It's the 3 rifle sound variations they talked about earlier. I guess when you spawn you will randomly spawn with 1 of the 3 different firing sounds from your lmg, a good idea if you ask me.
The 3 sound variations refers to (I think) the sound that the rifle makes when you fire a bullet. Currently, there is only one sound. They added 2 different shot sounds so the rifle doesn't sound like the same audio track looping over and over again. At least that's my understanding of it, I know that is how the AK-47 worked in counter-strike.
alrighty then. kinda like in the ww2 call of duty games how the mg42 had like half a dozen different firing sounds lol. was fun holding down the mouse for a couple seconds, letting go, press again for a new sound rinse repeat.
IeptBarakatThe most difficult name to speak ingame.Join Date: 2009-07-10Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
<!--quoteo(post=1792572:date=Aug 6 2010, 06:45 PM:name=DJPenguin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DJPenguin @ Aug 6 2010, 06:45 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1792572"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->well what if i wanted rifle instead of the rifle? can i choose rifle?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't see how this makes any sense. Isn't it counter-intuitive to have different sounds for the exact same gun. Doesn't having a different sound imply different ammo/damage?
What other FPS does this? I don't think weapon repetition is bad at all. How has it ever been a problem? Guns that are the same make the same sound. Pretty simple.
Personally I'd think it's the acoustics of the room people happen to be in is what should make weapons sound different, but I guess that's not really an option (right?)... so slight changes in the pitch and whatnot of the firing sound should do the trick nicely?
<!--quoteo(post=1792665:date=Aug 7 2010, 04:23 AM:name=FuzionMonkey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FuzionMonkey @ Aug 7 2010, 04:23 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1792665"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't see how this makes any sense. Isn't it counter-intuitive to have different sounds for the exact same gun. Doesn't having a different sound imply different ammo/damage?
What other FPS does this? I don't think weapon repetition is bad at all. How has it ever been a problem? Guns that are the same make the same sound. Pretty simple.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Why does it matter if any other FPS game does it or not? By that kind of thinking NS should never had combined RTS with FPS since no other FPS game has done it before. Also not every identical gun model sounds exactly the same. Finally this takes place in the future, in a alternate universe, so obviously things will be different in NS as opposed to the real world, that's kinda the point.
<!--quoteo(post=1792568:date=Aug 7 2010, 07:33 AM:name=CPCheebs)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CPCheebs @ Aug 7 2010, 07:33 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1792568"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The 3 sound variations refers to (I think) the sound that the rifle makes when you fire a bullet. Currently, there is only one sound. They added 2 different shot sounds so the rifle doesn't sound like the same audio track looping over and over again. At least that's my understanding of it, I know that is how the AK-47 worked in counter-strike.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> That isn't quite right. Simon explained it in a thread, I don't remember which, but essentially: When you spawn, you spawn with one of three rifles. (They are the same guns, but their sounds are different.) Each rifle sounds different to the other two. I recall reading that each firing "sound" is made up of three sounds: a starting up shot, intermediate shots, and ending shot. So essentially a total of nine sounds, in three groups, for the rifle?
yeh, it actually can be a problem to have the exact same waveform playing for each gun. for one thing the sound will get old very fast, and also if two ppl start shooting at almost the same time, u will get really nasty phasing. and u can imagine the mess that would happen if there are 16 rifles shooting at the same time. :s
i dont know of any games that are using this strategy exactly but its very common to have different variations and for the same weapon, crysis for example has way more than we do, from what ive seen it looks like they have diferent sounds for close, near, far, inside, outside, all times x 2 because AI use different sound sets to the player.
the 3 variations we are doing are designd to work as a sort of under the hood type thing. its not about making the guns sound compleatly different or like they have different ammo, its about creating a more natural sounding game, hearing the exact same wavform over n over can become really grating and break immersion, think about how jaring it is to hear a CD skipping.
the different sound sets we are using are acually quite similar so idealy when ur concentrating killing aliens u houldent even notice that this is going on.
also we do have different reverbs for diffrent sized rooms ect. but that dosnt really help this problem when ur in a particular reverb sphere all 3d sounds u hear are affected by that particualr reverb to some degree, so it would still be the same sound with the same reverb.
<!--quoteo(post=1792679:date=Aug 7 2010, 07:56 AM:name=TheGivingTree)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TheGivingTree @ Aug 7 2010, 07:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1792679"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Why does it matter if any other FPS game does it or not? By that kind of thinking NS should never had combined RTS with FPS since no other FPS game has done it before. Also not every identical gun model sounds exactly the same. Finally this takes place in the future, in a alternate universe, so obviously things will be different in NS as opposed to the real world, that's kinda the point.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
How is that relevant at all? I'm not saying NS can't be different than other games, I'm merely pointing out that "the weapon sound problem" isn't really a problem at all - it hasn't been enough of a problem for any other game to do some weird sound system.
The environment soundscapes should be enough to provide sound differentiation. I do like the idea of different sounds for different distances, though. That makes sense to me.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but did NS1 have anything like this? What makes NS2 different from NS1? I don't remember gun sounds being an issue at all...
<!--quoteo(post=1792749:date=Aug 7 2010, 08:40 PM:name=Zek)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Zek @ Aug 7 2010, 08:40 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1792749"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If anything I'd rather see the sound change as weapon upgrades are researched.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That makes a lot of sense.
I don't get why there needs to be 3 random sounds for the same weapon. How is that even possible? Don't the same guns make the same noises?
<!--quoteo(post=1792748:date=Aug 7 2010, 02:34 PM:name=FuzionMonkey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FuzionMonkey @ Aug 7 2010, 02:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1792748"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->How is that relevant at all? I'm not saying NS can't be different than other games, I'm merely pointing out that "the weapon sound problem" isn't really a problem at all - it hasn't been enough of a problem for any other game to do some weird sound system.
The environment soundscapes should be enough to provide sound differentiation. I do like the idea of different sounds for different distances, though. That makes sense to me.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but did NS1 have anything like this? What makes NS2 different from NS1? I don't remember gun sounds being an issue at all...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly how is it relevant? Which is why I don't get why you brought it up in the first place. Also who ever said it was a problem?? No one, all it is, is a change, a new feature.
<!--quoteo(post=1792748:date=Aug 7 2010, 03:34 PM:name=FuzionMonkey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FuzionMonkey @ Aug 7 2010, 03:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1792748"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->[this] isn't really a problem at all - it hasn't been enough of a problem for any other game to do some weird sound system.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Lols, yes it is, I've seen numerous games with different fire-sounds, it's not that uncommon. They've not gone so far as to make you spawn with a weapon that has a sole fire-sound, and then randomize that, no, but it's not unheard of.
What does it matter to you though to say this is stupid? If it's something this mundane than it shouldn't bother you.
Mr. EpicJoin Date: 2003-08-01Member: 18660Members, Constellation
As simon is trying to explain, the 3 variations thing is more of a "how do we get this to not sound awful" sort of issue than any sort of gameplay discussion. The issue with having literally 1 loop is that it will: - Will be audibly repetitive - Will cause phasing issues when multiple loops play with close timing offsets or when the elements making up the loops run into eachother. - Will cause all sorts of weird audible artifacts ( heard as pre-echo/pre-delay/delay/etc) - Will eventually cause constructive interference and raise output volume and likely cause lots of clipping. - Will eventually cause destructive interference and may or may not completely eliminate some sounds.
There are many technical reasons why having a single clip isn't the best idea, which is why they are trying to mitigate this with multiple different sounds. Essentially as long as the waveforms and phase are different at each given time then there won't be an issue. This can be accomplished by having complicated and careful waveform introduction and conception (not applicable to this case though, as the lmg is quick), by changing the pitch by around + or - 200 cents, by changing the playback rate, or by simply using different waveforms to begin with.
<!--quoteo(post=1792749:date=Aug 7 2010, 03:40 PM:name=Zek)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Zek @ Aug 7 2010, 03:40 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1792749"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If anything I'd rather see the sound change as weapon upgrades are researched.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No cause then in CO the aliens will know when you get to damage 2 and use that as an excuse to go fade :P
Comments
No, you're stuck with rifle.
What other FPS does this? I don't think weapon repetition is bad at all. How has it ever been a problem? Guns that are the same make the same sound. Pretty simple.
What other FPS does this? I don't think weapon repetition is bad at all. How has it ever been a problem? Guns that are the same make the same sound. Pretty simple.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Why does it matter if any other FPS game does it or not? By that kind of thinking NS should never had combined RTS with FPS since no other FPS game has done it before. Also not every identical gun model sounds exactly the same. Finally this takes place in the future, in a alternate universe, so obviously things will be different in NS as opposed to the real world, that's kinda the point.
That isn't quite right. Simon explained it in a thread, I don't remember which, but essentially:
When you spawn, you spawn with one of three rifles. (They are the same guns, but their sounds are different.)
Each rifle sounds different to the other two.
I recall reading that each firing "sound" is made up of three sounds: a starting up shot, intermediate shots, and ending shot.
So essentially a total of nine sounds, in three groups, for the rifle?
i dont know of any games that are using this strategy exactly but its very common to have different variations and for the same weapon, crysis for example has way more than we do, from what ive seen it looks like they have diferent sounds for close, near, far, inside, outside, all times x 2 because AI use different sound sets to the player.
the 3 variations we are doing are designd to work as a sort of under the hood type thing.
its not about making the guns sound compleatly different or like they have different ammo, its about creating a more natural sounding game, hearing the exact same wavform over n over can become really grating and break immersion, think about how jaring it is to hear a CD skipping.
the different sound sets we are using are acually quite similar so idealy when ur concentrating killing aliens u houldent even notice that this is going on.
also we do have different reverbs for diffrent sized rooms ect. but that dosnt really help this problem when ur in a particular reverb sphere all 3d sounds u hear are affected by that particualr reverb to some degree, so it would still be the same sound with the same reverb.
How is that relevant at all? I'm not saying NS can't be different than other games, I'm merely pointing out that "the weapon sound problem" isn't really a problem at all - it hasn't been enough of a problem for any other game to do some weird sound system.
The environment soundscapes should be enough to provide sound differentiation. I do like the idea of different sounds for different distances, though. That makes sense to me.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but did NS1 have anything like this? What makes NS2 different from NS1? I don't remember gun sounds being an issue at all...
That makes a lot of sense.
I don't get why there needs to be 3 random sounds for the same weapon. How is that even possible? Don't the same guns make the same noises?
The environment soundscapes should be enough to provide sound differentiation. I do like the idea of different sounds for different distances, though. That makes sense to me.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but did NS1 have anything like this? What makes NS2 different from NS1? I don't remember gun sounds being an issue at all...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly how is it relevant? Which is why I don't get why you brought it up in the first place. Also who ever said it was a problem?? No one, all it is, is a change, a new feature.
Lols, yes it is, I've seen numerous games with different fire-sounds, it's not that uncommon. They've not gone so far as to make you spawn with a weapon that has a sole fire-sound, and then randomize that, no, but it's not unheard of.
What does it matter to you though to say this is stupid? If it's something this mundane than it shouldn't bother you.
- Will be audibly repetitive
- Will cause phasing issues when multiple loops play with close timing offsets or when the elements making up the loops run into eachother.
- Will cause all sorts of weird audible artifacts ( heard as pre-echo/pre-delay/delay/etc)
- Will eventually cause constructive interference and raise output volume and likely cause lots of clipping.
- Will eventually cause destructive interference and may or may not completely eliminate some sounds.
There are many technical reasons why having a single clip isn't the best idea, which is why they are trying to mitigate this with multiple different sounds. Essentially as long as the waveforms and phase are different at each given time then there won't be an issue. This can be accomplished by having complicated and careful waveform introduction and conception (not applicable to this case though, as the lmg is quick), by changing the pitch by around + or - 200 cents, by changing the playback rate, or by simply using different waveforms to begin with.
No cause then in CO the aliens will know when you get to damage 2 and use that as an excuse to go fade :P
*pulls trigger*
* <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjbdygvTWS4" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjbdygvTWS4</a> *
*pulls trigger*
* <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBKBI7DOLHA" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBKBI7DOLHA</a> *
*pulls trigger*
* <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggH-ObiUWEE" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggH-ObiUWEE</a> *
Edit: Listen to all three at once for the most magical auditory experience of your life
*holds down trigger*
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDxn0Xfqkgw" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDxn0Xfqkgw</a>