<!--quoteo(post=1955387:date=Jul 31 2012, 07:08 PM:name=Betelgeux)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Betelgeux @ Jul 31 2012, 07:08 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955387"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><i> If you don't see your language there yet, e-mail me or tweet us and we'll add it.</i>
Email whom? Anyway there is no Magyar (Hungarian) language category, so I can't help translate.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> There is now.
Thank you. I will do my best. By the way, Magyar is also an agglutinative language with lots of affixes. World order is also not in sync with english but its flexible. But without the affixes no real senteces can be formed in sentences like "Evolve to ..." or "Welcome to ...". It can maybe solved in a draft form, where . Like "Evolvation will commence to: Something". Then Something wont need the affix to express "TO" Something.
<!--quoteo(post=1955401:date=Jul 31 2012, 08:14 PM:name=Betelgeux)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Betelgeux @ Jul 31 2012, 08:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955401"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Thank you. I will do my best. By the way, Magyar is also an agglutinative language with lots of affixes. World order is also not in sync with english but its flexible. But without the affixes no real senteces can be formed in sentences like "Evolve to ..." or "Welcome to ...". It can maybe solved in a draft form, where . Like "Evolvation will commence to: Something". Then Something wont need the affix to express "TO" Something.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> If you can make a list of all the places you need to change word orders I'll forward it to the devs.
<!--quoteo(post=1955412:date=Jul 31 2012, 09:30 PM:name=Mendasp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mendasp @ Jul 31 2012, 09:30 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955412"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If you can make a list of all the places you need to change word orders I'll forward it to the devs.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I was trying to say that not the world order is the problem, but the affixes.
In english there would be a message saying "Evolve to ... " so "Evolve to Lerk", "Evolve to Onos", "Evolve to Gorge" etc.
Great initiative, and tool for translate! I did many translations of the game for Portuguese (Brazil). And it created a group (old and some new players) to be discussed the translations. But how to accept one or more of the translations made​​?
I just checked the French part of the translation and it's really frustrating how people try to translate if they don't even : - Read the guidelines - Speak English (mine is far from perfect but some people really frighten me) - Speak French (this one is really problematic)
Anyway, I have some fix for the language system I would like to propose. When you have a name, Crag for example, it would be great to remind to people that this is not to be translated because it is a very specific name, sometimes we don't really know if we have to translate or not, and people don't read the guidelines so... life would be easier (or give a complete list of what shouldn't be changed) In the same way, why not specifying those names in a variable, that way the translation stay consistent all over the game and it's easier to stay up to date. One great example is :
"Allows aliens to choose X evolution"
This thing comes back for EVERY evolution, and sometimes we don't have the same construction for every sentence, making the game really weird and not consistent. One solution would be to translate only one time the name of each evolution (or not, if we keep the english name), and the sentence would become "Allow aliens to choose %evolution evolution". This way we wouldn't have to translate 10 times for nothing resulting in a bad job.
<!--quoteo(post=1955514:date=Aug 1 2012, 02:44 AM:name=Regnareb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Regnareb @ Aug 1 2012, 02:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955514"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->When you have a name, Crag for example, it would be great to remind to people that this is not to be translated because it is a very specific name, sometimes we don't really know if we have to translate or not, and people don't read the guidelines so...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Good question, and how to be with non-latin languages?
It hurts my eye seeing cyrillic (russian for instance) sentences with latin names. The same it hurts them when I see a transcription, especially a bad one.
And how to be with asian languages? Axamdeep just translates everything in chinese and it sounds and looks great in my opinion, because it is very logic.
I dont see the solution for russian yet. Maybe it is good to leave english name with latin letters, maybe not. Or maybe we will just get used to the version which majority of ppl will like. Or minority, but those one who understand what they are doing.
If you are on a language's page (French for example), and you open another language in a new tab (Spanish), if you propose/approve a translation in the first tab (French), it will propose/approve on the second one, the last language opened (Spanish).
Another one : If the original name already exists in the proposition and you click "Use original text as translation", it will do nothing but add another one.
So Armory (marine structure) can be translated but not Crag (alien structure), Veil Spur (structure ability) and Adrenaline (ability) ? Or can we use a judgement for these translations too?
Would be very good if the website could filter the strings not translated. This facilitate to search the new strings (when you add more strings).
<!--quoteo(post=1955552:date=Aug 1 2012, 02:20 PM:name=hit321)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (hit321 @ Aug 1 2012, 02:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955552"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So Armory (marine structure) can be translated but not Crag (alien structure), Veil Spur (structure ability) and Adrenaline (ability) ? Or can we use a judgement for these translations too?
Would be very good if the website could filter the strings not translated. This facilitate to search the new strings (when you add more strings).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I didn't say Armory could be translated, but somehow it's in the guidelines as an ok thing to translate. Armory is a building name and building names are better to keep in english.
<hr />
Ok, guidelines updated, they don't say you should translate Armory (because you shouldn't). Hopefully it's more clear now.
<!--quoteo(post=1955573:date=Aug 1 2012, 01:05 PM:name=Mendasp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mendasp @ Aug 1 2012, 01:05 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955573"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I didn't say Armory could be translated, but somehow it's in the guidelines as an ok thing to translate. Armory is a building name and building names are better to keep in english.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, I said that because is in the Guidelines. Will help a lot if in the Guidelines had something like:
Not translate: Alien and Marines Structures, name of abilities, Weapons and attacks.
Is hard to judge a translation for a ability but not for your structure (or the 'evolve'), or for a marine weapon and not for an alien attack.
Will be good if it could basically translate "all the game", not translating only: Marine, Alien (names), locations names. I said that for Portuguese (Brazil) language. Because something translated in a phrase letting a english word (that can be translated) can be a problem for many players (for not say frustrating). The brazilians players prefere to play a game in english OR in portuguese. a MIX of the both is very bad for us accept because it seems to be a poor translation. Or make "all" in portuguese (there is to be translated) or let all in english. Only the pronounciation of a english word mixed with a portuguese word or a phrase (if isn't a forename) will confuse the player.
I see on Dota 2, that have a nice translation for Portuguese. And the only things that aren't translated is the name of the Heros and some items that there isnt a translation. Even the attacks (skills) are translated.
Translating basically "all the game" create a bond, an intimacy and a good familiarity for many players on Brazil. Thing that doesn't happen if have many words english mixed with portuguese.
<!--quoteo(post=1955595:date=Aug 1 2012, 06:26 PM:name=hit321)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (hit321 @ Aug 1 2012, 06:26 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955595"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yeah, I said that because is in the Guidelines. Will help a lot if in the Guidelines had something like:
Not translate: Alien and Marines Structures, name of abilities, Weapons and attacks.
Is hard to judge a translation for a ability but not for your structure (or the 'evolve'), or for a marine weapon and not for an alien attack.
Will be good if it could basically translate "all the game", not translating only: Marine, Alien (names), locations names. I said that for Portuguese (Brazil) language. Because something translated in a phrase letting a english word (that can be translated) can be a problem for many players (for not say frustrating). The brazilians players prefere to play a game in english OR in portuguese. a MIX of the both is very bad for us accept because it seems to be a poor translation. Or make "all" in portuguese (there is to be translated) or let all in english. Only the pronounciation of a english word mixed with a portuguese word or a phrase (if isn't a forename) will confuse the player.
I see on Dota 2, that have a nice translation for Portuguese. And the only things that aren't translated is the name of the Heros and some items that there isnt a translation. Even the attacks (skills) are translated.
Translating basically "all the game" create a bond, an intimacy and a good familiarity for many players on Brazil. Thing that doesn't happen if have many words english mixed with portuguese.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> In theory this is all great. It's the same for more languages than you think (about sounding weird, and how companies go about translating the games), but, here's the thing... it will help players when playing against people from other countries to communicate, even if you don't know exactly what's going on, you can still recognize the words "Hive" "Harvester" "Armory" and so on...
For the buildings you just have to take them as their actual names, like the building's name is "ARMORY" or "ADVANCED ARMORY".
<!--quoteo(post=1955606:date=Aug 1 2012, 07:43 PM:name=cake.)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cake. @ Aug 1 2012, 07:43 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955606"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I would gladly help with the translation into Greek. Is that happening?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Added Greek.
Thank you for adding Greek! Spent some time on the Russian translations as well. Great to see so many people taking part in this and doing quality work!
I got another problem with the French traduction... normally we shouldn't translate abilities like "Bite", the problem is that in French "Bite" means "######", how do we do in this case?
<!--quoteo(post=1955622:date=Aug 1 2012, 08:46 PM:name=Regnareb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Regnareb @ Aug 1 2012, 08:46 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955622"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I got another problem with the French traduction... normally we shouldn't translate abilities like "Bite", the problem is that in French "Bite" means "######", how do we do in this case?
We claim it's a joke/easter egg? :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I haven't ever seen it ingame... so...
Just to clarify: ANY name (crags, spurs, cysts, hive, harvester, command station etc.), anything that bears a phrase or a word that identifies it, has to stay in English lettering? I'm asking for numerous reasons, for example because some languages take English words and leave them as they are but in that particular languages' letters (Command Station - Κομμαντ Στεισιον; Комманд Стейшн - this is a bad example, I know, don't condemn me for it, I'm just trying to make a point).
<!--quoteo(post=1955613:date=Aug 1 2012, 12:22 PM:name=Drown)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Drown @ Aug 1 2012, 12:22 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955613"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I would vouch for this too! Also, for us English speaking folks an English(Pirate) project would be fun!
Edit: Also is this just a text translation or is there some thought as to adding translated voices to the game?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Heh we need an English (GB) and an English (US) to divide us.
Edit: Would be funny to have austrailian and canadian voices though. My mind feels with south park references for the latter.
<!--quoteo(post=1955612:date=Aug 1 2012, 04:20 PM:name=Mendasp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mendasp @ Aug 1 2012, 04:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955612"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->In theory this is all great. It's the same for more languages than you think (about sounding weird, and how companies go about translating the games), but, here's the thing... it will help players when playing against people from other countries to communicate, even if you don't know exactly what's going on, you can still recognize the words "Hive" "Harvester" "Armory" and so on...
For the buildings you just have to take them as their actual names, like the building's name is "ARMORY" or "ADVANCED ARMORY".<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So, if is this the target, why translate Shotgun ? I agree with the help of communication.
I see a problem in Guidelines, and many people are confused with Guidelines, please that need a "fix".
A shotgun is something that you know, or a knife, these exist in real life. But I'm sure Infantry Portal, Arms Lab, etc are specific to the game and are not something from "real life", just like the alien names/buildings.
Not sure if that explained it. You can keep the weapon names in english if you feel like it's going to be better. These are just guidelines, you don't have to follow them 100%, it's something to help you know what's wanted or how to go about translating (or not) certain things.
I will speak with Charlie to see if we can get a better description for the guidelines of what's wanted and why do we want to keep certain things in english.
By the way, I'm surprised about the amount of people translating "Mine description" and so on, is it not obvious that it's a placeholder and an obvious waste of time to translate?
Well, "Infantry" is a real life word, so is "Portal" and can be translated. Arms lab i personally would say is the same as a Weapons Lab, and can be translated easily as well. That's only my opinion. I find it really hard to translate "Sentry" however... "Heavies" will also be hard in some languages, cause directly translating "Heavy" wont make sense. "Heavies" is equal to "Heavy Units" and now it's more easy to translate.
So are the alien names, they are all translatable, doesn't make it more valid.
The words, separately, can be translated, yes. But "Infantry Portal" as a concept, does not exist, so, you could just say it's the building name. I mean, in spanish that'd be a "Portal de infanterÃa", however, if I join a german server and they call the IPs something else I'm going to be confused as hell when they mention this stuff in chat. The point is to be able to communicate or infer what's going on with the game no matter the language they speak.
<!--quoteo(post=1955644:date=Aug 1 2012, 02:48 PM:name=Mendasp)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mendasp @ Aug 1 2012, 02:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955644"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A shotgun is something that you know, or a knife, these exist in real life. But I'm sure Infantry Portal, Arms Lab, etc are specific to the game and are not something from "real life", just like the alien names/buildings.
Not sure if that explained it. You can keep the weapon names in english if you feel like it's going to be better. These are just guidelines, you don't have to follow them 100%, it's something to help you know what's wanted or how to go about translating (or not) certain things.
I will speak with Charlie to see if we can get a better description for the guidelines of what's wanted and why do we want to keep certain things in english.
By the way, I'm surprised about the amount of people translating "Mine description" and so on, is it not obvious that it's a placeholder and an obvious waste of time to translate?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think for Cyrillic and other alphabets or systems it would be a good idea to allow them to entirely convert even proper nouns. Every proper noun in NS likely has an appropriate word in the other languages. Lerk, Fade, Skulk are all descriptive nouns that attach meaning to function and not having them translated reduces the ability of a player to intuitively and immediately understand the purpose if they don't have a familiarity with these somewhat peripheral lexical elements of English. The only exception I can think of is the Onos, Kharra and some of the location names.
Edit: However, Mendasp has a great point - In Europe, where people are much more commonly multilingual, it could cause considerable confusion when transitioning between different language servers.
So what's the conclusion here, to not translate "Shotgun", "Knife" etc.? I understand the issue with people saying "SG" ingame, and some people not understanding this due to the translation. I think rules for the translations needs to be rewritten if people should be able to properly communicate. "Shotgun" is "Hagle" in Norwegian, quite different, so saying "SG" wont do any good, just leave confusion. This is something UWE really have to think over twice. Having said that, I don't see the problem if you know basic english, if a guy says "Shotgun" on a Norwegian server, the Norwegians will know it's a "Hagle" he's talking about. However saying "SG" could lead to confusion, and here's where the issue really starts.
I saw someone started to accept nouns for French (probably trying to enforce the guidelines and reduce the mess around nouns translation). I'm generally happy with it -as said earlier Bite mean ###### in French which is ridiculous in game but we can discuss this very particular point later- but I think it gets too far and confusing when Hallucinate Crag goes untranslated : this is a problem as Hallucinate Crag is not a unsplitable expression, for the English user it clearly reads as a fake, hallucinated crag. For the French -non English- reader however this make no particular sense and he doesn't get the point that this is a fake unit leaving him with a clear, real disadvantage to its English counterpart. A drawback that the 'if someone speak English and says Hallucinate Crag he'll understand' doesn't balance out - because if he doesn't speak English he won't understand the guy speaking anyway and if he does he'll understand hallucinate and make the link with the French equivalent-.
That's it for my my first troll on French but I think it quite legit.
<!--quoteo(post=1955677:date=Aug 1 2012, 11:21 PM:name=Thrillseeker)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thrillseeker @ Aug 1 2012, 11:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955677"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->So what's the conclusion here, to not translate "Shotgun", "Knife" etc.? I understand the issue with people saying "SG" ingame, and some people not understanding this due to the translation. I think rules for the translations needs to be rewritten if people should be able to properly communicate. "Shotgun" is "Hagle" in Norwegian, quite different, so saying "SG" wont do any good, just leave confusion. This is something UWE really have to think over twice. Having said that, I don't see the problem if you know basic english, if a guy says "Shotgun" on a Norwegian server, the Norwegians will know it's a "Hagle" he's talking about. However saying "SG" could lead to confusion, and here's where the issue really starts.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I used that example as something that you can translate and that should not pose any problems, as most people will know what "shotgun" or "shotty" is no matter their language, and it's pretty much the same with the rest of the marine weapons, as it's part of your normal language, it's the rest of the stuff (buildings/upgrades) that is beneficial keeping in english.
If you join a spanish server and someone says: "Tienen una hive en data core, han puesto shades, tienen celerity". I'm pretty sure that knowing absolutely no spanish you can kind of know what's going on. In fact, that's pretty much how we communicate between spanish players. In NS1 it was the same, we'd use the english terms for everything, for example: "cele, cara, regen", and that's good, because you don't really want to fragment the community just based on language. If we kept everything in english I'm sure this wouldn't be an issue and people would use the english terms naturally, so it's what you have to think of, when I talk about NS/NS2 to another person that speaks my language, how do I refer to this stuff? I'm sure you don't translate the buildings right now in normal conversation.
<!--quoteo(post=1955771:date=Aug 2 2012, 04:43 AM:name=Araamarmorth)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Araamarmorth @ Aug 2 2012, 04:43 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955771"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I saw someone started to accept nouns for French (probably trying to enforce the guidelines and reduce the mess around nouns translation). I'm generally happy with it -as said earlier Bite mean ###### in French which is ridiculous in game but we can discuss this very particular point later- but I think it gets too far and confusing when Hallucinate Crag goes untranslated : this is a problem as Hallucinate Crag is not a unsplitable expression, for the English user it clearly reads as a fake, hallucinated crag. For the French -non English- reader however this make no particular sense and he doesn't get the point that this is a fake unit leaving him with a clear, real disadvantage to its English counterpart. A drawback that the 'if someone speak English and says Hallucinate Crag he'll understand' doesn't balance out - because if he doesn't speak English he won't understand the guy speaking anyway and if he does he'll understand hallucinate and make the link with the French equivalent-.
That's it for my my first troll on French but I think it quite legit.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Uhm, in the spanish translation we have translated "Hallucinate/Hallucination", so it's "Alucinar Crag" for example.
I guess what you have to ask yourself is: "Will I absolutely need to communicate this to other players?" Vital information about the game is what should be kept in english... it's all for the communication.
I will edit the guidelines today, but I think I've explained this in this thread, unless there's still doubts about what to translate or not. I know it's nice having everything in your own language, but it's best if we can all communicate with each other. The guidelines for NS1 translations were pretty much the same, but I haven't been able to find them.
The basic idea here is that there's a number of NS specific terms (Armory, Infantry Portal, Hive, Crag, Shade, Celerity, etc), that while being translatable, are just terms <b>VERY</b> specific to the game, and english speakers have learned what they mean <b>in the context of the game</b> and associated it with the buildings or upgrades, and that is something that should be kept across languages (while possible).
Comments
Email whom? Anyway there is no Magyar (Hungarian) language category, so I can't help translate.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There is now.
Thank you. I will do my best.
By the way, Magyar is also an agglutinative language with lots of affixes. World order is also not in sync with english but its flexible. But without the affixes no real senteces can be formed in sentences like "Evolve to ..." or "Welcome to ...".
It can maybe solved in a draft form, where . Like "Evolvation will commence to: Something". Then Something wont need the affix to express "TO" Something.
By the way, Magyar is also an agglutinative language with lots of affixes. World order is also not in sync with english but its flexible. But without the affixes no real senteces can be formed in sentences like "Evolve to ..." or "Welcome to ...".
It can maybe solved in a draft form, where . Like "Evolvation will commence to: Something". Then Something wont need the affix to express "TO" Something.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If you can make a list of all the places you need to change word orders I'll forward it to the devs.
I was trying to say that not the world order is the problem, but the affixes.
In english there would be a message saying "Evolve to ... " so "Evolve to Lerk", "Evolve to Onos", "Evolve to Gorge" etc.
In Magyar this would be translated to for example, "Ãtalakulás LerkKÉ", "Ãtalakulás OnosSZÃ", "Ãtalakulás GorgGÃ" or it can be also
"LerkKÉ átalalakulás", "OnosSZà átalakulás", "GorgGà átalakulás".... the world order is not so important, both is comprehensive.
The problem is on the -vé, -vá affix (to something) which changes a normal noun to an outcome-adverb.
I did many translations of the game for Portuguese (Brazil). And it created a group (old and some new players) to be discussed the translations.
But how to accept one or more of the translations made​​?
I just checked the French part of the translation and it's really frustrating how people try to translate if they don't even :
- Read the guidelines
- Speak English (mine is far from perfect but some people really frighten me)
- Speak French (this one is really problematic)
Anyway, I have some fix for the language system I would like to propose.
When you have a name, Crag for example, it would be great to remind to people that this is not to be translated because it is a very specific name, sometimes we don't really know if we have to translate or not, and people don't read the guidelines so... life would be easier (or give a complete list of what shouldn't be changed)
In the same way, why not specifying those names in a variable, that way the translation stay consistent all over the game and it's easier to stay up to date. One great example is :
"Allows aliens to choose X evolution"
This thing comes back for EVERY evolution, and sometimes we don't have the same construction for every sentence, making the game really weird and not consistent. One solution would be to translate only one time the name of each evolution (or not, if we keep the english name), and the sentence would become "Allow aliens to choose %evolution evolution". This way we wouldn't have to translate 10 times for nothing resulting in a bad job.
I've tried to remind people that some things arent not supposed to be translated but they just dont listen.
Hopefully we'll be able to check all those up and clean up a little bit.
Good question, and how to be with non-latin languages?
It hurts my eye seeing cyrillic (russian for instance) sentences with latin names. The same it hurts them when I see a transcription, especially a bad one.
And how to be with asian languages? Axamdeep just translates everything in chinese and it sounds and looks great in my opinion, because it is very logic.
I dont see the solution for russian yet. Maybe it is good to leave english name with latin letters, maybe not. Or maybe we will just get used to the version which majority of ppl will like. Or minority, but those one who understand what they are doing.
Frustrated.
If you are on a language's page (French for example), and you open another language in a new tab (Spanish), if you propose/approve a translation in the first tab (French), it will propose/approve on the second one, the last language opened (Spanish).
Another one : If the original name already exists in the proposition and you click "Use original text as translation", it will do nothing but add another one.
Or can we use a judgement for these translations too?
Would be very good if the website could filter the strings not translated. This facilitate to search the new strings (when you add more strings).
Or can we use a judgement for these translations too?
Would be very good if the website could filter the strings not translated. This facilitate to search the new strings (when you add more strings).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I didn't say Armory could be translated, but somehow it's in the guidelines as an ok thing to translate. Armory is a building name and building names are better to keep in english.
<hr />
Ok, guidelines updated, they don't say you should translate Armory (because you shouldn't). Hopefully it's more clear now.
Yeah, I said that because is in the Guidelines.
Will help a lot if in the Guidelines had something like:
Not translate: Alien and Marines Structures, name of abilities, Weapons and attacks.
Is hard to judge a translation for a ability but not for your structure (or the 'evolve'), or for a marine weapon and not for an alien attack.
Will be good if it could basically translate "all the game", not translating only: Marine, Alien (names), locations names. I said that for Portuguese (Brazil) language.
Because something translated in a phrase letting a english word (that can be translated) can be a problem for many players (for not say frustrating).
The brazilians players prefere to play a game in english OR in portuguese. a MIX of the both is very bad for us accept because it seems to be a poor translation. Or make "all" in portuguese (there is to be translated) or let all in english.
Only the pronounciation of a english word mixed with a portuguese word or a phrase (if isn't a forename) will confuse the player.
I see on Dota 2, that have a nice translation for Portuguese. And the only things that aren't translated is the name of the Heros and some items that there isnt a translation. Even the attacks (skills) are translated.
Translating basically "all the game" create a bond, an intimacy and a good familiarity for many players on Brazil. Thing that doesn't happen if have many words english mixed with portuguese.
Will help a lot if in the Guidelines had something like:
Not translate: Alien and Marines Structures, name of abilities, Weapons and attacks.
Is hard to judge a translation for a ability but not for your structure (or the 'evolve'), or for a marine weapon and not for an alien attack.
Will be good if it could basically translate "all the game", not translating only: Marine, Alien (names), locations names. I said that for Portuguese (Brazil) language.
Because something translated in a phrase letting a english word (that can be translated) can be a problem for many players (for not say frustrating).
The brazilians players prefere to play a game in english OR in portuguese. a MIX of the both is very bad for us accept because it seems to be a poor translation. Or make "all" in portuguese (there is to be translated) or let all in english.
Only the pronounciation of a english word mixed with a portuguese word or a phrase (if isn't a forename) will confuse the player.
I see on Dota 2, that have a nice translation for Portuguese. And the only things that aren't translated is the name of the Heros and some items that there isnt a translation. Even the attacks (skills) are translated.
Translating basically "all the game" create a bond, an intimacy and a good familiarity for many players on Brazil. Thing that doesn't happen if have many words english mixed with portuguese.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
In theory this is all great. It's the same for more languages than you think (about sounding weird, and how companies go about translating the games), but, here's the thing... it will help players when playing against people from other countries to communicate, even if you don't know exactly what's going on, you can still recognize the words "Hive" "Harvester" "Armory" and so on...
For the buildings you just have to take them as their actual names, like the building's name is "ARMORY" or "ADVANCED ARMORY".
<!--quoteo(post=1955606:date=Aug 1 2012, 07:43 PM:name=cake.)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cake. @ Aug 1 2012, 07:43 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955606"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I would gladly help with the translation into Greek. Is that happening?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Added Greek.
I would vouch for this too! Also, for us English speaking folks an English(Pirate) project would be fun!
Edit:
Also is this just a text translation or is there some thought as to adding translated voices to the game?
Spent some time on the Russian translations as well. Great to see so many people taking part in this and doing quality work!
We claim it's a joke/easter egg? :D
We claim it's a joke/easter egg? :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I haven't ever seen it ingame... so...
ANY name (crags, spurs, cysts, hive, harvester, command station etc.), anything that bears a phrase or a word that identifies it, has to stay in English lettering? I'm asking for numerous reasons, for example because some languages take English words and leave them as they are but in that particular languages' letters (Command Station - Κομμαντ Στεισιον; Комманд Стейшн - this is a bad example, I know, don't condemn me for it, I'm just trying to make a point).
Edit:
Also is this just a text translation or is there some thought as to adding translated voices to the game?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Heh we need an English (GB) and an English (US) to divide us.
Edit: Would be funny to have austrailian and canadian voices though. My mind feels with south park references for the latter.
For the buildings you just have to take them as their actual names, like the building's name is "ARMORY" or "ADVANCED ARMORY".<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So, if is this the target, why translate Shotgun ?
I agree with the help of communication.
I see a problem in Guidelines, and many people are confused with Guidelines, please that need a "fix".
Not sure if that explained it. You can keep the weapon names in english if you feel like it's going to be better. These are just guidelines, you don't have to follow them 100%, it's something to help you know what's wanted or how to go about translating (or not) certain things.
I will speak with Charlie to see if we can get a better description for the guidelines of what's wanted and why do we want to keep certain things in english.
By the way, I'm surprised about the amount of people translating "Mine description" and so on, is it not obvious that it's a placeholder and an obvious waste of time to translate?
The words, separately, can be translated, yes. But "Infantry Portal" as a concept, does not exist, so, you could just say it's the building name. I mean, in spanish that'd be a "Portal de infanterÃa", however, if I join a german server and they call the IPs something else I'm going to be confused as hell when they mention this stuff in chat. The point is to be able to communicate or infer what's going on with the game no matter the language they speak.
Not sure if that explained it. You can keep the weapon names in english if you feel like it's going to be better. These are just guidelines, you don't have to follow them 100%, it's something to help you know what's wanted or how to go about translating (or not) certain things.
I will speak with Charlie to see if we can get a better description for the guidelines of what's wanted and why do we want to keep certain things in english.
By the way, I'm surprised about the amount of people translating "Mine description" and so on, is it not obvious that it's a placeholder and an obvious waste of time to translate?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think for Cyrillic and other alphabets or systems it would be a good idea to allow them to entirely convert even proper nouns. Every proper noun in NS likely has an appropriate word in the other languages. Lerk, Fade, Skulk are all descriptive nouns that attach meaning to function and not having them translated reduces the ability of a player to intuitively and immediately understand the purpose if they don't have a familiarity with these somewhat peripheral lexical elements of English. The only exception I can think of is the Onos, Kharra and some of the location names.
Edit: However, Mendasp has a great point - In Europe, where people are much more commonly multilingual, it could cause considerable confusion when transitioning between different language servers.
That's it for my my first troll on French but I think it quite legit.
I used that example as something that you can translate and that should not pose any problems, as most people will know what "shotgun" or "shotty" is no matter their language, and it's pretty much the same with the rest of the marine weapons, as it's part of your normal language, it's the rest of the stuff (buildings/upgrades) that is beneficial keeping in english.
If you join a spanish server and someone says: "Tienen una hive en data core, han puesto shades, tienen celerity". I'm pretty sure that knowing absolutely no spanish you can kind of know what's going on. In fact, that's pretty much how we communicate between spanish players. In NS1 it was the same, we'd use the english terms for everything, for example: "cele, cara, regen", and that's good, because you don't really want to fragment the community just based on language. If we kept everything in english I'm sure this wouldn't be an issue and people would use the english terms naturally, so it's what you have to think of, when I talk about NS/NS2 to another person that speaks my language, how do I refer to this stuff? I'm sure you don't translate the buildings right now in normal conversation.
<!--quoteo(post=1955771:date=Aug 2 2012, 04:43 AM:name=Araamarmorth)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Araamarmorth @ Aug 2 2012, 04:43 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1955771"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I saw someone started to accept nouns for French (probably trying to enforce the guidelines and reduce the mess around nouns translation). I'm generally happy with it -as said earlier Bite mean ###### in French which is ridiculous in game but we can discuss this very particular point later- but I think it gets too far and confusing when Hallucinate Crag goes untranslated : this is a problem as Hallucinate Crag is not a unsplitable expression, for the English user it clearly reads as a fake, hallucinated crag. For the French -non English- reader however this make no particular sense and he doesn't get the point that this is a fake unit leaving him with a clear, real disadvantage to its English counterpart. A drawback that the 'if someone speak English and says Hallucinate Crag he'll understand' doesn't balance out - because if he doesn't speak English he won't understand the guy speaking anyway and if he does he'll understand hallucinate and make the link with the French equivalent-.
That's it for my my first troll on French but I think it quite legit.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Uhm, in the spanish translation we have translated "Hallucinate/Hallucination", so it's "Alucinar Crag" for example.
I guess what you have to ask yourself is: "Will I absolutely need to communicate this to other players?" Vital information about the game is what should be kept in english... it's all for the communication.
I will edit the guidelines today, but I think I've explained this in this thread, unless there's still doubts about what to translate or not. I know it's nice having everything in your own language, but it's best if we can all communicate with each other. The guidelines for NS1 translations were pretty much the same, but I haven't been able to find them.
The basic idea here is that there's a number of NS specific terms (Armory, Infantry Portal, Hive, Crag, Shade, Celerity, etc), that while being translatable, are just terms <b>VERY</b> specific to the game, and english speakers have learned what they mean <b>in the context of the game</b> and associated it with the buildings or upgrades, and that is something that should be kept across languages (while possible).