Focus
Nordic
Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
<div class="IPBDescription">I don't like it</div>In the combat mod there is a focus upgrade. I tried it out and did not like it. My attacks were to slow for how I play skulk/fade. So I did not like it. Is the focus upgrade in combat mod representative of the real focus?
Comments
The reason for this is simple, its very rare to be able to land 4 consecutive bites while holding M1 where as with focus you effectively have to land bites 1 and 3 this can occur faster then biting 4 times and with some skill and timing is much more probable.
Average DPS is the same, 2X damage 2X time... But instantaneous DPS is higher with Focus
Ex. you bite one time, time =1 but focus damge is twice as much
you bite 3 times without = time to bite 2 times with but focus does damage4 and nonfocus does damage 3
--This is because focus damage is counted up front and for kills that require relatively few attacks focus is faster
--if your biting an extractor though the difference is negligible,
Although with Glancing blows this may be a little to powerful since the skill of landing 1 good bite is a lot lower then landing 2 consecutive good bites....
It was incredibly useful for skulks, especially when used with silence and leap. And for Fades. It was basically the only chance to effectively take down armor 3 and weapon 3 marines with jetpacks. In NS2 you still can't get more than 2 swipes/bites in before you gotta blink/move around (most of the time not even 2), so it'd still fit into the game.
I really want it back, I'm tired of endlessly biting high tech marines. Yes, I know, the gorge should help and the lerk...but then again the lerk cant really spore anymore without being in a lot of trouble vs 3 high tech marines since spores aren't ranged anymore....and the gorge shouldn't be needed for combat, but rather support. And a class needs to be useful by itself to a certain extend.
Just try to figure out how to use Focus effectively, it's the most fun you'll ever have as an attacking alien when you do.
EDIT: I used it for any class. There was no reason to get something else from the sensory chamber.
The reason for this is simple, its very rare to be able to land 4 consecutive bites while holding M1 where as with focus you effectively have to land bites 1 and 3 this can occur faster then biting 4 times and with some skill and timing is much more probable.
Average DPS is the same, 2X damage 2X time... But instantaneous DPS is higher with Focus
Ex. you bite one time, time =1 but focus damge is twice as much
you bite 3 times without = time to bite 2 times with but focus does damage4 and nonfocus does damage 3
--This is because focus damage is counted up front and for kills that require relatively few attacks focus is faster
--if your biting an extractor though the difference is negligible,<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As a skulk, and even more so as a fade, I play by trying to dodge all bullets and then coming in for the kill during reload. I find it quite effective, particularly as a fade. As a fade I rarely use blink but instead shadowstep around player or players and get close every few seconds for a swipe. I can take on 3 marines this way, 2 if they have decent aim. 1 if they have goddly aim. Even with shotguns. For me, the slower attack of the focus totally throws me off. I am half dead before I even have done damage. Without focus I just got 1-2 hits in and am gone hitting the other guy.
<!--quoteo(post=2028974:date=Nov 19 2012, 09:48 AM:name=VeNeM)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (VeNeM @ Nov 19 2012, 09:48 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2028974"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->its a mod not made by the devs btw<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yep. I know that.
<!--quoteo(post=2028981:date=Nov 19 2012, 10:00 AM:name=Zek)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Zek @ Nov 19 2012, 10:00 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2028981"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If you don't like Focus then I think your Skulk/Fade playstyle needs improvement. You should be aiming attacks carefully and not missing. If you can do that then Focus is incredible. Think of it as good practice on how to aim your bites/swipes.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Its not the extra aim that is required. It is the slow down that I dislike.
Yeah and the Lerk spores don't damage armor. Somehow they did everything to prevent the good ol' hit and run.
But it's still better to get one Focus hit than get one normal hit.
I did only play with it for 5 minutes... It was terrible. The marines all had shotguns and I could no longer hit them with out them shotting me at least once. I almost need celerity to play fade because I don't often get the slowdown from being hit.
:D no Focus, no Cele? Practice it the other way around.
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exr5Tt42EXo" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exr5Tt42EXo</a>
I had celerity carapace regen two hives and adrenaline before I got focus. I think focus just does not work with the way I play. I started this thread because people seem to want focus back and I seem to have the opposite reaction. I wanted to see what you guys would say to my dislike. I seem to be getting a "Learn to play with it, try it more than 5 minutes"
What works for me is just to hit a marine once (preferable from behind) and then instantly leap away behind some obstruction. Very often marines don't even figure out where you are and you can go in for another bite without getting hit once. Obviously this works best in combination with silence and since silence is no longer a "shift" upgrade in NS2, focus would not be so OP in vanilla NS2.
So yeah, I would really like to see it tested in vanilla :)
The purpose of Focus is the first hit. You have a greatly increased chance of killing them instantly if they're wounded. If the first hit doesn't kill them the second one will, dealing 4 hits worth of damage in the time it would normally take to land 3. It's also easier to focus on dodging and still do 100% damage when you don't have to land as many hits.
Most of the time as a Fade you should <i>not</i> be in the combat.
Most of the time as a Fade you should <i>not</i> be in the combat.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This was combat mode where the point is getting the kill. I could see focus might be better in vanilla where the goal is not to the kill.
This was combat mode where I tried this. It is very fast pased and is all about the kills. I was often attacking groups of marines since they did not wander alone. The problem I had with focus was the attack time. In the time it took me to do one attack with focus I was shot. Without focus I get at least one hit in and am dodging again ready to do another hit. If I get hit enough I run away and heal, which I was having to do sooner with focus.
In NS1 there was no delay whatoever on the initial attack (as the video shows).
This was combat mode where I tried this. It is very fast pased and is all about the kills. I was often attacking groups of marines since they did not wander alone. The problem I had with focus was the attack time. In the time it took me to do one attack with focus I was shot. Without focus I get at least one hit in and am dodging again ready to do another hit. If I get hit enough I run away and heal, which I was having to do sooner with focus.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
As best I can understand it your argument is....if I miss my first hit, I can't get a second hit in before I have to run away....well I think we all know what our responses to that is going to be.
<!--quoteo(post=2029049:date=Nov 19 2012, 10:42 AM:name=statikg)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (statikg @ Nov 19 2012, 10:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2029049"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As best I can understand it your argument is....if I miss my first hit, I can't get a second hit in before I have to run away....well I think we all know what our responses to that is going to be.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Umm... no. It is simply that the attack time(attack delay) was too slow and that <b>I</b> preferred the regular attack time with regular damage.
EDIT: But I guess we should stop talking unless some NS1 vet, who already used NS2 combat Focus, shows us the light.
Still, the NS1 version is needed in NS2 :D
I got what I wanted from the thread and the topic of discussion is pretty much over. I would actually would like an ns1 vets input. I will ask one personally in fact.
You got me wrong on the killing thing, of course you want to kill. But you have to prepare the kills.
It's the same as in NS1, no initial attack delay. The slow-mo animation makes it feel weird though. But with celerity it is still the best choice.