis · August 2004

I'm with Lito, some games are very tough to run on my pc since I had to downgrade my card. Cvar tweaks make things easier, give me better performance, and cost nothing.

Who's the bigger nub? Person spending x amount of money on a card he can't get the most out of, or someone conserving their cash and getting as much out of the card as possible?

Insomnia · August 2004

here. It will help you, but its not really worth it. I'll explain why

first check what ur cl_updaterate is. Lets just say its 30 for now.
next u have to set ur ex_interp
so type this
ex_interp #; alias ex_interp
# = 1 divided by cl_updaterate.
so if ur cl_updaterate is 30 u would type in
ex_interp 0.033; alias ex_interp

What this does is really helps ur melee attacks. Virtually all ur bites should start hitting. However, ur gorge spit, and fade acid rocket will be way way off.

However, when u set up ex_interp like this, u cannot change it again unless u exit NS and restart it. So lets say you play aliens for one round. now if you want to play marines next round you must restart natural selection and rejoin serever then join marines. If you do not, all ur bullets will miss.

When you restart NS the ex_interp setting will reset to default.

Sarisel · August 2004

I usually tell people to refer to this old but still useful guide.

<a href='http://ucguides.savagehelp.com/ConnectionFAQ/Halflife.htm' target='_blank'>HL Connection Tweaks</a>

Don't listen to garbage people say about boosting your cl_updaterate and cl_cmdrate to insanely high values. Most servers put a cap on updates and otherwise you're needlessly saturating your connection with wonderful choke/lag that you cannot handle.

The guide doesn't mention ex_interp, which basically determines how much interpolation is done between server updates that you receive. Ideal setting is 1/cl_updaterate, which would get you to see only true frames. Unfortunately, this is quite choppy because you do not get enough updates from the server.

It also does not mention ex_extrapmax. This determines how much extrapolation is done when there is no available end position for a moving object/player. In other words, if a new update from the server has not been received yet, the game will try to predict for a given amount of time where something will end up. Boosting this can help smooth things out if you have low ex_interp settings.

<a href='http://www.gpforums.co.nz/showthread.php?threadid=180547' target='_blank'>Some useless junk, but has ex_interp and ex_extrapmax in it.</a>

Currently, in NS, the setting is locked to 0.1 whenever you enter a game. There is a way to work around it. Create a file called autoexec.cfg in your nsp directory and put the following lines into it (x is the value you want):

ex_interp "x"
alias ex_interp

You might also want to add your cl_updaterate, cl_cmdrate, and rate settings in autoexec.cfg because HL has a tendency to reset these on special occasions, such as when you join a HLTV server.

If you're preaching default settings, then consider that the default settings are not even adequate for a 56k modem. Personally, my philosophy is that if I shoot something with true aim, my bullets should register. Don't agree? What do I care? Knowledge for the masses.

There are a lot of sources out there that can serve as guides for HL connection tweaks. Just look for them.

HarmlessCreature · August 2004

the ex_interp is locked, and no one shouldnt try to bypass it, leave it as it is. It has SOME effect, I admit, but you can do much more on proper treating on other variables, which ARENT locked.

Interrupting ex_interp is (IF I remember correct) is forbidden on league games etc. so really, there is no point to change that variable.

Like I posted a few posts up, you can affect your game play on UNLOCKED things, like rate, cl_cmdrate, cl_updaterate etc... you need to fix those settings to the net_graph 1 (1 is most informative of them, so use it)

crypt · August 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Interrupting ex_interp is (IF I remember correct) is forbidden on league games etc. so really, there is no point to change that variable.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Only in CS leagues, because they think it is unfair if someone has more accurate models/hitboxes than someone with default values (of course they dont say it like that <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' />)

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>You should check your framerate and compare it to cl_cmdrate</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> From everything I heard this is defenatly a rumour. Just higher your updaterate as high as you connection can provide. for my broadband connection (DSL) this is 101.

HarmlessCreature · August 2004

cl_cmdrate is determinating the amount of your data (fps-packets) to be sended, you can send more frame-packets than you actually have ofcourse, but there is really no point in there. I think you mean cl_updaterate, that should be as high as your net allows it to be... but as said before (many times <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /> ) cl_cmdrate should be something like your FPS is...

hmm, let me think an example.. well, this is a VERY VERY bulky explanation of cl_cmdrate, so dont flame too much about it, but it'll give you an idea... you have constantly about 100fps on the game (or 99) and your cl_cmdrate is 20. Okay, this means that you send to the server a datapackets, which include data of 20 frames (while yourself have 100 frames per second).. this still doesnt mean that you dont send the data of the 80 FPS, it's not true, because it aint that simple, but it is TRUE that SOME information is NEVER sended to the server, this might include your focus bite, sg-shot, etc..

ofc, it doesnt harm that you have high cmdrate, if your network can handle it, but alas, many players doesnt have that kind of network.. so that's why it's important to not oversend data then..

yet still about the ex_interp, okay, I wasnt sure of it on NS, but it's STILL a locked fuction, which can though easily to be bypassed... but I'm sure, that it will be locked much better in the future... and isnt that kinda wrong to do? I mean, it's locked for some reason, so let it be. okay? <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /> happy hunting all <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif' />

Help With Registering Hits

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