So what happened to Hivesight?
Temphage
Join Date: 2009-10-28 Member: 69158Members
Join Date: 2009-10-28 Member: 69158Members
I've not seen it brought up... hivesight was never a total standin for a minimap, but it did definitely help the aliens get their bearings as they could tell where the marines were attacking and head over there. It was functional.
Now we get 'structure under attack' notifications with NFI where it's happening, and we can't even see the hives.
There's talks about an alien minimap and people are rejecting it for flavor reasons, but on the other hand, what happened to hivesight? Was it cut for release? Tested and broken and removed? Or simply decided it wasn't going to be a feature?
More curious than anything. It really helped focus the aliens. Now you get told 'hive is under attack' and have to mess with the maximap just to figure out where the hive is instead of heading for blip.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->In NS1, I remember "knowing" where the marines were, hivesight (I guess?) was the biggest part of this. (am I crazy or did it also show buildings being damaged? I certainly don't remember pressing 'c' then struggling to find 'me' and then trying to work out where the hell the red circle is, then repeating that 5 seconds later when I inevitably get lost due to the disorienting alien sight thing, only to discover that the red circle is just a dying cyst due to the chain being cut 5 minutes earlier...)
In NS2, I have no idea where the marines are... if I hop down this corridor as a shotgun marine turns the corner, 'splat'. So I go slower, listen, hide in the roof or down on the floor...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sums it up pretty well.
Now we get 'structure under attack' notifications with NFI where it's happening, and we can't even see the hives.
There's talks about an alien minimap and people are rejecting it for flavor reasons, but on the other hand, what happened to hivesight? Was it cut for release? Tested and broken and removed? Or simply decided it wasn't going to be a feature?
More curious than anything. It really helped focus the aliens. Now you get told 'hive is under attack' and have to mess with the maximap just to figure out where the hive is instead of heading for blip.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->In NS1, I remember "knowing" where the marines were, hivesight (I guess?) was the biggest part of this. (am I crazy or did it also show buildings being damaged? I certainly don't remember pressing 'c' then struggling to find 'me' and then trying to work out where the hell the red circle is, then repeating that 5 seconds later when I inevitably get lost due to the disorienting alien sight thing, only to discover that the red circle is just a dying cyst due to the chain being cut 5 minutes earlier...)
In NS2, I have no idea where the marines are... if I hop down this corridor as a shotgun marine turns the corner, 'splat'. So I go slower, listen, hide in the roof or down on the floor...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sums it up pretty well.
Comments
i could be mistaken, but i can often see marine outlines through walls even when they're not parasited... and i think i'd know if i'd downloaded a wallhack.
edit: <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/wiki/index.php/Hive_Sight" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/wiki/index.php/Hive_Sight</a> - i was half right, you do have wallhacks for 8 seconds after a marine is attacked.
edit2: i've also noticed that if there's a hive under attack it shows you the hive healthbar and location on your screen wherever you are on the map... if you don't know where 'flight control hive' is located, then maybe you need to learn the map.
I think the range should be doubled or even trippled.
Also this 30 sec long parasite thing is silly, should be permanent or removable by armory and *not* medpacks. Parasites are even less relevant now that the new bite system does damage increments other than 75 and as such you can't really expect parasite damage to prevent a bite at armor 0.
Don't like my posts, don't read them. Would it make you happy if I instead just waited a week for someone else to inevitably make this topic? Does it hurt your soul to see so many flaws pointed out in a game you have some sort of deep irrational emotional attachment to?
It's getting to the point that I feel like I'm owed some sort of explanation for why some of these things are even features.
to be honest, i've been disregarding almost every post you've made in the last few days because you've lost any credibility you had with this desperate crusade to convert people into thinking the game balance is broken.
you ask a question and i'll answer it gladly, but only so that when other people have the misfortune of reading one of your posts they'll hopefully heed my response as a thoughtful contribution. therefore avoiding being subjected to post after post of one-sided ruthless balance bashing from someone with no reputation of being an experienced/skilled player.
you ask a question and i'll answer it gladly, but only so that when other people have the misfortune of reading one of your posts they'll hopefully heed my response as a thoughtful contribution. therefore avoiding being subjected to post after post of one-sided ruthless balance bashing from someone with no reputation of being an experienced/skilled player.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The game balance is sort of broken. As an NS old-timer, I'm honestly pretty baffled at some of the design choices, such as the gimping of hive sight, thus removing a lot of "flavor" and utility for the Alien team.
I'm still checking out some of the new NS2 stuff, haven't yet seen what the alien commander can do (NS1 had none) but at the moment it seems like they dumbed down the aliens quite a bit. And the fact that people are talking about Combat for NS2... is very disturbing to me. The reason I stopped NS1 was Combat, and if this is brought back, the team oriented community that made the first game good will soon be replaced by COD Marine 12 year olds trying to re-enact scenes from Aliens.
Yeah, that sums up your trolling garbage. Such as your thoughtful contribution in this thread, which was... what again? Oh! To start a bunch of drama, which we call 'trolling'. Or that you thoughtfully contributed parading around the 50/50 pie chart like it was some sort of argument. Or when you basically tell people 'LEARN TO PLAY' when they say something negative about the aliens.
At least I'm offering solutions, unlike you you non-contributing zero. You think the game is flawless. Good for you. We can thank sycophants like you for being 'yes men' in every game that has ever had an incomplete feeling and strange design choices. Hint: sycophantic fanboys do nothing to help a game get better. That it bothers you SO MUCH that I'm pointing out things that could be improved that you've admitted you're engaging in a personal crusade against me, as if white-knighting actually gets you respect, amuses me somewhat.
Like I said, would it be better if I just waited a week for someone else to inevitably ask this question? Should I just go make a bunch of sockpuppet accounts to post my grievances individually, because ONE guy picking apart the game isn't cool with you, everyone should only be entitled to a single complaint a week?
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->therefore avoiding being subjected to post after post of one-sided ruthless balance bashing from someone with no reputation of being an experienced/skilled player.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And you are... who? Please, tell me how much l33t competitive experience you have like anyone here cares.
I'm still checking out some of the new NS2 stuff, haven't yet seen what the alien commander can do (NS1 had none) but at the moment it seems like they dumbed down the aliens quite a bit. And the fact that people are talking about Combat for NS2... is very disturbing to me. The reason I stopped NS1 was Combat, and if this is brought back, the team oriented community that made the first game good will soon be replaced by COD Marine 12 year olds trying to re-enact scenes from Aliens.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agreed. First, I am LOVING NS2...WELL DONE UWE! However, I really feel that both sides are far "too" similar now outside of visuals.
Both have commanders now.
Hive Sight just isn't that useful anymore.
Gorges are no longer true builders and can't set up any meaningful "territory control".
I really prefer the old "welding sound" as it felt rough and "not-perfected" as the current "futuristic sound" is. Tthat rough feeling puts you on edge as you're welding something together with basic technology while an alien could come up on you at any time. With this futuristic sound and effect it just feels too "perfected and controlled" and that un-easyness just isn't there. Face it, the scenes from Aliens where they are trying to frantically weld the door shut would be a lot less scary if they were standing back shooting lasers at the door. It's that rough and dirty frantic feeling of welding that puts you on edge.
It just feels that NS2 has taken a lot of control away from the players and most matches don't have those unique and quirky happenings that happened often in NS1.
Regardless, I am very happy with NS2 and I expect I'll be playing it for a very long time.
The big breaker to me is not being able to tell where the hell the marines are at / structures under attack are. It would help somewhat if we had more attentive commanders, but the whole point of hivesight was to allow the aliens to get a constant flow of intel on their own. It was a little visually messy, I think we can agree, but its exclusion detracts more than it adds.
We don't HAVE to have an alien minimap - but minimap-like functions portrayed on the hivesight was what replaced it in NS1. Right now you can use the maximap and see marines across the map doing whatever it is they do, but if you hadn't opened your map, you wouldn't know anything about it. Except a mysterious 'structure / unit under attack' message.
So, you stopped playing NS1 classic because a different game mode that didn't affect classic came into existence?
I don't follow your logic. Nor do I understand why the community NS2 combat mod would affect your opinion of the main game mode in any way.
Combat disrupted classic in that it split the playerbase, fractured some servers (next round, combat! Half the server leaves. Next round, classic, half the server leaves), and represented a major design decision shift on the devs. I actually enjoyed combat, I found it a nice distraction, but I think the inclusion of Combat was kind of like when a game developer accidentally lets it slip that only 6 months after the product launched that they're already working on a sequel. It means that resources, time, attention, and give-a-****-ness had to be taken away from the original product to focus on their next great thing, and that you can probably expect support for the original game to drop dramatically.
Personally I quit playing NS because 3.0 betrayed the game I originally fell in love with, and was full of some bizarre and bad gameplay choices. Res 4 kills was like, the worst thing ever. I didn't like that the aliens - who originally were billed as being soloists - had to rely more and more on advanced group tactics, and marines suddenly became far more effective at being given a shotgun and told to run wild and frag as many aliens as they could.
So, you stopped playing NS1 classic because a different game mode that didn't affect classic came into existence?
I don't follow your logic. Nor do I understand why the community NS2 combat mod would affect your opinion of the main game mode in any way.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It did effect classic. Combat gave everyone the option of the "easy way" and natural instinct is to take the easy way. That being said, the number of available of classic servers PLUS the quality of them dropped severely...enough where even I stopped playing NS1 because there were hardly any classic servers left worth playing on. They were mostly filled with bots or trolls.
Because some players are just that BAD.
Give them some time and eventually they'll learn.
To temphage:
The map "lights up in red" when something is under attack. I dont think that many people find it hard to press c for a split second when the voice message screams "bla bla is under attack"
Also get the commander to place drifters across the map for line of sight. Ohh wait... I forgot that you dont play RTS games (My bad).
Its really very bothersome how small the differences between both teams are now. Oh and why are there even siege turrets still? Alien defenses are extremely gimpy. I remember the "Wall of Lame" in NS1, now there's a reason for siege weapons...
Walking into a hive room doesn't really seem very dangerous in NS2, outside of running into some skulks.
I have hope that NS2 will find its direction. I'm just wondering where this direction came from. We'll see which way the game goes from here.
It's not difficult, but I enjoyed the constant visual info that hivesight provided. It made alien play flow so much smoother for me. As a marine it feels natural to open up a map or look at a minimap for navigation. Hivesight made alien navigation feel natural for it's species.
So, you stopped playing NS1 classic because a different game mode that didn't affect classic came into existence?
I don't follow your logic. Nor do I understand why the community NS2 combat mod would affect your opinion of the main game mode in any way.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, because a lot of the community moved to NS combat and so the vanilla servers were less populated. The community was small enough that finding a game of NS1 vanilla that wasn't vacant, or didn't have whiny kids, became a bother, so I stopped trying.
It also represented a shift from a design perspective that I did not like. The best NS was still NS 1.04
Mods affect the community. If you can't find a game of NS2 vanilla after combat comes out, can you still play the game? This game isn't deathmatch, you need a team.
Two hour battles for the redroom m i rite
<img src="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/uploads/post-7-1061936278.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
But no srsly gaise where the eff is hivesight, Cory.
At least I'm offering solutions, unlike you you non-contributing zero. You think the game is flawless. Good for you. We can thank sycophants like you for being 'yes men' in every game that has ever had an incomplete feeling and strange design choices. Hint: sycophantic fanboys do nothing to help a game get better. That it bothers you SO MUCH that I'm pointing out things that could be improved that you've admitted you're engaging in a personal crusade against me, as if white-knighting actually gets you respect, amuses me somewhat.
Like I said, would it be better if I just waited a week for someone else to inevitably ask this question? Should I just go make a bunch of sockpuppet accounts to post my grievances individually, because ONE guy picking apart the game isn't cool with you, everyone should only be entitled to a single complaint a week?
And you are... who? Please, tell me how much l33t competitive experience you have like anyone here cares.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
i'm not pretending to have l33t competitive experience. i'm just trying to improve myself as a player and explore the game fully before deciding whether it's broken or not... and i'm certainly not waving a 'plx fix' picket under the nose of the developers in hope of inciting a balance overhaul in the first week
please relax for a moment and look at your 'members posts' page. you've commented on almost every single thing the marines have which aliens don't, and then called it imba without any evidence or data. you disagree with so much of the dev design choices that you're basically insulting anyone who enjoys the game.
This. I've had some pretty fun games on pub servers thus far (focusing solely on the interaction with the community). There's already a NS2 Combat mod. Argh.
Still, there's some things that irk me with NS2 - it makes it a tad harder for me to fall in love with the game. No more walls of lame for one - the current Gorge buildables do next to nothing in even slowing down a marine advance. I'm also not a huge fan of the alien comm (I guess this would be related to the Gorge business) but part of me expects a third alien race (possibly NPC) to pop up with an extremely expensive tech-tree, and buildings that auto-build while shouting "FOR AIUR!" as they charge into battle. Also the gimped hivesight.
And 2 hour battles for red-room is where it's at. I did a ninja-phase gate to an alien hive yesterday and squealed in nostalgia when it worked.
Still, there's some things that irk me with NS2 - it makes it a tad harder for me to fall in love with the game. No more walls of lame for one - the current Gorge buildables do next to nothing in even slowing down a marine advance. I'm also not a huge fan of the alien comm (I guess this would be related to the Gorge business) but part of me expects a third alien race (possibly NPC) to pop up with an extremely expensive tech-tree, and buildings that auto-build while shouting "FOR AIUR!" as they charge into battle. Also the gimped hivesight.
And 2 hour battles for red-room is where it's at. I did a ninja-phase gate to an alien hive yesterday and squealed in nostalgia when it worked.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
give it a chance, lol.
it's only been out for 5 minutes.
it's only been out for 5 minutes.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
A lot of these things existed in the beta which has been on going for quite some time. Stop acting like it's a new game with mysterious problems that just arose on release.