I'd Like to add some more since my last post, I've discussed this with fellow regs (yo community) and after playing many reg games (big games with a lot of team work and tactics) I must say aliens are dominating too much... The game is played at the first 7-8 minutes, after the second hive is up its bye bye marines...
What I mean is, unless you HA rush, its impossible to siege a hive when aliens have 2 hives or more, unless marines use a sneak pg tactic, and take down the second hive at their first phase attempt, its pretty much over, second hive aliens using leap+umbra+bile are too strong to hold off without constant support of weapons, meds, and maybe even heavy weapons and HA... which brings me to my next point...
Marine RT health should go back to what it was in 3.1, marines are losing rts faster then they cap them, lets say we are talking about metal, a skulk will munch surface rt, and theres a marine building a pg in heating, untill he will get to surface the rt will be down, and the skulk will be munching storage d, then untill the marine will get there, the skulk can already move to heating, and if the marine will rush off to kill the skulk without building in the process, the skulk can come back just as fast and the marine rts will never be rebuilt...
Now its either cap&protect rts, or attack and lose them all, and hope to survive on kills, because one or two marines are not enough to recap...
Any way, u get my point.... its 95% that marines wont come back from a second hive... (speaking about decent good team work games...)
p.s - Since aliens are already quite overwhelming, I see no reson why fades/lerks should regain speed... they are as good as it is.
DEMOGRAPHIC INFO: I play both pub and competitive NS, every role except Fade, so I have no comments on Fade. I don't play CO.
GAME COMMENTS: Overall, I love the balance. I love the Marine RT health, it feels just about perfect. The alien power ramp with extra Hives feels just about right. Onos is good, and marines CAN come back from 2 Hives, if the aliens don't press their advantage quickly.
My only complaint is that Jets take a lot of work to counter for their cost. The classical counter to Jets was lerks, but the reduced Lerk speed makes them much less effective at that task. Jets <i>should</i> be pretty good, but I'd like to see one or two <i>minor</i> tweaks here. For example: --Increase Jetpack cost to 12. (Why all the insistence on having all costs be multiples of 5?), and/or --Increase Lerk climb speed a little, to help them catch Jets in the air. Vertical climb speed on Fades could stand a little boost as well, and would help the same issue.
Jetpack balance is important, because of their status as the marine's End-game Res Control tool. The Aliens also have an End-game Res Control tool--the Onos. It just so happens that the Marines' Res Control tool is the counter to the Aliens Res Control tool, making the end game res fight very difficult for aliens if they cant effectively counter jets.
As I understand it, 3.2 final doesn't have any significant coding changes--its mostly balance tweaks.
That means they could very well be arguing over the last few numbers right up to thursday night, so any changelog released before then might not be accurate.
ChocolateThe Team MascotJoin Date: 2006-10-31Member: 58123Members
edited March 2007
I know its probably way to late to consider my opinion (i haven't been on the forums lately <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" /> ) but ill put it anyway.
Ive noticed a pattern in the games I've played for at least the beginning part of a game(i play on small 16 player servers) and it is:
- Marines push out and control most of the maps rts (leaving only like 2 or 3 alien) (no change from what i used to see) - Marines are teching up, losing a few rts here and there - Aliens are in a slow losing situation until the first fade shows up - The fade pushes back the marines pretty far, giving the aliens more chances to bite rts - Marines get thrown into a losing ground situation (Proto goes up) - Marines get HA and get back into the game - Gets fun after this point
I personally don't got a problem with this (strong <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tsa.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::tsa::" border="0" alt="tsa.gif" /> start, strong <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/hive5.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::hive::" border="0" alt="hive5.gif" /> start-middle), but on the server I play on (Tactical Gamer) I've felt this kind of pattern (on ns_eclipse especially). I don't know if it is 100% correct, because I'm usually the "perma gorge" or the "RT killer skulk".
Ive also noticed that the Fade blink is a little slow, and think there should be an option for either blink (so you can choose the old or the new blink) and the usual balancing of this.
Those are my 2 most-likely wasted cents for this, but besides that I am very pleased. I never played beta 1 much, i really didnt like it, but i like beta 2 much more and only play beta 2.
Sarisel.::' ( O ) ';:-. .-.:;' ( O ) '::.Join Date: 2003-07-30Member: 18557Members, Constellation
edited March 2007
Yes, the new "responsiveness" of the fade's blink is what finally turned me off completely from playing this game. Newbie-friendly or not, I just don't find it enjoyable.
Ok...so far it's ok, but on some custom maps like Lemmings or Freefall, i lerk like always, but when i try to dive its just like im floating, even if im not gliding im slow as crap. As soon as i turn around and try to rise back up <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/asrifle.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::asrifle::" border="0" alt="asrifle.gif" /> I'm dead...Fades i guese are supposedly slow now, i never liked fades so i dont know...But you basically slowed down the strength of the speedy aliens, and now they stand no chance whatsoever...
This originally was a rebuttal to a player listing all the changes in 3.2 and explaining why he felt each was a horrible unbalancing move. His biggest issue seemed to be the hive teleport, but imo the chambers in NS were always meant to be equal options for any hive (first, second, third), its just taken them this long to actually balance it out (though SC still needs a touch of a boost).
So, on to the list.
<b>Change #1: Hive teleport.</b> The player felt that the hive teleport was too unbalanced against the marines, with no actual counters. I think there are ample ways to counter a 3.2 movement rush (which, though no longer requiring movements, the name seems to have stuck).
-The first and easiest is to stop the gorge from putting up the hive, or from spitting it. Sure, some hives can be dropped through the wall, but that onus is on the mapper. But even in those situations, the hive still needs to be spat/used, so if anything, those are the situations most like the 3.1 rush; marines could keep the gorge in the vent while they phase in and prepare for the takedown. -In other hives where the gorge has to run up to drop it, simply kill the gorge before he gets there. Not always simple, but definitely doable. -Get mt? With MT you can see any kind of a rush coming. -Sieges in the hive? I know its a horribly nub option and i hate it, but frankly i think this defensive tactic has gotten a natural boost in 3.2, since movement rushes are so much easier to pull off now. -Multiple phase gates. Another semi-nub option, but it works surprisingly well. Was playing Lucid on Gorges the other day, and we MC rushed Fear hive about 4 times with multiple onos each time. But they had 2 and then 3 phase gates. It was a tight as hell battle with 4 onos, that finally got the last MC rush to work.
So there ya have it, many strats to counter the new type of MC rush, and im sure there are plenty more. IMO, the new hive teleport IS balanced, and way more fun gameplay. It also unlocks the other upgrade chambers are first chambers, which is a HUGE addition to the general gameplay of NS.
<b>Change #2: Ghost Structures.</b> I think a lot of players do not understand why or how ghost structures work. Aliens dont bite the ghosts to instantly kill them; they TOUCH them, moving their bodies into the ghosts. That gives an instant recycle for 80% of the cost. Skulks can choose not to touch them, and bite them down, killing them fully. But thats a small part of it.
I think the biggest reason for ghosts was the insanely lame comm strat of dropping rts in alien territory. As in, a comm would listen for eggs at rts, then drop the rt before the gorge can. The gorge would sit there helpless. Even with no marines around, the gorge would have to either wait for a skulk to come by and bite it down, or move on to another rt. A horribly lame situation, which, until now, had absolutely no counter. And it worked pretty well when the comm was devious enough.
So, that was completely solved by ghosts. Also, a large part of trapping was solved. And on top of it all, is the fun factor of the general situations involving ghosts; just recently i was comming, dropped 3 sieges, and had a skulk run through em all. Sure, i only lost 9 res in total from that. But it was also the annoyance. Im sure the skulk was happy with himself. I dropped the sieges again, two got built, but the third (closer to the door) had to be redropped about 4 times before a marine would finally tap it to keep it solid (with me yelling to do so). More dynamics to an already awesomely dynamic game <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
So, perhaps people are missing the point with ghost structures. They arent 'inefficient and pointless' at all... at worst, they dont affect the marine game, and only barely affect the comm's res game. But, for the aliens, they add an interesting ability, as well as a fix to a critical almost-exploit that could cripple the alien res game.
<b>Changes #3: Gameplay changes</b>
These are the numerous other changes in the version.
-LERKS. The lerk cant pancake anymore. Yes, it was an awesome ability, but it WAS kinda stupid. So what happened to the lerk? With the higher base speed and the 3.2 final Climb Speed, the lerk is still one hell of a force to be reckoned with, and its far more customizable. The Silent Lerk is a great option now. In 3.1, they had no chance. 3.2, they can cause some insane havoc. The critical thing is to talk about the 3.2 FINAL lerk, not the 3.2 beta 2 lerk. That 20% less drag on climb made a huge difference.
-Webs. This was another stupid situation. Webs should have always been as balanced as they are in 3.2. Great fix. Webs are still useful as ever, just you cant damn near exploit them and keep a marine stuck there forever.
-Cloak. All the changes to cloak were for the better! All around the board! Its more efficient, and far more intuitive.
-The bilebomb range went down like 15%. Thats a significant change, but nothing serious. Its a huge blob of bile, and in 3.1 the gorge could whip that thing. Consider also its use as an INDIRECT weapon, which is actually not seen often enough. That is, a PG or whatever is on a higher ledge, or on the other side of a wall (with a gap above). The new gorge is much more able to launch a bile over the lip and right into the structures, whereas in 3.1 the bile would more often than not hit the ceiling. Either way, its hardly a nerf worth mentioning, since it can go either way.
-THE ONOS. The onos is now significantly more powerful at 1 hive, and roughly equal at 2 and 3 hives. That health boost is why. And why not? Its supposed to be a tough cookie, and was too weak without Cara before. And the new charge is awesomesauce, noone can deny that. Its actually become frequently used, and useful.
-DCs. They are WICKED now. Pretty much, DC and MC are equal now, and SC is just a touch weaker than the others. And thats for any hive, first, second or third. The role of DCs has changed dramatically, and it will probably be a few months before mainstream players figure out how they are properly used. As in, a single DC put in vents or secure locations around the map for (fast) healing of aliens. Or, a single DC and two OCs; that created a rather formidable WOL, since those DCs heal em fast! Even the hives; they heal hives like MAD! 3% every 2 seconds. Thats like a gorge permanently assigned to healspray on the hive.
-redemption got fixed, or at least far closer to fixed than ever before
-NO TELEFRAG (hi, many aliens lifeforms are now randomly saved... and yes, telefrag has determined the outcome of games before)
-The fade changes are obviously noticeable, but that in itself is a huge debate over whether it was for the better or not. Frankly, either way, i think its nicely balanced for its role.
-And the biggest change of all, though already mentioned... is the hive teleport.
These are other changes (of course), but the post was mostly a rebuttal to a player saying the aliens got nerfed by all these changes. I think its different, but great, and outlined a lot (but not all) of it here.
So there ya have it. IMO, 3.2 is by far the best version out to date.
I think the devs can see the problem that one player can dominate an entire game, but they are fixing it in a wrong way. Yes, the fade is powerful and was hard to use for a lot of people back then, but it's being handled the wrong way. Now, not only is it hard for good players to use it, but average joes will never get there. So instead of a selective group of people that could use a fade, now it's out of reach of nearly all players. Now, if you hit a wall, your speed goes to 0 and you'll die to those shotgun blasts. Map memorization becomes essential to playing.
My opinion is that instead of the "making it harder" route, go with something easier. I'd go so far as to remove blink. It's only helped a few great players in the past and in the future, it's a pain to play with. I'm not saying acid rocket should take it's place as it did in 1.04, but at least that was a weapon that nearly everybody could use.
I also want the lerk to be a support class and not the rambo as it is in 3.1, but I don't like it being paper and dying from a pistol whip, if you aren't looking at a certain direction. Perhaps the spikes were better as they kept the lerk from a distance. Again, I like the goal which is keep it a support guy and not rambo, but paper health makes even looking a risk.
I'd like silence to be looked at, especially when MT goes up. Most aliens use celerity as speed is quiet essential for anything here. I'd like for it to be given some use after MT.
You don't have a player matching system like Warcraft III or Halo 2. So I suggest methods of equalizing player performance. My theory is that if the game becomes easier, player potentials will become similar. And the result of that would be that since results are more predictable, the game in turn would be easier to balance.
might agree with some of your other 'ideas'...but remove blink? do you realize the importance of it? if you want to act like that, remove jp from marines? I love aliens, always been playing them and always will...but with the recent release of the final 3.2 changes, finally criippled aliens to its worse. sure, game is balanced for 6v6, but I like to think NS is a big community...where their are large servers, and not just private servers. I also like to think the title naturla-secletion hasn't changed, with the recent changes it might as well be called marine-selection.
I can't understand with the problems with fade, lerk and even armour boost taken away. But to solve it by removing blink? you might not understand the importance of blink than. The devs are screwing aliens every patch they release, sure bugfixs and other neat things are added, but with all the things done to aliens, might as well love those bugfixs. Even with the 3.2 beta1-2 going public, everybody started to comment about these changes, but also few or none even were noticed. When the final came out, almost nothing that was 'debated' or 'adviced' came into play. So long you keep balancing this game for 6v6, while the avg. server is 18+ player...co maps will be replacing ns servers. Your making it EASY to play marines, while aliens is harder? I remember somebody posted saying rt health is too low? are you kidding me? lol? you lower it to 5000, but you bump it to 5500? the people who comment here are way to close to the project to want to say anything bad about the releases or really care? bah who
Despite all the vitriol about "nerfed this" and "unbalanced that", I think 3.2 final is an excellent version.
Some servers see more alien wins and some see more marine wins, depending on how they use their settings and how skilled the players are, but overall both teams are about evenly matched. The balance is much better than it was in 3.1. Some people just like complaining about anything that hurts their favorite play style.
I believe that had to do with a couple of skilled fades or lerks that held the alien team afloat enough to wear the marines down.
And to kiddo:
1.04 had no blink. The game was playable. Then blink was introduced later on. The game adjusted. You must not imagine a feature being removed without any changes. After all, we went through beta 5 where you could only gestate in the hives. In summary, every change will always be accomodated. The devs won't just give onos 1 hp and call it 3.3. If they were to do that, they would also change everything around them. So if I say remove blink, I obviously mean something would replace it.
Blink is important to the game. I just think it's far too skill-dependent for most players to use. I mean before, I never saw many people use it properly. Now, it's even harder, because if you hit a wall, your acceleration goes kerplunk.
Anyway, this thread as puzl said, is about opinions and that is my own. I'm not saying yours is wrong or mine is right. I'm saying what I think.
<!--quoteo(post=1611334:date=Mar 4 2007, 05:35 PM:name=gumhat)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(gumhat @ Mar 4 2007, 05:35 PM) [snapback]1611334[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> They're not evenly matched, maybe on small 14 player servers there is a equal amount of alien and marine wins, but I dare you to play aliens on a 30 person server. It is 80% alien losses, whereas in 3.1 it was about 50/50. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
30-player servers have always experienced weird dynamics because they have such a magnified threshold effect. The sheer volume of free LMGs wandering around makes life really tough for the aliens until they hit 50 res, which takes much longer than in smaller games because of the res distribution--but once they DO hit 50 res, you can suddenly have 5 fades running around at the same time, which is virtually impossible for the marines to counter. Plus, having 15 players means the aliens have a staggering 375 <b>free</b> starting res, meaning the marine's can never hope to win by doing even res trades.
Really, if aliens are still struggling in that scenario, you just have to make one tiny little change to fix it: mp_friendlyfire 1.
Really, try it. That will solve all your problems with massed <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/asrifle.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::asrifle::" border="0" alt="asrifle.gif" /> , because they'll all be shooting each other instead of you.
<!--quoteo(post=1611363:date=Mar 5 2007, 12:39 AM:name=SmoodCroozn)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SmoodCroozn @ Mar 5 2007, 12:39 AM) [snapback]1611363[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> I believe that had to do with a couple of skilled fades or lerks that held the alien team afloat enough to wear the marines down.
And to kiddo:
1.04 had no blink. The game was playable. Then blink was introduced later on. The game adjusted. You must not imagine a feature being removed without any changes. After all, we went through beta 5 where you could only gestate in the hives. In summary, every change will always be accomodated. The devs won't just give onos 1 hp and call it 3.3. If they were to do that, they would also change everything around them. So if I say remove blink, I obviously mean something would replace it.
Blink is important to the game. I just think it's far too skill-dependent for most players to use. I mean before, I never saw many people use it properly. Now, it's even harder, because if you hit a wall, your acceleration goes kerplunk.
Anyway, this thread as puzl said, is about opinions and that is my own. I'm not saying yours is wrong or mine is right. I'm saying what I think. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
well then...if you want to remove blink, second hive gives fades acid rocket? that is the counter for jps normally anyway? (aside from lerks or webs) I fully understand what you saying, but in the recent changes to 3.2, removing blink is like finishing aliens off. This leaves the lerk, the only mobile type class, not good. Unless you want to wait for thrid hive, so you can start webbing? aside from webs don't work the same so might not work anyway or the biggest problem, jps can be down within 7-8mins of the game now. Oh and second hive doesn't have any armour anymore, so marines now have wps 3 by the second hive and shooting at paper fades and lerks... yes, balance.
+movement was made so it wouldn't be so skill-dependent but while they made that, they nerfed the fade at the same time and without second hive armour, its almost pointless having it. fades no longer worth 50 res!!! While lerks, they are hardly seen on the ground, they are hidding in the vents...good to know backup is close by....but wait, onos is stronger with three hives? play on larger servers, you never see that thrid hive. Some classes no longer worth the res, what a joke of a patch. What makes it more sad, throughout the beta people been saying this, but NOTHING was changed....well they did boost marine rt health. :/
aside from bugfixs and other changes that don't effect the balance, hive movement is the only good thing aliens gotten.
No the point is not forcing acid rocket into the hive 2 slot. The point is replacing blink with a more user-friendly alternative, one of which could be acid rocket.
I played my first 3.2 game today and I noticed how lopsided it was. Lopsided in that there were 2 great marine aimers with 40-10 scores, while the rest of the team barely broke even. On the alien side, it was more of a disaster. My score was around 2-11, while the others not much better. We did have an excellent fade, who then onosed. And because of this one player, the aliens held out and eventually won the game.
So I really don't know why the fade was nerfed in that aspect. Pro players can still play the fade, albeit a bit worse, but now the average player can't even touch the fade, without being mowed down. Oh and speaking of fade, jps are really the fade for the marines. I was onos in this game, but as soon as I was nearing the marine base, the 40-10 dude had a jp and hmg and hovered above me, spraying his hmg goodness.
As I watched through spectator mode as a lerk player of ours fight the jp, I was amazed how much skill was needed to play as the newly nerfed lerk. I mean it's hard already against a hmg person, but now you are slower.
Then we went to tanith and it wasn't any better. This time, our super fade was afk in the vents. He was kicked and our team lost after I repeatedly yelled cargo. Goes to show how one skilled player can carry a team.
Then the map changed to metal and we had a few good aliens players, while all the other good marines left the server. The marines remaining could not even cap 1 node. Needless to say, the game ended. I left after that and I looked at the server list.
Out of the servers remaining, only 3 were playing the ns mode, the others were the combat or siege. And out of these 3, the one I was playing at actually had people, while the others had placeholding bots. Oh and no 12 player servers were on the list.
<!--quoteo(post=1611334:date=Mar 4 2007, 03:35 PM:name=gumhat)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(gumhat @ Mar 4 2007, 03:35 PM) [snapback]1611334[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> They're not evenly matched, maybe on small 14 player servers there is a equal amount of alien and marine wins, but I dare you to play aliens on a 30 person server. It is 80% alien losses, whereas in 3.1 it was about 50/50. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I find it hard to believe that lowered fade blink acceleration and lower lerk speed would make such a drastic difference, especially considering marine RTs got a considerable reduction in health.
I see I have my filters on. So anything after 100 ping won't show. But I don't find choppy games enjoyable.
We just played a few games on G4B2S and it was very lopsided. We first played on shiva twice. Marines won both. Aliens tried here and there, but marines captured every node and nobody could get out of the hive within minutes of the game.
Then we went on tanith and the first game the aliens won after a failed gorge rush. The second game had aliens on waste and marines secured cargo within the first minutes. Marines pushed and took sat and the game.
I believe skulks, more than ever are pathetic forms and are unbelievably hard against even average players. Later marines take 4 or so bites and it just doesn't seem worth bothering to engage them. Ambushing never works, when marines hold choke points. How well will ambushing work when they've got cargo locked down? You need offense.
Lerk as I've said before is paper. If you don't through a vent perfectly or if you hit a wall by accident, your 30 res investment is gone. It's been like this yes, but even AS a sporing support unit, even peeping out can be fatal to a pistol whip.
Less than ever, people are fading. The more skilled players do this, but even they die very quickly. I try fading and I might get a swipe, but I get back to the hive with 40 hp, only to be chased by an aggressive jp who hmgs me.
Then we get the onos. They can work against heavies, but again, the jps are flying here and there and on big roof maps, you are guaranteed to die.
I don't know what to make of it. The two most critical life forms are now harder than ever to use. The supposed counters to jp are nerfed, in addition to it getting a buff. Skulks are designed to ambush, when you need to offensively push locked hives. Wow.
<!--quoteo(post=1611363:date=Mar 5 2007, 12:39 AM:name=SmoodCroozn)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SmoodCroozn @ Mar 5 2007, 12:39 AM) [snapback]1611363[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> And to kiddo:
1.04 had no blink. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Uh... correct me if im wrong, but i thought 1.04 blink was the INSTANT blink. Like, where you look and click, you were instantly there.
And about g4b2s... i just played on there for four hours. Aliens won plenty, maybe less than half but still near half. The good fades, lerks and oni still rocked the house as was needed, so i dont know where you get your info from. Maybe clanners keep stacking rines when you play? ...and you dont counter them?
Btw what makes 3.2 such a painful version for the aliens in large games? They can now pick dc, which is helpful vs the marine hordes. The reduced rt hp means that the marine rt:s should be going down all the time with 10+ skulks. The +movement should allow leapskulks and fades dominate the game even more. The onos is quite useful too, though the hive armor boost isn't there anymore. Good fades and lerks are still good enough. I thought the alien game went more public player friendly.
Oh and don't tell me its the fades. Fade a couple of weeks and then tell me its the fades if you still feel that way.
I think Marins had the easy part because their weapons were ranged weapons (oposite to close combat => melee alien weapon). And somehow bugs and lag made it possible for alien to keep up the pace. Now; No alien can approach me if i'm in a large place like a hive or something. It's like the slot14 bug (invincible). Each bullet counts. I think it's good and bad. Good because you don't say anymore : Darn!!! a full clip on that skulk and he bited me?!?!?!. On the other hands : "Poor skulky, no chance...".
Some tends to try OC walls... boring
Blance can be adjusted dynamicly upon the player numbers. Just don't divide by zero <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />. Once you get a version that work for 6vs6 to 12vs12 (for example). You have something. Like extra life for hive when 10 player etc... Here i think devs messed up with something ant the aliens pay the bill.
I would weaken the marines a tad in starting firepower but that's just me I guess. A single skulk cannot charge a non-lagging, non-noob marine 1-on-1. They always have hide and ambush. In combat it seems the marines win more in 3.2 than in 3.1 from my estimation. One of those factors is nade spam combined with people with aimbot like accuracy (ie: killing all non-fade or non-onos aliens the instant they see them with flying though the air wearing a jetpack while being whacked on by fades) Honestly the aim isn't the problem. It's the grenade spam spawn camping you get when marines get close to the hive.
Speaking of natural selection classic and 3.2:
The marine RT change seems to be about right, although I think all of the aliens need a somewhat higher base energy regeneration rate and slightly higher base speed ...but ONLY ns maps ideally. I disagree with the comments that 3.2 sucks with NS maps. It's heading slowing toward better balance. I just wish games lasted longer. Ghost structures seems to be a really good idea.
As far as seige maps go I have not played them long enough with people to know how the gameplay feels.
*shrug* that's my 2cents thus far
<!--QuoteBegin-Finawin+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Finawin)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteEBegin-->3.2 is garbage. I have no idea how many rocks were smoked while in development, but I would imagine the number to still be climbing.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So let's be bitter and sarcastic towards the developers because of some changes? To my knowledge you play combat most of the time, I think combat needs better plugins and that the balance with regards to NS seems to be better, or do you have a specific set of problem points? Useless insults solve nothing.
Sarisel.::' ( O ) ';:-. .-.:;' ( O ) '::.Join Date: 2003-07-30Member: 18557Members, Constellation
<!--quoteo(post=1611629:date=Mar 5 2007, 08:03 PM:name=the_x5)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(the_x5 @ Mar 5 2007, 08:03 PM) [snapback]1611629[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So let's be bitter and sarcastic towards the developers because of some changes? To my knowledge you play combat most of the time, I think combat needs better plugins and that the balance with regards to NS seems to be better, or do you have a specific set of problem points? Useless insults solve nothing. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's called venting - something that happens frequently when there isn't an official channel of communication between developers and players. The idea should be to actively participate in a balance feedback thread, possibly making sub-threads to address certain points of grievance. Instead, what is happening is that a thread gets dropped and it seems like a place to drop your load of frustration since nobody that matters is listening anyway.
<!--quoteo(post=1611580:date=Mar 5 2007, 04:02 PM:name=UncleCrunch)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(UncleCrunch @ Mar 5 2007, 04:02 PM) [snapback]1611580[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> I see more Alien quiters.
I think Marins had the easy part because their weapons were ranged weapons (oposite to close combat => melee alien weapon). And somehow bugs and lag made it possible for alien to keep up the pace. Now; No alien can approach me if i'm in a large place like a hive or something. It's like the slot14 bug (invincible). Each bullet counts. I think it's good and bad. Good because you don't say anymore : Darn!!! a full clip on that skulk and he bited me?!?!?!. On the other hands : "Poor skulky, no chance...".
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You know what changed in the LMG marine vs Skulk battle between 3.1 and 3.2?
Thats right, absolutely nothing! Don't complain about how 3.2 makes skulks too weak, because it didnt change skulks at all. Not in the slightest!
And if your being approached by a Lerk or a Fade in that large hive, you're <i>still</i> dead, so I don't really see what you're complaining about.
Comments
What I mean is, unless you HA rush, its impossible to siege a hive when aliens have 2 hives or more, unless marines use a sneak pg tactic, and take down the second hive at their first phase attempt, its pretty much over, second hive aliens using leap+umbra+bile are too strong to hold off without constant support of weapons, meds, and maybe even heavy weapons and HA... which brings me to my next point...
Marine RT health should go back to what it was in 3.1, marines are losing rts faster then they cap them, lets say we are talking about metal, a skulk will munch surface rt, and theres a marine building a pg in heating, untill he will get to surface the rt will be down, and the skulk will be munching storage d, then untill the marine will get there, the skulk can already move to heating, and if the marine will rush off to kill the skulk without building in the process, the skulk can come back just as fast and the marine rts will never be rebuilt...
Now its either cap&protect rts, or attack and lose them all, and hope to survive on kills, because one or two marines are not enough to recap...
Any way, u get my point.... its 95% that marines wont come back from a second hive... (speaking about decent good team work games...)
p.s - Since aliens are already quite overwhelming, I see no reson why fades/lerks should regain speed... they are as good as it is.
I play both pub and competitive NS, every role except Fade, so I have no comments on Fade. I don't play CO.
GAME COMMENTS:
Overall, I love the balance. I love the Marine RT health, it feels just about perfect. The alien power ramp with extra Hives feels just about right. Onos is good, and marines CAN come back from 2 Hives, if the aliens don't press their advantage quickly.
My only complaint is that Jets take a lot of work to counter for their cost. The classical counter to Jets was lerks, but the reduced Lerk speed makes them much less effective at that task. Jets <i>should</i> be pretty good, but I'd like to see one or two <i>minor</i> tweaks here. For example:
--Increase Jetpack cost to 12. (Why all the insistence on having all costs be multiples of 5?), and/or
--Increase Lerk climb speed a little, to help them catch Jets in the air. Vertical climb speed on Fades could stand a little boost as well, and would help the same issue.
Jetpack balance is important, because of their status as the marine's End-game Res Control tool. The Aliens also have an End-game Res Control tool--the Onos. It just so happens that the Marines' Res Control tool is the counter to the Aliens Res Control tool, making the end game res fight very difficult for aliens if they cant effectively counter jets.
That means they could very well be arguing over the last few numbers right up to thursday night, so any changelog released before then might not be accurate.
Ive noticed a pattern in the games I've played for at least the beginning part of a game(i play on small 16 player servers) and it is:
- Marines push out and control most of the maps rts (leaving only like 2 or 3 alien) (no change from what i used to see)
- Marines are teching up, losing a few rts here and there
- Aliens are in a slow losing situation until the first fade shows up
- The fade pushes back the marines pretty far, giving the aliens more chances to bite rts
- Marines get thrown into a losing ground situation
(Proto goes up)
- Marines get HA and get back into the game
- Gets fun after this point
I personally don't got a problem with this (strong <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tsa.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::tsa::" border="0" alt="tsa.gif" /> start, strong <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/hive5.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::hive::" border="0" alt="hive5.gif" /> start-middle), but on the server I play on (Tactical Gamer) I've felt this kind of pattern (on ns_eclipse especially). I don't know if it is 100% correct, because I'm usually the "perma gorge" or the "RT killer skulk".
Ive also noticed that the Fade blink is a little slow, and think there should be an option for either blink (so you can choose the old or the new blink) and the usual balancing of this.
Those are my 2 most-likely wasted cents for this, but besides that I am very pleased. I never played beta 1 much, i really didnt like it, but i like beta 2 much more and only play beta 2.
To compare: 3.1 fade = ferrari, 3.2 fade = honda civic
Edit for correctness: I'd rather see the current blink for non-cele fades and the old <i>acceleration</i> of the blink with the cele fade
sorry for calling you out so strongly as it may hurt your ego, but what in the hell are you doing?
fade blink sucks now too. gg ns. why did you go and do this?
This originally was a rebuttal to a player listing all the changes in 3.2 and explaining why he felt each was a horrible unbalancing move. His biggest issue seemed to be the hive teleport, but imo the chambers in NS were always meant to be equal options for any hive (first, second, third), its just taken them this long to actually balance it out (though SC still needs a touch of a boost).
So, on to the list.
<b>Change #1: Hive teleport.</b>
The player felt that the hive teleport was too unbalanced against the marines, with no actual counters. I think there are ample ways to counter a 3.2 movement rush (which, though no longer requiring movements, the name seems to have stuck).
-The first and easiest is to stop the gorge from putting up the hive, or from spitting it. Sure, some hives can be dropped through the wall, but that onus is on the mapper. But even in those situations, the hive still needs to be spat/used, so if anything, those are the situations most like the 3.1 rush; marines could keep the gorge in the vent while they phase in and prepare for the takedown.
-In other hives where the gorge has to run up to drop it, simply kill the gorge before he gets there. Not always simple, but definitely doable.
-Get mt? With MT you can see any kind of a rush coming.
-Sieges in the hive? I know its a horribly nub option and i hate it, but frankly i think this defensive tactic has gotten a natural boost in 3.2, since movement rushes are so much easier to pull off now.
-Multiple phase gates. Another semi-nub option, but it works surprisingly well. Was playing Lucid on Gorges the other day, and we MC rushed Fear hive about 4 times with multiple onos each time. But they had 2 and then 3 phase gates. It was a tight as hell battle with 4 onos, that finally got the last MC rush to work.
So there ya have it, many strats to counter the new type of MC rush, and im sure there are plenty more. IMO, the new hive teleport IS balanced, and way more fun gameplay. It also unlocks the other upgrade chambers are first chambers, which is a HUGE addition to the general gameplay of NS.
<b>Change #2: Ghost Structures.</b>
I think a lot of players do not understand why or how ghost structures work. Aliens dont bite the ghosts to instantly kill them; they TOUCH them, moving their bodies into the ghosts. That gives an instant recycle for 80% of the cost. Skulks can choose not to touch them, and bite them down, killing them fully. But thats a small part of it.
I think the biggest reason for ghosts was the insanely lame comm strat of dropping rts in alien territory. As in, a comm would listen for eggs at rts, then drop the rt before the gorge can. The gorge would sit there helpless. Even with no marines around, the gorge would have to either wait for a skulk to come by and bite it down, or move on to another rt. A horribly lame situation, which, until now, had absolutely no counter. And it worked pretty well when the comm was devious enough.
So, that was completely solved by ghosts. Also, a large part of trapping was solved. And on top of it all, is the fun factor of the general situations involving ghosts; just recently i was comming, dropped 3 sieges, and had a skulk run through em all. Sure, i only lost 9 res in total from that. But it was also the annoyance. Im sure the skulk was happy with himself. I dropped the sieges again, two got built, but the third (closer to the door) had to be redropped about 4 times before a marine would finally tap it to keep it solid (with me yelling to do so). More dynamics to an already awesomely dynamic game <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
So, perhaps people are missing the point with ghost structures. They arent 'inefficient and pointless' at all... at worst, they dont affect the marine game, and only barely affect the comm's res game. But, for the aliens, they add an interesting ability, as well as a fix to a critical almost-exploit that could cripple the alien res game.
<b>Changes #3: Gameplay changes</b>
These are the numerous other changes in the version.
-LERKS. The lerk cant pancake anymore. Yes, it was an awesome ability, but it WAS kinda stupid. So what happened to the lerk? With the higher base speed and the 3.2 final Climb Speed, the lerk is still one hell of a force to be reckoned with, and its far more customizable. The Silent Lerk is a great option now. In 3.1, they had no chance. 3.2, they can cause some insane havoc. The critical thing is to talk about the 3.2 FINAL lerk, not the 3.2 beta 2 lerk. That 20% less drag on climb made a huge difference.
-Webs. This was another stupid situation. Webs should have always been as balanced as they are in 3.2. Great fix. Webs are still useful as ever, just you cant damn near exploit them and keep a marine stuck there forever.
-Cloak. All the changes to cloak were for the better! All around the board! Its more efficient, and far more intuitive.
-The bilebomb range went down like 15%. Thats a significant change, but nothing serious. Its a huge blob of bile, and in 3.1 the gorge could whip that thing. Consider also its use as an INDIRECT weapon, which is actually not seen often enough. That is, a PG or whatever is on a higher ledge, or on the other side of a wall (with a gap above). The new gorge is much more able to launch a bile over the lip and right into the structures, whereas in 3.1 the bile would more often than not hit the ceiling. Either way, its hardly a nerf worth mentioning, since it can go either way.
-THE ONOS. The onos is now significantly more powerful at 1 hive, and roughly equal at 2 and 3 hives. That health boost is why. And why not? Its supposed to be a tough cookie, and was too weak without Cara before. And the new charge is awesomesauce, noone can deny that. Its actually become frequently used, and useful.
-DCs. They are WICKED now. Pretty much, DC and MC are equal now, and SC is just a touch weaker than the others. And thats for any hive, first, second or third. The role of DCs has changed dramatically, and it will probably be a few months before mainstream players figure out how they are properly used. As in, a single DC put in vents or secure locations around the map for (fast) healing of aliens. Or, a single DC and two OCs; that created a rather formidable WOL, since those DCs heal em fast! Even the hives; they heal hives like MAD! 3% every 2 seconds. Thats like a gorge permanently assigned to healspray on the hive.
-redemption got fixed, or at least far closer to fixed than ever before
-NO TELEFRAG (hi, many aliens lifeforms are now randomly saved... and yes, telefrag has determined the outcome of games before)
-The fade changes are obviously noticeable, but that in itself is a huge debate over whether it was for the better or not. Frankly, either way, i think its nicely balanced for its role.
-And the biggest change of all, though already mentioned... is the hive teleport.
These are other changes (of course), but the post was mostly a rebuttal to a player saying the aliens got nerfed by all these changes. I think its different, but great, and outlined a lot (but not all) of it here.
So there ya have it. IMO, 3.2 is by far the best version out to date.
My opinion is that instead of the "making it harder" route, go with something easier. I'd go so far as to remove blink. It's only helped a few great players in the past and in the future, it's a pain to play with. I'm not saying acid rocket should take it's place as it did in 1.04, but at least that was a weapon that nearly everybody could use.
I also want the lerk to be a support class and not the rambo as it is in 3.1, but I don't like it being paper and dying from a pistol whip, if you aren't looking at a certain direction. Perhaps the spikes were better as they kept the lerk from a distance. Again, I like the goal which is keep it a support guy and not rambo, but paper health makes even looking a risk.
I'd like silence to be looked at, especially when MT goes up. Most aliens use celerity as speed is quiet essential for anything here. I'd like for it to be given some use after MT.
You don't have a player matching system like Warcraft III or Halo 2. So I suggest methods of equalizing player performance. My theory is that if the game becomes easier, player potentials will become similar. And the result of that would be that since results are more predictable, the game in turn would be easier to balance.
I can't understand with the problems with fade, lerk and even armour boost taken away. But to solve it by removing blink? you might not understand the importance of blink than. The devs are screwing aliens every patch they release, sure bugfixs and other neat things are added, but with all the things done to aliens, might as well love those bugfixs. Even with the 3.2 beta1-2 going public, everybody started to comment about these changes, but also few or none even were noticed. When the final came out, almost nothing that was 'debated' or 'adviced' came into play. So long you keep balancing this game for 6v6, while the avg. server is 18+ player...co maps will be replacing ns servers. Your making it EASY to play marines, while aliens is harder? I remember somebody posted saying rt health is too low? are you kidding me? lol? you lower it to 5000, but you bump it to 5500? the people who comment here are way to close to the project to want to say anything bad about the releases or really care? bah who
Some servers see more alien wins and some see more marine wins, depending on how they use their settings and how skilled the players are, but overall both teams are about evenly matched. The balance is much better than it was in 3.1. Some people just like complaining about anything that hurts their favorite play style.
And to kiddo:
1.04 had no blink. The game was playable. Then blink was introduced later on. The game adjusted. You must not imagine a feature being removed without any changes. After all, we went through beta 5 where you could only gestate in the hives. In summary, every change will always be accomodated. The devs won't just give onos 1 hp and call it 3.3. If they were to do that, they would also change everything around them. So if I say remove blink, I obviously mean something would replace it.
Blink is important to the game. I just think it's far too skill-dependent for most players to use. I mean before, I never saw many people use it properly. Now, it's even harder, because if you hit a wall, your acceleration goes kerplunk.
Anyway, this thread as puzl said, is about opinions and that is my own. I'm not saying yours is wrong or mine is right. I'm saying what I think.
They're not evenly matched, maybe on small 14 player servers there is a equal amount of alien and marine wins, but I dare you to play aliens on a 30 person server. It is 80% alien losses, whereas in 3.1 it was about 50/50.
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30-player servers have always experienced weird dynamics because they have such a magnified threshold effect. The sheer volume of free LMGs wandering around makes life really tough for the aliens until they hit 50 res, which takes much longer than in smaller games because of the res distribution--but once they DO hit 50 res, you can suddenly have 5 fades running around at the same time, which is virtually impossible for the marines to counter. Plus, having 15 players means the aliens have a staggering 375 <b>free</b> starting res, meaning the marine's can never hope to win by doing even res trades.
Really, if aliens are still struggling in that scenario, you just have to make one tiny little change to fix it:
mp_friendlyfire 1.
Really, try it. That will solve all your problems with massed <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/asrifle.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::asrifle::" border="0" alt="asrifle.gif" /> , because they'll all be shooting each other instead of you.
I believe that had to do with a couple of skilled fades or lerks that held the alien team afloat enough to wear the marines down.
And to kiddo:
1.04 had no blink. The game was playable. Then blink was introduced later on. The game adjusted. You must not imagine a feature being removed without any changes. After all, we went through beta 5 where you could only gestate in the hives. In summary, every change will always be accomodated. The devs won't just give onos 1 hp and call it 3.3. If they were to do that, they would also change everything around them. So if I say remove blink, I obviously mean something would replace it.
Blink is important to the game. I just think it's far too skill-dependent for most players to use. I mean before, I never saw many people use it properly. Now, it's even harder, because if you hit a wall, your acceleration goes kerplunk.
Anyway, this thread as puzl said, is about opinions and that is my own. I'm not saying yours is wrong or mine is right. I'm saying what I think.
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well then...if you want to remove blink, second hive gives fades acid rocket? that is the counter for jps normally anyway? (aside from lerks or webs) I fully understand what you saying, but in the recent changes to 3.2, removing blink is like finishing aliens off. This leaves the lerk, the only mobile type class, not good. Unless you want to wait for thrid hive, so you can start webbing? aside from webs don't work the same so might not work anyway or the biggest problem, jps can be down within 7-8mins of the game now. Oh and second hive doesn't have any armour anymore, so marines now have wps 3 by the second hive and shooting at paper fades and lerks... yes, balance.
+movement was made so it wouldn't be so skill-dependent but while they made that, they nerfed the fade at the same time and without second hive armour, its almost pointless having it. fades no longer worth 50 res!!! While lerks, they are hardly seen on the ground, they are hidding in the vents...good to know backup is close by....but wait, onos is stronger with three hives? play on larger servers, you never see that thrid hive. Some classes no longer worth the res, what a joke of a patch. What makes it more sad, throughout the beta people been saying this, but NOTHING was changed....well they did boost marine rt health. :/
aside from bugfixs and other changes that don't effect the balance, hive movement is the only good thing aliens gotten.
I played my first 3.2 game today and I noticed how lopsided it was. Lopsided in that there were 2 great marine aimers with 40-10 scores, while the rest of the team barely broke even. On the alien side, it was more of a disaster. My score was around 2-11, while the others not much better. We did have an excellent fade, who then onosed. And because of this one player, the aliens held out and eventually won the game.
So I really don't know why the fade was nerfed in that aspect. Pro players can still play the fade, albeit a bit worse, but now the average player can't even touch the fade, without being mowed down. Oh and speaking of fade, jps are really the fade for the marines. I was onos in this game, but as soon as I was nearing the marine base, the 40-10 dude had a jp and hmg and hovered above me, spraying his hmg goodness.
As I watched through spectator mode as a lerk player of ours fight the jp, I was amazed how much skill was needed to play as the newly nerfed lerk. I mean it's hard already against a hmg person, but now you are slower.
Then we went to tanith and it wasn't any better. This time, our super fade was afk in the vents. He was kicked and our team lost after I repeatedly yelled cargo. Goes to show how one skilled player can carry a team.
Then the map changed to metal and we had a few good aliens players, while all the other good marines left the server. The marines remaining could not even cap 1 node. Needless to say, the game ended. I left after that and I looked at the server list.
Out of the servers remaining, only 3 were playing the ns mode, the others were the combat or siege. And out of these 3, the one I was playing at actually had people, while the others had placeholding bots. Oh and no 12 player servers were on the list.
34 Non-empty NS-mode servers, of which only 6 are running custom maps. Innumerable CO servers.
Maybe you were just checking during off-peak hours?
How many servers have bots?
How many servers are in NA vs EU or AU or SA?
How many servers are actually playable and don't have crappy ping spikes?
They're not evenly matched, maybe on small 14 player servers there is a equal amount of alien and marine wins, but I dare you to play aliens on a 30 person server. It is 80% alien losses, whereas in 3.1 it was about 50/50.
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I find it hard to believe that lowered fade blink acceleration and lower lerk speed would make such a drastic difference, especially considering marine RTs got a considerable reduction in health.
We just played a few games on G4B2S and it was very lopsided. We first played on shiva twice. Marines won both. Aliens tried here and there, but marines captured every node and nobody could get out of the hive within minutes of the game.
Then we went on tanith and the first game the aliens won after a failed gorge rush. The second game had aliens on waste and marines secured cargo within the first minutes. Marines pushed and took sat and the game.
I believe skulks, more than ever are pathetic forms and are unbelievably hard against even average players. Later marines take 4 or so bites and it just doesn't seem worth bothering to engage them. Ambushing never works, when marines hold choke points. How well will ambushing work when they've got cargo locked down? You need offense.
Lerk as I've said before is paper. If you don't through a vent perfectly or if you hit a wall by accident, your 30 res investment is gone. It's been like this yes, but even AS a sporing support unit, even peeping out can be fatal to a pistol whip.
Less than ever, people are fading. The more skilled players do this, but even they die very quickly. I try fading and I might get a swipe, but I get back to the hive with 40 hp, only to be chased by an aggressive jp who hmgs me.
Then we get the onos. They can work against heavies, but again, the jps are flying here and there and on big roof maps, you are guaranteed to die.
I don't know what to make of it. The two most critical life forms are now harder than ever to use. The supposed counters to jp are nerfed, in addition to it getting a buff. Skulks are designed to ambush, when you need to offensively push locked hives. Wow.
And to kiddo:
1.04 had no blink.
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Uh... correct me if im wrong, but i thought 1.04 blink was the INSTANT blink. Like, where you look and click, you were instantly there.
And about g4b2s... i just played on there for four hours. Aliens won plenty, maybe less than half but still near half. The good fades, lerks and oni still rocked the house as was needed, so i dont know where you get your info from. Maybe clanners keep stacking rines when you play? ...and you dont counter them?
Oh and don't tell me its the fades. Fade a couple of weeks and then tell me its the fades if you still feel that way.
I think Marins had the easy part because their weapons were ranged weapons (oposite to close combat => melee alien weapon). And somehow bugs and lag made it possible for alien to keep up the pace. Now; No alien can approach me if i'm in a large place like a hive or something. It's like the slot14 bug (invincible). Each bullet counts. I think it's good and bad. Good because you don't say anymore : Darn!!! a full clip on that skulk and he bited me?!?!?!. On the other hands : "Poor skulky, no chance...".
Some tends to try OC walls... boring
Blance can be adjusted dynamicly upon the player numbers. Just don't divide by zero <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />. Once you get a version that work for 6vs6 to 12vs12 (for example). You have something. Like extra life for hive when 10 player etc... Here i think devs messed up with something ant the aliens pay the bill.
It seems blockscript is not set on all servers...
I would weaken the marines a tad in starting firepower but that's just me I guess. A single skulk cannot charge a non-lagging, non-noob marine 1-on-1. They always have hide and ambush. In combat it seems the marines win more in 3.2 than in 3.1 from my estimation. One of those factors is nade spam combined with people with aimbot like accuracy (ie: killing all non-fade or non-onos aliens the instant they see them with flying though the air wearing a jetpack while being whacked on by fades) Honestly the aim isn't the problem. It's the grenade spam spawn camping you get when marines get close to the hive.
Speaking of natural selection classic and 3.2:
The marine RT change seems to be about right, although I think all of the aliens need a somewhat higher base energy regeneration rate and slightly higher base speed ...but ONLY ns maps ideally. I disagree with the comments that 3.2 sucks with NS maps. It's heading slowing toward better balance. I just wish games lasted longer. Ghost structures seems to be a really good idea.
As far as seige maps go I have not played them long enough with people to know how the gameplay feels.
*shrug* that's my 2cents thus far
<!--QuoteBegin-Finawin+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Finawin)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteEBegin-->3.2 is garbage. I have no idea how many rocks were smoked while in development, but I would imagine the number to still be climbing.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So let's be bitter and sarcastic towards the developers because of some changes? To my knowledge you play combat most of the time, I think combat needs better plugins and that the balance with regards to NS seems to be better, or do you have a specific set of problem points? Useless insults solve nothing.
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It's called venting - something that happens frequently when there isn't an official channel of communication between developers and players. The idea should be to actively participate in a balance feedback thread, possibly making sub-threads to address certain points of grievance. Instead, what is happening is that a thread gets dropped and it seems like a place to drop your load of frustration since nobody that matters is listening anyway.
I see more Alien quiters.
I think Marins had the easy part because their weapons were ranged weapons (oposite to close combat => melee alien weapon). And somehow bugs and lag made it possible for alien to keep up the pace. Now; No alien can approach me if i'm in a large place like a hive or something. It's like the slot14 bug (invincible). Each bullet counts. I think it's good and bad. Good because you don't say anymore : Darn!!! a full clip on that skulk and he bited me?!?!?!. On the other hands : "Poor skulky, no chance...".
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You know what changed in the LMG marine vs Skulk battle between 3.1 and 3.2?
Thats right, absolutely nothing! Don't complain about how 3.2 makes skulks too weak, because it didnt change skulks at all. Not in the slightest!
And if your being approached by a Lerk or a Fade in that large hive, you're <i>still</i> dead, so I don't really see what you're complaining about.
But when you take that out, aliens become as good as the PS3.
Aliens are nerfed especially Fades.
Rines have the upperhand now.