I Am Tired Of Accusations Of Cheating

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Comments

  • SavantSavant Join Date: 2002-11-30 Member: 10289Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
    <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Whenever anyone starts doing well, above the norm, the first thought is not "wow, he/shes good!" or a pub chat "nice shootin".

    No, the first thought is: "Are they cheating ?". <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    There's a good reson for that. They call them cheats. Had cheats not be so rediculously easy to obtain and use, then things would be different. Back in the early days of HL/TFC (before CS) things were different. Cheats were rare, and so most people just chalked it up to good play.

    Answer me this. If someone was to play their CD that they made from MP3 files, would you assume that they owned all the CDs that the songs came from, or would you assume that they downloaded the songs off the net? (let's try and keep the MP3/stealing debate out of this though, I'm just using it as an example)

    No matter which side of the MP3/stealing debate you come down on, you're going to assume they downloaded the tracks.

    <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->It's sad but also a fact of multiplayer life. I find myself doing it and kick myself and try to be less suspicious. As difficult as it may be to take in, you me be having your butt handed to you by a simply superior player.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Interestingly enough in other mods I play I'm usually in the top few on the scoreboard in 'average' games. I never got accused once of cheating, but there were MANY times that I felt people (doing more poorly than me) WERE cheating. One of the assumptions being made here is that a person accusing the other of cheating ALWAYS has a lower score when that just isn't the case.

    Let's look at a recent event. As you must have seen, there is a recent exploit that surfaced that allows aliens to become marines while on the alien team, and as such have the marine skin and weapons. When it started being spread around PILES of people used it.

    Now lets be honest here. No 'honest' person would think an exploit of this nature is legitimate. Just because you CAN use it doesn't mean you SHOULD use it. However, there are LOADS of people using it. Why? ...because they have little interest in fair play, and they see nothing wrong in cheating.

    This typifies the what 'honest' players feel. There are just so many people playing the game who have no real interest in playing 'fairly' that many honest players have become conditioned not only to accept that cheating is rampant, but to EXPECT that a good number of people are indeed cheating at any given time.

    I place the blame for cheating in the HL mods squarely at the feet of CS. When CS struck gold Sierra should have immediately begun work on a new more secure engine. They didn't. As a result cheats have flourished. Of course many people found that OGC worked just as well in other mods and not just CS.

    So here we are.

    If you are a good player on NS, get used to being called a cheater. It's not your fault, so place the blame where it belongs, on the back of cheaters and those who write them.

    Until a better engine comes along things won't be changing anytime soon.

    Regards,

    Savant
  • Ph0enixPh0enix Join Date: 2002-10-08 Member: 1462Members, Constellation
    Savant,

    You touched on what I was trying to say. A lot of people seem to have a CS-bred knnejerk reaction towards anyone doing 'suspicously' good.

    Rather then thinking of other options as to why the person in question is doing so well, they just label them as a cheat. I'm trying to coach myself out of that kneejerk reaction.
  • SavantSavant Join Date: 2002-11-30 Member: 10289Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor
    The problem with that is that it provides positive reinforcement to cheaters.

    For example. Take Johnny. He cheats using OGC. Now none of us REALLY knows if he cheats, but for the sake of argument we will say he does use a cheat.

    Now Johnny plays on a server using his cheat and is owning it up as expected. Along comes a person who say "wow you're a great player Johnny" or something like that. When it happens that provides POSITIVE reinforcement to Johnny that cheating=good. So if anything that will encourage him to continue to use cheats, and to offer cheats to his friends.

    On the oher hand, if he is continually accused of using cheats, then it may start to 'get' to him and he may (albeit unlikely) stop using cheats and play normally in order to stop being harassed.

    Now, NONE of this takes into account the innocent involved. While it's unfortunate, society (not LAW but society) has consistently shown that they would rather treat a person as guilty until proven innocent. Looking at any news report on a person that is arrrested, that makes the point. Why make a news report on a person if they are innocent until proven guilty? Why not just post stories on those convicted?

    We live in a world where people are sick of crime (or in this case cheating) and as such they are speaking out. Yeah it may seem like a witch hunt and yeah it may target the innocent with the guilty, but the alternative is giving in to these scum, and frankly that leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.

    Personally I trust my instincts. I play against many people and I see some excellent players. There are LOADS of excellent players that I have NEVER suspected are cheating. There are also many 'average' players that I know are cheating. (remember, cheating will only help you get kills, it WON'T stop you from being killed.)

    In the end, I think that cheating may very well 'destroy' the half-life engine if nothing is done about it. Only time will tell.

    Regards,

    Savant
  • LarofeticusLarofeticus Join Date: 2002-10-30 Member: 1764Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I am not a big sports fan so I will just go by the big names. Michael Jordan. I am sure many of you have played basketball. I am sure there are several of you on a school team or play at the Y or something. Do any of you even approach his skill? Does he use an aimbot to get the ball in the basket? does he have 360 degree motin sensoning ability to know where the other players are. No way, Jordan is good because of years of practice and a natural ability for the game.

    Now I am in NO WAY comparing myself to Michael jordan. I am just trying to explain to you that there is a wide range of skill levels in everything that involves competition.
    <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    eheh that just made me laugh for some reason
  • Minstrel_KnightMinstrel_Knight The truth and nothing but the truth... Join Date: 2002-11-21 Member: 9562Banned
    edited December 2002
    <!--QuoteBegin--Xentor+Dec 19 2002, 02:09 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Xentor @ Dec 19 2002, 02:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Well, with the right mousepad, you won't have that problem... A leather pad gives exactly the right amount of traction, but doesn't fill up the mouse with lint...

    As for opticals... Like I said, I have a wireless optical mouse which I don't use... It's a first-generation one, and it tends to miss quick movements, assuming it was just picked up... This is a disaster when you need to make a quick turn to shoot a flanking skulk... I'm not sure if that's a problem with the sensor (It's a single-sensor, not a dual like the newer ones), the communication to the wireless receiver, or the driver coding...

    Regardless... My good old-fashioned, wheeled, balled intellimouse works fine for now...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I personally use a 2000 Boomslang a Icemat and the Claw. Boomslang is a much better mouse than the Intellimouse Explorer I used to have and when combined with the Icemat glass mousepad it is much smoother and hardly gets dirty even after months of use. The claw is a rather interesting replacement for the keyboard in games but is not necessarily better just personal preference. And there is also the Eluminix keyboard which doesn't do much more than glow...


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  • JettoJetto Join Date: 2002-11-20 Member: 9468Members
    I agree with most of what the thread started posted.
  • ShockehShockeh If a packet drops on the web and nobody&#39;s near to see it... Join Date: 2002-11-19 Member: 9336NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
    Mmmm, get paid off new job tomorrow. Will be buying Razer Boomslang ASAP.

    But a glass mouse mat? Neat-o. May have to try that one.

    And I've been accused before, but only as an alien. And I explain patiently to them, it would be quite hard to make a decent cheat a Skulk could use, unless you wanted to become parasite lord. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • crowell00crowell00 Join Date: 2002-11-17 Member: 9108Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--Heresy_Fnord+Dec 19 2002, 01:56 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Heresy_Fnord @ Dec 19 2002, 01:56 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->

    As for the gamma thing, that is just foolish.



    Use the gamma setup that comes with NS to get it set properly foo!<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    My monitor is incapable(repeat incapable) of displaying properly through NS setup.I have been having this problem for a while. When I format my pc,the brightness is fine,but when I install my video drivers,my screen gets dim.It happened with my Radeon card,and it is happening with my Gf 4 card as well.I think the problem is in my mobo,and short of replaing my mobo,there isn't much I can do about it.

    I guess if the gamma gets locked,I'm screwed <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->



    Not to rant or anything,but we arent all "foo"s
  • Nm3-Col_EcLiPsENm3-Col_EcLiPsE Join Date: 2002-11-14 Member: 8634Members
    mm if mouse senstivity is skills then my settings on low FPS's is sensitivity "16.600000" when playing fast FPS's eg, UT my settings sensitivity "18.800000" i dont really see how having ur mouse setting give u ne skills cos i cant play with a low setting it removes my judgement of precise aim so i have 2 over do my movements which ant nice when you need every millisecond you can get.
  • TaskmanTaskman Join Date: 2002-11-22 Member: 9613Members
    I use a microsoft optical explorer 2.0 with ice skatez and an everglid pad. I am unsure how to check my sensitivity its near the end though. Just like all things in life learning to use the mouse at high sensitivity levels takes time. Practice and you wont "overshoot" when moving the mouse. The higher the level you go the quicker you can put a bullet in your opponets head.

    Taskman
  • WolfWingsWolfWings NS_Nancy Resurrectionist Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 4416Members
    <!--QuoteBegin---=Dirty:::Deeds=-+Dec 19 2002, 11:11 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (-=Dirty:::Deeds=- @ Dec 19 2002, 11:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> (Please note the lack of use of the slang, L33t, N00B etc.. I have a life!) <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Wow, where'd you get the BlameThrower? I want one! <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • FantasmoFantasmo Join Date: 2002-11-06 Member: 7369Members
    edited December 2002
    **I posted this on another "Kicked for 0wning" Thread**

    I have learned that sometimes the reason for kick/bans are not always about skill or suspected cheating, it can also be about attitude.

    An unnamed person and I were on a 10 player alien team and we made up 80% of the Kills for our side. We were both around 25/1 and he was whining and complaining about how he and I were doing all the work and that if one of us left they'd lose. To everyone it just seemed like he was bragging about his score, telling the marine team how much his team sucked and quoting his score even though everyone could read it on the scoreboard. Everybody just kept on telling him to shut up (even our own team), he accused them of being jealous, and the admin finally kicked and banned him. At that point we were both around 37-2 (Let me say all the scores are approximate, I don't actually remember them) and only he got kicked. I agreed with the actions of the Admin because he was being disruptive and even though he helped the team he certainly wasn't a teamplayer. I'm sure he's all telling people how he got kicked and banned for ownage on a server and blah, blity, blah and on and on. If the dude reads this post let me say that we won without your whiny, st00pid arse.

    Nobody likes a braggart and it's just a bloody game.

    That's not to say you are a braggart, admins are people and they are prone to jealous st00pidity too.

    **End of Thread**

    I also want to add that I've seen people who are 23-0 but rampantly DMing kicked/banned before too.

    EDiT: **obscenity** to arse
  • Butt_monkey_saladButt_monkey_salad Join Date: 2002-12-17 Member: 11006Banned
    wow, since people are rarely uber at NS(i mean, its fairly new), u MUST cheat in order to be as far as accused for it. I dont think anybody whines that easily in this game, dude! ANd if they do they must be 100% serious. Knock off the hacks and I suggest stop making threads that are by truth, against yourself. Thank you...
  • Minstrel_KnightMinstrel_Knight The truth and nothing but the truth... Join Date: 2002-11-21 Member: 9562Banned
    <!--QuoteBegin--Butt monkey salad+Dec 19 2002, 10:19 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Butt monkey salad @ Dec 19 2002, 10:19 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->wow, since people are rarely uber at NS(i mean, its fairly new), u MUST cheat in order to be as far as accused for it. I dont think anybody whines that easily in this game, dude! ANd if they do they must be 100% serious. Knock off the hacks and I suggest stop making threads that are by truth, against yourself. Thank you...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    NS has been around for over two months. That's more than enough time for people to get very good at it. I get called a cheater often enough, generally due to listen to skulk footsteps and shooting them as soon as they come around the corner.
  • Butt_monkey_saladButt_monkey_salad Join Date: 2002-12-17 Member: 11006Banned
    it was all sarcasm <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
  • QuestionQuestion Join Date: 2002-11-18 Member: 9180Members
    I remember in DOD i got accused of cheating SO many times it wasnt funny.Thank god that NS isnt like that.

    2 words.

    Lag and skill.Nuff said.
  • Heresy_FnordHeresy_Fnord Join Date: 2002-11-05 Member: 7207Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--crowell00+Dec 19 2002, 06:09 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (crowell00 @ Dec 19 2002, 06:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--Heresy_Fnord+Dec 19 2002, 01:56 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Heresy_Fnord @ Dec 19 2002, 01:56 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->

    As for the gamma thing, that is just foolish.



    Use the gamma setup that comes with NS to get it set properly foo!<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    My monitor is incapable(repeat incapable) of displaying properly through NS setup.I have been having this problem for a while. When I format my pc,the brightness is fine,but when I install my video drivers,my screen gets dim.It happened with my Radeon card,and it is happening with my Gf 4 card as well.I think the problem is in my mobo,and short of replaing my mobo,there isn't much I can do about it.

    I guess if the gamma gets locked,I'm screwed <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->



    Not to rant or anything,but we arent all "foo"s<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    No what is probably happening is a game gamma setting in the card. Hardware gamma if you will.

    I can't speak for nVidia cards but ATI has a feature in the advanced tab which will allow you to apply gamma changes. Look through your settings and give it a go.

    Hope that helps.

    BTW, I don't have any hard feelings of how people adjust their gamma. I just want people to use some reasonable settings. Don't turn all your brightness settings up just so you can see in every corner. It really ruins the atmosphere. It's more fun having to use the ingame flashlight once in a while.
  • MayIPostNowMayIPostNow Join Date: 2002-12-17 Member: 11001Members
    My worst ban so far (I've had 3) was for using unorthodox tactics. I charged into the marine base and hid, the admin was watching me, and asked what i was doing. I was going to throw up 2 def chambers and a 2 offense, then kill myself. I've used this tactic successfully before, and it holds off the marines for a bout a minute or two, depending on how close i get those turrets to the spawn. Well, the admin killed me before I could pull off that stunt, and when i told him what an assy thing to do that was, he banned me. Now I must say I hate being banned for thinking of the team.

    the other 2 were for inexperience in commanding.
  • zodazoda Join Date: 2002-11-05 Member: 7175Members
    wow man, you are aproaching 1000 posts, telling people who "uber" good you are and calling everyone a "newb" and you want us to respect you?<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->


    I consider myself a good player, I dont go out of my way to be the best or anything, I think thats just dumb.. I'd rather focus on somehting like skateboarding, programming, or somethign productive.



    My advice to you is to get out of the house.


    Not everyone cres about being a "l33t" player, some people just want to play and have fun... I don't have fun when I stand no chance... It's quiet funny how you call people who arent as good as you "newbs" , yet you demand respect?

    I am with coil here.... I don't think you can be a great player if you cant play as a team anyway. This isnt free for all, it isnt CS(good game , but not really team dependant), it's Natural-Selection... You need to wokr as a team... I don't care how good a fighter you are, if you cant understand the roles of everyone on your team you will not win... and generally you will be demanding.







    If you get banned, big deal.. you were too good for that server.. find some servers with equal players, not everyone is gonna strive to be as good as you.

    I personally dont acuse people of cheating... I ask questioons sometimes like "how did you get so good", "whats your PC like?" or "how long you been playing?"


    you just have to face it that not everyone is as good as you... It doesn't mean you're smarter than them, maybe just better at games.
  • FireStormFireStorm Join Date: 2002-11-06 Member: 7390Members
    /me agrees with the guy who posted this thread

    /me has already seen the message "Kicked by console" in NS.
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