My thoughts - So far...
Knocturnal
Join Date: 2009-11-16 Member: 69399Members
Join Date: 2009-11-16 Member: 69399Members
Look, I know the development team is rather small, but the game has been in beta for over 2 years... I loved NS1, it was my favorite 3rd party mod. But NS2 just doesn't measure up (considering the saturation of the FPS genre, and compared to what is already out there), and this is disregarding nostalgia. After this long the game is still poorly balanced, and aside from a few changes and additions this game knows practically no innovation.
I believe I have witnessed 2 matches that aliens won, well 4, but I really shouldn't count the match where marines had nobody who wanted to play commander, and the other match, well it was a first time commander. It's not just the Marines/Aliens that aren't balanced, some of the low and high tier stuff doesn't make sense. Maybe gorges can barricade doors and such, but I miss it's "spider web" ability. I also find maps feel very small, the only difference is that there are more vents and broken glass to fly or crawl through.
My opinion, NS2 has much potential. I would have preferred if it had gone towards a much bigger settings --- bigger maps, more open (not BF3 style), such as a marine infested ship (a big one, multiple levels), and with team sizes such as 16v16, or 20v20. Say each team could have control over more resources, where one team or the other would have to work their way into denying those points from the adversary team. Maybe what I'm suggesting is a slower start, just like every RTS.
I'm not mad or anything, but rather disappointed where this game stands after such a long beta run. The game is due to release soon, I really hope UW has something up their sleeve. I want this game to succeed... Am I the only one to feel this way?
I believe I have witnessed 2 matches that aliens won, well 4, but I really shouldn't count the match where marines had nobody who wanted to play commander, and the other match, well it was a first time commander. It's not just the Marines/Aliens that aren't balanced, some of the low and high tier stuff doesn't make sense. Maybe gorges can barricade doors and such, but I miss it's "spider web" ability. I also find maps feel very small, the only difference is that there are more vents and broken glass to fly or crawl through.
My opinion, NS2 has much potential. I would have preferred if it had gone towards a much bigger settings --- bigger maps, more open (not BF3 style), such as a marine infested ship (a big one, multiple levels), and with team sizes such as 16v16, or 20v20. Say each team could have control over more resources, where one team or the other would have to work their way into denying those points from the adversary team. Maybe what I'm suggesting is a slower start, just like every RTS.
I'm not mad or anything, but rather disappointed where this game stands after such a long beta run. The game is due to release soon, I really hope UW has something up their sleeve. I want this game to succeed... Am I the only one to feel this way?
Comments
This build... or ever?
Either way, play more. I've saw 2 alien wins in my first sitting with this build.
Edit: Balance with always be an issue with asymmetrical sides and RTS/FPS combo though. Currently I think the sides are not to bad, but could use tweaking to make certain elements more fun to play.
I think taking the current mechanics to a bigger setting would be disastrous to the game though. There are some significant differences between how veil plays compared to, say, tram, for example, even now, mostly due to size.
Can you imagine the impacts of trying to balance melee-based against gun-based units on a larger scale? The problems would be multiplied over what they are right now.
As for 20vs20 that will happen when they have linux servers and unix servers I believe. I don't see why they shouldn't have 20 vs 20, but right now that is impossible you must have those types of settings in a linux box or unix box, windows can't handle it. They did talk about linux and unix servers soon, so I hope they add a mod that can make it 20 vs 20, which will be very fun and making maps bigger too.
I am happy the way the games looks and feels. The graphics is beautiful and it looks realistic too. They just need to balance it a little more for aliens and it will be an epic classic.
Pure RTS balancing experience is of not use in NS2 because the FPS element.
An RTS game is ultimately a big number crunch - units have exact DPS and exact hit rates, a perfect RPS effect on eachother. Get a bit excel spreadsheet and you can see the sides are balanced. Making the units players means its up in the air about those numbers, up to player skill and how easy the devs have made it to hit the theoretical numbers.
Right now, I feel like they're just stabbing in the dark with little number crunching or thought. It's very "reactive" as opposed to "proactive."
E.g. reactive: "Tournament X from last Saturday showed that Aliens are placing 2nd hive at the start of the game. -> Make 2nd hive slower/costlier/crappier/blah"
Proactive: "Considering about equal tres flow, upgrade X in the alien tech tree comes a minute before upgrade Y on the marine tech tree, and it's too powerful for aliens to have at that time -> delay upgrade X or accelerate upgrade Y"
Sure, being reactive is easier and cheaper, but it results in a long and painful process of balancing the game around trends - a process which I feel like is nowhere near finished right now. Are people going to be around for another 1-2 years while an unbalanced game is slowly being balanced? Maybe. We'll see I guess... NS1 had a lot of enthusiasts willing to do that I guess, hopefully NS2 will too.
P.S. Oh, and the fact that construction speeds and structure health don't scale between 6v6/12v12 games = lol...
Graphics - ok.
Gameplay - one of a kind.
Sound - ok.
Character control - fps... Though a pain when engaging enemy, it's all about auto attacking, and who jumps and strafe's the most.
I'll keep playing this game, but I'll underline it's only because of it's unique gameplay. If Unknown Worlds survives, they need to hire better management, especially in the creative department. The game is creative... was*** 10 years ago. It may sound like I'm bashing, but I'm not. I just think many things could have been better.
Graphics - ok.
Gameplay - one of a kind.
Sound - ok.
Character control - fps... Though a pain when engaging enemy, it's all about auto attacking, and who jumps and strafe's the most.
I'll keep playing this game, but I'll underline it's only because of it's unique gameplay. If Unknown Worlds survives, they need to hire better management, especially in the creative department. The game is creative... was*** 10 years ago. It may sound like I'm bashing, but I'm not. I just think many things could have been better.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The fate of this game does not hinge on the likes of IGN, etc, popular video game site. Are you kidding me? This fairly hardcore and thoroughly unique title is coming into a tornado of triple A releases and other competitive games made by small teams that I can't see lasting more than a couple of months. Competitive games come and go depending on the strength and number of the community, and considering this isn't even released yet, it's a very healthy community.
Graphically this game is beautiful, not okay, beautiful with some really fantastic lighting assuming your PC can handle it at this stage. The gameplay is the first of its kind I've seen where the RTS portion doesn't seem like a trite gimmick, and actually adds to the already fairly complex asymmetrical gameplay (not that NS1 didn't).
Of all the small time competitive games coming out this last quarter of the year, NS2 has the brightest future by far. There's not a lot you can compare it to, and that is only a good thing in these times.
I think we just need to give it time really, although obviously I want to see the game at least somewhat better balanced by release as much as the next guy. If performance continues improving and they continue working on features and balance well post 1.0 then I have no doubt the game has a bright future ahead of itself.
I understand their frustrations, on one hand they wish they had millions of pounds to make the absolute game of their dreams. But on the other - indie - side of things, they have to make sure they can actually run the business.
Credit where credit is due, because with every update not only are they adding more and more to the game, but they are trying to please an impatient/passionate but ignorant (to development) community with builds that the community want to see as 'final'.
This has been a long time in development, and hopefully we see a lot more builds in the future. If the engine/artwork and programming is anything to go by then I can't wait to see this game in a years time.
I just hope they get the funding they deserve.
I understand their frustrations, on one hand they wish they had millions of pounds to make the absolute game of their dreams. But on the other - indie - side of things, they have to make sure they can actually run the business.
Credit where credit is due, because with every update not only are they adding more and more to the game, but they are trying to please an impatient/passionate but ignorant (to development) community with builds that the community want to see as 'final'.
This has been a long time in development, and hopefully we see a lot more builds in the future. If the engine/artwork and programming is anything to go by then I can't wait to see this game in a years time.
I just hope they get the funding they deserve.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I've actually considered the fact that if I ever won millions of dollars in the lottery, I would definitely be willing to give UWE a sizable chunk, say $500,000. I would like to see the team flourish for the years of enjoyment they gave me at no cost with NS1. Unfortunately this won't happen, but if anyone else that played and loved NS1 and wins the lottery at some point in the near future, think of UWE! lol
Reading these forums you would have the opinion that the game is completely unbalanced / broken / terrible in every aspect. Everyone has their own idea on how things should work and anyone who disagree's is a moron.
Competitive players say the game has such a low skill ceiling
Pub players want to remove anything that will put them at a disadvantage for not investing time to learn things (bhop, walljump, whatever)
What I know from playing since b200 - 223?
Tiny individual changes
- Slightly altering marine responsiveness
- Constant reiterations of walljump
- Cara adjustment (50 down to 30 on skulks)
- Increased fps (increased marine dominance)
- Exo suits
- Meta game
- 4 maps that completely vary (veil = 4 tech points, long travel distance. summit = 5 tech points, short travel distance. mineshaft = wat the ######? tram = different again, docking = to many res points)
Each of these individual items by themself constantly swing the balance back and forth between marines/aliens. Together they create huge swings in win percentages.
Welcome to asymetrical games! NS1 fluked it, SC1 / Warcraft fluked it. SC2 is slowly getting there. NS2.. well its beta so expect these things to happen till atleast 1.5 :)