I totally would if the game never came to be I would consider it a donation to NS1, maybie flayra could organise any that invested be made part of the consti if the game never arived that said im sure it will. Also if the early investers be able to beta test that would be awsome.
I'm a little skeptical because you could make a ton of money and not actually do anything. I'm not saying Unknown Worlds would try and take us all for fools, but stranger things have happened.
Two years from now, if you say "Oops, the game's not going to come out...sorry to all of you who payed us $25.00"
If 20,000 people all gave you $25, you'd of made a half a million dollars for NOT releasing a game.
If the people who pre-purchased got weekly newsletters and early alphas on the progress of the game, I might consider it. But for now, no.
<b>In my opinion, if the game wasn't released, it's a class action lawsuit waiting to happen. That's not a threat, someone's gonna do it to get their $25 back and to spite you for not putting out the game.</b> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> agreed.
and again, it would be great if we got not only updates, but perhaps constie or some extra privileges.
I voted yes. You guys made one of the best, most comprehensive FINISHED total conversions ever seen... there have been others, but few that were complete, polished, balanced, and playable. That is what I am basing my decision on.
I wish you all the best, and I'm willing to plunk down $25 to help see it happen. However, I am uncertain that this would be enough... I doubt that more than 500 people will pre-order in this fashion, and quite likely less. 12 grand is not really that much of a seed... at least it doesn't feel like one to me. But if you think it will help, I'll trust you enough to give you $25.
First of all, I would consider it a bad idea to invest in a game that I know nothing about. True, it's the same title (which would imply similar gameplay and what not), but all too often companies will ruin their sequels by trying to make them bigger and better than the original. If I was assured of a quality game, I would be more inclined to pre-order. What's making me think the chance of that happening is unlikely, and please don't take offense, is that recently you guys have really dedicated yourself to starting up this company. I think that saying you guys 'sold out' is a little too harsh, but recently it seems you're trying to wrap up NS1 (prematurely) so that you can concentrate on this scheme of yours to start a new company. The fact that you've been delegating all the regular tasks that you used to see to personally to new team members makes me think you're trying to shirk your responsibilities to the community and the game. I realize that companies can't support games forever, that at some point development must end, and that you didn't create NS for profit, but you tried to get out of the arrangement a little too quickly imo.
My next problem is that you're uncertain as to whether you'll be shipping NS2 to stores with a box/manual/etc. Not only is this a decision of dubious commercial wisdom, as your sales will take a hit due to its absence from the mainstream market (stores), but it makes it much less likely that I will get an enjoyable game out of it because it probably won't be supported well (by the team or the community), and I fear it will just fade into the background and be forgotten in light of newer/better games that will be released.
Anyway, in order to change my vote I would need to see a more fleshed out plan for the gameplay it would feature, and if I'm going to invest in this you guys had better go all the way, or not at all (i.e. good marketing, a box, and all that). A demo wouldn't hurt either; perhaps you can make one later and charge us more (which I would consider fair, because I would know what I was getting).
I would gladly pay the $25 ($35AU?) to pre-order, however payment method should definately be a primary concern. Many NS fans (most, even) do not have a credit card, or access to a credit card. there would have to be an alternate method of payment eg. Setting up a postal address for money orders or some such. I think a loyal fanbase makes this investment, while still a risk, a pretty good bet. The only problem is that it doesn't matter how much money people are willing to give if they can't get it to you <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I dont understand why everyone considers it such a risk many of who have donated to the consti I think of this as just and extention of the constellation just giving money to help flayra tbh I dont care if they produce a quality game or even a game at all im still going to donate because I believe in helping ppl for one thing and thanking flayra for ns1.
Also I think that providing a bank account number and allowing ppl to do direct bank depostits would be a good way to get the money.
NS has been fun and entertaining. It has been free. It's a great game. That alone is enough to justify paying $25 for it, even if it may not come out. The game concept and world is just too awesome to not give it a shot.
But no one is ever going to invest in something without knowing more about it. So I voted for Yes, but with more info.
Maybe it'd be possible to stay out of some of the legal troubles if you advertised it as, say, a donation. It just so happens that you'll get NS2 for free if it comes out.
Also, if NS2 uses a specific game's engine, will the users need to buy that game to play NS2 legally?
I voted yes- if i had a hard-copy delivered (I live in the UK btw)
But I wouldn't buy it if it used an OTT top-end engine that had a high system requirement.
Gameplay > graphics- that's why we are still playing HL1 mods <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
As much as I love playing NS, I would rather wait until the game is released. As a consequence, I'll be paying full price, but it should be worth it. I mean, I can skip eating about $30 in food over a week or so period, saving me money, losing a little weight, and still allowing me to buy the game.
Anyway, reason why I'd wait until it was released fully? There is always a chance that I might stop playing games outright, or just move on beyond first person shooters. If by the time it's released and for all I know I become a mother with children, then I'd definitally wouldn't have time to play, and it would be a waste of my $25, regardless of how small of a monetary amount it is.
I'll pay the full price for a published game. I'm sure you people at Unknown Worlds would want the full price for your games anyway, right?
<span style='color:red'>I VOTE YES ON FRENCH NS SITE (ns-fr.com) END HERE TOO</span>
<span style='color:blue'>my last post (in french)</span>
sans m adresser directement a qui que ce soit et sans vouloir faire le moralisateur ne pensez vous pas que tout travail mérite salaire et que Flayra a déja fait preuve de son talent.
je comprends que les constels considerent déja avoir payé pour ns et soutenir ns2
mais dans le fond 25$ est-ce si cher? relisez le post de roly, et considerez votre apport comme un don; plus que comme une précommande.
pour avoir joué a tout les "hits" sortis l' année passée farcry/doom3/sc:source, natural selection est le seul jeu/mod que je pratque encore régulierement (avec d autres: day of defeat par exemple ou avp2 par exp).
je trouvais (et je trouve encore) la news de Flayra enthousiasmante: un jeu en partie financé par la communauté et moins de contraintes vis à vis des éditeurs/distributeurs.
j aimerais bien qu' un forum annexe s' ouvre ou l' on comparerais les demarches commerciales qui ont précédés les sorties de cs (retail) dod (retail) cs:cz et natural selection.
le buzz, les effet d annonces, les prix des précommandes ...etc
<span style='color:blue'>my first post in french too </span>
OMG !!!
a titre personnel oui, oui, et oui.
en temps que gérant de cyber cyberstation foix 19 rue des chapeliers 09000 foix contact at: poste8.foix@laposte.net
et bientot/ peut etre manager de team ns
oui oui et encore oui, et je compte bien persuader les membres de la team d en faire autant : team [raz] remise a zero / equipe junior - de 18 ans a ne pas confonfre avec la team [ras] rien a signaler equipe senior / equipe senior + de 22ans <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo--> pub inside <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
alors voila vous etes pret a tous telecharger du steam/caca (voire a payer pour) et vous tournez la tete quand il s agit de participer au financement du dev de NS2.
W T F ! ! !
putain, désoler d etre grossier, mais merde quoi, il est ou le probleme:
le produit n existe pas ben justement puisque il sagit de financer sont dev
j ais deja payé pour ns/constel, ben ui encore heureux les prog dev ne vivent pas que d amour et d eau fraiche
je veux des infos sur ns2, suremment pas ,je dois faire partie de ces rares joueurs qui fuient les spoilers, moi j aime bien la decouverte, et puis les annonces a la blizzard 3 ans avant la sortie du jeu ça m a toujours gonflé.
oui avec la boite et le boitier <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->? teuh !!! et puis quoi encore marine un chocolat chaud et des croissants au beurre non mais sans deconner !!!! quand Flayra te demandes de sauter ta seule réponse doit etre : ou ! Si Flayra te permet de participer au financement du dev de ns2 ta seule reponse doit etre combien !
paye ou c le couloir des loosers qui t attend.
lol/ps: ce poste et evidemment a prendre au second/troisieme degré mais il contient aussi quelques reflexions fondées.
faites comme bon vous semble personne ne viendras chez vous et vous menacez d une arme pour pré-payer ns2 (lol pour toute les précommandes de hl2 quand meme).
pps: client d oeil au fan de starship troopers 1, salut amical a captain bigleux au han au sly a tonton crunch (tonton si tu nous lis encore, je brule un ciegre en ton nom pour avoir eduqué le noob alien que je suis encore) et à tt ceux que j oublient ici mais que ne manquerais pas de "cut" sur un serveur allemand( les serveurs français c' est de la merde y a meme pas de commande "/res" et puis les allemands y jouent mieux)
ppp: je vais consulter le thread officiel et reviendrais verser un peu de bille sur le forum français aprés.
Also, if the game does actually get made, there better be some really good marketing or I won't ever know it came out. That means getting it out to the mags and hyping it up.
At the risk of embarrassing myself, I can give a go at a summary of the top post. My French is a wee bit rusty, haven't spoken or read it on a regular basis for about 15 years. I won't go into details, though. Chances are this summary will have enough errors as it is.
It's mostly positive stuff. He support this and thinks Flayra has already proven himself. He understands the people who've already donated and also pays for NS2 (I think that's it at least). (This part I'm not 100% about:) $25 isn't that much, if you consider it a donation [for NS] in addition to the fact that you'll get NS2. He played some other games (the so-called "hits"), but NS is the only game/mod he goes back to ("plays again"). I'm a bit confused here, because after that he seems to say he "also [plays some] others like Day of Defeat and AVP2 [Alien vs Predator 2?]", which doesn't exactly mix with the former statement. It might be something I missed. The rest is a bit harder, but an even shorter summary is that he is enthusiastic about these news and that he likes the idea of a game funded by the community instead of being "constrained" by publishers.
The last part is something of a mystery to me. I could hazard a guess, but that's it. It mentions selling a commercial product, and list CS/DoD retail and NS, but I'm not sure what the message is. The first sentence says that "he would like a related(?) forum opened(?) [or to put it differently, assuming I understood it correctly: he'd like a new board made, which will only be used for this issue]", but I can't quite put it togheter with the rest of the paragraph as the next part goes "...or compare...".
-
Other than the details, I think that covers the general idea. Don't quote me on that, though.
i might prepurchase it, only when i get screenys, and the requirements of a working beta, or alpha (that will take quite a while) and even then, i would probably want to wait until the game is actually released, thats my thoughts
I would if i got some gameplay videos, I wouldent pay for a game that ends up like that classic john romero quote <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Sure I mean I've been here for god knows how long and to be honest as long as there was one thing that I could look at (Even one piece of concept art) I'd plop down £25 (!!) right there and then. After all the PC industry needs more "bedroom" coders and personally I'd hate to see NS suffer from a publisher forced release like so many other games.
So if my small donation is able to make sure NS2 is released when its ready and not when someone says it should be ready I'll do it.
I'm interested in the concept of NS2, especially since I have seen what kind of effect a new engine such as the Source engine has made to Counterstrike. It feels like a whole new world.
I believe that the 25 dollars price is more than reasonable due to the fact that as soon as you go through a publisher you'll lose out on the amount of money that you actually receive by a considerable amount, so it may be that you'll end up with the guys here at Unknown worlds only receiving 15 dollars or less per copy of the game anyway (but over a broader audience)
I would definately want more information before I pledged support and an engine would definately need to be chosen (or at least initial engine).
My primary concern is to whether the 25 dollar 'contribution' would be honoured by the publishers. That in itself may cause a few issues as it'll be another point that you'd have to bargain - the publisher is going to never receive any money from this loyal contribution base, I guess it depends on how many people contribute.
The other issue that has already been raised is the length of time for development. I've only recently found NS and though I want to play it my first experience was pretty dire because of my system - For some it seems a little awkward with the first halflife engine, even though I have a 9600XT and an Athlon 2200+ ... go figure <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I just know that my life will probably continue and i'll stop playing games as much, not only that I'll become really old and my reaction times will go, so 16 year olds will be beating me, hands down... oh wait, they already do that <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
If the guys (and girls) at UW could get out some concept models, or even perhaps implement something quick and dirty with the source engine that would go a long way to making peoples minds up.
I really don't care about getting a box, but I'd have to be able to back up the downloadable copy. You can also use the latest and greatest P2P software that's out at the time to distribute the file... but whatever happens, if you make a 'friends' client, try to get it working <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Comments
I'm a little skeptical because you could make a ton of money and not actually do anything. I'm not saying Unknown Worlds would try and take us all for fools, but stranger things have happened.
Two years from now, if you say "Oops, the game's not going to come out...sorry to all of you who payed us $25.00"
If 20,000 people all gave you $25, you'd of made a half a million dollars for NOT releasing a game.
If the people who pre-purchased got weekly newsletters and early alphas on the progress of the game, I might consider it. But for now, no.
<b>In my opinion, if the game wasn't released, it's a class action lawsuit waiting to happen. That's not a threat, someone's gonna do it to get their $25 back and to spite you for not putting out the game.</b> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
agreed.
and again, it would be great if we got not only updates, but perhaps constie or some extra privileges.
If for some bizarre reason it didn't take off oh well no big deal.
I wish you all the best, and I'm willing to plunk down $25 to help see it happen. However, I am uncertain that this would be enough... I doubt that more than 500 people will pre-order in this fashion, and quite likely less. 12 grand is not really that much of a seed... at least it doesn't feel like one to me. But if you think it will help, I'll trust you enough to give you $25.
Tikatt
Beta to beta is almost a new game. Get a solid gameplay and show us a more specific direction where your going with this, and i would buy.
First of all, I would consider it a bad idea to invest in a game that I know nothing about. True, it's the same title (which would imply similar gameplay and what not), but all too often companies will ruin their sequels by trying to make them bigger and better than the original. If I was assured of a quality game, I would be more inclined to pre-order. What's making me think the chance of that happening is unlikely, and please don't take offense, is that recently you guys have really dedicated yourself to starting up this company. I think that saying you guys 'sold out' is a little too harsh, but recently it seems you're trying to wrap up NS1 (prematurely) so that you can concentrate on this scheme of yours to start a new company. The fact that you've been delegating all the regular tasks that you used to see to personally to new team members makes me think you're trying to shirk your responsibilities to the community and the game. I realize that companies can't support games forever, that at some point development must end, and that you didn't create NS for profit, but you tried to get out of the arrangement a little too quickly imo.
My next problem is that you're uncertain as to whether you'll be shipping NS2 to stores with a box/manual/etc. Not only is this a decision of dubious commercial wisdom, as your sales will take a hit due to its absence from the mainstream market (stores), but it makes it much less likely that I will get an enjoyable game out of it because it probably won't be supported well (by the team or the community), and I fear it will just fade into the background and be forgotten in light of newer/better games that will be released.
Anyway, in order to change my vote I would need to see a more fleshed out plan for the gameplay it would feature, and if I'm going to invest in this you guys had better go all the way, or not at all (i.e. good marketing, a box, and all that). A demo wouldn't hurt either; perhaps you can make one later and charge us more (which I would consider fair, because I would know what I was getting).
I think a loyal fanbase makes this investment, while still a risk, a pretty good bet. The only problem is that it doesn't matter how much money people are willing to give if they can't get it to you <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Also I think that providing a bank account number and allowing ppl to do direct bank depostits would be a good way to get the money.
But no one is ever going to invest in something without knowing more about it. So I voted for Yes, but with more info.
Also, if NS2 uses a specific game's engine, will the users need to buy that game to play NS2 legally?
But I wouldn't buy it if it used an OTT top-end engine that had a high system requirement.
Gameplay > graphics- that's why we are still playing HL1 mods <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
As much as I love playing NS, I would rather wait until the game is released. As a consequence, I'll be paying full price, but it should be worth it. I mean, I can skip eating about $30 in food over a week or so period, saving me money, losing a little weight, and still allowing me to buy the game.
Anyway, reason why I'd wait until it was released fully? There is always a chance that I might stop playing games outright, or just move on beyond first person shooters. If by the time it's released and for all I know I become a mother with children, then I'd definitally wouldn't have time to play, and it would be a waste of my $25, regardless of how small of a monetary amount it is.
I'll pay the full price for a published game. I'm sure you people at Unknown Worlds would want the full price for your games anyway, right?
<span style='color:blue'>my last post (in french)</span>
sans m adresser directement a qui que ce soit et sans vouloir faire le moralisateur ne pensez vous pas que tout travail mérite salaire et que Flayra a déja fait preuve de son talent.
je comprends que les constels considerent déja avoir payé pour ns et soutenir ns2
mais dans le fond 25$ est-ce si cher?
relisez le post de roly, et considerez votre apport comme un don; plus que comme une précommande.
pour avoir joué a tout les "hits" sortis l' année passée farcry/doom3/sc:source, natural selection est le seul jeu/mod que je pratque encore régulierement (avec d autres: day of defeat par exemple ou avp2 par exp).
je trouvais (et je trouve encore) la news de Flayra enthousiasmante: un jeu en partie financé par la communauté et moins de contraintes vis à vis des éditeurs/distributeurs.
j aimerais bien qu' un forum annexe s' ouvre ou l' on comparerais les demarches commerciales qui ont précédés les sorties de cs (retail) dod (retail) cs:cz et natural selection.
le buzz, les effet d annonces, les prix des précommandes ...etc
<span style='color:blue'>my first post in french too </span>
OMG !!!
a titre personnel oui, oui, et oui.
en temps que gérant de cyber
cyberstation foix
19 rue des chapeliers
09000 foix
contact at: poste8.foix@laposte.net
et bientot/ peut etre manager de team ns
oui oui et encore oui, et je compte bien persuader les membres de la team d en faire autant :
team [raz] remise a zero / equipe junior - de 18 ans a ne pas confonfre avec la team [ras] rien a signaler equipe senior / equipe senior + de 22ans
<!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo--> pub inside <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
alors voila vous etes pret a tous telecharger du steam/caca (voire a payer pour)
et vous tournez la tete quand il s agit de participer au financement du dev de NS2.
W T F ! ! !
putain, désoler d etre grossier, mais merde quoi, il est ou le probleme:
le produit n existe pas ben justement puisque il sagit de financer sont dev
j ais deja payé pour ns/constel, ben ui encore heureux les prog dev ne vivent pas que d amour et d eau fraiche
je veux des infos sur ns2, suremment pas ,je dois faire partie de ces rares joueurs qui fuient les spoilers, moi j aime bien la decouverte, et puis les annonces a la blizzard 3 ans avant la sortie du jeu ça m a toujours gonflé.
oui avec la boite et le boitier <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->? teuh !!! et puis quoi encore marine un chocolat chaud et des croissants au beurre non mais sans deconner !!!!
quand Flayra te demandes de sauter ta seule réponse doit etre : ou !
Si Flayra te permet de participer au financement du dev de ns2 ta seule reponse doit etre combien !
paye ou c le couloir des loosers qui t attend.
lol/ps: ce poste et evidemment a prendre au second/troisieme degré mais il contient aussi quelques reflexions fondées.
faites comme bon vous semble personne ne viendras chez vous et vous menacez d une arme pour pré-payer ns2 (lol pour toute les précommandes de hl2 quand meme).
pps: client d oeil au fan de starship troopers 1, salut amical a captain bigleux au han au sly a tonton crunch (tonton si tu nous lis encore, je brule un ciegre en ton nom pour avoir eduqué le noob alien que je suis encore) et à tt ceux que j oublient ici mais que ne manquerais pas de "cut" sur un serveur allemand( les serveurs français c' est de la merde y a meme pas de commande "/res" et puis les allemands y jouent mieux)
ppp: je vais consulter le thread officiel et reviendrais verser un peu de bille sur le forum français aprés.
i will translate it when i get more time
NS FOREVER
In the forum the FAQ's the very first rule:
1. No posting in foreign languages. We moderators can only speak and understand English.
lol
It's mostly positive stuff. He support this and thinks Flayra has already proven himself. He understands the people who've already donated and also pays for NS2 (I think that's it at least).
(This part I'm not 100% about:) $25 isn't that much, if you consider it a donation [for NS] in addition to the fact that you'll get NS2.
He played some other games (the so-called "hits"), but NS is the only game/mod he goes back to ("plays again"). I'm a bit confused here, because after that he seems to say he "also [plays some] others like Day of Defeat and AVP2 [Alien vs Predator 2?]", which doesn't exactly mix with the former statement. It might be something I missed.
The rest is a bit harder, but an even shorter summary is that he is enthusiastic about these news and that he likes the idea of a game funded by the community instead of being "constrained" by publishers.
The last part is something of a mystery to me. I could hazard a guess, but that's it. It mentions selling a commercial product, and list CS/DoD retail and NS, but I'm not sure what the message is. The first sentence says that "he would like a related(?) forum opened(?) [or to put it differently, assuming I understood it correctly: he'd like a new board made, which will only be used for this issue]", but I can't quite put it togheter with the rest of the paragraph as the next part goes "...or compare...".
-
Other than the details, I think that covers the general idea. Don't quote me on that, though.
So if my small donation is able to make sure NS2 is released when its ready and not when someone says it should be ready I'll do it.
I believe that the 25 dollars price is more than reasonable due to the fact that as soon as you go through a publisher you'll lose out on the amount of money that you actually receive by a considerable amount, so it may be that you'll end up with the guys here at Unknown worlds only receiving 15 dollars or less per copy of the game anyway (but over a broader audience)
I would definately want more information before I pledged support and an engine would definately need to be chosen (or at least initial engine).
My primary concern is to whether the 25 dollar 'contribution' would be honoured by the publishers. That in itself may cause a few issues as it'll be another point that you'd have to bargain - the publisher is going to never receive any money from this loyal contribution base, I guess it depends on how many people contribute.
The other issue that has already been raised is the length of time for development. I've only recently found NS and though I want to play it my first experience was pretty dire because of my system - For some it seems a little awkward with the first halflife engine, even though I have a 9600XT and an Athlon 2200+ ... go figure <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I just know that my life will probably continue and i'll stop playing games as much, not only that I'll become really old and my reaction times will go, so 16 year olds will be beating me, hands down... oh wait, they already do that <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
If the guys (and girls) at UW could get out some concept models, or even perhaps implement something quick and dirty with the source engine that would go a long way to making peoples minds up.
I really don't care about getting a box, but I'd have to be able to back up the downloadable copy. You can also use the latest and greatest P2P software that's out at the time to distribute the file... but whatever happens, if you make a 'friends' client, try to get it working <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->