Relocation and Technodes (and commanders)
PedoKuma
Join Date: 2011-01-10 Member: 76968Members
Join Date: 2011-01-10 Member: 76968Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Why you won't have funny relocate in NS2</div><i>For the few people who don't want to read that big post, I've colored my big ideas in red :>.
</i>
Hey, UWE and NS2 players, don't you think CS (which is the actual CC you know...) is to big and its tech-nodes dependence is annoying ?
Have you ever experienced the kind of game where you commander quickly build an outpost near the aliens' first hive and let you cover his ass while he rush sieges ? It was nice to have this king of game every 100 or so.
But now, in NS2, marines have to do the tech-nodes' race too, and it's kinda annoying. Weren't kharaas and marines supposed to be asymmetrical ? Now they both rush for tech-nodes, have a commander (I know their roles are different but...), armor/weapon upgrades, ...
What I propose is to <!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro--><b>be able (as marine) to build CS on tech-nodes and a kind of Commander chair wherever</b><!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->(basically a little chair that you can go in to command and where you can build IPs around and something like 50% of health/armor of a normal CS). This way, if you want to rush the aliens' start, you put a CChair near their base, you put a little base, you rush tier2 and ARCs, you win ... or you epicly loose because a skulk scooted you too early by luck. If you can't put CChair, your only tool to do that is to put a BIG CS on the tech-node, the same tech-node that will be, IN EVERY GAMES, scooted every minutes because it's big rooms and aliens need to expand too. Actually in NS2, viable rushes are All-in build orders aren't very numerous (for me, in marine side, there aren't any).
Also, in order to make marines expand in tech-nodes' areas, and because UWE is changing the marines' tech tree, I suggest to make <!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro--><b>Tech-nodes generate resources, especially Tres</b><!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->, and at a faster rate than RT (2.5* the RT rate ?).
Pros : -That would make more viable strategies to NS2 gameplay (which is a really good thing, huh) and you would be able to build as marines almost everywhere; even in the gorge's hideout :>.
-End game hunts would come back (And I <strike>think</strike> know you <strike>sometimes</strike>always miss the funny last gorge running away or the marine going as fast as he can to build his new CC His comm droped before their base got owned.)
-Would make both teams to have a good advantage in getting the more tech-nodes they can and destroying their enemy's.
-<!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro--><b>That would prevent the "We still have one hive but no RT and not enough Tres to build another" issue</b><!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->, which is really annoying, huh.
Cons :would be another model to make/code (maybe post 1.0?). (don't see other cons, tell me :p)
Finally, about side commander, <!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro--><b>why not call that chair "Support chair" and let a marine comm in and help the actual commander </b><!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->by giving med/ammo/cata packs (and maybe weapons ?) to the team while the comm is managing the bots (IE macs, arcs, turrets,...) and building.
I think that's all, might edit if I find something else. Feel free to tell me if you didn't understand anything (I'm a bit tired so I'm lazy to read it now). I'd like to talk with you about my ideas, need yours and your opinion. Your turn :)
</i>
Hey, UWE and NS2 players, don't you think CS (which is the actual CC you know...) is to big and its tech-nodes dependence is annoying ?
Have you ever experienced the kind of game where you commander quickly build an outpost near the aliens' first hive and let you cover his ass while he rush sieges ? It was nice to have this king of game every 100 or so.
But now, in NS2, marines have to do the tech-nodes' race too, and it's kinda annoying. Weren't kharaas and marines supposed to be asymmetrical ? Now they both rush for tech-nodes, have a commander (I know their roles are different but...), armor/weapon upgrades, ...
What I propose is to <!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro--><b>be able (as marine) to build CS on tech-nodes and a kind of Commander chair wherever</b><!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->(basically a little chair that you can go in to command and where you can build IPs around and something like 50% of health/armor of a normal CS). This way, if you want to rush the aliens' start, you put a CChair near their base, you put a little base, you rush tier2 and ARCs, you win ... or you epicly loose because a skulk scooted you too early by luck. If you can't put CChair, your only tool to do that is to put a BIG CS on the tech-node, the same tech-node that will be, IN EVERY GAMES, scooted every minutes because it's big rooms and aliens need to expand too. Actually in NS2, viable rushes are All-in build orders aren't very numerous (for me, in marine side, there aren't any).
Also, in order to make marines expand in tech-nodes' areas, and because UWE is changing the marines' tech tree, I suggest to make <!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro--><b>Tech-nodes generate resources, especially Tres</b><!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->, and at a faster rate than RT (2.5* the RT rate ?).
Pros : -That would make more viable strategies to NS2 gameplay (which is a really good thing, huh) and you would be able to build as marines almost everywhere; even in the gorge's hideout :>.
-End game hunts would come back (And I <strike>think</strike> know you <strike>sometimes</strike>always miss the funny last gorge running away or the marine going as fast as he can to build his new CC His comm droped before their base got owned.)
-Would make both teams to have a good advantage in getting the more tech-nodes they can and destroying their enemy's.
-<!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro--><b>That would prevent the "We still have one hive but no RT and not enough Tres to build another" issue</b><!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->, which is really annoying, huh.
Cons :would be another model to make/code (maybe post 1.0?). (don't see other cons, tell me :p)
Finally, about side commander, <!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro--><b>why not call that chair "Support chair" and let a marine comm in and help the actual commander </b><!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->by giving med/ammo/cata packs (and maybe weapons ?) to the team while the comm is managing the bots (IE macs, arcs, turrets,...) and building.
I think that's all, might edit if I find something else. Feel free to tell me if you didn't understand anything (I'm a bit tired so I'm lazy to read it now). I'd like to talk with you about my ideas, need yours and your opinion. Your turn :)
Comments
I rarely see that either side lose all their resource nodes and are stuck to die without them being able to do anything. And I would say I play alot.
For offensive all-in stategies we already got the Phase Gate coming.
I don't like having several commanders. That's all about griefing and interfiering with the original commanders strategy.
One commander per team can do the job.
Hives should retract their tentacles(thats how you can see when there is someone in the hive) when a player jump in one of them.
And Command Chairs should close when there already are a commander.
The only thing I could see implemented to the game was that; captured Tech Points generate Team Resources. That way marine expansions will be valuable again. Not only used as a late-game secondary spawn points.
I rarely see that either side lose all their resource nodes and are stuck to die without them being able to do anything. And I would say I play alot.
For offensive all-in stategies we already got the Phase Gate coming.
I don't like having several commanders. That's all about griefing and interfiering with the original commanders strategy.
One commander per team can do the job.
Hives should retract their tentacles(thats how you can see when there is someone in the hive) when a player jump in one of them.
And Command Chairs should close when there already are a commander.
The only thing I could see implemented to the game was that; captured Tech Points generate Team Resources. That way marine expansions will be valuable again. Not only used as a late-game secondary spawn points.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
CC hiding happened 1 round every 100, and it took 2minutes. That's not if you were recycling all your base and waiting your death like an idiot, you're trying to survive, even if you can't win. Also, I want CChair but that's not only for hunting marines, as I said before.
Then, I don't think we'll have all-in strategies with PG. Phase are weak and if you loose your outpost (IE skulks waiting to bite your ass at the exit) you're owned(in NS1, we don't know yet in NS2 but I think it'll be the same). Further, as UWE said, you won't be able to move ARCs and EXOs through the phase, that's why a robotic facility near the base would be more effective.
About several commanders now, I didn't say the secondary commander could build/manage the base, I only said he could drop support to his teammates. This way, in 16vs16, he could help the commander when he is busy, and the plasma cost (I hate "personal resources" name :p) for the commander would be lowered, allowing him to buy more sentries/arcs (They'll cost plasma right ?) or weapons.
Finally, where I'm with you is when a commander get in the CS/Hive, all hives/CS should close until he leaves, Preventing grieffers to do sh*t or ragers to switch team and sell the base.
ps : I was thinking, Why the hell when an alien go into a hive, he become the overmind (or hivemind/whatever you call it, I can't remember). I mean, there should be a UI to select alien commander (easily expandable to marine side) and then he would be disappear and become the commander (for Marine side, only the elected commander could push the login screen, something like he's the only on to have the password eheh).
Thank you for the repply by the way :>
By the time this happens marines have already lost the game, and it is just plain old farm hiding. It's annoying, and hated in many RTS games.
<!--quoteo(post=1848977:date=May 28 2011, 11:17 PM:name=PedoKuma)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PedoKuma @ May 28 2011, 11:17 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1848977"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Then, I don't think we'll have all-in strategies with PG. Phase are weak and if you loose your outpost (IE skulks waiting to bite your ass at the exit) you're owned(in NS1, we don't know yet in NS2 but I think it'll be the same). Further, as UWE said, you won't be able to move ARCs and EXOs through the phase, that's why a robotic facility near the base would be more effective.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Imagine dropping a phase gate (and a power node) and a robotics factory near a hive. Thats a all-in siege tactic.
<!--quoteo(post=1848977:date=May 28 2011, 11:17 PM:name=PedoKuma)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PedoKuma @ May 28 2011, 11:17 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1848977"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->About several commanders now, I didn't say the secondary commander could build/manage the base, I only said he could drop support to his teammates. This way, in 16vs16, he could help the commander when he is busy, and the plasma cost (I hate "personal resources" name :p) for the commander would be lowered, allowing him to buy more sentries/arcs (They'll cost plasma right ?) or weapons.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I still think that several commanders are obsolete and not needed in any way. To me it just seems like a bug that needs squashing :P
<!--quoteo(post=1848977:date=May 28 2011, 11:17 PM:name=PedoKuma)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PedoKuma @ May 28 2011, 11:17 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1848977"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->ps : I was thinking, Why the hell when an alien go into a hive, he become the overmind (or hivemind/whatever you call it, I can't remember). I mean, there should be a UI to select alien commander (easily expandable to marine side) and then he would be disappear and become the commander (for Marine side, only the elected commander could push the login screen, something like he's the only on to have the password eheh).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't like the idea of voting for a commander to be part of the vanilla game. That should be a public server mod, if anything. It will only be annoying in competetive play.
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=113423" target="_blank">Resources Re-Envisioned</a>