Hit Registration problem - Video proof
It's Super Effective!
Join Date: 2012-08-28 Member: 156625Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
Join Date: 2012-08-28 Member: 156625Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
<div class="IPBDescription">Video recording of the hit registration problem</div>Hello NS2 community, I've noticed the forums have a couple of topics regarding hit detection in this game, it doesn't happen all the time, but I've experienced it twice so far, fortunately I was recording some footage and I would like to present it here.
Here's the YouTube link:
<a href="http://youtu.be/M4XFtt0yyxc" target="_blank">http://youtu.be/M4XFtt0yyxc</a>
Here are some other links related to this topic:
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=124526&hl=" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...=124526&hl=</a>
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=124752&hl=" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...=124752&hl=</a>
It would be beniticial to the integrity of the game if the community could support behind this,
Cheers
Here's the YouTube link:
<a href="http://youtu.be/M4XFtt0yyxc" target="_blank">http://youtu.be/M4XFtt0yyxc</a>
Here are some other links related to this topic:
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=124526&hl=" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...=124526&hl=</a>
<a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/index.php?showtopic=124752&hl=" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/ns2/forums/in...=124752&hl=</a>
It would be beniticial to the integrity of the game if the community could support behind this,
Cheers
Comments
Unless you're playing lan, what you see on your screen the moment you die is something the other client sent the server, then the server sent to you, with a delay depending on your connection/distance from server etc
One thing I cannot stand in NS2 is the input delay.. Seems like my mouse responds in game a fraction of a second later. Also shotgun fires like a minute after you click.
Oh yeah and regardless of this I have noticed the reg issue also.
If you cant see the problem there then your blind, hit detection has been really off since 224/225
@3:23 - 2 shots into cyst, 10 I think into the skulk but it's hard to say because client-side skulks take like 2-3 seconds to die so you always waste a lot of ammo on dead skulks
@3:38 - 7 shots into skulk, melee, 1 shot into skulk
That was some pretty lucky registry, I usually get 0 damage from 5-10 shots in a magazine, although some servers are crappier like the first part of your video and it takes half a magazine to kill a skulk running at you in a straight line. I think it's because of my framerate, yours seems to be remarkable compared to my 30fps late game.
What bothers me even more than not being able to kill Skuls as marine is when you play as a Skulk or Lerk and you instantly die to 1 or 2 LMG shots even with Carapace. Just instant death for no apparant reason - It's like the hits do not register on the client-end until you're dead sometimes. And other times it will cause you to be almost invulnerable to marine fire while you jump around in a group of marines.
They both seem like hitreg issues to me, but far be it for me to suggest any way to fix it. I know nothing of netcode programming.
I could only guess what the bug in question was, but this is clearly a real thing. I've had the same feeling off and on myself for sure. There's games I feel really accurate, but I can't seem to kill anything, and other games I feel a mess and just lay skulks out.
This video has got me thinking though; I'll be switching servers when this comes up I suppose?
Might be something worth looking into, Max... but yeah, if someone records please have r_stats and net_stats on - it'd help a lot.
This is kind of like deciding to carry everything in your house across town on foot because you don't like the rain where you live. A: it's an unbelievably unrealistic amount of effort, and B: every town has rain.
thats a terrible analogy.. and ###### man cod has better reg then ns2 and that game is on listen servers lol.
Yes, Call of Duty is the game you want to compare this to. That over-funded and underwhelming game engine, has to be compared to this one.
I believe NS2 is as well. I remember Corey stating that he took a huge amount of net code inspiration from the way things were done in quake 3. It's just unrealistic to completely and fully accurately recreate what a small crew of some of the best engineers to ever be assembled at a gaming company were able to produce over 3 generations of technology, as one guy working for a few years after graduation.
You're joking right? I mean, yes they do die in the correct number of bullets, but that's not the issue here. The issue is he was shooting at them running in a straight line and following them almost spot-on and out of 50 shots fired, like 3-4 registered.
The difference between the 2 servers on the video, as far as hitreg, is like night and day. And my hunch is it's not necessarily due to ping or tickrate. Voogru show excellent ping and tickrate, usually... It might've been good to have net_stats on regardless...
And speaking of COD, that engine is a fork of the Quake engine which had been refined for nearly 10 years at the time, and COD itself has been refined for nearly another 10 on top of that. And no, I don't think COD is perfect either. All games' lag compensation means you will die when you think you've made it safe around a corner on your screen.
However, comparing COD to an engine which was basically completely changed and large parts rewritten 3 weeks ago (which is NS2's) is pretty funny to say the least. They're trying, and it'll come around, eventually.
Speaking of Quake, the HL1 (goldsrc) engine which NS1 is built on is a fork of quake as well :-P .
Umm watching it again, no he missed A LOT. And I never put too much stock into damage numbers as they're often wrong, that's not really anything new. Watching where he was aiming and actually counting the hits, no he missed a lot and the 9 shots that did connect killed the skulk, albeit his death was slightly delayed. Even with 2 people shooting in the second one, they both missed A TON.
This needs to be done on a filled server with a friend in repeat scenarios.
It was a hit marker issue, not hit registration issue. The damage was going through on the server side, but for some reason the numbers weren't appearing client side. If you watch the first two skulks, the guys nearby friend hit maybe 2 or 3 bullets? Yet the hit markers state a maximum of like 30 damage done by the recorder. That's quite a bit short of killing a skulk I'm afraid.
Skulk dying in the correct number of shots > not a hit reg issue.
Although the Quake engine has introduced and redefined the FPS and gaming industry, there will always be the two that are referred to as the top engines of them all.
Quake
Unreal
...
The main point to all this hit reg talk comes down to lag compensation and it's failure to display the model in the correct position.<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
<a href="http://www.gamefront.com/files/22645177/asdf.rar" target="_blank">http://www.gamefront.com/files/22645177/asdf.rar</a>
anyways i hope a dev will watch the entire demo because i will
Despite being bad, it's also inconsistent. Not sure whether it depends on the FPS, but playing on servers with stable tickrate mostly, it could be one of the culprits. Other then that I don't know, it is just is random at the very least.
It's pretty simple how it should be: You shoot at what you see, and you hit, if you are on target. This is how it ideally works, not some unituitive "the guy is really somewhere else because the server thinks so, so I have to aim at the air infront or behind the player beacuse the game fails to put the model in the proper place", but hell, even then in games without lag compensation it's not too hard to get used to it, but in NS2 it feels more dependant on luck then anything else to get your bullets (or bites for that matter) where they are supposed to hit.