Awesome NS2 game.
Papayas
Join Date: 2010-07-01 Member: 72219Members
Join Date: 2010-07-01 Member: 72219Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Just talking about an awesome game of NS2.</div><u>It was a good game of NS2 a few days ago and I want to share it with you.</u>
It was only a small game about 4 vs 4. Anyway...
...I was on the Marine side and I was a commander. I put down the usual Armoury and went to Marine Exspansion to place another Command chair.
We were getting a few attacks from some rushers but that soon died down.
I told my team to go to Marine exspansion to get the Command Chair up but they didn't do as I said. I actually had to say <b>"Can you please do as I say :/"</b> to get them to work with me but after that I had a few marines that did as I said.
I sent them to the repair room first and placed down 2 Extracters that they worked on and they got them up quite quickly. I then upgraded the amoury to get shotguns. I sent them up to Alien Expansion where there was a Drifter that was just about to turn into a Harvester but they managed to kill it.
I then placed an Armoury in that room to allow them to get shotguns and after it was up I didn't realise that it was unpowered so I ordered my MAC that was up there to create a portable power node. That then went up and they bought their shotguns. I placed down a turret in that room and also I placed an Extracter there.
After a few attacks on the main Hive we managed to win.
This game just proves that having an experienced commander and without rushing to their you can easily finish the game. It was a fun game that lasted only about 15 minutes but none-the-less it was still fun and a good strategic game.
<u>Problems that I had with this game:</u>
-When I first ordered my Marines they didn't do as I said. I am guessing this is because there are a lack of commanders that order their Marines around.
-Shotgun seemed to Over-power the aliens and they seemed to have no chance against us. Of course skill is also a factor of this.
Other than that is was a good game and very fun. Commanders still have a strong role among the team and the portable Power nodes are a very good addition. It allows bases in areas when you can't normally have them.
<!--sizeo:3--><span style="font-size:12pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->The Moral of the story is: We need <b>more Commanders</b> sending <b>Orders!</b><!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
People that I remember playing with in this game:
Abomos
It was only a small game about 4 vs 4. Anyway...
...I was on the Marine side and I was a commander. I put down the usual Armoury and went to Marine Exspansion to place another Command chair.
We were getting a few attacks from some rushers but that soon died down.
I told my team to go to Marine exspansion to get the Command Chair up but they didn't do as I said. I actually had to say <b>"Can you please do as I say :/"</b> to get them to work with me but after that I had a few marines that did as I said.
I sent them to the repair room first and placed down 2 Extracters that they worked on and they got them up quite quickly. I then upgraded the amoury to get shotguns. I sent them up to Alien Expansion where there was a Drifter that was just about to turn into a Harvester but they managed to kill it.
I then placed an Armoury in that room to allow them to get shotguns and after it was up I didn't realise that it was unpowered so I ordered my MAC that was up there to create a portable power node. That then went up and they bought their shotguns. I placed down a turret in that room and also I placed an Extracter there.
After a few attacks on the main Hive we managed to win.
This game just proves that having an experienced commander and without rushing to their you can easily finish the game. It was a fun game that lasted only about 15 minutes but none-the-less it was still fun and a good strategic game.
<u>Problems that I had with this game:</u>
-When I first ordered my Marines they didn't do as I said. I am guessing this is because there are a lack of commanders that order their Marines around.
-Shotgun seemed to Over-power the aliens and they seemed to have no chance against us. Of course skill is also a factor of this.
Other than that is was a good game and very fun. Commanders still have a strong role among the team and the portable Power nodes are a very good addition. It allows bases in areas when you can't normally have them.
<!--sizeo:3--><span style="font-size:12pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->The Moral of the story is: We need <b>more Commanders</b> sending <b>Orders!</b><!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
People that I remember playing with in this game:
Abomos
Comments
But you rarely get anything like that, unless you get a team full of a few forum/NS1 vets who will work together.
I do think that the shotgun is OP and it is definitly more OP when there is a group of people using them but for some of the time when my team were holding that room they only had rifles and the Aliens still couldn't kill them (I was backing them up with Med Packs but still)
I can still kill 2 shotgunners though if I am a skulk and even more so now because of the new updates making the skulk better.
There also wasn't that much defense at my base; only 1 sentry that you could easily get behind and destroy before I could get to you (I was in the Marine expansion Command Chair because I had to build it) and then kill the IP.
Well.. Back in NS1 players usually understood the importance of commander's orders and building RTs and another stuff to manage to get a good game.
There was also another group that (as marine) rushed right at start straight to alien hive for spawn camp (or as we called it in Finland: "Hivelle ja päähän", which roughly translates to "to the hive and headshot".) If those rushers formed 2/3 of your marine team and the rest of them were new in game or just thinking: "I don't build that thing", then commander's last hope to save the game would be to relocate the base near alien hive. (If he wants to keep pressure on and doesn't wait until they spawn at marine start one by one which would be pointless.)
In NS2 game mechanics call people to be more solo type players. They have their own resources and they don't need to take care of anything else than get kills. You only need to get one resource tower up because you get your resources from frags and RTs.
In NS2 commander can't locate him self near hive because he had to get that mac there in alive what seems to be impossible. until that tactic is just rushing.
So everything is good if IP and armory are still up in their point of view. And a skillful commander can defend the base on his own like in NS1 (yes, without turrets!).
So if you want people to really play together and play as a good team the game mechanics should be more like in NS1 just because its teamplay or lose. NS2 it's just some solo guys and blames another people to why they sucks so hard and their EGO don't let them understand that it needs a little teamwork too.
<b>Problem is game mechanics. Not that people don't give enough orders or that the Shotgun is OP.</b>
And if the marine commander does not tell people where to go, marines will gave a huge resource disadvantage, as skulks can just ninja the extractors.
I however do not find waypoints very usefull, partly because of how i never know if I actually gave one or if the symbol only appears on my hud, and partly because I have to find and move to players, which is hard to do when you have to sit with criss crossed arms to navigate using arrow keys (clicking map is to much movements with the mouse (unless you want to travel far, fast, and know where (such as if you get a "under attack" warning)), hotkeys ftw!).
Instead I found that spitting out location names, and sometimes numbers or classes, in my mic to be more than sufficient. Not everyone follows the orders (only those close or not busy), so the marines doesnt get to concentrated on one spot.
You just have to keep an eye on the tides of battle, if you got valuable stuff on one side of map and everyone goes to the other, tell someone to try and ninja the other way. If an enemy tried to ninja you, it will act as a defence, or in worst case a warning, and if not you can get some enemy extractors killed.
Offtopic:
I dont get it, why is arrow keys comm movement? NS2 is probably the reason I have started to get tense shoulders. Crisscrossing ones arm in such a position for hours just aint good for the body...
They should really fix those marine NPCs.
There was also another group that (as marine) rushed right at start straight to alien hive for spawn camp (or as we called it in Finland: "Hivelle ja päähän", which roughly translates to "to the hive and headshot".) If those rushers formed 2/3 of your marine team and the rest of them were new in game or just thinking: "I don't build that thing", then commander's last hope to save the game would be to relocate the base near alien hive. (If he wants to keep pressure on and doesn't wait until they spawn at marine start one by one which would be pointless.)
In NS2 game mechanics call people to be more solo type players. They have their own resources and they don't need to take care of anything else than get kills. You only need to get one resource tower up because you get your resources from frags and RTs.
In NS2 commander can't locate him self near hive because he had to get that mac there in alive what seems to be impossible. until that tactic is just rushing.
So everything is good if IP and armory are still up in their point of view. And a skillful commander can defend the base on his own like in NS1 (yes, without turrets!).
So if you want people to really play together and play as a good team the game mechanics should be more like in NS1 just because its teamplay or lose. NS2 it's just some solo guys and blames another people to why they sucks so hard and their EGO don't let them understand that it needs a little teamwork too.
<b>Problem is game mechanics. Not that people don't give enough orders or that the Shotgun is OP.</b><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Commander interface could be improved. Being able to give multiple waypoints or more specific orders (e.g. attack, defend, escort) would be helpful in this regard. Also, none of the squad-based features have been implemented. This, combined with the op shotgun, make it much easier to do things by yourself.
Also, I find there to be many players who are new or are unfamiliar (because they haven't played in a few patches) with the current tactics/strats that its hard to get people organized. However, thats pretty standard for pub play. If you really want the teamwork-oriented games, you're going to have to wait for clan matches and tournaments.
this is my biggest gripe about the keybindings for commander. cuz really, do you need keybindings for the upgrades that you're only going to click once? no. move map navigation back to wasd and off of the arrow keys. this was a silly UI decision. make z, x, and c the permanent (regardless of where you are in the command options) keys for drop ammo, drop medpack, drop cat pack.
omg yes! This needs to happen. It's never a big deal if you're a few milliseconds off dropping a structure, but that means death if you're trying to support your units with skillshots.
Sigh! Of course not. Commander got another tools to that.
Never saw a good commander jump out the comm chair and kill two or three skullks? I do that all the time at NS1 public games. Sometimes in clan games too (in old good times).
So commanders tools is:
-Get shotgun to defend base, if there is something bigger than skullks.
-Beacon at Observatory.
-Wait until some another player spawns from IP and then jump out. (yes two shooters at base vs 1 fade is enough)
-Order player(s) to run back.
-Order player(s) to use phasegate to get back to base.
There shouldn't be any option to build base turrets because that is waste of resources. NS1 in back to 1.0 adn 1.04 people do that because they really got no glue how to play this type of game. (Including my self)
<!--quoteo(post=1839753:date=Apr 4 2011, 06:00 AM:name=Tig)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tig @ Apr 4 2011, 06:00 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1839753"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->this is my biggest gripe about the keybindings for commander. cuz really, do you need keybindings for the upgrades that you're only going to click once? no. move map navigation back to wasd and off of the arrow keys. this was a silly UI decision. make z, x, and c the permanent (regardless of where you are in the command options) keys for drop ammo, drop medpack, drop cat pack.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1839756:date=Apr 4 2011, 08:54 AM:name=KuBaN)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (KuBaN @ Apr 4 2011, 08:54 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1839756"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->omg yes! This needs to happen. It's never a big deal if you're a few milliseconds off dropping a structure, but that means death if you're trying to support your units with skillshots.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
For crying out loud! -.-
Never heard about minimap clicks about your mouse and use hotkeys to drop items?
Movement with arrow keys or WASD is pointless because it is <u>slow</u> and not accurasy enough. For example, you guys are maybe played warcraft 3, starcraft or starcraft 2 or another realtime strategy game? If you are, you really know about how important it is to use that minimap clicks to navigate and do everything else from hotkeys. It is fastest and best way to play.
I played NS1 in 4 or 5 seasons at Team Fantasys commander and I think my APM <i>(Actions per minute)</i> was about between 60-120 for 5 players. Dropping medpacks and ammo packs 3 different locations of map, dropping couple of weapons in one who is in base and another squad same time dropping resource tower and some scans from observatory.
My point is, if I have to use to do that simple job with using my WASD or arrow keys that would be really annoying to play and if there is still that minimap clicking but WASD buttons are in my way, that slows me down atleast 75% about do that everything.
<b>Make a simple test for your self.</b> Practice to use your hotkeys and drop armory in your base, make another location 2-3 medpacks and ammo packs and swap location to another side of map. Drop same amount of meds and ammo and return to base and drop there same amount of meds and ammo packs.
IF you do this right, you have done it in between 6-8 seconds. At least I do.
So when i tried same thing at arrow movement and mouse clicking items I already spend 10 seconds to move my view to first place and dropped my ammo and medpacks.
<b>[I'm not trying to say that everyone or me should be super pr0 commander. I just want to people to understand what is "best way" to control things efficiently and what is important things about playing as commander.]</b>
^---This
I totally agree with this statement.
And I think waypoints are a better mechanism...I don't know all these area names by heart
...crap I don't even know some of the streets near where I live.
Playing marine ...I literally BEG for orders waypoints etc. and when I don't get them I wander...
This is me
...I don't know where he/she is building planning to build...I don't know...might as well walk allllll the way to the hive.
(WHICH IS SO STUPID)
but I gotta do something with my free time.
Also lovely story about a quick tight game.
(and no I don't have the same problem on aliens...because of hivesight i think...but I have a better handle on the game without the commander telling me.)
I remember one round, where the marine team losing badly, and I gave each of them individual waypoints to go to the corner of the map and defend, and after I formed them all to be in a squad, I beacon them all to a hidden beacon next to the hive that was covered with hydras all over the wall and whips everywhere. I told them each individually what to do with a mic and after a tense fight, we won. It was a sight to see, all the the marines watching each others backs....
That is true, although there is still a lack of Commanders that send orders there is also the shotgun that allows marines to solo things easily. One of the quotes in my signature is what someone said.
This kind of represents what the current marine commander does. The commander still has a impact of the game though it is just that no one actually commands properly to use that position to their full advantage.
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Well, there is 1 problem that around at the moment and that is the doors not opening for the Drifters and MACs. If they did have a good team that communicated with their commander then they would have had someone open the door and let the Drifter through (I have done this in a few games now, even though it is a bug it still promotes teamwork with players and their Com.
And yeah, about 5 minutes into the game I actuallly properly took command and sent them to go and do as I said - Enought time to get a second RT and maybe enough time for the noobs to get a second hive up. I asked my team to build in Repair room as I just mentioned so that gives them more time. Overall, the aliens did seem quite nooby IMHO.
Never heard about minimap clicks about your mouse and use hotkeys to drop items?
Movement with arrow keys or WASD is pointless because it is <u>slow</u> and not accurasy enough. For example, you guys are maybe played warcraft 3, starcraft or starcraft 2 or another realtime strategy game? If you are, you really know about how important it is to use that minimap clicks to navigate and do everything else from hotkeys. It is fastest and best way to play.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I play RTS's. I understand the importance of hotkeys. But the importance of hotkeys is considerably less than in a traditional RTS because you have considerably less to manage. You aren't directly micromanaging offensive units across the board while also ordering the construction of multiple buildings at once. I'd rather be able to follow a moving squad with the "slow" precision of WASD than having to click a considerably scaled down mini map that never seems to focus on what I'm clicking and disorients me more than the Skulks view tilt ever will.
I think the biggest issue is that lag/bugs/GUI wonkiness makes hotkeys/minimap movement tedious and unreliable. Too much lag causes the comm view to rubberband so much that it makes clicking on the minimap unreliable. Also, I've noticed various instances where the minimap doesn't update fast enough or at all, leaving you to guess where that 'structure under attack' alert is coming from, and then, half of the time its a skulk killing a powernode somewhere. Hotkeys also tend to get very bugged if you're trying to do too many things at once. The list goes on and on, but the issue is not that the important RTS features aren't there, but that they don't work very well. Ironically, its sometimes quicker to move the comm view via the arrow keys or manually click the structure/upgrade buttons.