IMO this should play <u>when people register for the forum</u>.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What a weird movie. It would seem it's directly aimed at the special edition pre-orderers for not acting like fanboys?
Also it would seem to be that <u>the "NaturalSelection2HD" guy made this movie</u>. Kind of tricky because at first it feels like it originated from an unknown dev working at UnknownWorlds (maybe it was the shots of the pivotal tracker and discussion about the frequency in which bugs and features get added to the game...or maybe it was the gameplay footage that i've never seen before - like the turret shooting a skulk).
<!--quoteo(post=1797721:date=Sep 6 2010, 06:39 PM:name=FocusedWolf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FocusedWolf @ Sep 6 2010, 06:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1797721"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What a weird movie. It would seem it's directly aimed at the special edition pre-orderers for not acting like fanboys?
Also it would seem to be that <u>the "NaturalSelection2HD" guy made this movie</u>. Kind of tricky because at first it feels like it originated from an unknown dev working at UnknownWorlds (maybe it was the shots of the pivotal tracker and discussion about the frequency in which bugs and features get added to the game...or maybe it was the gameplay footage that i've never seen before - like the turret shooting a skulk).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I sort of agree. I believe whoever is making the videos (mr.Australian man) needs clarify at the start of every video that the opinions you have are not representative of Unknown worlds staff as like FocusedWolf has said it's quite easy to think otherwise.
Other than that I do actually like the videos and it will eventually go a long way to advertising the game.
Evil_bOb1Join Date: 2002-07-13Member: 938Members, Squad Five Blue
Nice video presentation on NS2 and Unknown Worlds!
I've watch a few of NS2HD's vids, very nicely done.
@focusedwolf you seem like a confused person, focus on what is there not your imagination, because if so, you've already lost the focus :p
@Revi.uk you used to people speaking of themselves in the third person? Its pretty clear he is talking about NS2 and Unknown Worlds, and he doesn't include himself when saying so.
<!--quoteo(post=1797729:date=Sep 6 2010, 07:18 PM:name=Evil_bOb1)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Evil_bOb1 @ Sep 6 2010, 07:18 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1797729"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Nice video presentation on NS2 and Unknown Worlds!
I've watch a few of NS2HD's vids, very nicely done.
@focusedwolf you seem like a confused person, focus on what is there not your imagination, because if so, you've already lost the focus :p
@Revi.uk you used to people speaking of themselves in the third person? Its pretty clear he is talking about NS2 and Unknown Worlds, and he doesn't include himself when saying so.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's not necessarily what he says it's the manner in which he says it, the context that's used and also his actual YouTube account name. "NaturalSelection2HD" has a certain level of authenticity about it when "TheRealFlayra" doesn't unless you know his name already.
Don't misunderstand though, I really do like the video's. However, to avoid unnecessary confusion there should be a simple disclaimer at the start of the video.
I think he should have just stuck to the "state of the game" without going into the snippy commentary. It's not that I don't agree with most of the guy's points but he just took a reputable looking channel which showcased the game and turned it into a place to vent opinions. No one appreciates the whiners on the forums but you have to factor in that the majority of people waiting for this game to come out are not regularly reading the boards and hearing about the "development drama". In short, keep up the good work with the videos but let's try and stay positive and centered on the game features!
<!--quoteo(post=1797734:date=Sep 6 2010, 07:51 PM:name=Cerebral)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Cerebral @ Sep 6 2010, 07:51 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1797734"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think he should have just stuck to the "state of the game" without going into the snippy commentary. It's not that I don't agree with most of the guy's points but he just took a reputable looking channel which showcased the game and turned it into a place to vent opinions. No one appreciates the whiners on the forums but you have to factor in that the majority of people waiting for this game to come out are not regularly reading the boards and hearing about the "development drama". In short, keep up the good work with the videos but let's try and stay positive and centered on the game features!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I kinda agree.
As a side note, I think it's always good to stay on the actual progress and try not to see the future. I believe NS2 has potential to be all kinds of good things, but right now it's alpha and it has absolutely no gameplay structure. You can say it has great single features, but talking about it as if it was a complete game just doesn't seem credible. For example I wouldn't call it complex, not until it actually has a structure that can be commented.
He just needs to ventilate for all the anguish eaten by the providing insta grat ppl residing around the game camping site. Im not a fanboy but NS has given me second most gaming pleasure in my short life and to me thats awesome.
<!--quoteo(post=1797734:date=Sep 6 2010, 07:51 PM:name=Cerebral)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Cerebral @ Sep 6 2010, 07:51 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1797734"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think he should have just stuck to the "state of the game" without going into the snippy commentary. It's not that I don't agree with most of the guy's points but he just took a reputable looking channel which showcased the game and turned it into a place to vent opinions. No one appreciates the whiners on the forums but you have to factor in that the majority of people waiting for this game to come out are not regularly reading the boards and hearing about the "development drama". In short, keep up the good work with the videos but let's try and stay positive and centered on the game features!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yea I agree... but it wasn't a huge crazy rant he made, so I didn't loose respect for the channel.
That fellow seemed quite level-headed to me, and not fanboyish...He just seemed supportive of an independent developer without throwing logic out of the window.
And I wasn't confused as to whether or not he's associated with Unknown Worlds. Really, it just reminded me of HDStarCraft, that guy who casts videos of starcraft matches.
At any rate, I agree (of course) with everything said in that video. There aren't logical points that can be made against what he said, but we can debate the effectiveness of his delivery...although I don't see much point in that debate :)
<!--quoteo(post=1797774:date=Sep 7 2010, 03:47 AM:name=Sorel)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sorel @ Sep 7 2010, 03:47 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1797774"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That fellow seemed quite level-headed to me, and not fanboyish...He just seemed supportive of an independent developer without throwing logic out of the window.
And I wasn't confused as to whether or not he's associated with Unknown Worlds. Really, it just reminded me of HDStarCraft, that guy who casts videos of starcraft matches.
At any rate, I agree (of course) with everything said in that video. There aren't logical points that can be made against what he said, but we can debate the effectiveness of his delivery...although I don't see much point in that debate :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Effective delivery debate commencing...
Glad to see the video is generating a good argument! I'm not great at 'delivering' yet.. So please, have the 'effective delivery debate' so I can improve!
To clear up if there is any doubt, I am not affiliated with UWE at all. Nor do I think the game is perfect. I'm trying to be professional with the channel, and will always take heed of the community's feelings when creating the content. Number 21 is definitely controversial, but I felt that the counter-argument to 'it's a pile of unplayable crap' needed to be made.
EDIT: Revi.uk you make a good point, but I am following in the footsteps of 'HDStarcraft.' Of course, if you all believe strongly (Or the Dev's say!) that I should disclaim, I will add a note to the channel.
The information you give is obviously investigative in nature and you don't purport yourself as being an UWE representative. However, you have the "natural selection 2" words in your name and carry some of their image in your business. I suggest you put a disclaimer in the channel info.
I'm very interested in your point that you made in this case - I think it needed to be said in a logical and professional manner and your excellent videos makes you an persuasive voice in the community. I hope it resonates with people who are thinking of posting useless information.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited September 2010
I'll just quote myself from the comments section
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This video is just flame-bait. Even if it is good info, it won't be interpreted like that by some people...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'll add to this the following:
You are dealing with the YouTube community. The people who have posted right now on this video are from this community. But what if this video goes viral, then you're dealing with people who either know nothing about the game and UWE. Associate you with the UWE dev crew, by misinterpreting some of the things you said.
The main thing is, it is not very clear from what you say and from the video's themselves, you are not part of the UWE dev team.
We are dealing with a YouTube community that refuses to read the descriptions or annotations most of the time, which will almost always end up in flamewars or stupid "repeating" questions. All of which might hurt the PR side of NS2, I've also suggested a while back: You need to make it very clear, the footage you're shooting is from an unfinished Alpha product. It is quite important you keep this in mind, because you can't know everything that is going on behind the scenes in the NS2 development process, even if UWE is the most transparent game design studio ever...
Description of the video and annotations are not helpful most of the time, I've dealt with it long enough to see there are people who are simply blind to these things. Heck even baking in descriptions or notes/credits do not help.
Of course these are doomsday scenario's, but still should be kept in mind when dealing with the internet.
<i>- When unprepared for the internet: Your cojones grow to humongous size, while your brain changes into a impenetrable brick</i>
Is probably the best description that goes with most internet people <img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/smileys/tongue.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Glad to see the video is generating a good argument! I'm not great at 'delivering' yet.. So please, have the 'effective delivery debate' so I can improve!
To clear up if there is any doubt, I am not affiliated with UWE at all. Nor do I think the game is perfect. I'm trying to be professional with the channel, and will always take heed of the community's feelings when creating the content. Number 21 is definitely controversial, but I felt that the counter-argument to 'it's a pile of unplayable crap' needed to be made.
EDIT: Revi.uk you make a good point, but I am following in the footsteps of 'HDStarcraft.' Of course, if you all believe strongly (Or the Dev's say!) that I should disclaim, I will add a note to the channel.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's fair enough, I've never seen any of those videos before so I wouldn't have known.
The manner in which you actually deliver is good, although it feels quite rigid; are you reading from a sheet of paper?
I feel that the delivery could be improved if you read what you wanted to say, put the paper down and then paraphrase yourself, this will make it sound more fluid and natural.
You should keep things a little more civil/objective when making these videos. NS2HD really has a lot of potential to provide a good niche for the public to get info about NS2, and the last thing we want is a prospective customer being drawn into community flamewars before they've even played the game. Don't worry, the flamewars will find them eventually, all in due time ;)
I've watched all their vids, including the last couple. I love what they are doing, the professional nature of the videos and the fact they are demonstrating a mature and respectful way for the community to act.
Please keep up the work in #21 NS2HD. I feel the community needs to be reminded and shown (through good example) by people/groups such as yourself how to be positive, respectful and mature.
<!--quoteo(post=1797830:date=Sep 7 2010, 08:50 PM:name=cmc5788)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cmc5788 @ Sep 7 2010, 08:50 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1797830"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You should keep things a little more civil/objective when making these videos. NS2HD really has a lot of potential to provide a good niche for the public to get info about NS2, and the last thing we want is a prospective customer being drawn into community flamewars before they've even played the game. Don't worry, the flamewars will find them eventually, all in due time ;)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The trolling will probably die out slightly when the game is at a point where it's playable.
Topic: the YouTube Channel is okay i guess - however i started laughing when he said critics should get their heads out of their asses because I then asked myself who has his head in someone's ass already if you know what i mean.
And that is my point right here: the creator seems to be too much of a fanboy.
That's why it lacks objectivity. He puts himself into a developer position although he is - i assume - just a preorderer just like the rest of us.
Dont get me wrong, i'm looking forward to this game but you can't always be sitting there throwing around flowers and praising.
Good channel, poor arguments. Saying "this is NOT OFFICIAL" just cheapens the experience. It's all level-headed and professional enough. I dunno what everyone's problem is. Man I'd love to get up in this ###### but even I find this whole debate not worth arguing. So boring. Good channel is good. Move on.
<!--quoteo(post=1797953:date=Sep 8 2010, 03:19 PM:name=Harimau)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Harimau @ Sep 8 2010, 03:19 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1797953"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Good channel, poor arguments. Saying "<u>this is NOT OFFICIAL</u>" just cheapens the experience. It's all level-headed and <u>professional</u> enough. I dunno what everyone's problem is. Man I'd love to get up in this ###### but even I find this whole debate not worth arguing. So boring. Good channel is good. Move on.
tl;dr: Meh.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The movie is so professional that it is easily mistaken as coming from UNW, and <u>if</u> it was, then it would be very embarrassing for the devs because of the sense of "###### YOU COMMUNITY!!! LOVE THE ALPHA NOW!!!".
This channel works like publicity for the game (which even the devs recognize, with the proof being the twitter mention).
This channel should <u>not</u> contain any mention of how the community has been receiving the Alpha, or what amounts to whining against the community, because this is <u>BAD</u> publicity.
Evil_bOb1Join Date: 2002-07-13Member: 938Members, Squad Five Blue
Come on focuswolf. The first thing he says in that video is hello, he introduces himself as ns2hd, and then says he is going to talk about the development of ns2. He clearly identifies himself as a separate entity from UWE.
I understand you want to save the world but let people do their thing, and save it with your own things.
People who upload youtube videos are part of the community. People who upload video responses to youtube are part of the community. People who like, or dislike, and view the youtube videos are part of the community. You cannot escape the community.
Comments
I'll say it again: Welcome to the internet. It's pretty fruitless to tell people to stop.
Also, good video commentary.
IMO this should play <u>when people register for the forum</u>.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What a weird movie. It would seem it's directly aimed at the special edition pre-orderers for not acting like fanboys?
Also it would seem to be that <u>the "NaturalSelection2HD" guy made this movie</u>. Kind of tricky because at first it feels like it originated from an unknown dev working at UnknownWorlds (maybe it was the shots of the pivotal tracker and discussion about the frequency in which bugs and features get added to the game...or maybe it was the gameplay footage that i've never seen before - like the turret shooting a skulk).
Also it would seem to be that <u>the "NaturalSelection2HD" guy made this movie</u>. Kind of tricky because at first it feels like it originated from an unknown dev working at UnknownWorlds (maybe it was the shots of the pivotal tracker and discussion about the frequency in which bugs and features get added to the game...or maybe it was the gameplay footage that i've never seen before - like the turret shooting a skulk).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I sort of agree. I believe whoever is making the videos (mr.Australian man) needs clarify at the start of every video that the opinions you have are not representative of Unknown worlds staff as like FocusedWolf has said it's quite easy to think otherwise.
Other than that I do actually like the videos and it will eventually go a long way to advertising the game.
Have to agree with the point of saying that most developers would never publicly release a game at this stage. I can now see why haha.
+1 tho.
I've watch a few of NS2HD's vids, very nicely done.
@focusedwolf you seem like a confused person, focus on what is there not your imagination, because if so, you've already lost the focus :p
@Revi.uk you used to people speaking of themselves in the third person? Its pretty clear he is talking about NS2 and Unknown Worlds, and he doesn't include himself when saying so.
I've watch a few of NS2HD's vids, very nicely done.
@focusedwolf you seem like a confused person, focus on what is there not your imagination, because if so, you've already lost the focus :p
@Revi.uk you used to people speaking of themselves in the third person? Its pretty clear he is talking about NS2 and Unknown Worlds, and he doesn't include himself when saying so.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's not necessarily what he says it's the manner in which he says it, the context that's used and also his actual YouTube account name. "NaturalSelection2HD" has a certain level of authenticity about it when "TheRealFlayra" doesn't unless you know his name already.
Don't misunderstand though, I really do like the video's. However, to avoid unnecessary confusion there should be a simple disclaimer at the start of the video.
I kinda agree.
As a side note, I think it's always good to stay on the actual progress and try not to see the future. I believe NS2 has potential to be all kinds of good things, but right now it's alpha and it has absolutely no gameplay structure. You can say it has great single features, but talking about it as if it was a complete game just doesn't seem credible. For example I wouldn't call it complex, not until it actually has a structure that can be commented.
Im not a fanboy but NS has given me second most gaming pleasure in my short life and to me thats awesome.
Yea I agree... but it wasn't a huge crazy rant he made, so I didn't loose respect for the channel.
And I wasn't confused as to whether or not he's associated with Unknown Worlds. Really, it just reminded me of HDStarCraft, that guy who casts videos of starcraft matches.
At any rate, I agree (of course) with everything said in that video. There aren't logical points that can be made against what he said, but we can debate the effectiveness of his delivery...although I don't see much point in that debate :)
And I wasn't confused as to whether or not he's associated with Unknown Worlds. Really, it just reminded me of HDStarCraft, that guy who casts videos of starcraft matches.
At any rate, I agree (of course) with everything said in that video. There aren't logical points that can be made against what he said, but we can debate the effectiveness of his delivery...although I don't see much point in that debate :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Effective delivery debate commencing...
Glad to see the video is generating a good argument! I'm not great at 'delivering' yet.. So please, have the 'effective delivery debate' so I can improve!
To clear up if there is any doubt, I am not affiliated with UWE at all. Nor do I think the game is perfect. I'm trying to be professional with the channel, and will always take heed of the community's feelings when creating the content. Number 21 is definitely controversial, but I felt that the counter-argument to 'it's a pile of unplayable crap' needed to be made.
EDIT: Revi.uk you make a good point, but I am following in the footsteps of 'HDStarcraft.' Of course, if you all believe strongly (Or the Dev's say!) that I should disclaim, I will add a note to the channel.
I'm very interested in your point that you made in this case - I think it needed to be said in a logical and professional manner and your excellent videos makes you an persuasive voice in the community. I hope it resonates with people who are thinking of posting useless information.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This video is just flame-bait. Even if it is good info, it won't be interpreted like that by some people...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'll add to this the following:
You are dealing with the YouTube community. The people who have posted right now on this video are from this community. But what if this video goes viral, then you're dealing with people who either know nothing about the game and UWE. Associate you with the UWE dev crew, by misinterpreting some of the things you said.
The main thing is, it is not very clear from what you say and from the video's themselves, you are not part of the UWE dev team.
We are dealing with a YouTube community that refuses to read the descriptions or annotations most of the time, which will almost always end up in flamewars or stupid "repeating" questions. All of which might hurt the PR side of NS2, I've also suggested a while back: You need to make it very clear, the footage you're shooting is from an unfinished Alpha product. It is quite important you keep this in mind, because you can't know everything that is going on behind the scenes in the NS2 development process, even if UWE is the most transparent game design studio ever...
Description of the video and annotations are not helpful most of the time, I've dealt with it long enough to see there are people who are simply blind to these things. Heck even baking in descriptions or notes/credits do not help.
Of course these are doomsday scenario's, but still should be kept in mind when dealing with the internet.
<i>- When unprepared for the internet: Your cojones grow to humongous size, while your brain changes into a impenetrable brick</i>
Is probably the best description that goes with most internet people <img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/smileys/tongue.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" />
Glad to see the video is generating a good argument! I'm not great at 'delivering' yet.. So please, have the 'effective delivery debate' so I can improve!
To clear up if there is any doubt, I am not affiliated with UWE at all. Nor do I think the game is perfect. I'm trying to be professional with the channel, and will always take heed of the community's feelings when creating the content. Number 21 is definitely controversial, but I felt that the counter-argument to 'it's a pile of unplayable crap' needed to be made.
EDIT: Revi.uk you make a good point, but I am following in the footsteps of 'HDStarcraft.' Of course, if you all believe strongly (Or the Dev's say!) that I should disclaim, I will add a note to the channel.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's fair enough, I've never seen any of those videos before so I wouldn't have known.
The manner in which you actually deliver is good, although it feels quite rigid; are you reading from a sheet of paper?
I feel that the delivery could be improved if you read what you wanted to say, put the paper down and then paraphrase yourself, this will make it sound more fluid and natural.
Other than that fantastic stuff keep it up!
I've watched all their vids, including the last couple. I love what they are doing, the professional nature of the videos and the fact they are demonstrating a mature and respectful way for the community to act.
Please keep up the work in #21 NS2HD. I feel the community needs to be reminded and shown (through good example) by people/groups such as yourself how to be positive, respectful and mature.
The trolling will probably die out slightly when the game is at a point where it's playable.
Topic: the YouTube Channel is okay i guess - however i started laughing when he said critics should get their heads out of their asses because I then asked myself who has his head in someone's ass already if you know what i mean.
And that is my point right here: the creator seems to be too much of a fanboy.
That's why it lacks objectivity. He puts himself into a developer position although he is - i assume - just a preorderer just like the rest of us.
Dont get me wrong, i'm looking forward to this game but you can't always be sitting there throwing around flowers and praising.
Focus on constructive critism aswell.
tl;dr:
Meh.
tl;dr:
Meh.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The movie is so professional that it is easily mistaken as coming from UNW, and <u>if</u> it was, then it would be very embarrassing for the devs because of the sense of "###### YOU COMMUNITY!!! LOVE THE ALPHA NOW!!!".
This channel works like publicity for the game (which even the devs recognize, with the proof being the twitter mention).
This channel should <u>not</u> contain any mention of how the community has been receiving the Alpha, or what amounts to whining against the community, because this is <u>BAD</u> publicity.
I understand you want to save the world but let people do their thing, and save it with your own things.
You cannot escape the community.
Also, steppin'razor: your* signature.