Will NS2 be more like the good old NS?
LordHorusNL
Join Date: 2009-08-31 Member: 68658Members
Join Date: 2009-08-31 Member: 68658Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Will games last more than 20 minutes.</div>I was wondering if the developers could release some more information about the type of gameplay we can expect from natural selection 2.
I played NS for years "since the first release" and had to stop a few years back before the combat gametype was released, i remember playing these awesome games that could take up to 4 hours with heavy combat and great tactics. So today i thought Hell! why not install NS again and have some fun, this is however not what i found!
Matches now take no more than 20 minutes on most pubs, structures can be built in 3 seconds "i remember when it was more like 30 and that kicked ass" and alien movement has become so fast it looks like they are moving at warp speed.
It became clear to me today that all that was good about NS is dead, and before i pre-order my NS2 SE i would like to know if it is in some way going to return to that great experience i had all those years ago? or is it going to be the same mess that is NS 2.0+?
Also whats up with marines not being able to "build" structures? will normal marines only be able to engage in combat now? (i love running between sites in NS repairing structures) and what do other players think about the gameplay type/speed? NS 1.04 or NS 2.0+
I played NS for years "since the first release" and had to stop a few years back before the combat gametype was released, i remember playing these awesome games that could take up to 4 hours with heavy combat and great tactics. So today i thought Hell! why not install NS again and have some fun, this is however not what i found!
Matches now take no more than 20 minutes on most pubs, structures can be built in 3 seconds "i remember when it was more like 30 and that kicked ass" and alien movement has become so fast it looks like they are moving at warp speed.
It became clear to me today that all that was good about NS is dead, and before i pre-order my NS2 SE i would like to know if it is in some way going to return to that great experience i had all those years ago? or is it going to be the same mess that is NS 2.0+?
Also whats up with marines not being able to "build" structures? will normal marines only be able to engage in combat now? (i love running between sites in NS repairing structures) and what do other players think about the gameplay type/speed? NS 1.04 or NS 2.0+
Comments
"No, we're not planning to include a combat mode in NS2 at this time. We expect that the community will use our modding tools to recreate Combat along with many other game modes."
I think 30 minute average for matches is a good target. Any shorter and games become too hectic, any longer and it will become boring playing so many long matches. I play Left 4 Dead matches and they average about 90 minutes long... everyone gets tired, nobody wants to play more than once a night, and the game is just boring after a while. I think NS2 should be more dynamic, allowing for fast strats to end the game quickly, or for long, drawn out epic battles. Would be awesome if teams could specialize in one or the other.
That's not "epic;" that's bad game design.
Games should not last 4 hours.
That's not "epic;" that's bad game design.
Games should not last 4 hours.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Says you.
If a team is lazy or doesn't communicate enough they should lose in the classic mode. Outside of all that, I'm hoping they'll get the right mix in NS2 so you still get a feeling of accomplishment after winning a hard fought game.
I'm not exactly for the eternity games either, but this... In most 20 minute games the victor is decided at the latest by 5 minutes.
Well, you found the problem. I'd like to have 20 minutes of meaningful and interesting gameplay. At best NS 3.2 is capabable of creating even 40+ minutes of absolutely marvellous play, but it doesn't show up often enough. Improving the gameplay structure so that uneven games finish quick, but even ones aren't decided too early should in my opinion be one of the major aims of NS2.
Garbage is a bit harsh, don't you think?
Rough around the edges maybe. :P
People need to eat, go to bath, have exercise etc. I also believe most loong matches occur because of bad game design (Tremulous) and excessive turtling.
Most <i>stalemates</i> are due to bad game design. Long matches are natural in a well balanced game of closely matched players.
DINGDINGDING we have a winner!
Rough around the edges maybe. :P<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No, I was being polite.
Would help your team bounce back during a last-ditch defense, and wouldn't help offense - they might get half their team back, but they would still have to move across the map again, and mounting an offense with half the team dead usually won't do much
Or decreasing the respawn time if you're an alien dying on infestation or marine off infestation...the nanites/bacteria interfere with the data that needs to be sent back to the hive/IP to allow the player to return if you're not on your own element :P
It won't solve the problem with turtling, but that can always be fixed in other ways
BACON!
I think the way NS1 did with beacon what quite good. The commander can use some res at crucial times to bring back the team.
I think the way NS1 did with beacon what quite good. The commander can use some res at crucial times to bring back the team.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
completely forgot about beacon (how embarrassing!) yes, it was quite useful at important times.
But we don't know if it will be back in NS2, and it was only for marines anyway...
Since they are so rare, that sort of indicates the game is unbalanced right now... and it is... you need 15 marines before things get interesting or else it's instant alien win every time... :P
So for a long-match to occur, their would have to be something wrong with the alien team with respect to the research-efforts-res-collecting of the marine team... One possible cause is when a game starts between 2 players... and later on the server fills up with an unusual starting point :P
The BEST!!! map for a long match is cerbsiege!!! reason being... marines can seal up those RTs with weldable walls... this and a relocate to the bunker (plus good marines) means that the marines can repeatedly be geared up and beaconed into marine start (where the door/teleporter is to the siege room)... so marines can have many shots at trying to secure the siege room... or the alternative is that marines fight through the halls all the way to the alien hive... either way that map is epic under the right conditions.
Another good map is digsiege_fnl. As long as marines don't go the easy route of getting into siege room... the other choice is a heavy train through the rocks to alien-start... now that can be epic. Other situations that can occur is marines relocate to the 5-rt tunnel and have to fight their way out because aliens OC'd the entire map...
zzzz no server runs these epic maps anymore... usually it's just the standard crap co_core ns_eclipse ns_hera ns_nothing ######.
So for a long-match to occur, their would have to be something wrong with the alien team with respect to the research-efforts-res-collecting of the marine team... One possible cause is when a game starts between 2 players... and later on the server fills up with an unusual starting point :P
The BEST!!! map for a long match is cerbsiege!!! reason being... marines can seal up those RTs with weldable walls... this and a relocate to the bunker (plus good marines) means that the marines can repeatedly be geared up and beaconed into marine start (where the door/teleporter is to the siege room)... so marines can have many shots at trying to secure the siege room... or the alternative is that marines fight through the halls all the way to the alien hive... either way that map is epic under the right conditions.
Another good map is digsiege_fnl. As long as marines don't go the easy route of getting into siege room... the other choice is a heavy train through the rocks to alien-start... now that can be epic. Other situations that can occur is marines relocate to the 5-rt tunnel and have to fight their way out because aliens OC'd the entire map...
zzzz no server runs these epic maps anymore... usually it's just the standard crap co_core ns_eclipse ns_hera ns_nothing ######.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
...?
In reality with even teams, that knew what they were doing, the game length didn't change all that much. What changed was the the time it took from the start of the game til the aliens got a second hive, while the overall time really didn't change that much.
But you cant balance for skill. Any game thats decided by the 5th minute, at least in public play, usually has the dominant or stacked side. try evening the teams up a bit more skill wise and you might see better games. you're not always guaranteed to win this way but hey you'll at least get the games you so desperatly crave. even though 1.04 was a horrible turtle fest of tiny onos hitboxes and even worse fading mechanics.
<!--quoteo(post=1726381:date=Sep 6 2009, 11:29 PM:name=homicide)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (homicide @ Sep 6 2009, 11:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726381"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->...?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
the correct response is "...!"