Calling it pubstomping to play on a pub server and do too well seems disingenuous, what alternative is there? If there was a way to find a game in which everyone is just as skilled as yourself I'm sure everybody would use it, but there isn't. I only have fun when I'm playing seriously - when I play Lerk I typically slaughter marines and just get increasingly reckless until eventually I cross the line and get killed. Knowing how far your opponents will let you push it is part of the skill.
You got some crazy moves. . . I've only watched about 10 min, but I've seen you do strafe wobbling in air like skulks do on the ground
Another time you you bit a guy back, then front as he turned, and then bounced off the ceiling before you power dived his head
I'm a lot more aggressive with spikes than you are when I play Lerk I usually try to get a Marine within the 2 bite range when approaching them from behind <i>(I see you mostly go for only bites though)</i>
The latest patch lets you cloak while gliding if you are moving slow enough and regen is also very good My framerate dumps pretty bad when I'm recording too, but if I can get in a good game there's a few things I'd like to show you for feedback
<!--quoteo(post=2024666:date=Nov 15 2012, 11:18 AM:name=Metal Handkerchief)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Metal Handkerchief @ Nov 15 2012, 11:18 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2024666"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->... I do hope you intend to actually play in some real games ...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
While the NS community is a better gaming community than most in my opinion, the one sad thing that sticks out is this divide between casual and competitive players. It's not the fact that the two sides are looking for different things in balance. That is understandable, as the nature of a competitive game is different than a pub. It's the fact that competitive players are so goddamn insulting toward people that don't make all of their goals and suggestions oriented around competitive matches and how those matches should be balanced. This stuck up attitude from the competitive community is the one negative thing that only serves to hurt it. I can almost guarantee that if the comp players got every balance change they wanted implemented into the game, the game would DIE. Suggestions and input are welcome from all members of the community, but if you can't do it without telling people they are stupid or their opinions don't count because they don't play competitively, then do us all a favor and stay out of the conversation, and in your ivory towers.
MouseThe Lighter Side of PessimismJoin Date: 2002-03-02Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
<!--coloro:#FFA500--><span style="color:#FFA500"><!--/coloro-->Metal Handkerchief & RedDragon, as fun as it is to argue semantics, try to stay on topic.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
Out of curiousity, what things did you all pick up from watching Saba play? I think it'll help us to see them listed out (and if we're lucky, Saba might explain why she does these various things.
The few things I noticed: <ul><li>Not much pancaking while attacking. Most often it's just a chain of bites while slowly moving around them at about their eyelevel.</li><li>Slows down dramatically just as she gets to a marine (presumably a tap or two on the back key) which makes it easier to move around them.</li><li>Uses the map quite a bit to repeatedly flank marines, even to flank the same one multiple times.</li></ul>
<!--quoteo(post=2025093:date=Nov 15 2012, 03:20 PM:name=Mouse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mouse @ Nov 15 2012, 03:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2025093"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><ul><li>Not much pancaking while attacking. Most often it's just a chain of bites while slowly moving around them at about their eyelevel.</li><li>Slows down dramatically just as she gets to a marine (presumably a tap or two on the back key) which makes it easier to move around them.</li><li>Uses the map quite a bit to repeatedly flank marines, even to flank the same one multiple times.</li></ul><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I think you should always pancake while attacking. I think circle-strafing will work against inexperienced marines - while it's easier to land bites, marines will learn to jump or strafe to the side and leave you floating slowly around an empty space. the Lerk doesn't appear to have much of a speed cap as far as vertical movement (think it's 44 for falling). in addition most players from any FPS have a lot of trouble aiming with rapid z-axis changes
IMO the ideal way to play is to incorporate both circlestrafing and pancaking around your opponent, while trying to cut off line of sight so that you can't get focused down, something like this engagement: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56UvF2mGxv0#t=2m10s" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56UvF2mGxv0#t=2m10s</a>
if you want to slow down before biting, you can try the movement special key (default shift), it may help to slow you down if you're having trouble landing bites.
it's a great idea to flank within rooms and circle around (data core on summit is a fantastic example of Lerk friendly environments). one thing I purposefully avoid doing is flanking from a hallway that's actually behind the marines, though. most players already start retreating way too late, and there's a high chance of retreating into enforcing marines.
rhombusLerk QueenJoin Date: 2011-06-23Member: 106055Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
edited November 2012
<!--quoteo(post=2024877:date=Nov 15 2012, 02:40 PM:name=Zek)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Zek @ Nov 15 2012, 02:40 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2024877"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Calling it pubstomping to play on a pub server and do too well seems disingenuous, what alternative is there? If there was a way to find a game in which everyone is just as skilled as yourself I'm sure everybody would use it, but there isn't. I only have fun when I'm playing seriously - when I play Lerk I typically slaughter marines and just get increasingly reckless until eventually I cross the line and get killed. Knowing how far your opponents will let you push it is part of the skill.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
+1.
I've played on a few teams and scrimmed quite a bit. A lot of the time I don't like sitting around in ENSL, and would rather join a friend, etc and have fun.
<!--quoteo(post=2024919:date=Nov 15 2012, 03:24 PM:name=MaximumSquid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MaximumSquid @ Nov 15 2012, 03:24 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2024919"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm a lot more aggressive with spikes than you are when I play Lerk I usually try to get a Marine within the 2 bite range when approaching them from behind <i>(I see you mostly go for only bites though)</i>
The latest patch lets you cloak while gliding if you are moving slow enough and regen is also very good My framerate dumps pretty bad when I'm recording too, but if I can get in a good game there's a few things I'd like to show you for feedback<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Majority of my fights I'd prefer 1-3 marines unless I'm feeling ballsy enough to take on more. Spikes do damage, through armor and directly to Marine health, but I'd prefer to glide in quietly and deal burst damage than give away my position by spiking first. Especially when I'm trying to cover ground between me and the Marine. Only time I'd really use spike is when my team is there, I don't have spores, and it's a giant cluster in the room (or if the Marine hasn't heard me approaching yet after I've flapped a few times). The Marines are more distracted with the other Aliens to where I can sit back and quietly assist with chipping away at their hp/ap.
I'd rather get silence and run on full speed ahead than slow down to cloak. You're only as invisible as how silent you are. I would like to see some of your moves, Maximum.
<!--quoteo(post=2025093:date=Nov 15 2012, 06:20 PM:name=Mouse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mouse @ Nov 15 2012, 06:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2025093"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Out of curiousity, what things did you all pick up from watching Saba play? I think it'll help us to see them listed out (and if we're lucky, Saba might explain why she does these various things.
The few things I noticed: <ul><li>Not much pancaking while attacking. Most often it's just a chain of bites while slowly moving around them at about their eyelevel.</li><li>Slows down dramatically just as she gets to a marine (presumably a tap or two on the back key) which makes it easier to move around them.</li><li>Uses the map quite a bit to repeatedly flank marines, even to flank the same one multiple times.</li></ul><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
- I have little left-right movement area on my mouse pad (sensitivity is high already, I hate cranking my dpi then lowering it when I leave game) about 6.5 inches worth. That and I prefer to jump up to the ceiling to where I can get a better bearing on where my target is and quickly glance around to make sure he doesn't have friends coming to help him. I picked up this style while playing NS1.
- I bank really hard to left/right and tap on my forward key to slow it down.
- To catch them off guard is your best weapon. If you flank them from the same doorway, sooner or later they'll catch on and blast you out of the sky. Try to be as unpredictable as you can.
@gliss: It's also about your own personal play style. Not all of us have a pocket Gorge. <3
But most marines don't expect a lerk to be dive bombing them while they get spiked... they tend to panic and start running for cover, letting you finish off with a couple bites in the rump.
i was lerking last night for a few games - mostly support gassing & long range spiking - very hit & run. ('cause I a skeerd)
so we had this game where it was basically over & there were 2 gorges sitting outside of cafeteria where there was one late game shotty marine huddled in there behind a wall, but i wasnt sure where.
they get on mike & say 'come on lerk get in there, we healed you. go kill him'
OK.
flap. flap. flap. I notice the guy is wedged in this corner so i swing in for a bite.
oops bite not selected . panic! flap. flap. flap. oh shi.... no energy!
bump into geometry. fall right at the guys feet :) BOOM. BOOOM.
.... and waiting for respawn.
needless to say they laughed at me for all to hear. I was ashamed. :)
Another important thing is to be careful about your flaps. That energy drain adds up very very quickly if you spam it in combat, especially when using spores. That was a bad habit from NS1 I'm still working on breaking.
<!--quoteo(post=2025769:date=Nov 16 2012, 10:41 AM:name=Zek)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Zek @ Nov 16 2012, 10:41 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2025769"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><b><i>Another important thing is to be careful about your flaps. </i></b>That energy drain adds up very very quickly if you spam it in combat, especially when using spores. That was a bad habit from NS1 I'm still working on breaking.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
yea. :o I was trying to make that mistake obvious in my description. <b>complete </b>brain freeze in that engagement - i got all fidgety there.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
No energy turns into floor Lerks, I'm usually using adrenaline on me Lerk because out of combat celerity is annoying when you get shot and lose speed. So I tried celerity Lerk yesterday and low and behold I turned into a floor Lerk due to not being used to energy conservation with celerity :D
rhombusLerk QueenJoin Date: 2011-06-23Member: 106055Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
<!--quoteo(post=2025780:date=Nov 16 2012, 10:57 AM:name=Kouji_San)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Nov 16 2012, 10:57 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2025780"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->No energy turns into floor Lerks, I'm usually using adrenaline on me Lerk because out of combat celerity is annoying when you get shot and lose speed. So I tried celerity Lerk yesterday and low and behold I turned into a floor Lerk due to not being used to energy conservation with celerity :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I mostly use it to travel and to rush up behind marines with a quiet glide. That's all I use it for since you do get slowed when hit.
I love the window in Docking map ;) gives clear shot at power node.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah. It keeps 1-3 Marines busy while they camp that window for a time. It's also great to lure them out onto landing pad for a more open area to kill them in.
<!--quoteo(post=2026274:date=Nov 16 2012, 11:41 PM:name=Bad Mojo)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bad Mojo @ Nov 16 2012, 11:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2026274"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Something about the term "floor lerks" is just hilarious to me. Can't quite put my finger on it though.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I feel the same way about pancaking, even though that mighty tactic isn't crazy effective like it used to be.
Did anyone else notice that spikes are properly silenced now when you're using silence? I really hope this is an intended change since it suits my playstyle a lot! Just a shame that by the time the 3rd hive comes up the game is usually decided already.
Comments
You got some crazy moves. . .
I've only watched about 10 min, but I've seen you do strafe wobbling in air like skulks do on the ground
Another time you you bit a guy back, then front as he turned, and then bounced off the ceiling before you power dived his head
I'm a lot more aggressive with spikes than you are when I play Lerk
I usually try to get a Marine within the 2 bite range when approaching them from behind
<i>(I see you mostly go for only bites though)</i>
The latest patch lets you cloak while gliding if you are moving slow enough and regen is also very good
My framerate dumps pretty bad when I'm recording too, but if I can get in a good game there's a few things I'd like to show you for feedback
While the NS community is a better gaming community than most in my opinion, the one sad thing that sticks out is this divide between casual and competitive players. It's not the fact that the two sides are looking for different things in balance. That is understandable, as the nature of a competitive game is different than a pub. It's the fact that competitive players are so goddamn insulting toward people that don't make all of their goals and suggestions oriented around competitive matches and how those matches should be balanced. This stuck up attitude from the competitive community is the one negative thing that only serves to hurt it. I can almost guarantee that if the comp players got every balance change they wanted implemented into the game, the game would DIE. Suggestions and input are welcome from all members of the community, but if you can't do it without telling people they are stupid or their opinions don't count because they don't play competitively, then do us all a favor and stay out of the conversation, and in your ivory towers.
Out of curiousity, what things did you all pick up from watching Saba play? I think it'll help us to see them listed out (and if we're lucky, Saba might explain why she does these various things.
The few things I noticed:
<ul><li>Not much pancaking while attacking. Most often it's just a chain of bites while slowly moving around them at about their eyelevel.</li><li>Slows down dramatically just as she gets to a marine (presumably a tap or two on the back key) which makes it easier to move around them.</li><li>Uses the map quite a bit to repeatedly flank marines, even to flank the same one multiple times.</li></ul>
I think you should always pancake while attacking. I think circle-strafing will work against inexperienced marines - while it's easier to land bites, marines will learn to jump or strafe to the side and leave you floating slowly around an empty space. the Lerk doesn't appear to have much of a speed cap as far as vertical movement (think it's 44 for falling). in addition most players from any FPS have a lot of trouble aiming with rapid z-axis changes
IMO the ideal way to play is to incorporate both circlestrafing and pancaking around your opponent, while trying to cut off line of sight so that you can't get focused down, something like this engagement: <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56UvF2mGxv0#t=2m10s" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56UvF2mGxv0#t=2m10s</a>
if you want to slow down before biting, you can try the movement special key (default shift), it may help to slow you down if you're having trouble landing bites.
it's a great idea to flank within rooms and circle around (data core on summit is a fantastic example of Lerk friendly environments). one thing I purposefully avoid doing is flanking from a hallway that's actually behind the marines, though. most players already start retreating way too late, and there's a high chance of retreating into enforcing marines.
+1.
I've played on a few teams and scrimmed quite a bit. A lot of the time I don't like sitting around in ENSL, and would rather join a friend, etc and have fun.
<!--quoteo(post=2024919:date=Nov 15 2012, 03:24 PM:name=MaximumSquid)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MaximumSquid @ Nov 15 2012, 03:24 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2024919"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm a lot more aggressive with spikes than you are when I play Lerk
I usually try to get a Marine within the 2 bite range when approaching them from behind
<i>(I see you mostly go for only bites though)</i>
The latest patch lets you cloak while gliding if you are moving slow enough and regen is also very good
My framerate dumps pretty bad when I'm recording too, but if I can get in a good game there's a few things I'd like to show you for feedback<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Majority of my fights I'd prefer 1-3 marines unless I'm feeling ballsy enough to take on more. Spikes do damage, through armor and directly to Marine health, but I'd prefer to glide in quietly and deal burst damage than give away my position by spiking first. Especially when I'm trying to cover ground between me and the Marine. Only time I'd really use spike is when my team is there, I don't have spores, and it's a giant cluster in the room (or if the Marine hasn't heard me approaching yet after I've flapped a few times). The Marines are more distracted with the other Aliens to where I can sit back and quietly assist with chipping away at their hp/ap.
I'd rather get silence and run on full speed ahead than slow down to cloak. You're only as invisible as how silent you are. I would like to see some of your moves, Maximum.
<!--quoteo(post=2025093:date=Nov 15 2012, 06:20 PM:name=Mouse)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mouse @ Nov 15 2012, 06:20 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2025093"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Out of curiousity, what things did you all pick up from watching Saba play? I think it'll help us to see them listed out (and if we're lucky, Saba might explain why she does these various things.
The few things I noticed:
<ul><li>Not much pancaking while attacking. Most often it's just a chain of bites while slowly moving around them at about their eyelevel.</li><li>Slows down dramatically just as she gets to a marine (presumably a tap or two on the back key) which makes it easier to move around them.</li><li>Uses the map quite a bit to repeatedly flank marines, even to flank the same one multiple times.</li></ul><!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
- I have little left-right movement area on my mouse pad (sensitivity is high already, I hate cranking my dpi then lowering it when I leave game) about 6.5 inches worth. That and I prefer to jump up to the ceiling to where I can get a better bearing on where my target is and quickly glance around to make sure he doesn't have friends coming to help him. I picked up this style while playing NS1.
- I bank really hard to left/right and tap on my forward key to slow it down.
- To catch them off guard is your best weapon. If you flank them from the same doorway, sooner or later they'll catch on and blast you out of the sky. Try to be as unpredictable as you can.
@gliss: It's also about your own personal play style. Not all of us have a pocket Gorge. <3
so we had this game where it was basically over & there were 2 gorges sitting outside of cafeteria where there was one late game shotty marine huddled in there behind a wall, but i wasnt sure where.
they get on mike & say 'come on lerk get in there, we healed you. go kill him'
OK.
flap. flap. flap. I notice the guy is wedged in this corner so i swing in for a bite.
oops bite not selected . panic! flap. flap. flap. oh shi.... no energy!
bump into geometry. fall right at the guys feet :) BOOM. BOOOM.
.... and waiting for respawn.
needless to say they laughed at me for all to hear. I was ashamed. :)
lerk play video links now in favorites ... :)
yea. :o I was trying to make that mistake obvious in my description. <b>complete </b>brain freeze in that engagement - i got all fidgety there.
I love the window in Docking map ;) gives clear shot at power node.
I mostly use it to travel and to rush up behind marines with a quiet glide. That's all I use it for since you do get slowed when hit.
<!--quoteo(post=2025817:date=Nov 16 2012, 11:30 AM:name=Rabcor)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Rabcor @ Nov 16 2012, 11:30 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2025817"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->lerks <3
I love the window in Docking map ;) gives clear shot at power node.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah. It keeps 1-3 Marines busy while they camp that window for a time. It's also great to lure them out onto landing pad for a more open area to kill them in.
I feel the same way about pancaking, even though that mighty tactic isn't crazy effective like it used to be.
Did anyone else notice that spikes are properly silenced now when you're using silence? I really hope this is an intended change since it suits my playstyle a lot! Just a shame that by the time the 3rd hive comes up the game is usually decided already.