MAC TRAINS

Zomb3hZomb3h Join Date: 2011-01-27 Member: 79241Members, Reinforced - Shadow
in NS2 General Discussion
MAC Trains seem to do what Gorges did in the last build: Repairing faster than the rate of damage.

I've seen MAC Trains repair ARCs faster than what the aliens could deal in damage.

It's about as annoying as when welders were repairing at an almost equal, buzz-killing rate.

If there was a nerf for the marine side (excluding Jetpacks), the MAC Trains would probably be the next thing.
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Comments

  • schkorpioschkorpio I can mspaint Join Date: 2003-05-23 Member: 16635Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1961342:date=Aug 12 2012, 08:59 AM:name=Zomb3h)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Zomb3h @ Aug 12 2012, 08:59 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961342"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->MAC Trains seem to do what Gorges did in the last build: Repairing faster than the rate of damage.

    I've seen MAC Trains repair ARCs faster than what the aliens could deal in damage.

    It's about as annoying as when welders were repairing at an almost equal, buzz-killing rate.

    If there was a nerf for the marine side (excluding Jetpacks), the MAC Trains would probably be the next thing.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    probably a good idea to not have the repair rate stack after 3 welders/ MACs
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  • Mr.GreedyMr.Greedy Join Date: 2012-07-21 Member: 154270Members
    Just fix that like regeneration ---> welders dont work while under atack
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  • WheeeeWheeee Join Date: 2003-02-18 Member: 13713Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1961354:date=Aug 11 2012, 07:07 PM:name=Mr.Greedy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mr.Greedy @ Aug 11 2012, 07:07 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961354"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Just fix that like regeneration ---> welders dont work while under atack<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    they already kind of tried that back when welders had to ramp up their repair rate. people complained a lot.
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  • Zomb3hZomb3h Join Date: 2011-01-27 Member: 79241Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1961347:date=Aug 11 2012, 07:02 PM:name=schkorpio)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (schkorpio @ Aug 11 2012, 07:02 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961347"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->probably a good idea to not have the repair rate stack after 3 welders/ MACs<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    A kind of unstacking of repair (similiar to Bilebomb unstackage) would work.

    But then you got the whole MACS repairing MACS repairing the MAC that's repairing the OTHER MAC and it's an endless cycle of repair orgy.
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  • AngeluszAngelusz Harmonic entropist Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18072Members, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester
    Fortunately, MACs have only little hp and are easy to take out. If the comm has so many resources that he can spam enough to keep filling up the ranks... then the problem is not in the repair rate, but the aliens are just fighting an uphill battle and <b>should</b> lose.
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  • Chuck_NorrisChuck_Norris Join Date: 2012-04-01 Member: 149779Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1961354:date=Aug 11 2012, 04:07 PM:name=Mr.Greedy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mr.Greedy @ Aug 11 2012, 04:07 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961354"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Just fix that like regeneration ---> welders dont work while under atack<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I can remember myself that we had that situation a while ago. It was horrible to see that u cant do anything against bilebomb, if they had a decent gorge (or was it a lerk back then? - can't remember who bilebombed).
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  • antacidantacid Join Date: 2007-08-07 Member: 61821Members, NS2 Playtester
    <!--quoteo(post=1961578:date=Aug 12 2012, 09:22 AM:name=Angelusz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Angelusz @ Aug 12 2012, 09:22 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961578"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Fortunately, MACs have only little hp and are easy to take out. If the comm has so many resources that he can spam enough to keep filling up the ranks... then the problem is not in the repair rate, but the aliens are just fighting an uphill battle and <b>should</b> lose.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Two macs repairing each other can yield more repairs than a lerk can physically do damage, making them unkillable.

    It takes a skulk somewhere around 10-12 bites to kill a single repaired mac.

    They are not easy to take out.
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  • AngeluszAngelusz Harmonic entropist Join Date: 2003-07-10 Member: 18072Members, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester
    <!--quoteo(post=1961585:date=Aug 12 2012, 12:08 PM:name=antacid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (antacid @ Aug 12 2012, 12:08 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961585"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Two macs repairing each other can yield more repairs than a lerk can physically do damage, making them unkillable.

    It takes a skulk somewhere around 10-12 bites to kill a single repaired mac.

    They are not easy to take out.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Oh. That's more than i seem to recall. I'll doublecheck when I get back home from work. :)
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  • ArcL!ghtArcL!ght Join Date: 2007-11-27 Member: 63031Members, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester
    I'm proud to represent to you the gorge bile bomb. Fixes MAC trains in a jiffy.
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  • TimMcTimMc Join Date: 2012-02-06 Member: 143945Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1961589:date=Aug 12 2012, 05:11 AM:name=ArcL!ght)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ArcL!ght @ Aug 12 2012, 05:11 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961589"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm proud to represent to you the gorge bile bomb. Fixes MAC trains in a jiffy.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Yeah I saw a commander do a 30 MAC train, then one gorge killed it in a few shots of bile lol.
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  • NeoRussiaNeoRussia Join Date: 2012-08-04 Member: 154743Members
    <img src="http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/515/2012081200007.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

    OP unit, please nerf.
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  • AurOn2AurOn2 COOKIES&#33; FREEDOM, AND BISCUITS&#33; Australia Join Date: 2012-01-13 Member: 140224Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Forum staff
    edited August 2012
    The constant stream o yellow, oh, so beutiful
    now that i have to try.
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  • H3lixH3lix Join Date: 2012-08-03 Member: 154722Members, NS2 Map Tester
    <!--quoteo(post=1961608:date=Aug 12 2012, 07:12 AM:name=NeoRussia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NeoRussia @ Aug 12 2012, 07:12 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961608"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><img src="http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/515/2012081200007.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

    OP unit, please nerf.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    i rofl GG
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  • Zomb3hZomb3h Join Date: 2011-01-27 Member: 79241Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1961578:date=Aug 12 2012, 05:22 AM:name=Angelusz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Angelusz @ Aug 12 2012, 05:22 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961578"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Fortunately, MACs have only little hp and are easy to take out. If the comm has so many resources that he can spam enough to keep filling up the ranks... then the problem is not in the repair rate, but the aliens are just fighting an uphill battle and <b>should</b> lose.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Let's put this in perspective.

    -Alien(s) hitting a resource tower/structure/power-node.
    -MAC Train out of ###### no where starts repairing it, making it impossible to take down.
    -Marine comes along and takes out or forces alien retreat.

    The fact that they're able to render any damage done completely useless at an extremely high rate is not only boring, but frustrating considering it almost ensures a <b>steam-rolling</b> defeat knowing the MAC trains can sustain all vital structures in less time than the Aliens can destroy them.

    They shouldn't have stackable repair rates.
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  • BloodyIronBloodyIron Join Date: 2009-11-09 Member: 69321Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Pretty sure bilebomb is how you handle that. Furthermore, if you let your opponents get that many MACs, as in that many resources, what do you expect will happen? You would win?
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  • CobraCommanderCobraCommander Join Date: 2012-07-30 Member: 154472Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1961694:date=Aug 12 2012, 07:41 AM:name=H3lix)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (H3lix @ Aug 12 2012, 07:41 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961694"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i rofl GG<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Whoever crashes the game with lag first wins :D
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  • elodeaelodea Editlodea Join Date: 2009-06-20 Member: 67877Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    MACs were always this 'OP'. They just never had auto weld to make use of it and relied on people fighting the UI (spamming f + mouse click). I say 'OP' because gorge bilebomb will still counter MAC swarms.

    Imo while it may seem like a problem now, i'd rather UWE fix AI unit functionality/smoothness first (drifter/MAC) with auto attack, command on mouse press instead of mouse release, reliable pathing etc. I think only then we can have much more productive balance discussion about the numbers.
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  • SopsSops Join Date: 2003-07-03 Member: 17894Members, Constellation
    <!--quoteo(post=1961589:date=Aug 12 2012, 05:11 AM:name=ArcL!ght)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ArcL!ght @ Aug 12 2012, 05:11 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961589"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm proud to represent to you the gorge bile bomb. Fixes MAC trains in a jiffy.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Gorges are slow, so to cover the map from mac trains the alien team would need to have 2-3 gorges while the marine team is freed up by not needing to repair anything and can have more JP+SG marines out shooting gorges.

    <!--quoteo(post=1961744:date=Aug 12 2012, 12:55 PM:name=BloodyIron)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BloodyIron @ Aug 12 2012, 12:55 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961744"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Pretty sure bilebomb is how you handle that. Furthermore, if you let your opponents get that many MACs, as in that many resources, what do you expect will happen? You would win?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I have seem a number of games run passed 30 minutes this patch which were still undecided, by this point commanders have nothing better to spend their res on so they just start spamming.
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  • Firepower01Firepower01 Join Date: 2012-08-03 Member: 154658Members
    Give MACs energy so they can only do so much repairs in a given amount of time, or nerf their repair rate.
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  • elodeaelodea Editlodea Join Date: 2009-06-20 Member: 67877Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited August 2012
    <!--quoteo(post=1961893:date=Aug 13 2012, 07:29 AM:name=Sops)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sops @ Aug 13 2012, 07:29 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961893"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Gorges are slow, so to cover the map from mac trains the alien team would need to have 2-3 gorges while the marine team is freed up by not needing to repair anything and can have more JP+SG marines out shooting gorges.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Gorges are actually faster than MACs even with the speed upgrade. Add bellyslide and i dont really see a problem here.

    I don't believe you need 2-3 gorges to 'cover' areas of the map either. That scouting function comes from the team as a collective. A MAC swarm can only be in one place at a time and is pretty predictable to keep track of.

    Also, you are making the assumption that gorges are inherently useless lifeforms when they really arn't...
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  • DarkATiDarkATi Revelation 22:17 Join Date: 2003-06-20 Member: 17532Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1961578:date=Aug 12 2012, 04:22 AM:name=Angelusz)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Angelusz @ Aug 12 2012, 04:22 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1961578"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Fortunately, MACs have only little hp and are easy to take out. If the comm has so many resources that he can spam enough to keep filling up the ranks... then the problem is not in the repair rate, but the aliens are just fighting an uphill battle and <b>should</b> lose.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    +1

    Agreed.

    Cheers,
    Cody
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