Creep "Fungicide"?
Rainseeker
Join Date: 2008-01-29 Member: 63530Members
Join Date: 2008-01-29 Member: 63530Members
Don't know if it's been addressed before, but perhaps marines can research a fungicide of some sort that only is active in powered rooms, thus pushing back creep or preventing it from spreading into the room? Also, it could limit alien's self-healing ability and perhaps make them get energy back slower.
Comments
Can there be a compromise on this? If this was the case then lit rooms would barely ever be infested, and DI couldn't be used to open locked doors or power down nodes.
How about this.
Power node on = DI expands at a considerably slower pace because it is sensitive to light. If the alien team never took out the power node it would take a good chunk of the game to just infest the room.
Power node off = DI expands at a much faster rate preferring minimal light and dark dank places.
To the original posters idea. I personally am not a fan of this. I would like to see a better system implemented to remove DI before flame throwers make an apparence in a game. Maybe some sort of replacement tool/gun for the pistol slot that doesn't carry as much ammo as the flame thrower forcing marines to continually restock to clear out really well rooted DI areas.
Power node on = DI expands at a considerably slower pace because it is sensitive to light. If the alien team never took out the power node it would take a good chunk of the game to just infest the room.
Power node off = DI expands at a much faster rate preferring minimal light and dark dank places.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
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Though, the Hive's original infestation should always spread at the fastest rate and deteriorate/recede when the Hive is killed.
I dont think it should do either of those things. It's all about territorial control. Infestation = "power" on the alien side, i.e. it allows buildings to be placed and provides other advantages. Due to this symmetry it only makes sense for the two elements to be mutually exclusive.
If humans control a room, the power is on, therefore doors can be locked. If aliens control a room, the power is off & infestation is present. If aliens want to control a room, the first thing they should do is take out the power node. Because of this dynamic it makes perfect sense for the two features (power/infestation) to be mutually exclusive in order to avoid confusion.
If aliens want to build in a powered area, they should have a building that allows it infestation in a limited area, the equivalent of a mobile power node allowing humans to build in an infested area. If it's desirable to have infestation power down nodes or unlock doors, this "mobile infester" would have to be placed next to a power node or locked door and protected.
Infgestation acts as an indicator, so it kind of works to the marines advantage in that sense (typically). Making it into an easily controlable substance on the behalf of the marines would demote DI to DP.. Dynamic Pest.
Infgestation acts as an indicator, so it kind of works to the marines advantage in that sense (typically). Making it into an easily controlable substance on the behalf of the marines would demote DI to DP.. Dynamic Pest.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
agreed. Aliens should be able to use infestation offensively not only defensively. Under your scheme, infestation would be relegated as a solely defensive mechanic.
By the way, zex, is your 'understanding of how it works' from only one side (marine).. As for myself, I find that I'm forced to advocate the ability of the Kharaa for reasons of 'rinehoreism.
It's just racist!
Exactly, but there is one caveat you're missing in this whole discussion. That is, by your definition of power and territory control, the maps automatically start with everything being on the offensive mode for marines. This is a massive advantage.
If powered areas = offensively controlled marine territory than the whole map, from the moment the game starts, is controlled offensively by the marines since the whole map starts with power nodes at full health.
This is a huge advantage, and it only gets much larger if infestation is bound to only powered down rooms because then aliens will have to take the time to kill every single power node, while dealing with ever expanding and aggressive marines backed up by repairing macs, before they can ever expand their infestation and control from the defense of their single hive. This gets even worse when you consider that to build harvesters aliens need infestation first. It is hard enough already to get control of resource nodes through infestation expansion; it takes me a good portion of a tram game to get infestation to two nodes. It will be even harder if infestation is bound to only powered down rooms. It also makes any type of infestation removal equipment, like flame throwers, useless. Just send in a MAC train, repair the node, and hold the room while the infestation dies off.
Infestation takes a good amount of hive energy, which could be spent on useful drones needed to build structures, and time to cover a whole room. All marines have to do is send in a single mac and repair a power node to gain control of a room. At most it cost one MAC, which doesn't really matter since the CC energy doesn't need to be spent on anything else. With aliens, every time they loose infestation they have lost precious energy that could of been spent on drones.
And marines do have the ability to use power offensively. Power the room up, burn away a patch of DI, and build on it. The biggest problem right now is a lack of early game mechanics to remove DI. Marines have to wait for flamer throwers to deal with DI.
I imagine there will be a variety in the final map set, i.e some maps where humans push into a primarily infested map, scenarios where humans and aliens are vying for unpowered territory, etc.
I could be wrong (and often am) but I believe the current powered scenario is only a result of infestation only being implemented for a few weeks & incomplete rather than intentuional final map design.
Yes there should be a very apparent and easily recognizable connection to DI and power nodes, but it shouldn't be as linear as power on = no infestation and power off = infestation. I guess it would make it easier from a development side of things, but it would also make the game play very easy to predict, and not as fun or exciting.
Isn't that the entire point of the "power grid" system that UW has created for NS2? Power conveys an advantage to humans, therefore the ebb and flow of territorial control is naturally going to be driven by the combatants battling over the state of the power grid. It makes no sense for infestation to be totally separate from this system, since <u>it serves the same functions for aliens as power does for humans.</u> I think the confusion here is a result of the incomplete infestation system and this will be much more obvious as development progresses.
I agree with you, but I still can't get behind how linear you're implementation would be. I might change my mind if I could try it out, and there was some major changes to the way power nodes are taken down and repaired. But there would have to be some heavy changes. Right now power nodes favor marines plain and simple. Taking them down doesn't give any real advantage to aliens; I play whole games where alien teams don't even bother taking down some of the power nodes because there is no real point, other then it looks cool. Marines will just come with a MAC train and repair them in under 5 seconds anyways after a skulk spent a good minute plus on destroying them. Also, you still haven't answered what the point would be of DI removing equipment if power just automatically did it for you.
Also, power still will give advantages to marines even if infestation can grow in powered rooms. One you just slow down the growth rate substantially so aliens would need to take down power if they wanted to make any real sort of progress over the long run of the game. Second, if they ever make things darker, powering up a room gives marines better vision of aliens, especially when they blend in with infestation. Three, you can still build in a room even if infestation has started to move into it, where as aliens would be completely locked out of a room once the power was up.
Also you're allowing Marines to use power in a offensive way, while forcing aliens infestation to be only defensive. Marines could use power to offensively remove infestation from areas. But aliens wouldn't be able to use infestation in the same way to take down power nodes. Maybe if infestation could cover power nodes and block them from being repaired until a marine manually removes the infestation.
I support the idea of infestation growing over power nodes. It would be nice if the creep slowly damaged said node, or at least disabled power until it's cleared away.
<ul><li><b>Power Nodes in neutral territory start off in a neutral state (Unbuilt Power Node, 50% HP).</b></li><li>Marine rooms are well lit. Infestation cannot spread directly on top of Res Nodes and Tech Nodes.</li><li>Neutral rooms use red emergency lighting. Infestation cannot spread directly on top of Res Nodes and Tech Nodes.</li><li>Un-powered rooms are barely lit, with lights possibly flashing intermittently (like 2-seconds-on 4-seconds-off, not strobing). Infestation can be spread anywhere.</li><li>Alien Dark Vision fades in as light levels decrease, and vice versa, giving Aliens a natural advantage in unlit areas, a natural disadvantage in lit areas (through dark vision's absence), and the ability to gauge brightness levels through the scaling opacity of dark vision. Flashlights and Flamethrowers hinder Alien Vision in the same manner when aimed at a Kharaa unit.</li><li>Destroying a Power Node removes the Armor of all Marine structures in the room, leaving structures vulnerable without electricity (possibly room to re-implement electrified structures upgrade). Fictionally, chalk it up to some power overload.</li></ul>
Result: Both sides have a comparable territorial advantage that should be fought for above all else.
good point & good suggestion, I would say if there's infestation on or near a power node it should start damaging the node, to have some symmetry with the power grid's effect on infestation. I'd even go so far as to say if there's infestation present in the same room, the power node should take damage. This would be a good offensive use of the gorge (whether he spreads infestation by creating a particular building as I favor, or just spits it) and it would free up other alien units from having to focus on attacking the node if they want to bring it down, rather than attacking humans & defensive structures.