<!--QuoteBegin-crisano+Sep 30 2004, 02:43 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (crisano @ Sep 30 2004, 02:43 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Think of it this way, it's a lot more unfair to the aliens if they were forced to fight a squad of camping marines. LMGs will always slaughter skulks in a long range fight unless the marines have broken wrists or mice. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> If there is no CC, what is there to camp?
<!--QuoteBegin-Grunt+Sep 30 2004, 02:34 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Grunt @ Sep 30 2004, 02:34 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I don't think it is fair for the marines to be forced to attack the hive <i>and</i> defend the CC seeing as they have the time limit.
That would be the same in a CS map where the Ts have to guard the hostages and plant a bomb, and if they don't do eaither in X time, they lose. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> how would you solve this, then? if the alien team totally overwhelmes the marines skillwise and set up a spawncamp, but there is no cc to kill, then how would they end the game?
or should we promote marine f4'ing as soon as it looks like you arent going to win.
<!--QuoteBegin-TOmekki+Sep 30 2004, 03:51 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TOmekki @ Sep 30 2004, 03:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> how would you solve this, then? if the alien team totally overwhelmes the marines skillwise and set up a spawncamp, but there is no cc to kill, then how would they end the game? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> The only solution that I can possibly see to that problem, which WILL arise if things are the way they are now minus a CC, is to make certain areas of the map in Combat unenterable by aliens, the certain area being marine spawn. Basically some invisible magical nanite force field repelling aliens from entering the marine's land of good feeling and safety.
This could also help promote marine teamplay, letting them have a few extra seconds to form squads, especially heavy squads that could weld each other and whatnot.
<!--QuoteBegin-crisano+Sep 30 2004, 04:03 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (crisano @ Sep 30 2004, 04:03 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-TOmekki+Sep 30 2004, 03:51 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TOmekki @ Sep 30 2004, 03:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> how would you solve this, then? if the alien team totally overwhelmes the marines skillwise and set up a spawncamp, but there is no cc to kill, then how would they end the game? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> The only solution that I can possibly see to that problem, which WILL arise if things are the way they are now minus a CC, is to make certain areas of the map in Combat unenterable by aliens, the certain area being marine spawn. Basically some invisible magical nanite force field repelling aliens from entering the marine's land of good feeling and safety.
This could also help promote marine teamplay, letting them have a few extra seconds to form squads, especially heavy squads that could weld each other and whatnot. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Could get boring waiting for the marines to respawn and exit out of there safe spot however..
The CC's presence should be a server variable, defaulting to off. That's the only way to let people keep playing their ridiculously long Combat games anyway.
<!--QuoteBegin-Alkiller+Sep 30 2004, 04:09 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Alkiller @ Sep 30 2004, 04:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Could get boring waiting for the marines to respawn and exit out of there safe spot however.. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> It wouldn't if server admins keep the 10-15 minute timelimit as a max. Marines will be forced to regroup and rush fast if they want to win. It'll only become boring if marines have the time to loiter around at base, have tea and cookies, whatever. Maybe add in a map wide computer voice announcement like when there is 5 minutes left.
Comp Voice: Marines, you have 5 minutes left. Stop acting like a bunch of pansies and rush together.
<!--QuoteBegin-PseudoKnight+Sep 29 2004, 05:30 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (PseudoKnight @ Sep 29 2004, 05:30 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Frankly, I hope they redesign the whole concept after 3.0 final comes out. The main objectives shouldn't be in the spawning zone. (ie. control over multiple res nodes is one idea) I wish it was an easy fix, but I think redesigning the maps in a new version of combat is necessary for the mode to reach it's full potential. The only thing they can do right now is tweak little things like spawn qeue time until it's the best it can be in this format. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I agree with you completely. I don't like it that the game is so dependant on spawning and the aim of the game is to spawn camp the other team while you take down their cc/hive.
Things that aren't fun: O Being spawn camped O Waiting to spawn
So I would simply remove them. Spawn camping would be prevented DOD style only with OCs and turrets. Spawning would have a fixed time after dieing, say 5-10 seconds to give you time to type "FECK!" or whatever.
The way to win would have to be changed obviously, but eliminating the bits that aren't fun and then adding new fun features is the method I would use if I was going to change NS.
Obviously with 3.0 in feature lock we won't see anything like this. I'm not really fussed about 3.0 final though, I only look forward to it so that we can move on and start making something better. 3.0 just has to many fundamental gameplay flaws in my mind to be fixed by small tweaks.
Comments
If there is no CC, what is there to camp?
That would be the same in a CS map where the Ts have to guard the hostages and plant a bomb, and if they don't do eaither in X time, they lose. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
how would you solve this, then? if the alien team totally overwhelmes the marines skillwise and set up a spawncamp, but there is no cc to kill, then how would they end the game?
or should we promote marine f4'ing as soon as it looks like you arent going to win.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The only solution that I can possibly see to that problem, which WILL arise if things are the way they are now minus a CC, is to make certain areas of the map in Combat unenterable by aliens, the certain area being marine spawn. Basically some invisible magical nanite force field repelling aliens from entering the marine's land of good feeling and safety.
This could also help promote marine teamplay, letting them have a few extra seconds to form squads, especially heavy squads that could weld each other and whatnot.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The only solution that I can possibly see to that problem, which WILL arise if things are the way they are now minus a CC, is to make certain areas of the map in Combat unenterable by aliens, the certain area being marine spawn. Basically some invisible magical nanite force field repelling aliens from entering the marine's land of good feeling and safety.
This could also help promote marine teamplay, letting them have a few extra seconds to form squads, especially heavy squads that could weld each other and whatnot. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Could get boring waiting for the marines to respawn and exit out of there safe spot however..
It wouldn't if server admins keep the 10-15 minute timelimit as a max. Marines will be forced to regroup and rush fast if they want to win. It'll only become boring if marines have the time to loiter around at base, have tea and cookies, whatever. Maybe add in a map wide computer voice announcement like when there is 5 minutes left.
Comp Voice: Marines, you have 5 minutes left. Stop acting like a bunch of pansies and rush together.
I agree with you completely. I don't like it that the game is so dependant on spawning and the aim of the game is to spawn camp the other team while you take down their cc/hive.
Things that aren't fun:
O Being spawn camped
O Waiting to spawn
So I would simply remove them. Spawn camping would be prevented DOD style only with OCs and turrets. Spawning would have a fixed time after dieing, say 5-10 seconds to give you time to type "FECK!" or whatever.
The way to win would have to be changed obviously, but eliminating the bits that aren't fun and then adding new fun features is the method I would use if I was going to change NS.
Obviously with 3.0 in feature lock we won't see anything like this. I'm not really fussed about 3.0 final though, I only look forward to it so that we can move on and start making something better. 3.0 just has to many fundamental gameplay flaws in my mind to be fixed by small tweaks.