Is It Me Or Did Hitbox Lag Get A Bit Worse.
Emanon
Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16254Members, Constellation
Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16254Members, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">Try to be serious</div> First off lets remove the comments of things like my aim or just calling me a plain noob cause I am a fairly experienced NS player.
I was wondering if anyone else has noticed that it is a bit harder to hit skulks and lerks now. Im finding that what should be a direct hit only lands 2 or 3 pellets unless the alien player comes directly towards you.
I just want some input from other experienced/cal players.
What I have tried is various combinations of the following:
Default ex_interp and connection settings.
Then
ex_interp all the way from 0.1 to 0.03
cl_cmdrate from 50-100
cl_updaterate from 50-100
No choke or loss problems and these setting were tested on a server that runs at 150fps and doesnt limit any network settings.
This problem wasn't as noticable in beta 4a, and it was identified by the NS dev's, as it was recieved partial blame for the delay of beta 5 according to the front page.
If you are not experiencing these problems would you be kind enough to post your network settings that you have changed it would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Emanon
I was wondering if anyone else has noticed that it is a bit harder to hit skulks and lerks now. Im finding that what should be a direct hit only lands 2 or 3 pellets unless the alien player comes directly towards you.
I just want some input from other experienced/cal players.
What I have tried is various combinations of the following:
Default ex_interp and connection settings.
Then
ex_interp all the way from 0.1 to 0.03
cl_cmdrate from 50-100
cl_updaterate from 50-100
No choke or loss problems and these setting were tested on a server that runs at 150fps and doesnt limit any network settings.
This problem wasn't as noticable in beta 4a, and it was identified by the NS dev's, as it was recieved partial blame for the delay of beta 5 according to the front page.
If you are not experiencing these problems would you be kind enough to post your network settings that you have changed it would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Emanon
Comments
Config is the same as in beta 4, so I've got no clue what the problem is.
the old crosshair was realigned but the position of the pellets hasn't changed, I have been using the same crosshair pre and post beta 5 made by <span style='color:green'>TyrNemesis^</span>
I noticed skulks are harder to hit from head on, I shoot at their head, but it does not seem to work.
I was wondering if anyone else has noticed that it is a bit harder to hit skulks and lerks now. Im finding that what should be a direct hit only lands 2 or 3 pellets unless the alien player comes directly towards you.
I just want some input from other experienced/cal players.
What I have tried is various combinations of the following:
Default ex_interp and connection settings.
Then
ex_interp all the way from 0.1 to 0.03
cl_cmdrate from 50-100
cl_updaterate from 50-100
No choke or loss problems and these setting were tested on a server that runs at 150fps and doesnt limit any network settings.
This problem wasn't as noticable in beta 4a, and it was identified by the NS dev's, as it was recieved partial blame for the delay of beta 5 according to the front page.
If you are not experiencing these problems would you be kind enough to post your network settings that you have changed it would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Emanon <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your using the wrong values for those ex_interp.
Try using correct values
Ex_interp .02 = cl_updaterate 50 cl_cmdrate 50
Ex_interp .01 = cl_updaterate 100 cl_cmdrate 100
you'll also have to adjust your ex_extrapmax value so the players are correctly shown and smoother
Session Start: Wed Sep 08 19:00:58 2004
Session Ident: #naturalselection
...
(19:17:41) (@PS_M|BreakfastCoffeeShower) I'm personally quite fond of the uninformed and highy biased complaints
(19:17:48) (briktal|sexyb5party) you are the first person I've found, today at least, to be complaining about skulks being super hard to kill
(19:18:10) (briktal|sexyb5party) and not like that in previous versions
(19:18:24) (+supernorn) psst. Its because he hasnt learnt how to shoot such a fast moving target yet.
...
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
-What I was greeted with after mentioning this in #naturalselection
What is the sparks bug? I'm not that old to the community.
Head on shots are easy, when they are strafing and bhopping like mad is slightly more difficult. I've missed a couple gorge kills that look like the pellets connected with the phattey.
Fades? No problems there
Onoses are to big to miss.
Lorks? Haven't seen any in a while, actaully. I've heard the comm yell "HA at base, no more spore worries" so I guess they still exist.
ex_interp 0.02 and 0.01
updaterate and cmdrate of 50 and 100
and then adjusting ex_extrapmax accordingly and couldnt get anything smooth enough to play.
Anything sub 0.03 isnt smooth enough.
IDK, why do I have to play with all these obscure settings anyhow. I really shouldnt have to. (sorry, it's late and im tired)
In beta 4a ex_interp 0.06 worked flawlessly and thats all i had to change.
IMO this should be #1 on the priority list for the devs as it effects everything, from ability to enjoy the game to adverse effects on balance. No sense balancing a game that relys on such problems as this. Although it as come a long way and congrats on that!
all in all a nice patch (as long as you dont play Co on servers with much more than 20 player slots).
Session Start: Wed Sep 08 19:00:58 2004
Session Ident: #naturalselection
...
(19:17:41) (@PS_M|BreakfastCoffeeShower) I'm personally quite fond of the uninformed and highy biased complaints
(19:17:48) (briktal|sexyb5party) you are the first person I've found, today at least, to be complaining about skulks being super hard to kill
(19:18:10) (briktal|sexyb5party) and not like that in previous versions
(19:18:24) (+supernorn) psst. Its because he hasnt learnt how to shoot such a fast moving target yet.
...
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
-What I was greeted with after mentioning this in #naturalselection <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
gg arrogant twats. I noticed this problem too.
actually I noticed that when I shot at them the sparks would appear on the floor behind them but not actually hit them.
Ive seen a **** load of players complaining about dodgy registery since beta5.
I just chalked it up to having my ha.. uuhhh.. scripts removed (well, lambert and 3jump).
Oddity to the max. :I
Whilst i have nothing to add to this thread i'm just posting in the hope that a big thread with a lot of people saying they're having issues will get noticed and maybe FINALLY this problem can be solved.
I was wondering if anyone else has noticed that it is a bit harder to hit skulks and lerks now. Im finding that what should be a direct hit only lands 2 or 3 pellets unless the alien player comes directly towards you.
I just want some input from other experienced/cal players.
What I have tried is various combinations of the following:
Default ex_interp and connection settings.
Then
ex_interp all the way from 0.1 to 0.03
cl_cmdrate from 50-100
cl_updaterate from 50-100
No choke or loss problems and these setting were tested on a server that runs at 150fps and doesnt limit any network settings.
This problem wasn't as noticable in beta 4a, and it was identified by the NS dev's, as it was recieved partial blame for the delay of beta 5 according to the front page.
If you are not experiencing these problems would you be kind enough to post your network settings that you have changed it would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Emanon<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
By default, Half life uses very low rates, because it's prediction is designed for slow moving objects, for shooters like cs and hldm, basically avg 200 units. Now, we move to a game like ns, where we have fades and skulks that move at nearly 3 times that, theres obviously going to be a lot of difference between what the server will see and what the client will see. Now, what causes this difference between what, X the server sees, and Y, what the client sees?
<i>*Also, when you hear the sound of your shot hitting something, it means your client saw you hit it, but the server didn't.</i>
<!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->*Maximum rates you are able to use by the default server.cfg/calns.cfg*
cl_updaterate 30
cl_cmdrate 100*
rate 10000
Even if you use 100, 50 or whatever, all that is ignored, only the maximum set by the server are used.
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
<!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->Line taken from calns.cfg *note cl_maxupdaterate is left at default, which is 30*
sv_minrate 2000
sv_maxrate 10000
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
So, we have the default server config, or the cal config, both are pretty close rate wise, both use almost the default half life rates. This is the problem, we are using rates from nearly 4-5 years ago, with a game that doesn't fit into the prediction rules of regular half life. This leads to things like, 2 mile away bites, shots going through other players, bites going through players, etc. So how do we fix the difference between what we see Y, and what the server sees X, we increase the rates. Increasing the maximum rates allows the client to update to the server more often, thus giving a much more accurate picture of what the server is seeing.
Now lets take a look at the cs cal config
<!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->hostname "CAL CS Match Server"
sv_maxupdaterate 100
sv_minupdaterate 20
sv_maxrate 25000
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
These are the highest server rates possible, now, it's true cs doesn't use nearly as many resources as ns does, but even a 3-4 year old game uses the maximum rates. Not all servers may be able to use these rates as they may tax the server too much bandwidth wise, but ns with these rates makes the game 10 times more playable.
<i>*There is also cl_cmdrate, which is server-side FPS based, it should be set to the number of fps the server is getting, which should almost always be 100, unless the server is just terrible. If you set cmdrate too high, or above the server fps, you will get server-side choke, meaning the server cannot update as fast you are requesting</i>
Session Start: Wed Sep 08 19:00:58 2004
Session Ident: #naturalselection
...
(19:17:41) (@PS_M|BreakfastCoffeeShower) I'm personally quite fond of the uninformed and highy biased complaints
(19:17:48) (briktal|sexyb5party) you are the first person I've found, today at least, to be complaining about skulks being super hard to kill
(19:18:10) (briktal|sexyb5party) and not like that in previous versions
(19:18:24) (+supernorn) psst. Its because he hasnt learnt how to shoot such a fast moving target yet.
...
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
-What I was greeted with after mentioning this in #naturalselection <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
gg arrogant twats. I noticed this problem too. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
The funny part is, they are absolutely terrible players, much worse than your average pubber
I know this was supposed to be fixed (or rather "improved"), but I don't know what's going on otherwise.
I know this was supposed to be fixed (or rather "improved"), but I don't know what's going on otherwise.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, the last slot bug hasn't been totally fixed, I've seen bugged players with the last slot.
I guess I didn't really explain the whole purpose behind my earlier post, basically I was explaining why HL's prediction doesn't work as well for ns as it does other mods(unless you have an extremely low ping, around 10-40 ping, which even then it can differ greatly sometimes). And, it's because of the speed of the objects in ns.
Having cl_maxupdaterate and maxrate low is a bad thing, because you update the position of the object from the server, now with 30 it only updates every so often, so we have to end up using client-side prediction on the object to guess where it's going. With ns, unlike mods like cs, objects can move <i>a lot</i> before the next update.
Hrm I'll try my best to draw it
X = what server actually sees.
Y = where the client updates from the server.
- = client's guessed path between each update.
Lets use a moving(leaping) skulk for example
<!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->Server
X X X X
X X X X
X X X X X X X X
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
<!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1--> Client
-Y----Y-
--Y --Y--
--Y--Y--Y ---Y--Y
<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
Ok, now if we shoot during a "-" and that "-" differs too much from the "X" the server saw the server drops the hit and we hear the bullet hit the hull of the model (a thud, but no blood, or little is shown, what use to show sparks), but the server ignores it and goes on. This is also why if we sometimes shoot behind the player it will hit (because our "-" was ahead of the X.)
How can we fix this? Well we could all ask valve to rewite hl's netcode prediction with better support for fast moving objects, if it's even possible, or you can learn to guess what the server is seeing, or just set maxupdaterate and maxrate to a higher value server-side. Setting the rates higher, will allow "Y" to happen more often (if we set our rates to match), thus meaning our client has to use less "-" and will be much more accurate.
Im just tring to identify that there was a change. Then hopefully someone can then find and fix the problem.
From what i can recall there were no speed changes in the classes. Something someone tweeked somewhere is hurting gameplay.