Competitive Play and Casting in NS2
statikg
Join Date: 2012-09-19 Member: 159978Members
Join Date: 2012-09-19 Member: 159978Members
Its been a long time since NS1 and to say that the world of competitive gaming has changed alot is an understatement. The biggest change is obviously in the number of people who actually prefer to watch the game then play it. Coming recently from sc2 I can say that the majority of the sc2 community actually spends 70-95% of their "sc2 time" watching streams or VODs rather then actually playing the game. Thus, I finally come to the point of my post - which is that in order to ensure the success of ns2 as a popular and competitive game we must create an enjoyable viewer experience.
I would like to start the conversation by setting out my ideas of what would make for an enjoyable experience and hopefully other people will want to chime in. I would say that you can break down the viewer experience down into 2 major areas: Casting skill/technique and the viewing interface.
<b>1) Casting</b>
Right now I would say that the only major caster is NS2HD. I find him to be a very enjoyable personality to listen to with good knowledge of the game. Still sometimes he goes off on a tangent talking about the general trends going on in the game and misses some key action. It is very difficult to fit this kind of stuff into NS2 since there is so much action going on in different areas all the time! I think that this could be improved upon by having a different person in charge of the observational controls leaving the caster more brain time to think about when to say what. Having said that, good casting in NS2 will be very difficult I think because of the sheer amount of action leaving little to no time to discuss the strategical aspects of each match - the discussion of which I think is key to hooking viewers to the game! It may very well be that sometimes action needs to be ignored by the caster in order to deal with this.
<b>2) Viewing Interface</b>
I feel that the display for viewers can really be improved upon from what we currently have. I find often I feel like although I can see whats going on in one specific situation I am missing out on the game in general because I just can't see enough. I am thinking that some sort of split screen approach (I have no technical knowledge of how these things could be accomplished) might be really great.
A few specific ideas I had:
Increasing the size of the minimap to maybe 1/4 of the screen. 1/4 is probably too big but I definitely feel the game would benefit if it were increased in size from the current size to allow people to better figure out what is going on elsewhere.
Put in the top left of the screen a little "currently under construction" tab for both races. This would show what buildings are being constructed and maybe even have a little popup icon whenever a weapon or a new lifeform is bought/evolved. The tech tab at the bottom middle is really great, but I often feel like it isn't enough to give me the full picture.
I also think it would be great if we could tell what weapon marines are holding easily, perhaps by a change in the color of their name or something like that.
Anyway hopefully this will get a great discussion going as I am really psyced about the future of this game!
I would like to start the conversation by setting out my ideas of what would make for an enjoyable experience and hopefully other people will want to chime in. I would say that you can break down the viewer experience down into 2 major areas: Casting skill/technique and the viewing interface.
<b>1) Casting</b>
Right now I would say that the only major caster is NS2HD. I find him to be a very enjoyable personality to listen to with good knowledge of the game. Still sometimes he goes off on a tangent talking about the general trends going on in the game and misses some key action. It is very difficult to fit this kind of stuff into NS2 since there is so much action going on in different areas all the time! I think that this could be improved upon by having a different person in charge of the observational controls leaving the caster more brain time to think about when to say what. Having said that, good casting in NS2 will be very difficult I think because of the sheer amount of action leaving little to no time to discuss the strategical aspects of each match - the discussion of which I think is key to hooking viewers to the game! It may very well be that sometimes action needs to be ignored by the caster in order to deal with this.
<b>2) Viewing Interface</b>
I feel that the display for viewers can really be improved upon from what we currently have. I find often I feel like although I can see whats going on in one specific situation I am missing out on the game in general because I just can't see enough. I am thinking that some sort of split screen approach (I have no technical knowledge of how these things could be accomplished) might be really great.
A few specific ideas I had:
Increasing the size of the minimap to maybe 1/4 of the screen. 1/4 is probably too big but I definitely feel the game would benefit if it were increased in size from the current size to allow people to better figure out what is going on elsewhere.
Put in the top left of the screen a little "currently under construction" tab for both races. This would show what buildings are being constructed and maybe even have a little popup icon whenever a weapon or a new lifeform is bought/evolved. The tech tab at the bottom middle is really great, but I often feel like it isn't enough to give me the full picture.
I also think it would be great if we could tell what weapon marines are holding easily, perhaps by a change in the color of their name or something like that.
Anyway hopefully this will get a great discussion going as I am really psyced about the future of this game!
Comments
I already spend way more time watching than playing. Mainly because the game is so much better at a high level, but I can't play marines for ######, so I'll never be in a clan (except maybe if I learned to comm). Also I can watch games and write code at the same time.
(Incidentally, this means I don't mind if there needs to be a 15 minute break for teams to do whatever)
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Increasing the size of the minimap to maybe 1/4 of the screen. 1/4 is probably too big but I definitely feel the game would benefit if it were increased in size from the current size to allow people to better figure out what is going on elsewhere.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Good idea. I struggle to see the minimap in Insight. Fixing the "black icon" issue would help here.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Put in the top left of the screen a little "currently under construction" tab for both races. This would show what buildings are being constructed and maybe even have a little popup icon whenever a weapon or a new lifeform is bought/evolved. The tech tab at the bottom middle is really great, but I often feel like it isn't enough to give me the full picture.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The existing alert feature could be extended to add this. It's mainly the dropping of phasegates, and possibly some marine upgrade structures, that needs to be highlighted. Phases especially are usually a sign of interesting action coming up. It would be good if the caster could click on the build alert to go to it.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I also think it would be great if we could tell what weapon marines are holding easily, perhaps by a change in the color of their name or something like that.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The player frames cover player weapons/lifeforms perfectly already IMO. Only thing they don't show is if marines have jetpacks, and which upgrades aliens picked - both would be useful, but I'm not sure where you'd fit them.
Rest assured the current state of Insight is not its final state. Huze is constantly making improvements. A bigger minimap is highly unlikely: Creating a great viewing experience is not about the caster following every play by play, it is about narrating the overall story, splashed with the colour of individual battles. A much more readable minimap, however, is very much on the cards.
Finding decent casters that actually know what they are doing (unlike me!) is the biggest challenge.
some little mistakes and technical difficulties are quite understandable (and it's nice to see that you can improvise to make up for them) and will probably go away over time. that adds indie-flair anyway! :)
Also, pre-set camera locations to get the most out of the action in a given area, without having the caster fly his camera through 2 walls and a hive to get where he wants to be?
Built into the map design and somehow hotkeyed/clickable from Insight. Actually, a small icon at every preset camera location in the topdown view in Insight would be awesome!
Acceptable? Close enough!
Link to my stream (LIVE NOW actually!) : <a href="http://www.twitch.tv/rwryne" target="_blank">http://www.twitch.tv/rwryne</a>
Link to blind's stream: <a href="http://www.twitch.tv/blindns2" target="_blank">http://www.twitch.tv/blindns2</a>
Well I'm also doing casts but finding a very hostile environment towards myself for no apparent reason (will not name persons or clans for the matter).
Most however do call me in if I want to cover it since I'm one of rares who does not have the actual connection with good upload to make stream so I tend to go for record>encode>upload procedure. This is where the actual problem lays since most clans want to have their matches casted live, and I myself can't do that.
2nd problem is that nobody is suggesting any improvement except TrC, and I do find it hard from time to time to keep on talking cause some parts are just better left unspoken imho (but still hehe). So no comments, no likes\dislikes or what so ever does not leave me anything to improve on myself.
<b>So here is some general advice to everyone watching those casts. Comment guys, we cannot improve unless we know what is wrong or what we miss!</b>
Something similar to the replay function used in Starcraft 2/HLTV is planned for post 1.0. =)
And I'm enjoying the current casters. Every time I watch them I get the itch to jump in the game myself, which should say something.
Link to my stream (LIVE NOW actually!) : <a href="http://www.twitch.tv/rwryne" target="_blank">http://www.twitch.tv/rwryne</a>
Link to blind's stream: <a href="http://www.twitch.tv/blindns2" target="_blank">http://www.twitch.tv/blindns2</a><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Haha. Sig endorsed!
Just wanted to say that your casts are very enjoyable and fun to watch. It deserves more attention, keep up the good work man.
Oh and also Blind, because.. well. Blind is awesome.
Oh and also Blind, because.. well. Blind is awesome.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Don't forget Zeikko. I always love his insights into the game.
You missed our trifecta! Blind Zeikko and I tricasted yesterday
@ 53 minutes I believe:
<a href="http://www.twitch.tv/rwryne/b/333243943" target="_blank">http://www.twitch.tv/rwryne/b/333243943</a>
Thanks!
<!--quoteo(post=1982678:date=Sep 25 2012, 03:16 AM:name=wiry)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (wiry @ Sep 25 2012, 03:16 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1982678"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't think I've ever heard Zeikko cast a game. Will have to check it out.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I've done casting every know and then for a year now. I think the best and most recent one would be the wasabi cup finals with Blind: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gss3Kdq-R14&feature=plcp" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gss3Kdq-R14&feature=plcp</a>
<!--quoteo(post=1982685:date=Sep 25 2012, 03:50 AM:name=Ryne)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ryne @ Sep 25 2012, 03:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1982685"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You missed our trifecta! Blind Zeikko and I tricasted yesterday<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Haha! That was hilarious. It was so difficult not to speak over each other but still keep the discussion up.
Back to the topic. I would also love to get more feedback of the casting because it's hard to analyze own casting and figure out the weaknesses and needs for improvement. I agree we need better casting, productional values and organization to make NS2 a world class esport.
As for the casters, I would suggest making yourself an -"insert name here" casting feedback - thread somewhere to really help yourselves out.
E-mail: ns2@wasabione.com
Steam: WasabiOne
Skype: dillon.savage
gtalk: tropico@gmail.com
or you can even forum PM me
We all have different styles, we all look at things with our own unique perspectives. We value our viewers and want to know more about what you want to hear and see, but at the same time realize that there is a very wide audience and things continue to be adjusted so that all parties get something out of the streams. I too have to give shout outs to Ryne, Blind, Zeikko and ArcLight. I very much enjoy listening and watching all of your videos, keep up the good work!
1. Strange camera control decisions during combat. One example: Zooming in to watch a funny ragdoll when the battle isn't even over yet.
2. Not watching the right places on the map at the right time. One example: Watching a marine building a res tower in say pipeline instead of the two marines that are fighting off multiple skulks while trying to build a phase gate in system waypointing.
1. Strange camera control decisions during combat. One example: Zooming in to watch a funny ragdoll when the battle isn't even over yet.
2. Not watching the right places on the map at the right time. One example: Watching a marine building a res tower in say pipeline instead of the two marines that are fighting off multiple skulks while trying to build a phase gate in system waypointing.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
All casters should take these two points to heart.