Alien Commander threatens NS2 Survival
uber_earp
Join Date: 2008-12-16 Member: 65784Members
Join Date: 2008-12-16 Member: 65784Members
Please don't do the ALIEN COMMANDER.
The beauty of the NS is the dichotomy and distinction between how each team operates. If you guys do implement an Alien Commander in this, I'm telling you now that people aren't going to play it for long.
Look, we love NS, heck I was one of the uber nerds that bought the Special Edition Account! Everyone is looking forward to this game because of how fond we are of the NS as we know it. So it is foolish to think that the same level of love and excitement NS will exist if its premise is altered so dramatically.
It's all about expectation. Expectation is based on a reality we know now, and that is the unique game style of NS1. Then it follows that the expectation must only be a "better" NS1. Too much change will be dangerous. And I'm already have second guesses about my purchase, putting hope in a reverse mod of this engine to NS1 original game play.
I sincerely hope you take this to heart. And PLEASE, let me know if anyone else feels the same way.
I'm not try to be threatening or antagonistic. (So any rage posts in response betray a user's intemperance, and illegitimacy of his/her claims)
The beauty of the NS is the dichotomy and distinction between how each team operates. If you guys do implement an Alien Commander in this, I'm telling you now that people aren't going to play it for long.
Look, we love NS, heck I was one of the uber nerds that bought the Special Edition Account! Everyone is looking forward to this game because of how fond we are of the NS as we know it. So it is foolish to think that the same level of love and excitement NS will exist if its premise is altered so dramatically.
It's all about expectation. Expectation is based on a reality we know now, and that is the unique game style of NS1. Then it follows that the expectation must only be a "better" NS1. Too much change will be dangerous. And I'm already have second guesses about my purchase, putting hope in a reverse mod of this engine to NS1 original game play.
I sincerely hope you take this to heart. And PLEASE, let me know if anyone else feels the same way.
I'm not try to be threatening or antagonistic. (So any rage posts in response betray a user's intemperance, and illegitimacy of his/her claims)
Comments
But really, you're complaining about something that you haven't even seen in practice. It could always be scrapped later. I mean, the game hasn't even hit alpha yet.
But really, you're complaining about something that you haven't even seen in practice. It could always be scrapped later. I mean, the game hasn't even hit alpha yet.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
For the 1st bit: LOL
And for the 2nd bit: I completly agree with you.
There are 2 factions, just like NS with unique classes. Then they decided to give each faction the otherès unique class and the game became SOOO boring. Symmetry is boring.
now i dpnt think itèll kill ns, just dampen the fun
Yes, asymmetry in the teams is part of what made NS1 fun and unique, and giving aliens commanders makes the two teams more similar in function. <b><!--sizeo:7--><span style="font-size:36pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->BUT,<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec--></b> we also don't know what OTHER features that UWE has yet to introduce that will help offset this and push the teams farther apart again.
Yes, asymmetry in the teams is part of what made NS1 fun and unique, and giving aliens commanders makes the two teams more similar in function. <b><!--sizeo:7--><span style="font-size:36pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->BUT,<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec--></b> we also don't know what OTHER features that UWE has yet to introduce that will help offset this and push the teams farther apart again.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Or for that matter what the role of the alien commander will even be. Right now all you can do is look at a list of unavailable upgrades and spam builders, which is pretty barebones. There's still plenty of room for UWE to make the alien vs marine commander roles distinct within the context of an RTS overlay.
but either way - why dont we wait an see - scrapping things is the easy part
if there is anything affecting the survival of ns2, its people that are unable to come to terms with change.
you aren't even willing to give it a fair go.
I hold hope that as the alpha evolves we will see the two teams begin to diverge in dramatic ways :D
...I'm telling you now that people aren't going to play it for long.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Is it really necessary to make dramatic claims about the game's success or failure based on one change? Nobody will base their enjoyment on one single feature, and the drama only loses you credibility. Projecting your opinion on others doesn't make it more valid.
The alien team appears to have the most change, but it seems well planned and I think it can work. The hives now get upgraded, they spread creep, and the alien commander does general upgrades/chamber duty. The commander does the econ/macro, while the gorges get to tend the creep and the chambers. Gorges support the commander directly, so there is actually going to be additional gorge strategy going on :D
I think it will make alien gameplay a LOT less chaotic, and if done properly has the potential to make the games a lot more dynamic and responsive in terms of strategy. I think way more complicated things can happen when you can distribute the workload to multiple commanders, and it also reduces the impact of bad gorges and or bad single commanders.
I can't wait to see it come together :)
First I heard of Natural Selection was in a thread about this game, Battleswarm, that pits a team of 6 FPS marines against two RTS players commanding a horde of bugs. Basic sentiment was "NS already did this better"
I was surprised to find that NS2 is nothing like that, it's not FPS vs RTS, it's more FPS + RTS vs FPS + RTS. I'll be the first to admit my opinion isn't really valid because I never played the first game, but I think that's a great formula.
I do agree with the sentiment that each team should have different abilities, but then I realized they already do. Marines have a choice between various types of guns, alien players have classes to choose from, gorge builds and maintains, skulk running up/along walls and roofs, and even one that flies and can launch clouds of gas.
If I say anything else, let me say this: wait and see!
I hold hope that as the alpha evolves we will see the two teams begin to diverge in dramatic ways :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I love being a gorge so I shed a little tear when i could not build res towers. ;-)
But most pub ns2 games I play these days noone builds res and that really gimps the alien team (having two fades but 1 res tower, *sigh*). Much as i lurve my gorge, if this gets fixed then im happy for the gorge to be a hydra dropping, heal machine.
The alien life forms are so radically different to the marine side that my :-( at the two commanders quickly went away once i realised that this just changes the role of the gorge to hydra-dropping and team support. Push him forward as a team helper. (I dont see that the marines have that role, so asymmetry is still there).
Im scared that my little fatboy will be up in the front lines, but if that is what it takes to defeat the marine vermin then im willing to waddle up the front.
Also, given the beautiful lua interface to the core game, it wont take long for someone to code ns1 in ns2. ;-) (I for one will love to get away from hl1 textures. ;-)
That's not what it's about, at least for me.
I love a lot of the changes I'm seeing, but I really do think this one is a bad idea. As everyone else has said before, it's the differences between the teams that made NS1 what it was. An alien comm was always joked about before, but I never would have seriously considered myself.
I loved the alien team setup in that all of you are free individuals working towards the same thing, guided by instinct (hivesight) and teamwork. The marines operated more like a tactical unit, with orders coming from one place and being carried out either by assigned people or by whoever could do it.
Reworking the alien building/upgrades system, sure I could see that. Add an all-out RTS alien comm...
I will wait until I see it fully implemented and working, maybe they'll surprise me, but I'm really skeptical.
The beauty of the NS is the dichotomy and distinction between how each team operates. If you guys do implement an Alien Commander in this, I'm telling you now that people aren't going to play it for long.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Only now do you want to ###### about what was well known for like a year?
NS2 is NOT NS1 + GRAPHICS. And by being distinct from its predecessor it is guaranteed that no matter how popular NS2 gets, there will always be NS1 servers to play on.
The beauty of the NS is the dichotomy and distinction between how each team operates. If you guys do implement an Alien Commander in this, I'm telling you now that people aren't going to play it for long.
Look, we love NS, heck I was one of the uber nerds that bought the Special Edition Account! Everyone is looking forward to this game because of how fond we are of the NS as we know it. So it is foolish to think that the same level of love and excitement NS will exist if its premise is altered so dramatically.
It's all about expectation. Expectation is based on a reality we know now, and that is the unique game style of NS1. Then it follows that the expectation must only be a "better" NS1. Too much change will be dangerous. And I'm already have second guesses about my purchase, putting hope in a reverse mod of this engine to NS1 original game play.
I sincerely hope you take this to heart. And PLEASE, let me know if anyone else feels the same way.
I'm not try to be threatening or antagonistic. (So any rage posts in response betray a user's intemperance, and illegitimacy of his/her claims)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Also, if the game is too much the same, it won't seem so much as a sequel as just a high-res textured NS1. That may make a lot of people get bored faster, but who knows... But eitherway... They made NS1 so well, they know what they are doing. Give them a chance.
NS2 is NOT NS1 + GRAPHICS. And by being distinct from its predecessor it is guaranteed that no matter how popular NS2 gets, there will always be NS1 servers to play on.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So basically the entirety of everything that is NS2 is summed up in the fact that both teams have commanders now, and if you dislike this ONE aspect you dislike every single new thing and change they've added into NS2?
Seriously guys he's bringing up ONE issue, NS2 is built upon MANY changes, rendering the entire go play NS1 argument completely invalid, and cliched.
Another vote for NO ALIEN COMMANDER!!!
I'm hoping that they know what they are doing, and I'm hoping that they will be able to add enough to make the alien commander a compelling feature of NS2 rather than this weird new feature that doesn't really fit in with the rest of the world of NS.
Seriously guys he's bringing up ONE issue, NS2 is built upon MANY changes, rendering the entire go play NS1 argument completely invalid, and cliched.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
+1
Throwing the "Go play NS1 then" in the OP's face is childish.
For the record I'm not really keen on the alien comm at the moment either. It feels a bit tweedle dum, tweedle dee.
1. FPS+RTS with a commander for the marines with the aim of the game to work as a team to destroy each others bases
2. Just FPS with no commanders and each player fighting mostly solo gaining xp for killing the enemy which you could use to upgrade yourself to gain new weapons armour and abilities. Ultimately there was still the aim to destroy each others bases but would only happen later in games.
3. other fun maps like gorge rush which was a race of who could get to the end course first while being a gorge only but there were others which I forget at this time
From my experience the most played maps and servers were mostly of type 2 as it removed the need to rely on good commanders or gorges but still punished bad players for dying too easy and giving XP to the enemy. So from this perspective having commanders at all is not needed.
This said some of the most satisfying games of ns1 were when the whole team would play as a team to grind out a win under a good commander or leadership.