Balance Test Changes - Constructive Skulk Movement Discussion

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Comments

  • KineKine Join Date: 2013-06-12 Member: 185541Members
    Cuel wrote: »
    Yeah let's invent the wheel twice. I gave my thoughts, I think it's fine. Isn't that enough?

    Unfortunately not. That is not an argument or does it provide any insight.
    Cuel wrote: »
    Your thoughts was that it felt like walking in mashed potatoes (It doesn't). It feels fluid and requires some practice. The speed increase in combination with harder control (and sounds) while moving fast is a good combination.

    So by your logic a harder control scheme and moving fast is a good combination? I am sure that you would be first in line for a brand new control scheme for your iPhone(you strike me as a mac person). The control scheme is made up of you, your cat(you strike me as a cat person), 3 bells, and 2 whistles. Now you can only use your iPhone on the back of a flat-bed truck going 70 miles an hour down the interstate by way of trusted kitty pal by communicating with the bells and whistles. Don't worry your cat won't quite get it at first (or the sounds), but it just requires some practice.


    Feel free to refer to my original argument above rather than selecting only the bit about mashed potatoes.
    Here I will even quote it for you so you don't have to use the cat thing:
    Kine wrote: »
    What I feel is wrong with the skulk movement changes:
    - The jump height is much too high, often when chaining wall jumps one ends up colliding with the ceiling unintentionally([Departures<->Strand]@Docking and [SubAccess<->SystemWaypointing@Veil] come to mind. When clinging to a ceiling your skulk model is rotated(Instead of your vision. I am assuming due to gimbal locking issues as to the best of my knowledge NS2 does not use Quaternions) in order to reflect the surface normal of whatever you are clinging too. Shouldn't your jump reflect this also propelling you downwards?
    - The jump acceleration/gravity feels much too sluggish. The skulk feels like it is generating aerodynamic lift, or you are bouncing on the moon(Maybe this could be justified somewhere like descent, but the gravitational acceleration seems to affect marines differently).
    - The inability to change direction/strafe in mid-air. Why is a human carrying a rifle, 4 clips of ammo, an axe/welder, 3 proximity explosives, full battle armor, a pistol, a vision obstructing helmet, and an entire jetpack while wearing combat boots exponentially more agile when changing direction than a genetically enhanced, purpose bred, small to medium dog sized, alien that can climb on the ceiling?
    - Why is that same marine able to have comparable speed on a flat surface to the "agile" alien. Has all of humanity been wiped out with only Kenya surviving to repopulate our numbers? The marines all look quite white to me.
    - The skulk feels like it would be better suited to a joystick control scheme as strafing has basically become non-existant.
    Cuel wrote: »
    A common thing for changes is that people in general do not like them at first

    Tell that to the American Indians. I am sure they weren't too happy about the "changes" being forced upon them when they were forced to relocate. But hey, they have a thriving and vast nation today right? Being unhappy about poor changes is more than justified.
  • KineKine Join Date: 2013-06-12 Member: 185541Members
    ezekel wrote: »
    @kine
    get my name out of your mouth, that entire server was shit talking me while I was trying to be as nice as possible and explain some of the changes

    So you agree that overwhelmingly people seemed to not enjoy the proposed state of the game. No it was not the first time for everyone. It was the first time on that server as the server admin had just finished installing it.
  • male_fatalitiesmale_fatalities ausns2.org Join Date: 2004-03-06 Member: 27185Members, Constellation
    This thread is gold!

    /Lock it Ironhorse
  • KineKine Join Date: 2013-06-12 Member: 185541Members
    edited June 2013
    Additionally, can the casual players stop making hypothesis regarding skulk movement in competitive play. Unless your a comp player, you have no idea so just shhh.... As gamers that play the game 1000x more than you we simply know better, so whatever point you think you are going to make we have already thought about and either decided its irrelevant or wrong.

    So by your logic you know better because you play the game 1000 times more than casuals like myself? I don't feel I am casual at all, average I would say. I spend about equal time commanding(I really like some of the alien commander changes by the way) as playing on the field. I am by no means the best NS2 player, but I feel I have played enough NS2 to have at least a basic grasp on the mechanics of the game.

    I looked up your steam profile from your signature because I was curious as to how much time you had spent playing NS2. "1000x" the time I have played seems like an insane amount of gameplay.

    I am assuming this is your steam profile based on your signature: Link

    Based on the screenshot here it appears that you have played 622 hours of Natural Selection 2.

    This is my steam profile: Link

    Based on the screenshot here it appears that I have played 684 hours of Natural Selection 2.

    Simple math would indicate that you have actually played 9.1% less or 2 days 14 hours less Natural Selection 2 than I, the casual player, has. Again, I feel I am probably average and you are probably above average.

    You had originally stated you play the game "1000x" more than I when in reality you have actually played the game "0.9094x" as much NS2 as I have. Probably just forgot to carry a 1 somewhere. It happens.

    Or could we just assume you are being a jerk on the internet because you think you are special? I really had hoped that some of the competitive(my words not yours) players would provide some constructive insight.

  • KineKine Join Date: 2013-06-12 Member: 185541Members
    IronHorse wrote: »
    Ah, ok.

    Yea I can't think of anything better than wallhopping lol..

    I disagree with "The result is a game that is more focused on just being able to use the controls than actually playing." i suppose..
    Because i only use the RMB and Spacebar to wallhop... no other controls are necessary?
    You even have jump queuing, feedback sounds, and you barely have to aim or be terribly close to a wall.

    Maybe it is the right course of action to take with some additional refinement, or maybe the maps just need to be adjusted slightly as this is a game altering change.
    I just know that the majority of non-elitist players I have encountered really don't like the changes to movement.

    Could you elaborate on jump queuing? Is that just some kind of input interpolation/caching that makes jumping from a wall more intuitive?
    Seeing as how gameplay code is written in Lua, making it by nature opensource, would you mind posting a snippet of what you are describing? I am a software engineer by trade, so it might be a little bit more clear that way.
  • ScatterScatter Join Date: 2012-09-02 Member: 157341Members, Squad Five Blue
    Bit odd to screenshot his profile, upload to imgur and then go on this A-spectrum rant in regards to the mild hyperbole that mf used. Very weird.



  • KineKine Join Date: 2013-06-12 Member: 185541Members
    edited June 2013
    Scatter wrote: »
    Bit odd to screenshot his profile, upload to imgur and then go on this A-spectrum rant in regards to the mild hyperbole that mf used. Very weird.

    After the trained cat post, I was feeling a bit frisky. What can I say?

    I am sure he is miles ahead of me in skill, but attempting to discredit my arguments based on inexperience in the form of time played is just silly and done out of ignorance.
  • MouseMouse The Lighter Side of Pessimism Join Date: 2002-03-02 Member: 263Members, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    I can't see this thread going anywhere worthwhile. Try to stay on topic in future.

    LOCKED
This discussion has been closed.