Drifters
Runteh
Join Date: 2010-06-26 Member: 72163Members, Reinforced - Shadow
Join Date: 2010-06-26 Member: 72163Members, Reinforced - Shadow
<div class="IPBDescription">Current Role</div>I think the drifter has taken a really great change for the better in its recent implementation, and compensates beautifully for the lack of hive sight when walking on infestation.
I have found myself popping out 3 at the beginning of games, and once I know where the marine start is I send them off to the other tech points or choke points to scout.
Enzyme is also a really great addition, I have found myself using it but with two downsides.
1. Not sure if it is visual to the marines, or whether the drifter becomes visible once cast (I am in two minds about this) but it does move when out of range... I think for it not to move when it is out of range would make it feel clunky, but there needs to be a 'range circle' so I know I can cast it safely without the drifter moving and becoming noticed.
2. Range is far too low, I think it could be doubled. I tend to stick drifters in spots where marines will not step or fire into. This means that it is slightly father back from the tech point than its range, and that tends to be where fights occur. (Around Extractors/Tech Points) This is debatable for reasons of balance.
The important point is though, as I start to use them I am increasingly more aware of them as a 'useable' unit. With the CRAG/SHIFT/SHADE I only ever tend to use them where they are placed - next to Tech Points/Harvesters. As you only use their abilities when you are being attacked, or near your hive, they sort of become under used and under valued.
Why not move these abilities to the drifter as well, as an extension of the structures? I think UMBRA/ENZYME/etc would be used more, as you have that dynamic ability to cast them anywhere on the map, and you would be more aware of the drifters value as NPC.
It might also aide in the end game, as you could use drifters to umbra/enzyme the marine's base, and I think it would make for some really interesting and tactical game play.
I have found myself popping out 3 at the beginning of games, and once I know where the marine start is I send them off to the other tech points or choke points to scout.
Enzyme is also a really great addition, I have found myself using it but with two downsides.
1. Not sure if it is visual to the marines, or whether the drifter becomes visible once cast (I am in two minds about this) but it does move when out of range... I think for it not to move when it is out of range would make it feel clunky, but there needs to be a 'range circle' so I know I can cast it safely without the drifter moving and becoming noticed.
2. Range is far too low, I think it could be doubled. I tend to stick drifters in spots where marines will not step or fire into. This means that it is slightly father back from the tech point than its range, and that tends to be where fights occur. (Around Extractors/Tech Points) This is debatable for reasons of balance.
The important point is though, as I start to use them I am increasingly more aware of them as a 'useable' unit. With the CRAG/SHIFT/SHADE I only ever tend to use them where they are placed - next to Tech Points/Harvesters. As you only use their abilities when you are being attacked, or near your hive, they sort of become under used and under valued.
Why not move these abilities to the drifter as well, as an extension of the structures? I think UMBRA/ENZYME/etc would be used more, as you have that dynamic ability to cast them anywhere on the map, and you would be more aware of the drifters value as NPC.
It might also aide in the end game, as you could use drifters to umbra/enzyme the marine's base, and I think it would make for some really interesting and tactical game play.
Comments
My opinion on the matter is; if it isn't a structure, the alien commander shouldn't have to interact with it.
But in general I don't like the idea of having mana based combat spells in game, it really smells like some kind of cheesy mmo.
I'd rather see the gorge get umbra and play like the defiler's dark-swarm, but that's always a problem with khamm/gorge so it's not really specific to the topic.
If you are attacking somewhere on the map, you have pre-planned so in your head. You communicate with your team and go about it.
For instance, whips and arcs ACTUALLY get used pro-actively. Whips less so because they are just a bit of a faff.. but I see more and more whip rushing.
If somewhere on the map is attacked, often you take time to react to this. Usually by this time the fight has occurred and ended. UMBRA sort of becomes useless, and I usually only see it being used when aliens are on the last hive and doing everything they can to prevent defeat.
Who uses the rupture ability on cysts for example? I try to, but because it is only ever used 'defensively' it is never really used. For instance, how many times have you ever had a cyst rupture on you? I don't think I can ever remember a time...
Essentially, locking these abilities to static structures with the speed the game runs at means the commander has to be in that area, aware of an impending attacking and that the marine also has to get close enough for these abilities to work. This also has to occur within the time frame of the attack. You basically need several factors to occur before they become useful.
Seems like a waste of some cool abilities. I guess I get tired of just plonking down structures and not really finding a great use for them. The whip is the only alien structure I 'enjoy' using because it is the complete opposite of the others.
This doesn't sound like the alien commander to me. This sounds like the marine commander. Some people enjoy the fast paced gameplay that such an approach brings, I do not however, which is why I was excited by the approach the alien commander was meant to take, and why I enjoy playing alien commander now.
I see the marine commander as a low maintenance, high offence approach, while the alien commander is a high maintenance low offence approach. To me, the alien commander should care more about what he already has. If your minions happen to clear an area, you encroach into it, but you are never actively assaulting a location, as the marine commander does. This is why I dislike the idea of having any meaningful presence off infestation.
<!--quoteo(post=1938417:date=May 23 2012, 03:15 PM:name=Runteh)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Runteh @ May 23 2012, 03:15 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1938417"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Who uses the rupture ability on cysts for example? I try to, but because it is only ever used 'defensively' it is never really used. For instance, how many times have you ever had a cyst rupture on you? I don't think I can ever remember a time...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The rupture ability is just so bad right now. Why do you want a mature cyst? To get the rupture ability. What does the rupture ability do? Destroys the mature cyst.
What...
One problem with this is that if the 3 drifter abilities it gains aren't balanced well this could cause the aliens to become even more locked into crag hive first (as umbra is amazing).
Didn't Charlie say this was his route? So it is hard to argue with that. My only thought is that this would really give the alien comm that support ability that perhaps it lacks.
I understand that it is more asymmetric, but perhaps the alien comm is too disconnected from the life forms?
I think the drifter sort of works in this aspect, because of its weakness. As you are either:
1. Using it to scout.
2. Supporting, not actively attacking.
You couldn't take a drifter into a room in its current state like you can an ARC.
Also, I don't think it would be fast paced because the drifter sort of sits there and gets used when cloaked. They always get shot to pieces if you try to run them in somewhere.
Costing tres? Otherwise marines'll be fighting their way to the hives through a constant cloud of enzymes..
<!--quoteo(post=1938426:date=May 23 2012, 03:34 PM:name=Align)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Align @ May 23 2012, 03:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1938426"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Costing tres? Otherwise marines'll be fighting their way to the hives through a constant cloud of enzymes..<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Both of these kind of support the way I see the dynamic between marines and aliens in conflict.
The alien commander has little to no ability to support isolated players. However, he should have the ability to massively support players when they are in alien controlled locations. Fighting an alien on infestation should be suicide. A marine should not be able to simply take a shotgun and walk into the alien hive, killing everything along his path. There should be an invisible (though aesthetically visible) front line of sorts, between the infested areas, and the powered areas. Each team trying to push into the others territory. Marines venturing onto alien infestation should be quickly overpowered and dispatched. Aliens venturing out of infested areas should find themselves unsupported and weak. Conflicts in no man's land should be even, but essentially obsolete in terms of the bigger picture.
It seems to me that a lot of elements currently in the game <i>support</i> this kind of dynamic, but in its absence, they become misshapen mechanics that serve to annoy players more than anything else. ARC trains which simply roll through everything in their path, only to deploy right next to the hive and destroy it. Onos who leave their hive, run through marine controlled areas, directly to marine spawn and destroy the power node. These things should require possession to move reliably, rather than just having free reign over the entire map.
The wonderful thing about an RTS with real players as units is not having to micro manage units. When abilities like enzyme and umbra are tied to structures for their use, it drags that micro managing back in. You're forced to act through the crags and drifters, instead of simply acting.
The marine commander can drop heath and ammo out of thin air, so why not allow the alien comm to use abilities like enzyme wherever they want on the map? Or limit it to infestation, even.
Researching the abilities through structures is good policy, but when those abilities are allowed only with those structures it limits their usability and ultimately they get forgotten.
My opinion on the matter is; if it isn't a structure, the alien commander shouldn't have to interact with it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
+1
very well said