<!--quoteo(post=1920206:date=Mar 31 2012, 07:13 PM:name=ironhorse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ironhorse @ Mar 31 2012, 07:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1920206"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->known bug. we're on it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Personally, I think it should stay. It's like dodging an attack.
I apologize, I didn't spend much time on the Onos this week. I realize it's quite a problem at the moment.
I don't think there's a simple/quick fix for him right now, but I'll be able to address the balance problems with him again after we're done with PAX East.
<!--quoteo(post=1920320:date=Apr 1 2012, 08:20 AM:name=Zuriki)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Zuriki @ Apr 1 2012, 08:20 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1920320"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Personally, I think it should stay. It's like dodging an attack.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This. It should be avoidable and it shouldn't hit Jetpackers who are in the air. Inversely it should hit people who are slightly above or beneath your height due to stairs if they're standing on the ground, sometimes it does but most of the time it doesn't. <i>That's</i> what seems like a bug.
<!--quoteo(post=1920206:date=Mar 31 2012, 01:13 PM:name=ironhorse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ironhorse @ Mar 31 2012, 01:13 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1920206"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->known bug. we're on it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
On this subject, is it intended that onos can consecutively stomp the same marine? i.e You can pretty much be locked to the ground for as long as the onos has energy. If one onos spams this while the other gores them all it could become quite a serious problem. (Since players would pretty much be locked to the ground with no means of escape)
I don't know if it's the right topic but I'll write my 2 cents about 202 gameplay. I've just left a 2h game beeing as alien comm. We fought to the last blood, loosing a hive building another, over and over again. We had like 500 team res, plenty of lame here and there, all upgrades...team could afford onoses. Still we weren't able to kill marines. It wasn't the skill of a team. We were equal - that's why it lasted so long. Rine commander used few not fair tactics, as blocking onoses with building was very common, but still the game was a nice combat :)
The main problems from my point of view as an alien commander were : - marines fully upgarded can kill hive with axes in no time. Aliens need some good defense system as sentries are or tech places for hives should be reworked. Hydras, whips are useless. Rines tend to hop in to the hive or behind it with jps and slash it. If the alien team is fighting hard at the second end of the map you won't make it to get on time to the hive to save it :( - in few tech points for the hives you can't put a single hydra or whip to defend the hive from every side, this way leaving blank spots for a wandering marines willing to slash a hive. Come on, imagine alien commander having 3 hives, fully upgraded team fighting on the front and seeing a single rine getting inside the hive place with loads of lame around and hiding behind a hive model slashing it with an axe. Could it be something more frustrating for an alien commander?? - 3 arcs can kill the hive in a blitz, when properly defended with a team of fully upgraded marines you can't kill them. Gorges used to have bb, they could bile the arcs from distance, covered by other aliens. Thats why gorges were so needed in the late game. Now you need to spend 34 res for a Lerk who gets nailed with everything marines can have in late games (nades, flamers, sgs) because he needs to fly over the arcs to slowly kill them (BB is now DOT). Now, show me the players who can kill 3 arcs with a Lerk BB while they are defened by 5 marines with big weapons lvl3 in a small corridor ? UWE can do ? I say no can do!
A question to UWE - Are you planing in a short term balancing those pointed gaps ? Or do you have different insights then mine ? Would be nice hearing from you nad get some input on those highlighted issues.
Really love the 202 build! 201 had been kinda crappy, the overall UI changes looked strange at first and the hit registration seemed like all kinds of broken.
202 on the other hand plays really really nice. Good feedback on hitting stuff and the material effects look really great. But the whole font/UI/FoV is kinda strange, starting up 202 for the first time, i had to check my resolution. Because everything looked like having the wrong FoV.
But the really responsive and great gameplay made up for that, after a few hours i didn't even notice the difference anymore. Still can't put the finger on what's different in terms of FoV/View. Is it just the new UI, because it's more crowded then the old one? Or did something actually change about the FoV? Sure it's playable after getting used to it, but at first glance it feels kinda crowded/claustrophobic.
Other then that i can't complain about this build, only had 1 random crash after first start up, after that the thing ran trough for 10+ hours. Btw: Huge thanks for finnaly making it possible to gestate on hives! The progress you guys manage to make with each new build is really impressive and it just doesn't stop to amaze me :)
Does anyone else not like how when a building is destroyed it blinks away slowly on the map? it takes like 3 seconds before you can tell whether or not a resource tower was destroyed because after it gets blown up you can still see it on the map for a few seconds, blinking on and off until it finally doesn't blink back on.
Playing the new build i do notice the hit detection change, however it just seems to amplify the fact that hits do not seem to get detected correctly. Is there any way to make an easy counter that tracks bullets hit? As it seems like it takes 25 to 30 hits to kill moving skulks at times.
Love the new build! Much smoother and more responsiveness (no lag, easier to bite and shoot)
Some changes that would make a big difference i think: - omit or change alien flashlight (to be effective as an alien you really need to play with it on all the time) as it is ugly and you can't enjoy the games atmospherics graphics anymore when you play aliens - add graphic effects and sounds to bullet trajectories and impacts (right now it's just weird, you can hear yourself getting hit but there's no sound of bullets hitting metal and no visual feedback as well, it's like the marine is injecting bullets into you from afar LOL) - change dynamic infestation for it to be more than just a flat bitmap spreading on the ground.
Balance seems better and that improves with each build although I have always thought it was less important than performance etc for now.
201 was great performance wise but 202 is a lot laggy at times with random lag spikes and I can I freeze for anywhere from 2 to 10 seconds several times per match, although my character is still doing something in game as when the freezing stops I am in a different area slightly.
Its been mentioned a lot I know but Onos at hive one isnt right as is the amount of ARC's the marines can send out at a time. Just watched as the marines sent out 8 in a convoy and destroyed a hive plus structures in less than a minute. The same convoy then went to the next hive and the very same happened. Two hives down and a marine win in approx 3 minutes with the Aliens more than pi$$ed off. I was marine and felt sorry for them as I have been on the Alien team and seen it happen a lot.
I don't know what UW have done, but at last the marine jump spam seems to have just about stopped. It is enough now to clear a railing then quickly drops in the height you can get. Makes the game a lot better and I cant thank you guys enough for that. I will now have to find something else to moan about haha.
mm i've only just noticed that using leap automatically angles you up now? This can sometimes be a bit annoying as it causes you to hit the ceiling against your will and lose speed, so the effective area which you can move in is lower. Where you point with your mouse isn't the direction you end up going.
<!--quoteo(post=1920690:date=Apr 1 2012, 05:05 PM:name=hotd0g)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (hotd0g @ Apr 1 2012, 05:05 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1920690"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Some changes that would make a big difference i think: - omit or change alien flashlight (to be effective as an alien you really need to play with it on all the time) as it is ugly and you can't enjoy the games atmospherics graphics anymore when you play aliens<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Please do not get rid of the unique, useful, and extremely cool alien flashlight. I do not think it is ugly at all.
<!--quoteo(post=1920105:date=Mar 31 2012, 08:56 AM:name=Ryne)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ryne @ Mar 31 2012, 08:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1920105"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I agree, this patch has made stomp useless as gore damages buildings faster, and you do not run out of energy nearly as quick.
It was very clearcut before, Gore against marines, Smash against buildings. Now it is not so clearcut since both attacks do damage to both players and buildings<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have to say, I like the idea of specific skills fitting specific roles, too.
I still think the solution to Gore is to lower its rate of fire. Think Focus rate in NS1. Then knockdown isn't so bad, because they can't just hold down the button till they hit you.
<!--quoteo(post=1919966:date=Mar 31 2012, 03:43 AM:name=Mkk_Bitestuff)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mkk_Bitestuff @ Mar 31 2012, 03:43 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1919966"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->FPS for me is way down, not that it has ever been high. I think that UWE might need to stop looking at automatically reported stats on FPS for the game, as generally people with better FPS are much more likely to keep playing... i know atleast 5 people that will not play the game at all because they get between 5 and 25 FPS in combat, which is about what mine is.
Also are collisions predicted client side? As sometimes there is momentary lag and you appear to fall into or through the map.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> It has a simple solution - don't weight FPS by time played but only by 1 - how many players have specific average FPS.
Comments
Personally, I think it should stay. It's like dodging an attack.
I don't think there's a simple/quick fix for him right now, but I'll be able to address the balance problems with him again after we're done with PAX East.
This. It should be avoidable and it shouldn't hit Jetpackers who are in the air. Inversely it should hit people who are slightly above or beneath your height due to stairs if they're standing on the ground, sometimes it does but most of the time it doesn't. <i>That's</i> what seems like a bug.
On this subject, is it intended that onos can consecutively stomp the same marine? i.e You can pretty much be locked to the ground for as long as the onos has energy. If one onos spams this while the other gores them all it could become quite a serious problem. (Since players would pretty much be locked to the ground with no means of escape)
The main problems from my point of view as an alien commander were :
- marines fully upgarded can kill hive with axes in no time. Aliens need some good defense system as sentries are or tech places for hives should be reworked. Hydras, whips are useless. Rines tend to hop in to the hive or behind it with jps and slash it. If the alien team is fighting hard at the second end of the map you won't make it to get on time to the hive to save it :(
- in few tech points for the hives you can't put a single hydra or whip to defend the hive from every side, this way leaving blank spots for a wandering marines willing to slash a hive. Come on, imagine alien commander having 3 hives, fully upgraded team fighting on the front and seeing a single rine getting inside the hive place with loads of lame around and hiding behind a hive model slashing it with an axe. Could it be something more frustrating for an alien commander??
- 3 arcs can kill the hive in a blitz, when properly defended with a team of fully upgraded marines you can't kill them. Gorges used to have bb, they could bile the arcs from distance, covered by other aliens. Thats why gorges were so needed in the late game. Now you need to spend 34 res for a Lerk who gets nailed with everything marines can have in late games (nades, flamers, sgs) because he needs to fly over the arcs to slowly kill them (BB is now DOT). Now, show me the players who can kill 3 arcs with a Lerk BB while they are defened by 5 marines with big weapons lvl3 in a small corridor ? UWE can do ? I say no can do!
A question to UWE - Are you planing in a short term balancing those pointed gaps ? Or do you have different insights then mine ?
Would be nice hearing from you nad get some input on those highlighted issues.
Best regards
Xan
201 had been kinda crappy, the overall UI changes looked strange at first and the hit registration seemed like all kinds of broken.
202 on the other hand plays really really nice. Good feedback on hitting stuff and the material effects look really great.
But the whole font/UI/FoV is kinda strange, starting up 202 for the first time, i had to check my resolution. Because everything looked like having the wrong FoV.
But the really responsive and great gameplay made up for that, after a few hours i didn't even notice the difference anymore.
Still can't put the finger on what's different in terms of FoV/View. Is it just the new UI, because it's more crowded then the old one? Or did something actually change about the FoV?
Sure it's playable after getting used to it, but at first glance it feels kinda crowded/claustrophobic.
Other then that i can't complain about this build, only had 1 random crash after first start up, after that the thing ran trough for 10+ hours.
Btw: Huge thanks for finnaly making it possible to gestate on hives! The progress you guys manage to make with each new build is really impressive and it just doesn't stop to amaze me :)
Some changes that would make a big difference i think:
- omit or change alien flashlight (to be effective as an alien you really need to play with it on all the time) as it is ugly and you can't enjoy the games atmospherics graphics anymore when you play aliens
- add graphic effects and sounds to bullet trajectories and impacts (right now it's just weird, you can hear yourself getting hit but there's no sound of bullets hitting metal and no visual feedback as well, it's like the marine is injecting bullets into you from afar LOL)
- change dynamic infestation for it to be more than just a flat bitmap spreading on the ground.
I think those 3 would make a BIG difference.
201 was great performance wise but 202 is a lot laggy at times with random lag spikes and I can I freeze for anywhere from 2 to 10 seconds several times per match, although my character is still doing something in game as when the freezing stops I am in a different area slightly.
Its been mentioned a lot I know but Onos at hive one isnt right as is the amount of ARC's the marines can send out at a time. Just watched as the marines sent out 8 in a convoy and destroyed a hive plus structures in less than a minute. The same convoy then went to the next hive and the very same happened. Two hives down and a marine win in approx 3 minutes with the Aliens more than pi$$ed off. I was marine and felt sorry for them as I have been on the Alien team and seen it happen a lot.
I don't know what UW have done, but at last the marine jump spam seems to have just about stopped. It is enough now to clear a railing then quickly drops in the height you can get. Makes the game a lot better and I cant thank you guys enough for that. I will now have to find something else to moan about haha.
Sal
- omit or change alien flashlight (to be effective as an alien you really need to play with it on all the time) as it is ugly and you can't enjoy the games atmospherics graphics anymore when you play aliens<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Please do not get rid of the unique, useful, and extremely cool alien flashlight. I do not think it is ugly at all.
It was very clearcut before, Gore against marines, Smash against buildings. Now it is not so clearcut since both attacks do damage to both players and buildings<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have to say, I like the idea of specific skills fitting specific roles, too.
I still think the solution to Gore is to lower its rate of fire. Think Focus rate in NS1. Then knockdown isn't so bad, because they can't just hold down the button till they hit you.
Also are collisions predicted client side? As sometimes there is momentary lag and you appear to fall into or through the map.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It has a simple solution - don't weight FPS by time played but only by 1 - how many players have specific average FPS.