Wtf is wrong with camo
despair
Join Date: 2012-11-01 Member: 165746Members
Join Date: 2012-11-01 Member: 165746Members
Comments
Walking reduces your transparency. Its in the patch notes.
It's just as potent as before just takes a little bit more patience which honestly makes the ambushes much more successful anyway
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edits:
Lol at 17 disagrees. . .
As my view on the evolution hasn't changed since I posted this a week ago I can only hope that many of you have gotten better at using it since then
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If the lights were to go out or if you were sneaking in from behind or a side entrance It would probably work much better, but you can no longer go through the front door. Cammo is also useful as a gorge when in danger as it tends to activate quite quickly allowing you to hide.
The main benefit of Stealth evolutions in my opinion though is that they are dirt cheap, which could be very good if you are going for an early 2nd hive.
Before: full transparency while still and mobile.
Current: full transparency only while still.
>just as potent as before
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to make a shade hive at least worth using they should...
make silence give you an invisibility to observatories and scans provided you are stationary/walking
improve the effectiveness of shades vs arcs.
First off, if all things were equal, the ideal time to have camo for aliens would be right off the start. Since marines are weaker and they don't have observatories all over the map, aliens would have the advantage. The problem is that if you go camo first you are waiting for celerity/adren or carapace until the third hive.
Secondly, it changes the alien playstyle. You need an alien team that works better as a group and understands ambush gameplay. Without it they die too much and get rolled.
So since shade tends to be the third hive, camo is available in the late game when marines have plenty of observatories and the res to scan freely. So it's basically not much more than a novelty at this point.
We went though the same thing with sensory chambers in NS1. They used to be too weak to put up until hive three. Then they got buffed - with focus IIRC. All of a sudden sensory didn't suck that much anymore.
Shade changed the marine strat heavily....well until shade was reverted back to partially visible.
We never saw shade being used during the beta much...not until it actually cloaked you. Even then it was a risky strat and required a change in how aliens played too.
Well focus came about due to issues in marines constantly getting buffed making late game marines too hard to kill (sounds familiar).
Sensory still sucked...just made it somewhat useful as 3rd hive upgrade.
Issue really is with camo...90% or 99% it might as well be 0%.
I thought we went over this late in the beta before camo was actually made useful and was 100%.
The movement penalty for being cloaked was enough of a trade of...considering it has totally countered by a scan or obs.
Going shade early meant you where "all in" so to speak and had to get 3 hives if you wanted your onos to be able to survive in combat (a slow or weak onos dies quick).
By mid or late game its pretty much useless except for shits and giggles (cloaked onos in hall is still fun) and is really just a novelty. Its more important to get a 3rd hive for umbra than it is to get shade upgrades.
Camo needs to be buffed back to what it was...add in a motion tracker (in place of pistol) that a marine can get out and use. When in use it would reveal nearby aliens to any team mates within say 10 meter radius of user by showing the alien as a red dot on the minimap (no circles).
After all aliens come out of cloak when they attack or take damage...so really knowing an alien is at all is enough.
Camo was already garbage.
Now, perhaps the current camo needs tweaking etc, but it is clearly more fun to play with than the old one.
lol... I can't disagree with this more........ incoming disagree x10000
Perhaps the team doesn't know how to use shade effectively? Though I never liked using camo over silence, I still have no problem using camo for kills even with the nerf. Camo is all about ambushing the marines, and now you can't use it like a total noob to do a frontal assault (which I didn't agree with). In my opinion a frontal assault/attack should be done using silence. As a marine 60-70 percent of my combat awareness comes from sound. Without sound I'm lost and have no idea where the enemy is. A group of skulks using silence can easily flank and ambush/assault marines without them being able to react in time. Camo should be used for ambushing marines above doorways, they walk into a room and check all their corners... they think they're safe (they're not). Either way I like the change, and it's something people will have to get use to. I agree that the shade ink needs to work better vs. arcs, but the idea that cloak makes you total invisible even while scanned is dumb and would make scans useless.
With camo i find it's really important to be high up. Anything on the floor, or up to eye height, is in the marines awareness comfort zone--if you're already on the roof you're that extra fraction of a second out of the marines average cone of vision, which, hopefully, will give you enough time to be cloaked by the time he's actually looking at you.
I would like it if shift+ctrl made you walk slower than just shift as a skulk, so you could perhaps walk slow enough to get 90-95% vis.
True. Once you have the mechanics down of it it works perfectly.
You can't run around the level anymore full inviso while eating a sandwich and killing 4 marines by yourself anymore. Aliens now have job.
Allow the skulk to move at full speed, while having 80% camouflage. Then get a friend to just observe you as you run around, and maybe try to shoot you. I'm really confident that it would be difficult to track.
To add to Savants well thought out post, the only time realistically (in pub play) you are going to get camo is end game versus dug in marines. It does not help, and perhaps even hurts when newer players use it to sit outside the marine base with an onos in a corner. When i comm aliens i skip it and get silence to avoid the above scenario, since the nerf, i have never even been asked to get camo in 10-20 3 hive games.
That reminds me of my first encounter with this when it was first implemented was vs a Gorge on Descent. I heard the Gorge's footsteps and proceeded with three marines from "Gravity Control" towards their hive "Drone Bay". I didn't find a Gorge along the way and thought, lets spray a few bullets in random directions of where he could be hiding. Low and behold I found him. It must've been a scary moment for the Gorge leading up to this point as well. He was situated in the middle of the hallway and obviously couldn't move, while hoping we wouldn't touch/decloak him, otherwise we'd see him in any case :P
Sorry, but I can do this without camo. You would be surprised how easy you can hide in plain sight just by not moving on a ceiling. Multiple times, marines just run past me. But I must have been on their screen. You just need to remind yourself, that moving your mouse = movement. If you are perfectly still and not on an obvious / bright texture, you don't need camo.
Camo was good for two things:
- To close the distance to defending marines, who would otherwise just shoot you when you engage along these hallway they are watching.
- Sitting on the ground at an obvious marine-route and bite them at the moment they pass by.
The second is even possible now. The first one isn't viable anymore.
You really don't need camo to ambush. This is possible without it just fine. You needed it to close the distance to guarding marines.
On top of this, it was a high risk to go early camo. As others have stated a thousand times, you need cara and cele / adren more for your higher lifeforms. If marines could secure enough tech points with an obs, camo got absolutely useless.
I agree, that the old camo was unfair for the marine on the field. Increasing the com dependency of the marine team (that is already very high) more with camo was also a problem. But a flashlight-like device to uncloak aliens would have been a much better solution.
Camo was balanced in a high-risk-reward-sense for the aliens. Now it is just a high risk.
I think Camo will only become viable when it's combined with a new feature of sorts.
Or my idea, which is awesome: Old camo, except that if marines stand still they can see moving cloaked aliens partially. If they move, they can't see anything. Cat and mouse game.