Ns_nancy
The_Nighthawk
Join Date: 2002-11-06 Member: 7316Members
Join Date: 2002-11-06 Member: 7316Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Has a marine ever won on this map?</div> I've been playing daily on the Pubs since the game released, and I don't remember seeing the Marines ever win a single game on this map. Has it been done? I think it's a great map, only nearly impossible to win on as the Marines. Post your team's winning strategy, that the rest of us may benefit from your experience!
Comments
Establish your main base immediately in an empty hive. Don't even turret, keep a few marines posted. Push immediately for the second hive. Turret and phase it. Marines win. All in 5 minutes.
The trick is have your main base in a hive location. It's a cakewalk from there.
because there aren't a lot of open rooms (save for the mess hall) fades aren't nearly as effective as they are on other maps: anytime they pop out to shoot acid rockets they should be exposed to all kinds of turret and machine gun fire, because they'll be close to marines and turrets this makes it pretty dangerous for the fades.
First thing ... the Very-First-Thing when you get in the chair (well, after the initial rush): send 1-2 marines to the unname hive and to subspace. the unnamed hive is the easiest to defend, so if you're short on people just send someone there.
now, get your base up, get 2 turrets looking down the hallway, one in the middle to protect the inf. portals. best case scenario - unnamed hive is open. when 2 or more marines are there get working on the resource and a turret fac.
DO NOT get resources along the way (this includes the one that is right next to your base), you need to take the hive, fast. This is the biggest mistake i see made, coms always grab that close resource and most of the game turns into a struggle for that point, all while the aliens grab hives.
once the hive is secure, get a observatory up and get a teleport from your homebase to the unnamed hive.
Now the tough part.
THE EASY WAY: if you're playing an un-organized alien team they might have the mess hall, and odds are a lone gor is building some defense in the second hive, clean out the mess hall, DON'T BUILD anything there ... push to the second hive (subspace is the easiest and closest after you take the mess hall) ... clear that, build res + fac + tele ... now build seige in both hives (just to be safe) add a few more turrets. Now you can grab resources, save up, get your HMGs and armor and have fun with the last hive.
THE HARD WAY: ok, the aliens know what they're doing. when your marines hit mess it's filled to the brim with alien turrets. you use your observatory to look at the two hive locations and see that the aliens already have two hives, so you'll be facing fades soon. No biggie, but you have to play slow and smart. Get the resource close to your base, build a turret fac there and upgrade it to seige so you can start blasting the mess hall. Also get the resource that's near the unnamed hive and defend it well ... that's where the aliens will launch attacks from. Ok, mess should be about clear, and you need to start thinking about fades ... you want HMGs and heavy armor, build a depot in the unnamed hive and upgrade the one in your main base. Save your cash and get that heavy armor going. Keep your marines in mess with 1-2 around the unnamed hive ... either defending the vents, or heading through the passage to scout and harass the engine room. Once mess is clear build it up like you would a hive: fac with seige and tele. build a ton of turrets in mess, the fades will pop around corners to shoot but here's where you have an advantage ... they'll be really close to the turrets. Plus with seige in there you'll make sure they have to go far away for repairs, giving you precious time to get Heavy Armor and HMGS ... Once you have this, push up the stairs, ignore the resource and build a turret fac in the room just past that, but not in-line of the hallway (so the fades can't hit it from a distance) ... get a tele there fast, upgrade the fac to seige. As long as your marines hold out, you'll blast the crap out the their second hive. Once you've done that just keep the momentium up and you'll have it won.
good luck,
_f
to win imho then many other maps, its not as large as some and my tactics works great on smaller maps,
grabing chokepoints is faster and its easy to get a map well-defended with using small amounts of Res.
In the past week I haven't seen the aliens win a single round of nancy, as long as the marines have had control of mess hall and a single hive. Mess hall keeps aux, mother interface and the cargo bay resources (that's 4 resources from one spot...gotta love siege when you're not alien) clean, plus limits the aliens wanting to travel to and from the unnamed hive or attack the marine base to vents, which jetpackers can most of the time keep clean anyway (or HA in the case of the route from engine to aux). Mess hall is a nice staging area too, it's pretty roomy and is pretty close to the center of the 3 hive triangle.
Mess hall = the "4th hive" in nancy IMO.
If the Kharaa start in the unnamed hive, and fail to take the messhall, they are as good as dead.
1. Marines take messhall.
2 Secure one hive
3. Siege resourcepoint next to unnamed hive from messhall
4. siege unnamed hive and res from corridor outside hive
5. game over.
NS_Bast is also another "marine" map. You can Siege both feedwater and engineroom from the vents. You can even build a TF in the corner of your mainbase, and build turrets down in the vents below engineroom, withouth having to build a TF down there.
I've won on every map as a marine commander, as a marine soldier, and as alien player. Every map can be won by either team, what matters is the quality of the players that make up the teams.
As we were retreating to get another hive, the no-hive-health-countdown got us.
Winning a game has nothing to do with map inequality
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ever played ns_bast?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bast is easy to win if you keep moving. Alien rushes are really easy on that map, as are marine rushes. Other than some of the stupid siege areas because the map is so small, it's a great map. It's one of the easiest to learn because it is so small and diverse in the way the locations come together and appear.
Sieging from a vent is a great tactic, and if aliens fail to hear marines building in the vents, *shrug* it's their fault. Grenades work now, so if you're dealing with a fade in the vent and still don't have an upgraded armory, don't cry about it, you deserve to die... >=]
The problem you're dealing with in NS_NANCY is probably either your team of marine can't hit sand in the middle of a desert, or the fact that your commander don't know how and more importantly, WHERE to build.
Most of the previous posts that listed strategy gave a few okay advise, but for the most part, usually a group of marine can't survive long enough to pull off what is suggested.
But anyways, me personally, when not commanding, I attribute most of my victories as a marine on NS_NANCY to jetpacks. You can fly to ALL THREE HIVES through the vents with jetpacks and pop them. The vents are easily accessible also, making jetpacks all the more viable. Of course, a marine needs to know the vents.. and also know how to actually use a jetpack =D
And no, I'm not talking about normal servers, like 7 vs 7. I am talking about 12vs12 or 15vs15.
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LOL! If marines can manage to loose a 12v12 or 15v15 on ANY map, they must have a really bad commander.
Winning a game has nothing to do with map inequality
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ever played ns_bast?
And no, I'm not talking about normal servers, like 7 vs 7. I am talking about 12vs12 or 15vs15.
And just to prove you people wrong, messhall is not important. If you have two hives, you don't need it. It's not going to stop the marines, or stop the aliens. Now if you have one hive, then yes, grab it, because if the aliens get it and have a second hive, they can easily get to your base if you don't have messhall as an outpost to slow the aliens.
I've seen so many commanders stop and take mess hall, but if they had just kept their marines going, they could have taken mother interface or subspace instead.
Mess hall is damned hard to hold, too close to marine base to be worth the res for phases, and the combination of the large window and the counter make it insanely easy for skulks to slip right through/by without getting nipped by a single turret. You would have to expend massive amounts of resources to keep skulks from moving through the area. And it can't even siege a hive... the best it can do is siege mother interface and the locker rooms. Woo!
Any skulk worth his salt knows that there is virtually no room on Nancy that you can't get to via the vent system. The 70 resources the commander expends securing Mess would be far better spent securing mother interface, subspace, or unnamed.
You can try for divide & conquer with Port Engine and Mess, but #1) Movement chambers and the vent system flush that strategy right down the shitter, and #2) There's no efficient way for marines to move from Port to Mess without going through someplace that is hideously dangerous.
This is NS_Nancy, right? Mess Hall isn't a choke point to anything. There are at least three routes to each hive, from the other hives. Learn the vents, learn the corridors. Even if you hold Mess, Aux Command and Cargo 2, I can still freely and safely run from any hive to any hive. You'd need jetpackers shutting down the vents with GLs to stop that.
Mess is a nice staging area, _if you have screwed up and not moved quickly to a hive. Or if you took no-name hive first, and now are trying to fight your way to subspace hive.
But its just nice. Not hard to win Nancy without ever taking Mess Hall.
Everytime the marines lose on this map is because they spend too much time bunkering up mess hall instead of getting to the closest hive. I hear too many comms say, "This is an important site, hold until I get some turrets up." I don't agree.
This is one of my favorite maps to command, and I win more times than not by dropping a res in each point on the way to the unnamed hive, and then securing it. THREE points on the way to a hive is almost too good to be true. The aliens have two choices. They can either defend the hive area for future development, or chew up the resources you just built. 9 times out of ten, they'll be trying to chew up the res nodes you just built closest to your base, while you've already secured Unnamed and you're heading for the next. At that point, its game over.
While it's not critical to victory, it's nice to set up a staging area there. It's also extremely annoying for the aliens - while they're working on taking it out, you can be wiping out a hive.
If you control mess hall, it is significantly easier for marines to capture a majority of all the nodes on the map, as well as the hives.
Usually, putting a turret factory ontop of the cabinet in mess hall makes it a difficult easy reach for anything but a lerk...and even then, good turret placement should keep that tf far longer than most others against your typical skulk/lerk attacks. Also, mess hall is grenade friendly. All enemy attack routes to mess hall come from: a narrow stairwell, a narrow side entrance, and a slightly wider outside hallway, of which the only easy ways out is up a ladder, through a vent, or into mess hall. Given the number of angular entrances to mess hall, most smart grenadiers should be able to make the most of their nade bounces for maximum spread and damage.
1 week ago I was on aliens on bast and we won 4 times with a skulk rush! (then we stoped cuz it got booring) all we did was rush from teh hive (the one at the gate going up and down <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> and sprinted trough the vent and w ekilled em all! <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo-->
1 week ago I was on aliens on bast and we won 4 times with a skulk rush! (then we stoped cuz it got booring) all we did was rush from teh hive (the one at the gate going up and down <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> and sprinted trough the vent and w ekilled em all! <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If the initial skulk rush succeeds, it's more due to crappy marines than good aliens.
Frankly, doing the initial rush is always a bad bet. If the marines are good, you will die and wait forever in the respawn queue while the marines lock down half the map, potentially costing you the game.
If the marines are bad, you will win anyhow.
So why rush?
i played a game recently where we aliens cam back from 0 hives and the only persoon alive was a gorg on bast <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
When the aliens have no hives, the autokill timer counts down, killing any aliens instantly. You guys must've had a hive left.
Noname hive should be the 2nd/last hive you capture(for some reason its the easiest one). Subspace hive should be your first target(unless its their main hive), then go for the one by aux command.
Early on you have to walk through mess hall to get to 2 hives. So either secure mess hall, or set up a phase gate at the hive you secured. I usually chose the latter as it is more convenient(mess hall is constantly under attack, and its better to secure a hive anyway).
Do not underestimate cargo bay. You can put a TF by the wall closer to aux command, and you can just send your marines there and quickly build turrets near the hive without the aliens shooting at your TF because it is on the other side of the wall. Another good TF placement is the little square right under the stairs that leads to the hive at aux command.
A mistake I've done is taking noname hive first. It's hard to get other hives because 1) its the hive furthest away from the rest and 2) you need mess hall to get to the other hives. So anyway, I secured noname hive, and the aliens went and secured mess hall. They kept it well defended so if I wanted to get pass I'd have to clear it all out. The problem is the aliens were well coordinated, it took us a long time to clear it. When we finally cleared it fades came so we slowly lost the game because there's no other way to get through to the other hives.
If subspace is their primary hive, it is usually a good option to rush it, as it is quite close to the marine spawn.
Prota(GER)