<!--quoteo(post=2047245:date=Dec 17 2012, 12:41 PM:name=sloe)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (sloe @ Dec 17 2012, 12:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047245"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->With the "new wall jump" code:
Run straight forward while strafing towards a wall and mash the jump key. The speed increase is about as fast as celerity or bhop and when you get used to it you can alternate surfaces. Watch how quickly you catch up to other skulks who aren't using this technique.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=2047245:date=Dec 17 2012, 03:41 PM:name=sloe)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (sloe @ Dec 17 2012, 03:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047245"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->With the "new wall jump" code:
Run straight forward while strafing towards a wall and mash the jump key. The speed increase is about as fast as celerity or bhop and when you get used to it you can alternate surfaces. Watch how quickly you catch up to other skulks who aren't using this technique.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes I know, as i said once there's a working movement mechanic that isn't complete junk than maybe there will be some type of skill and bring a bit of life to the skulk gameplay.
Oh and IMO, bring back leap to something useful, heck bring it back to this. <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXRTSq3xxDg" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXRTSq3xxDg</a>
<!--quoteo(post=2047251:date=Dec 17 2012, 03:51 PM:name=Syknik)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Syknik @ Dec 17 2012, 03:51 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047251"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yes I know, as i said once there's a working movement mechanic that isn't complete junk than maybe there will be some type of skill and bring a bit of life to the skulk gameplay.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree... silence, stealth (darkness and green textures used to advantage), camo, wall walking, wall hopping, and leap aren't enough of a movement mechanic. Nerf parasite.
... Where's that eye rolling picture? You considering silence, camo, and wall walking to be a movement mechanic? Don't get me started on leap, the pathetic little hopscotch "leap". That's for another thread.
<!--quoteo(post=2047248:date=Dec 17 2012, 03:48 PM:name=unkind)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (unkind @ Dec 17 2012, 03:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047248"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->wtf was wrong with bhopping, jesus<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I really enjoyed bhopping but it wasn't intentional as it was originally a flaw in the Half-Life/GoldSrc/Quake engine that took skill to learn and so became commonly acceptable for competitive (or even casual) players, mostly because it was rampant and dealt with in the days of TFC/CS (not to forget Quake itself) before NS was released. I recall during NS1 play testing they removed the (silent) bhopping for marines but left in bhopping for aliens because competitive players felt it gave the aliens a very skillful dynamic that could counter the twitch-aim skill of a marine 1v1. UWE could try to replicate bhopping but it wouldn't be exactly the same, as the mouse gesture + strafe combination used for bhopping were exploiting the movement physics/math in some unintended way to give a slight acceleration. Maybe I'm wrong.
<!--quoteo(post=2047132:date=Dec 17 2012, 03:09 PM:name=Locklear)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Locklear @ Dec 17 2012, 03:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047132"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Pretty much this.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The optimisation can't be that bad as I can run it without any huge issues on lowest settings. To put this in context I can't run planetside 2 which my set up should be able to run on lowest settings comfortably according to Sony while I shouldn't really be able to run NS2
<!--quoteo(post=2047164:date=Dec 17 2012, 04:55 PM:name=bERt0r)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bERt0r @ Dec 17 2012, 04:55 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047164"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If this game doesnt reward rambos, why can a single alien easily take out a whole base or a single marine take out a crucial upgrade?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because its rewarding players for knowingly sacrificing themselves or punishing idiots for not using turrets and whips.
Essentially I always end up as part of the "roughnecks" / the suicide squad because I play far better that way, I can get into bases with ease and if you get 2 people with that ability you can make a nice double act and even halt the enemy expansion by taking out things like unbuilt hives. That is if the enemy commander hasn't prepared
Presently if I end up as commander its under the understanding I'm not in charge but supporting the in field commander and everyone else on the team understands I am listening to one person. I will have a plan too but I will not be dealing with their request unless it works for either my plan or the in field commanders plan.
<!--quoteo(post=2047255:date=Dec 17 2012, 04:07 PM:name=Syknik)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Syknik @ Dec 17 2012, 04:07 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047255"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->... Where's that eye rolling picture? You considering silence, camo, and wall walking to be a movement mechanic? Don't get me started on leap, the pathetic little hopscotch "leap". That's for another thread.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I do not play this game enough to compete with the eye rolling picture. But leap is definitely a pathetic little hopscotch...I'm surprised they haven't buffed that yet.
Rage-quitting should be an auto-ban, just saying. I don't think I have actually finished a game completely in about 3 days. Losing team always auto-quits.
<!--quoteo(post=2047261:date=Dec 17 2012, 09:21 PM:name=sloe)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (sloe @ Dec 17 2012, 09:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047261"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I do not play this game enough to compete with the eye rolling picture. But leap is definitely a pathetic little hopscotch...I'm surprised they haven't buffed that yet.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I think they're trying to find a balance between the leap meaning Skulks can cover an entire room in one bound and Marines all go "Is that my spleen ?" as Aliens can close the gap so quick and present leap which I will say barely does its intended job and more often than not celerity and wall jumping does it better than leaping.
<!--quoteo(post=2047262:date=Dec 17 2012, 04:23 PM:name=PoNeH)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PoNeH @ Dec 17 2012, 04:23 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047262"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Rage-quitting should be an auto-ban, just saying. I don't think I have actually finished a game completely in about 3 days. Losing team always auto-quits.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That definitely sucks and it happens ~40% of the pubs I've played.
Leap was also a mobility tool for spawning and quickly reaching the front line again, or closing the distance to melee similar to bhop/celerity. In NS1 bhop wasn't as powerful with hive #2 and leap. Not so much anymore because the hopscotch destroys your stamina by the time you get there, and it still takes about twice as long. Once leap is available it should easily replace celerity as the distance-closing technique of choice since once you reach melee celerity pretty much turns off anyway. What if adrenaline/celerity gave a boost to leap distance?
Since introducing the pixel-perfect hit-boxes I wonder if glancing blows was actually a bad idea. I think body/head with no glancing blows might work better, it would boost viability of skulk leap, drop ambush, going for headshots, etc. A large part of NS1 skulk melee viability came from their bites being particularly deadly even if done to the toe. Skulks thrashing about, not this nip nip toe-nail clip. Yaknow?
i know bunnyhopping wasn't an intentional feature but a glitch in the hl1 engine. However it did keep me very interested in skulk play and I felt it was a clear way for me to gauge how skilled I was in NS1.
<!--quoteo(post=2047268:date=Dec 17 2012, 04:34 PM:name=senate)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (senate @ Dec 17 2012, 04:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047268"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i know bunnyhopping wasn't an intentional feature but a glitch in the hl1 engine. However it did keep me very interested in skulk play and I felt it was a clear way for me to gauge how skilled I was in NS1.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I did enjoy that too, I'm just saying they don't have "the algorithm" to implement bhopping again and it might be a step backwards to try replicating it in Spark, where time spent elsewhere or even on new movement mechanics might produce better results. UWE is generally good when it comes to community outrage over balance issues so I'm thinking they'll buff the skulk somehow, even if it means indirectly like adding headshots for aliens. I'm not part of the NS scene and I really just make wild guesses though.
I would like to point out an obvious problem with bunny hopping. I see daily complaints about aliens winning too much/being OP. Then there is the group who wants to make aliens much easier to play and much harder to hit.
Now try figuring out what the developers should do with this split in thinking.
Easy. Aliens have a much lower skill ceiling than marines. Aliens will be at a huge disadvantage in any straight up fight against good marines. Bhop fixes this problem while below average players don't notice a balance change. Done.
<!--quoteo(post=2047293:date=Dec 17 2012, 04:16 PM:name=NeoRussia)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NeoRussia @ Dec 17 2012, 04:16 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047293"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Easy. Aliens have a much lower skill ceiling than marines. Aliens will be at a huge disadvantage in any straight up fight against good marines. Bhop fixes this problem while below average players don't notice a balance change. Done.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So aliens are winning more now. You make aliens better and this balances the game?
<!--quoteo(post=2047267:date=Dec 17 2012, 03:32 PM:name=sloe)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (sloe @ Dec 17 2012, 03:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047267"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Leap was also a mobility tool for spawning and quickly reaching the front line again, or closing the distance to melee similar to bhop/celerity. In NS1 bhop wasn't as powerful with hive #2 and leap. Not so much anymore because the hopscotch destroys your stamina by the time you get there, and it still takes about twice as long. Once leap is available it should easily replace celerity as the distance-closing technique of choice since once you reach melee celerity pretty much turns off anyway. What if adrenaline/celerity gave a boost to leap distance?
Since introducing the pixel-perfect hit-boxes I wonder if glancing blows was actually a bad idea. I think body/head with no glancing blows might work better, it would boost viability of skulk leap, drop ambush, going for headshots, etc. A large part of NS1 skulk melee viability came from their bites being particularly deadly even if done to the toe. Skulks thrashing about, not this nip nip toe-nail clip. Yaknow?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I've often thought that aliens (maybe not the lerk unless it adds to the DoT) should have impact damage to increase the use of hit and run tactics instead of mad hopping in circles till somebody dies. When I leap at a marine and chomp his face on the way past it should do more than when I nip his calf as we bounce around...
Comments
Run straight forward while strafing towards a wall and mash the jump key. The speed increase is about as fast as celerity or bhop and when you get used to it you can alternate surfaces. Watch how quickly you catch up to other skulks who aren't using this technique.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sounds really fun and skillful.
Run straight forward while strafing towards a wall and mash the jump key. The speed increase is about as fast as celerity or bhop and when you get used to it you can alternate surfaces. Watch how quickly you catch up to other skulks who aren't using this technique.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes I know, as i said once there's a working movement mechanic that isn't complete junk than maybe there will be some type of skill and bring a bit of life to the skulk gameplay.
Oh and IMO, bring back leap to something useful, heck bring it back to this. <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXRTSq3xxDg" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXRTSq3xxDg</a>
I agree... silence, stealth (darkness and green textures used to advantage), camo, wall walking, wall hopping, and leap aren't enough of a movement mechanic. Nerf parasite.
I really enjoyed bhopping but it wasn't intentional as it was originally a flaw in the Half-Life/GoldSrc/Quake engine that took skill to learn and so became commonly acceptable for competitive (or even casual) players, mostly because it was rampant and dealt with in the days of TFC/CS (not to forget Quake itself) before NS was released. I recall during NS1 play testing they removed the (silent) bhopping for marines but left in bhopping for aliens because competitive players felt it gave the aliens a very skillful dynamic that could counter the twitch-aim skill of a marine 1v1. UWE could try to replicate bhopping but it wouldn't be exactly the same, as the mouse gesture + strafe combination used for bhopping were exploiting the movement physics/math in some unintended way to give a slight acceleration. Maybe I'm wrong.
The optimisation can't be that bad as I can run it without any huge issues on lowest settings.
To put this in context I can't run planetside 2 which my set up should be able to run on lowest settings comfortably according to Sony while I shouldn't really be able to run NS2
<!--quoteo(post=2047164:date=Dec 17 2012, 04:55 PM:name=bERt0r)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bERt0r @ Dec 17 2012, 04:55 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=2047164"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If this game doesnt reward rambos, why can a single alien easily take out a whole base or a single marine take out a crucial upgrade?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because its rewarding players for knowingly sacrificing themselves or punishing idiots for not using turrets and whips.
Essentially I always end up as part of the "roughnecks" / the suicide squad because I play far better that way, I can get into bases with ease and if you get 2 people with that ability you can make a nice double act and even halt the enemy expansion by taking out things like unbuilt hives. That is if the enemy commander hasn't prepared
Presently if I end up as commander its under the understanding I'm not in charge but supporting the in field commander and everyone else on the team understands I am listening to one person. I will have a plan too but I will not be dealing with their request unless it works for either my plan or the in field commanders plan.
I do not play this game enough to compete with the eye rolling picture. But leap is definitely a pathetic little hopscotch...I'm surprised they haven't buffed that yet.
I think they're trying to find a balance between the leap meaning Skulks can cover an entire room in one bound and Marines all go "Is that my spleen ?" as Aliens can close the gap so quick and present leap which I will say barely does its intended job and more often than not celerity and wall jumping does it better than leaping.
That definitely sucks and it happens ~40% of the pubs I've played.
Leap was also a mobility tool for spawning and quickly reaching the front line again, or closing the distance to melee similar to bhop/celerity. In NS1 bhop wasn't as powerful with hive #2 and leap. Not so much anymore because the hopscotch destroys your stamina by the time you get there, and it still takes about twice as long. Once leap is available it should easily replace celerity as the distance-closing technique of choice since once you reach melee celerity pretty much turns off anyway. What if adrenaline/celerity gave a boost to leap distance?
Since introducing the pixel-perfect hit-boxes I wonder if glancing blows was actually a bad idea. I think body/head with no glancing blows might work better, it would boost viability of skulk leap, drop ambush, going for headshots, etc. A large part of NS1 skulk melee viability came from their bites being particularly deadly even if done to the toe. Skulks thrashing about, not this nip nip toe-nail clip. Yaknow?
I did enjoy that too, I'm just saying they don't have "the algorithm" to implement bhopping again and it might be a step backwards to try replicating it in Spark, where time spent elsewhere or even on new movement mechanics might produce better results. UWE is generally good when it comes to community outrage over balance issues so I'm thinking they'll buff the skulk somehow, even if it means indirectly like adding headshots for aliens. I'm not part of the NS scene and I really just make wild guesses though.
Now try figuring out what the developers should do with this split in thinking.
So aliens are winning more now. You make aliens better and this balances the game?
Ummm...
Since introducing the pixel-perfect hit-boxes I wonder if glancing blows was actually a bad idea. I think body/head with no glancing blows might work better, it would boost viability of skulk leap, drop ambush, going for headshots, etc. A large part of NS1 skulk melee viability came from their bites being particularly deadly even if done to the toe. Skulks thrashing about, not this nip nip toe-nail clip. Yaknow?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I've often thought that aliens (maybe not the lerk unless it adds to the DoT) should have impact damage to increase the use of hit and run tactics instead of mad hopping in circles till somebody dies. When I leap at a marine and chomp his face on the way past it should do more than when I nip his calf as we bounce around...