Jetpack Or Heavy
master_wong
Join Date: 2004-11-05 Member: 32649Members
Join Date: 2004-11-05 Member: 32649Members
<div class="IPBDescription">In a CO map</div> I play CO often, for being a somehow good noob. (I always get #1 in most CO servers with normal players, but only as an alien.)
I'm really bad as marine, so I need this question to be answered.
Heavy or Jet? Which can be more efficient under what conditions in what map?
I'm really bad as marine, so I need this question to be answered.
Heavy or Jet? Which can be more efficient under what conditions in what map?
Comments
There is one, and only one (IMO,) exception; Rushing A1 A2 HA Welder (lvl 6 now, with lvl 0 lmg,) with a partner. If you're any good with LMG, and can clock up some early kills, you will wipe the floor with the opposition. 2 HAs welding can kill for ages, and hopefully the aliens will never get onos if your teammates dont die horribly. (Which, generally, they do. :|)
Just get to a vent, one person with welder out sits behind the person in the vent entrance and just welds him. The person in front kills madly, taking loads of damage but no dying. (Resuply required soon, obviously.) Then in quiet moments, swap positions. (It's only fair. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->)
JP is more solo. You can get to hive faster, avoid all lifeforms except lerks, (and even then they are easier to dodge,) and can generally be more useful to your team.
Your enemy is spores, so getting a welder with a partner is as effective as the HA strat. Alternatively, sacrifce MT for a3 to live that much longer. (Anyone who does not have MT when not rushing JP/HA is insane, or is using ESP hacks imo. It's too big of an advantage to throw away.)
HTH
Anyone with a decent set of headphones can go without it.
at least in my hands <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> (bangbangbangbangbang fade dead)
i heard they make u fire faster...
this is usually wat i get as marines
lvl1 - Resupply
lvl2 - Weps lvl1
lvl3 - shoggy
lvl4 - weps lvl 2
lvl 5 - weps lvl 3
lvl 6 - armour
lvl 7 - armoud
lvl 8+9 - jp
lvl 10 gl/mt/hmg
i think iv gone wrong sumwhere lol this is jus a ruff guidline of my personal preferance
especially with an sg in you hand (the choking of hmg disorrients me tho)
this is usually wat i get as marines
lvl1 - Resupply
lvl2 - Weps lvl1
lvl3 - shoggy
lvl4 - weps lvl 2
lvl 5 - weps lvl 3
lvl 6 - armour
lvl 7 - armoud
lvl 8+9 - jp
lvl 10 gl/mt/hmg
i think iv gone wrong sumwhere lol this is jus a ruff guidline of my personal preferance <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well a few things really
Firstly, not getting a1 until level 6. Are you insane?!
Secondly, that's 1 too many upgrades. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Jp > Shotty lvl 3
Hell, IMO, HMG lvl2 > Shottie lvl3. Only for hive killing are shotties better.
Headphones only give information of your imediate locality.
Yep. JP's are too hard to devour, and it isn't worth devouring a LA marine. Assuming you have resupply, the only advantage you get from HA is immunity to spores, which isn't worth a whole lot when you have to get past fades and onos.
<!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif' /><!--endemo--> +JP > <!--emo&::hive::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/hive5.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='hive5.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif' /><!--endemo-->
this is usually wat i get as marines
lvl1 - Resupply
lvl2 - Weps lvl1
lvl3 - shoggy
lvl4 - weps lvl 2
lvl 5 - weps lvl 3
lvl 6 - armour
lvl 7 - armoud
lvl 8+9 - jp
lvl 10 gl/mt/hmg
i think iv gone wrong sumwhere lol this is jus a ruff guidline of my personal preferance <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well a few things really
Firstly, not getting a1 until level 6. Are you insane?!
Secondly, that's 1 too many upgrades. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Jp > Shotty lvl 3
Hell, IMO, HMG lvl2 > Shottie lvl3. Only for hive killing are shotties better.
Headphones only give information of your imediate locality. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
ok these are my sides of the argument.
i hate getting armour because if i am not playing with a teamate that can weld and not being able to weld myself i think its not worth it.
id rather like to have the firepower to kill them before they get me. OFC I adapt to the situation at hand and the map.
Secondaly. about the hmg > sg. like i said i adapt to the surroundings. if they have onos's . if the map is very narrow at points. i mite get the hmg tho i rarely do.
i prefer the sg as it has a much better reload time which is invaluable in co maps as they are very small, its more than likeley wen ur in the middle of reloading a skulk will leap and bite u.
JP is good but u hav to upgrade armour levels which i dont see worthwhile in public co maps.
I suggest to all new players getting Armor 1 first, but if you really want that shotgun to own some aliens go Weap1-Shotgun-Resupply-Armor1 if you have a decent start your armor 1 may come before focus skulk which can be very irritating.
Also unless you intend to stick with a large group of people or a few people have agreed to get heavy armor with you i wouldnt suggest getting heavy, like someone said is a previos post you will stick out, i know myself if i see a heavy hes my first target. But once your a fully upgraded jp you usually want to focus all you firepower on that hive
Congradulations <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
And catpacks are useful if you have a shoGGy or hmg and they have a bunch of skulks. Kill one, wipe the floor with anything. Fades will go down so quickly, even really good players, because the best fades know exactly how long they can stay before running, and catpacks completely screw up the math. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
EDIT: HMG can be countered by umbra, there is nothing to counter SG.
EDIT: HMG can be countered by umbra, there is nothing to counter SG. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
....bad bad logic. You are SO much more likely to survive your first encounter with a skulk if you get armor 1. You get 3 bites instead of 2. 50% increase in survival time is a good thing. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Not to mention, if you don't get armor1, and someone DOES get focus, you are officially tissue paper. Armor1 makes focus almost ineffective. The only time focus is useful after the marine team has all gotten armor1 is if you have a lerk sporing armor off.
And umbra reduces all bullet damage by the same percentage, so how exactly is it a "counter" to hmg but not shotties? Unless you meant gls....in which case a good fade is counter enough <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Not to mention, if you don't get armor1, and someone DOES get focus, you are officially tissue paper. Armor1 makes focus almost ineffective. The only time focus is useful after the marine team has all gotten armor1 is if you have a lerk sporing armor off.
And umbra reduces all bullet damage by the same percentage, so how exactly is it a "counter" to hmg but not shotties? Unless you meant gls....in which case a good fade is counter enough <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
At the start of the round, you'll most likely be grouped together with 3-4 other marines so the chance of you getting bitten is minimal. Plus, it's not that hard to just hold a choke point from a distance - you have plenty of time to kill the skulk before it gets near you.
If they have focus (lvl 3) it means I would have a shotgun, fastest finger first. If there's more than one focus skulk, then I'll prolly get armour1 at lvl 4.
Umbra counters hmg by decreasing the effectiveness of the gun (blocks 1 out of 2 bullets). At least with a shotgun you have a chance of taking out the alien if the other team does umbra.
If they have focus (lvl 3) it means I would have a shotgun, fastest finger first. If there's more than one focus skulk, then I'll prolly get armour1 at lvl 4.
Umbra counters hmg by decreasing the effectiveness of the gun (blocks 1 out of 2 bullets). At least with a shotgun you have a chance of taking out the alien if the other team does umbra. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Trusting a group of random marines I don't know with my life is something I won't do. Besides, you can never check ALL the hiding spots; the chances that a skulk will get the drop on you once is always there. Without armor1, an ambush is almost always fatal. With armor1, your precious teammates will have enough time to react and kill that skulk, or you could just jump around and kill it yourself.
And combat maps aren't supposed to have long corridors or chokepoints. Chalk up big rooms without cover to poor map design *cough*sava*cough*. A chokepoint implies that you are <u>defending</u> the chokepoint, which is the aliens' job anyway. Against good aliens, you won't be able to just camp a big room and wait for kills.
In all honesty, you have a better chance of surviving that focus skulk's attack if you get armor1 and resupply, or armor2, instead of a shotty (I'd get resupply). If you can't kill a skulk in the time it takes him to bite you 3 times with focus, no upgrade is gonna help you. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
And umbra "counters" a shotgun just as effectively as it counters a hmg. It decreases damage from both by 50%. The only difference is that a shotty is overkill for lerks and skulks up close, but there's really no way a lerk can umbra well enough to protect a rushing skulk from an hmg's longer range, so the point is moot. Umbra helps fades and onos; everything else dies quickly enough that doubling the number of bullets needed only increases the time it takes to kill it by a second or so.
There is one, and only one (IMO,) exception; Rushing A1 A2 HA Welder (lvl 6 now, with lvl 0 lmg,) <span style='color:yellow'>with a partner</span>... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That highlighted bit is key. Jetpackers an make excellent rambos which in Combat is excellent. HA require teamwork. Odds are as a slow, grounded HA you'll get hit a lot. You need at least one buddy to cover you and help you weld up and stuff.
Thanks.
*******Nevermind. I found a thread with all this info in the General Forum ********
I disagree. JPs die too early on pubs.
Hmm. Well, in a pub, where JP pros are like gold dust, HA can be viable. However it's more expensive to kit out a HA train to shottie down a hive than it is to jet to it, ninja a PG and then just send vanillas through. (A popular PCW tactic.) If all 5 marines empty a shotty clip into the hive it's already as good as dead.
HA is great if your team will weld each other, but otherwise pointless. The tendency for them to group together tightly means that shotties hit more friendlies than skulks, allowing a 3 skulk pack to do serious damage to that train of yours. Additionally, one decent onos makes short work of any HA train. Stomp, digest, run, repeat.