Game Needs More Strategic Depth
Bullet_Force
Join Date: 2012-11-02 Member: 165952Members
Join Date: 2012-11-02 Member: 165952Members
I came to this game mostly from an RTS background having played the fantastic Men of War series (WW2 real time tactical game) and was impressed with the idea that you could weld an RTS game with a shooter. At present though the game's RTS component is severely shallow.
For Aliens it consists of building two hives then upgrading the first one to Shift hive then you drop Onos egg and if your team works together you will do good. Other live forms like Lerks and Fades seem to be made of paper and die so easily to shotguns its a highly risky investment compared to just waiting for the Onos.
For Marines its all about getting early phase gates and then basically turtling your way to victory via forward armouries. Although they have several weapons to use the only one you need is shotgun. That gun does it all bang bang. Later on you throw on a jetpack and your complete. Game finishes with 2 exos shooting hive.
I'd like to see instead diverse strategies being encouraged. The shade tree for the Aliens really needs some love as it's never useful except the third hive. So to for Lerks, Gorges and Fades and less need to rely on the Onos.
For Marines they need more weapons and some new technology paths. The shotgun needs to have some limitations.
For Aliens it consists of building two hives then upgrading the first one to Shift hive then you drop Onos egg and if your team works together you will do good. Other live forms like Lerks and Fades seem to be made of paper and die so easily to shotguns its a highly risky investment compared to just waiting for the Onos.
For Marines its all about getting early phase gates and then basically turtling your way to victory via forward armouries. Although they have several weapons to use the only one you need is shotgun. That gun does it all bang bang. Later on you throw on a jetpack and your complete. Game finishes with 2 exos shooting hive.
I'd like to see instead diverse strategies being encouraged. The shade tree for the Aliens really needs some love as it's never useful except the third hive. So to for Lerks, Gorges and Fades and less need to rely on the Onos.
For Marines they need more weapons and some new technology paths. The shotgun needs to have some limitations.
Comments
I was hopeing so much that the RTs-part is improved, compared to NS1.
you appear to have missed the ~5 onos rush whine threads which have already petered out because more or less everyone agreed that it was a sucky tactic and that it was detrimental to sacrifice early-mid game tech because skipping to late game tech was universally more useful.
<!--quoteo(post=2018084:date=Nov 10 2012, 09:34 AM:name=Mr.Greedy)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mr.Greedy @ Nov 10 2012, 09:34 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2018084"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Thats what I say all the time. Feels like Starcraft with only 2 races,without airunits, 1/3 upgrades,1/3 troops. Well, not much to do/try, right?
I was hopeing so much that the RTs-part is improved, compared to NS1.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
well at the moment it's a 'starcraft 1', and the developers are currently working on intermittent content/balance tweaking to turn it into a 'broodwar'.
If we are talking about pub play then you are wrong. You can build shade hive first no problem, just as long as the second hive is a crag hive. And in my experience you don't need to go for an onos egg at all if the players actually spends their res on lifeforms. Too many times recently I've seen players hoard up res and not go lerk or fade when they can, which results in our team losing mapcontrol cause all we have are skulks running around. In this situation we need an onos egg to get anything done, but that is not indicative of the state of the game, rather it is indicative of players not knowing how to play.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Other live forms like Lerks and Fades seem to be made of paper and die so easily to shotguns its a highly risky investment compared to just waiting for the Onos.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lerks and fades are great, you just have to know how to play them. And on pub play you don't even need to be skilled as a lerk or fade, you just need to know when to engage and when to not engage/flee. Too many new players simply run into a group of marines and think they should be able to take them on, instead of attacking as a pack... and then they die, go to the forums and complain. New people just need to practice, but it seems many of them are simply not very patient.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->For Marines its all about getting early phase gates and then basically turtling your way to victory via forward armouries.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That is also wrong. I agree that phasegates are pretty much a necessity early on, but turtling from the get go is the noob way. You should be aggressive and take down their RTs and force <i>them</i> to run around and defend them. That is very viable and much more fun than turtling.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Although they have several weapons to use the only one you need is shotgun. That gun does it all bang bang. Later on you throw on a jetpack and your complete.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree that shotguns are just simply an upgrade to the rifle and I'd also hope that UWE adjusts it, so it's not just a no-brainer to get it once it's researched. But they are already aware of this so I have faith in them.
i admit the shotgun is dandy, but it's not a nobrainer... you need to manage resources for mines and jetpack which are usually more desirable than shotgun.
saying shotgun is simply an upgrade to the rifle is in effect the same as saying onos is simply an upgrade to skulk.
Did u ever play Starcraft? I dont think so.
This game badly needs some stronger counters. Like "Shotgun counters Fade". And not "Shotgun counters everything" .
Just opened a Thread about that. <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=124111" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...howtopic=124111</a>
Game isn't done yet. . .
Bare minimum there will be 3 more evolutions being released for aliens, a good chance for welding doors and vents shut, as well as other new content
Game isn't done yet. . .
Bare minimum there will be 3 more evolutions being released for aliens, a good chance for welding doors and vents shut, as well as other new content<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Then we have reached the status of NS1. WOW.
Game isn't done yet. . .
Bare minimum there will be 3 more evolutions being released for aliens, a good chance for welding doors and vents shut, as well as other new content<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Didn't we have door welding a while back? It turned to be worse for the marines than the aliens though.
depends on the map design.
imagine a door that when welded shut would prevent/delay access to a key vent, or something similar.
<!--quoteo(post=2018240:date=Nov 10 2012, 11:07 PM:name=tarquinbb)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (tarquinbb @ Nov 10 2012, 11:07 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2018240"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i admit the shotgun is dandy, but it's not a nobrainer... you need to manage resources for mines and jetpack which are usually more desirable than shotgun.
saying shotgun is simply an upgrade to the rifle is in effect the same as saying onos is simply an upgrade to skulk.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, it's a great weapon, especially for skulks and fades close up, but it doesn't work well at long range, in addition to the pres cost you mention.
I would have to disagree about the OPs remarks about the other 2 weapons, they are just situational. A GL or 2 in a team can do a lot of damage, but they need shotgun/LMG guys around to keep them alive. Grenades are also the hard counter to gorge clogs. I found less uses for the flame thrower, but it can clear spores and umbra, and burning aliens generate energy slower, so there is clearly an intended role, but it doesn't get used much because there are too many onii to worry about.