Anyone misses the old jetpack and focus?
Zagrivera
Join Date: 2005-03-24 Member: 46328Members
Join Date: 2005-03-24 Member: 46328Members
Hello,
I'm sorry if any of theses topic were already debated to death, I did not find other topics talking about this with the search tool.
I just started putting some hours playing NS2 and I really love the game so far, I feel like i'm playing a better NS1 which is awesome!! I can't wait to write this down and go play :P
There is two things that I miss from NS1 tho, and those two things would be:
<u><b>Jetpack Speed:</b></u>
The first game that I played marines and I saw that I was able to get myself a jetpack I was overcome with joy! But when I started using it I didn't loved it a bit.
- It really seems to me that the jetpacks is really slower than in NS1,they have a much lower vertical speed acceleration. (I felt more in control in NS1)
- Going up ladders (If I remember correctly, in NS1 you were able to climb faster with a jetpack than without)
Maybe it is for balance issue and all or maybe it is just me that is nostalgic of the old style of gameplay and that I need to adjust or maybe i'm totally in error here. I would like your thoughts!
<u><b>The Focus Upgrade For Aliens:</b></u>
This upgrade was awesome, my favorite for the skulk, I loved pairing it with celerity and silence. I will say that i'm not a pro alien player at the moment. As a skulk, I feel like. if I'm a skulk in the later stages of the game, I can pretty much only harass, I cannot compete against armor 3 marines . I feel very weak compared in NS1.
Having focus as a possible ability gave the skulk, well at least for me, a opportunity to help in combats in the later stages of a game. I loved how you had to time your bites and that it used a lot more energy. And if I remember correctly, if you took the focus upgrade, you did less damage to structures compared to a non-focused skulk in the long term. so maybe the commander would ask combat skulks (with focus) to go in combat while harass skulks go, well, harass!.
Maybe this ability would unbalance the whole game?
Theses were Two things I liked more in NS1 than in NS2. I would like to hear what you guys have to say about theses!
I'm sorry if any of theses topic were already debated to death, I did not find other topics talking about this with the search tool.
I just started putting some hours playing NS2 and I really love the game so far, I feel like i'm playing a better NS1 which is awesome!! I can't wait to write this down and go play :P
There is two things that I miss from NS1 tho, and those two things would be:
<u><b>Jetpack Speed:</b></u>
The first game that I played marines and I saw that I was able to get myself a jetpack I was overcome with joy! But when I started using it I didn't loved it a bit.
- It really seems to me that the jetpacks is really slower than in NS1,they have a much lower vertical speed acceleration. (I felt more in control in NS1)
- Going up ladders (If I remember correctly, in NS1 you were able to climb faster with a jetpack than without)
Maybe it is for balance issue and all or maybe it is just me that is nostalgic of the old style of gameplay and that I need to adjust or maybe i'm totally in error here. I would like your thoughts!
<u><b>The Focus Upgrade For Aliens:</b></u>
This upgrade was awesome, my favorite for the skulk, I loved pairing it with celerity and silence. I will say that i'm not a pro alien player at the moment. As a skulk, I feel like. if I'm a skulk in the later stages of the game, I can pretty much only harass, I cannot compete against armor 3 marines . I feel very weak compared in NS1.
Having focus as a possible ability gave the skulk, well at least for me, a opportunity to help in combats in the later stages of a game. I loved how you had to time your bites and that it used a lot more energy. And if I remember correctly, if you took the focus upgrade, you did less damage to structures compared to a non-focused skulk in the long term. so maybe the commander would ask combat skulks (with focus) to go in combat while harass skulks go, well, harass!.
Maybe this ability would unbalance the whole game?
Theses were Two things I liked more in NS1 than in NS2. I would like to hear what you guys have to say about theses!
Comments
With regards to jetpacks, I actually prefer the current version. In NS1, while they were definitely better, they were just too good, to a silly degree. They had so much control that it felt like you were just flying around in spectator mode, going perfectly in whichever direction you wanted. They were really good in even small corridors, and just insanely good in big open rooms. The current jetpack really is not optimal for in combat use (though it can still be useful in skilled hands) and is better for momentum based travel, suffering when trying to change directions. I also love that forward movement decreases vertical lift, it adds a whole new dimension to its use.
Interestingly I think the problem with old jetpacks could be balanced by the addition of focus. Focus would be super awesome I think pretty much everyone agrees with that. The Devs seem to be really against it though due to the classic "this is not ns1" thought process. Its my thought that focus would also make shade first a more viable option, I also think it could possibly fit in the shift tree if they wanted to put something else in shade, but preferably it would be in shade.
I agree that focus would help with the problem of skulks not scaling as well as marines. It would also help buff fades making them more skill based instead of having to make them extra tanky.
Add both please. :(
Air control feels weaker (you get large upward thrusts while trying to just hover and change direction) and you have less fuel but fade is better in the air than ns1 with shadowsteps and double jumps, plus blink has less acceleration, it's easier to achieve finer movements.
This
I find this explanation for leaving out focus quite amusing considering that 6 out of the 6 current upgrades existed in NS1 O_o
One of the side benefits of focus was that it made you a better skulk. Without being able to spam bites, you actually had to learn to aim.
Hope they bring it back.
There are still formidable butyou can't abuse it like before.
I agree as stated above that if the jetpacks would come close to what they were in NS1, they would need a higher research/buy cost.
Maybe not make them as powerful as in NS1 but a "in between"?
And yeah, Focus, I miss you!!!
Maybe making the skulks with focus do near to no damage to structures, maybe that would balance it?
Keep sharing your thoughts!
Regarding focus I gotta argue that a new attack mechanic would need to help diversity in that one. The simple click for double damage mode just doesn't fit in the ns2 playstyle in my opinion. Or at least it should feel very different to the basic bite attack.
Regarding focus I gotta argue that a new attack mechanic would need to help diversity in that one. The simple click for double damage mode just doesn't fit in the ns2 playstyle in my opinion. Or at least it should feel very different to the basic bite attack.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Erm... you attack at half speed, so it does feel very different.
Indeed ^^
And If I remember correctly, you could run out of energy with focus in a moderate/long fight so yeah, having focus meant you couldn't bite spam and you wouldn't do much dmg to structures and the most important thing, you had to time your bites!
Aliens have no way of improving their damage, other than evolving to a different lifeform.
Jetpacks just don't feel right and are too clunky. I enjoyed the JP in NS1, even after all of the nerfs it received throughout the years. I still remember the glory days of indefinitely remaining in the air during the NS1 beta versions.
I go and do things faster with a vacuum cleaner.
*cough cough*
SGs...
Also, I 100% agree with bringing back Focus. Really, anything that makes skulks able to fight marines in the late game. If you aren't an Onos or a Fade when they have armor 3, all you can do is harass structures.
The way NS2 is designed currently too profitable for defensive play in the end-game. Many factors contribute to this: Auto-heal armouries, auto-weld MACs, super-turrets, relentless kham overflow expansion and the fact that infestation/power limits functionality in opposition territory. The big one though is the end-game personal tech; the Dexo and Onos.
Both of these are slow-moving, high-hp, heavy damage units with low in-out effectiveness. On top of that, they are skill-nullifiers. They're impossible to miss and they're impossible to miss with. There is zero dexterity required and success is purely down to decision making. It should come as no surprise that we see cautious stand-off play for long periods of every game, especially in public settings where co-ordination and skill is low.
If we upped the cost and effectiveness of the jetpack, I think we could mitigate (not solve) this problem. Part of the reason why the end-game is so stale is that the important stuff doesn't really die much and that stand-offs occur in the same location for eons. If we saw more jetpacks, we would also see more fades and the jp/fade dynamic is far more interesting. It is quick, it can quickly change location, it comes with more deaths/kills and things can actually go wrong.
In the same vein, I would like to try Focus (as it would speed up the dying stages of a game considerably). It's a real shame, however, that the Fade is built around getting cheap initial swipes though and I'm not sure how this would ultimately pan out.
As far as focus goes, "double damage at half attack speed" always seemed boring, but extremly useful.
If focus were to be brought back, i would hope it would be along the lines of an additional effect from movement abilities, if only for skulks and fades.
That is, Leap + Bite in midair = 125 damage (75 normal); Blink + Swipe = 125 damage; Shadowstep + Swipe = 150 damage
Onos already has something similar to this in charge (landing a hit at full charge speed = 2x damage)
As far as focus goes, "double damage at half attack speed" always seemed boring, but extremly useful.
If focus were to be brought back, i would hope it would be along the lines of an additional effect from movement abilities, if only for skulks and fades.
That is, Leap + Bite in midair = 125 damage (75 normal); Blink + Swipe = 125 damage; Shadowstep + Swipe = 150 damage
Onos already has something similar to this in charge (landing a hit at full charge speed = 2x damage)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I like this!!