There is no hard coded system to prevent this outside of the normal voting and server moderation tools being properly utilized by players and admins to make sure the game stays fun for everyone. However, we should see the problem of new players getting repeatedly kicked after loading on reserved slot servers disappear as the new reserved slot system is already in place as of 252.
As always, veteran members of the NS2 community should do their best to be patient with the newbies as they learn the ropes. It's a tricky game with a lot of different game systems going on and a lot of complexity to learn.
Then sadly, this free weekend is going to fail. I think I'm going to stay out of it. I don't want to see ANOTHER round of veterans pub stomping. Ultimately I feel that is the #1 deterrent to retention. When veterans are getting outrageous K:D scores, it just ensures that new players don't stay. We've already seen this repetitively. Until UWE does something about this, the game is destined to die quickly. I guess we're in store for another round of 70:1 KD on pub stomping.
I totally agree with you on trying to help new players. But it doesn't take many veterans out to stroke their egos to ruin the game for many players.
I don't really agree with this point of view. In my past experience veteran players did not universally choose to play against rookies, but were distributed relatively evenly. Some stacking happens, but it's not very common at all. Besides, without people on their team that know what they're doing the new players don't have anyone to ask for advice or any examples to follow. If anything I'll be playing a lot more than usual over the weekend so that I can help people pick up the game for the first time.
We have the new tutorial system in place for the first time, too. There's honestly a lot of little things that should add up to making this weekend run much better than those previous (and I wouldn't say those "failed," either).
I don't really agree with this point of view. In my past experience veteran players did not universally choose to play against rookies, but were distributed relatively evenly
Visit the steam forums more often. Especially after sales. Really disgruntled players cite this as their #1 reason they don't like the game.
And it's already happening:
"didnt happen to me but ultimately i didnt find the gameplay to be all that fun, would be nice to have some servers with nothing but weekenders cause the regular players just destroy us"
Some stacking happens, but it's not very common at all. Besides, without people on their team that know what they're doing the new players don't have anyone to ask for advice or any examples to follow. If anything I'll be playing a lot more than usual over the weekend so that I can help people pick up the game for the first time.
I don't know about, but what I heard, the last two sales were full of pub stomping. Partially explains why the new player retention rate was less than 20% at a very generous estimate. It's probably more like 10%.
The latest updates made the game almost unplayable to me...
The performance didnt increase, it get much worse! Also i got kind of "input lags" which means the screens move after i moved my mouse... It´s impossible to hit something anymore!
Regarding the Reinforcement Program, I'm all for donating money to keep you guys in business and pumping out content. However before I invest in you, I want to know what my ROI will be over the next 12 months? How many more 'DLCs' do you guys plan on making before you move onto a new title?
NarfwakJoin Date: 2002-11-02Member: 5258Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica PT Lead, NS2 Community Developer
Well, I guess I'm just going to have to be a badass and stack the team with all the greens and lead them to victory over their oppressors. TO BATTLE RAAA
But yeah, please, guys, don't stack teams against brand new players. That's just mean.
Seen similar situations today when a guy ragequit the game when we were "spawn killing the hive". Me and one other guy were killing the eggs and their upgrades. Naturally this a frustrating experience and people clueless to the game think we're just spawn killing them.
I couldn't explain to the guy why we were doing this or he was already gone. Similar situation when I played alien and my team was not coordinated enough to push. Had to hit 2 ips alone at the same time, naturally resulting in spawn killing them until my team decided it was safe to go in.
In both cases I'm trying to end the game, not rank up kills. That being said, to those who play bf or cod this seems like a clear case of spawn killing.
As much as I'd love to see more people stick with this game, most of them are simply not cut out for these kind of hardcore games. Not saying the harsh ass kicking they receive in their first game is helping, it's really not.
No way to fix this I'm afraid unless you make rookie only servers where they end up getting an experience that's far away from what the game should be. No team work, clueless floor lerks and commanders who think it's tower defense.
The only thing that sort of comes close to a solution would be the mentor program. Actually having multiple mentors in every game being the commander and helping people out while making sure they do nothing that screws with the FPS gameplay.
A nice concept but not gonna work unless every veteran signs up and has the patience for it.
I'm always helping people out where I can, whether they listen or not is not always the case but I keep helping out wherever I can. But the moment I enter any sort of combat I will upset balance for the rookies. That being said I could do a lot more. I just don't always feel like taking a backseat role in such games. Commanding is nice and all but commanding rookies can get tiresome. Don't get me wrong some of them are great to play with and work with. But it can be tiresome when you end up in a game where nobody communicates back and saying their name along with an order followed with a waypoint and a please resulting in them running the other direction cause they be Casey Fucking Rayback.
No fixing the rookie unbalance I'm afraid. Just try not to stack wherever possible. Those games aren't half as bad if both teams have equal amount of veterans.
DFA is hosting a ROOKIES ONLY server for the weekend. We are going to be actively babysitting it so that any non-rookies will be kicked unless commanding.
Vets are welcome to make use of our ELITE NS2 server or primary DFA server instead.
DFA is hosting a ROOKIES ONLY server for the weekend. We are going to be actively babysitting it so that any non-rookies will be kicked unless commanding.
Vets are welcome to make use of our ELITE NS2 server or primary DFA server instead.
Thank you Dev team, for all your hard work!!!
This has been a fun journey since NS1!
This update is soo fun, these updates have been a nice evolution to see and be a part of.
killing a jetpacker earlier today while caught in my webs....priceless, he thought he could gl the hive-NOPE
I LOVE the new alien hive vision, I feel it's the best of both worlds.
I agree with Super_Gorge, lack of matchmaking is just a way to broadly sweep away huge portions of new players. Not to mention having imbalanced teams is match-ruining, rendering all content and balance tweaks moot.
Getting people to stick with a game that has problems like that was viable a few years ago, but nowadays people will instantly switch to their other five go-to games, games that are on sale, games that are free, or games that they bought but haven't tried yet.
You should post your "dream tier" ideas here, that's for sure. We'll see what can we do. More posts means more chance! It's tricky to make a new tier, so all help is much welcomed!
"I've donated 1000$ to Unknown Worlds Entertainment and all I got is this lousy T-shirt"
My personal dream tier:
The ability to have my steam avatar show up as decal on my shoulder pads.
None of that other stuff needed, just a custom decal on my SE Black Armour and I'm a happy little girl.
Would be worth ~40€ to me. The system is in place, let use it to it's full potential!
(I so much hoped that would be a standard feature sooner or later... gives the player models more "personality". Also clans could all display their logo, sponsor, etc.)
dePARAJoin Date: 2011-04-29Member: 96321Members, Squad Five Blue
Many players testing the game this weekend again *hopefully*
The more of these players buying the game helping UWE to finance theyr stuff.
But why the hell are they doing the same mistakes again and again and again.
- We still have the 32 clusterfuck servers in the serverbrowser
- The serverperformance should show the average performnace of the last hour, not from that moment you cklick on refresh
- New "skill system" is start in right direction but in the current state it should renamed in "stats padding system"
And again, green rookies get slaugtered on rubberbanding 5 tick servers.
Thats the way to bring more players the game. NOT
It's really unfortunate for UWE to shoot itself in the foot like this by releasing a major patch that hurts performance right before the free weekend because they needed to test the patch. I don't mind being turned into a beta tester, even without prior notice - whatever's best for NS2 in the long run is what I want, even if the game is glitchy for a little while. But for a game with system requirements that are already through the roof, this thing is just going to hemorrhage players during the free weekend. So many sales are going to be lost that it hurts to think about. People are going to quit the game after 5 minutes because they'll decide it can't run on their system. This is aside from all the normal problems with huge bad performance servers and stuff which even in the best of times make introducing people to NS2 kind of tough.
In ISE's video he has new icons for the hand grenades in his armory. In my armory the hand grenade icons are a rifle, a rifle butt, and a pistol. Anyone know more about this? I'd really rather have the grenade icons if possible, this is just confusing right now.
Agree, I understand UWE are small but the system specs are demanding for this game and the server specs are just ridiculous.
Games like TF2 where ISPs can host a good amount of servers on an average box specs, flood in the people!
In ISE's video he has new icons for the hand grenades in his armory. In my armory the hand grenade icons are a rifle, a rifle butt, and a pistol. Anyone know more about this? I'd really rather have the grenade icons if possible, this is just confusing right now.
DFA is hosting a ROOKIES ONLY server for the weekend. We are going to be actively babysitting it so that any non-rookies will be kicked unless commanding.
Vets are welcome to make use of our ELITE NS2 server or primary DFA server instead.
Brilliant idea. It may be worth posting this in the steam forums as well. At lot of the newer players will be discussing the game on those forums this weekend and may not find this info buried in this post. (If you havent of course done it already!)
Open rant to Unknownworlds Entertainment (mostly referred to as UW or "you" from this point on):
tl;dr? The less ranty and hopefully constructive advice is in bottom section.
I had to watch the "Reinforced program" video twice, just to make sure I wasn't imagining things.
In another world these updates could be called DLC expansions, they could be accessed by a season pass or through an in-game micro transaction
In a world where NS2 sells like CoD, yes. In a world where NS2 sells like NS2, no. People don't need Unknownworlds telling them how "amazing" they are for adding free content. Especially since I'm sure UW is more than aware that any attempt at paid DLC at this point would split the already small player base and kill the game.Sure, for a single player game concurrent player count is mostly irrelevant. NS2 isn't a single player game though, in fact its strictly on-line multiplayer.
No, UW didn't need to add any more than they promised. But I don't believe for a second that the expansions ware strictly a labor of love and not a calculated move to bring in more players (and sell more copies).
What they did need to do however, was fix that which was broken (and to this day, in many ways, still is). A lions share of the patches ware necessary performance and bugfixes.
I'm going to take a moment to quote my favorite line from the official wiki:
What are the system requirements?
The target specifications for Version 1.0 are 1.2 GHz Processor, 256MB RAM, a DirectX 9 level graphics card, Windows Vista/2000/XP, Steam, mouse, keyboard and of course, an internet connection. We are working hard to make sure NS2 runs well on average hardware without having to upgrade your machine!
Ah, brings a nostalgic tear to my eye when I remember that this is what greeted NS2 hopefuls on the preorder page back in 2009 (and no, its still not updated in the wiki).
Now back to my rant:
What I find rather amusing is the part about not wanting micro transactions, despite the "Reinforced" program being just that. A model, where you "buy" nothing or next to nothing.
Sure, if you want to call this compensation for providing a free service, I assume you intend to split profits from this venture (if any) with your volunteers, you know, all the guys and gals that use their free time and resources (electricity costs money, as you aptly pointed out in the video), to help you. Sounds fair, right?
Just to be clear, that isn't a serious suggestion, because I'm almost certain that these people wouldn't take a cent from you, even if you tried to shove it in their hands. Thats the kind of dedicated fanbase this game has, people that are willing to work for free, ignore glaring problems and defend any terrible decisions UW makes. I'm very disappointed... So very, very disappointed, that UW would exploit this dedication in such an ugly manner. Shame on you Unknownworlds Entertainment.
The sad part is that I really do like the UW team (they seem like a bunch of top lads, dedicated to keeping their company afloat), and I absolutely love the NS concept. Its just so heartbreaking to see UW consistently shoot itself in its collective foot.
Now, thats my rant done, now for something constructive:
Heres what I propose. You already have a framework in place for cosmetic changes to specific player models. Why not roll with it. If done right (no glowing skulk models), you could easily pull off cosmetic micro transactions. I'm sure loads of people would be willing to pay for a unique marine skin, special taunts, alternative command console voices etc. Premium cosmetic changes for a few bucks, for personal satisfaction or showing off.
In a world where NS2 sells like CoD, yes. In a world where NS2 sells like NS2, no. People don't need Unknownworlds telling them how "amazing" they are for adding free content. Especially since I'm sure UW is more than aware that any attempt at paid DLC at this point would split the already small player base and kill the game.Sure, for a single player game concurrent player count is mostly irrelevant. NS2 isn't a single player game though, in fact its strictly on-line multiplayer.
At release, NS2 sold inordinately well. Like, seriously. For its price and its indie status, it sold unimaginable numbers of copies. UWE were perfectly within their rights to say "good game guys, lets all go buy yachts and fuck off, let these nerds play their games". But they didn't. You think all of this is just a calculated action to get more money? I'm 90% sure an EA analyst would have advised to cut almost all support for the game, and to pull almost all staff off the project immediately after the initial boom in sales.
UWE didn't. So yeah, pretty sure that makes it a labour of love.
At release, NS2 sold inordinately well. Like, seriously. For its price and its indie status, it sold unimaginable numbers of copies. UWE were perfectly within their rights to say "good game guys, lets all go buy yachts and fuck off, let these nerds play their games". But they didn't. You think all of this is just a calculated action to get more money? I'm 90% sure an EA analyst would have advised to cut almost all support for the game, and to pull almost all staff off the project immediately after the initial boom in sales.
UWE didn't. So yeah, pretty sure that makes it a labour of love.
I may have agreed if this was a single player title or at the very least had a single-player campaign. In short, if it was a game that didn't require an active userbase to continue selling. You think NS2 generated incredible profit with its initial sales? I highly doubt it, I also stress the word "profit". Writing their own engine, is bound to have been a huge investment and quite a gamble. Theres also the matter of brand awareness. NS2 and its popularity will have a massive impact on UWs next title, having a broken strictly multiplayer game that fizzled out after short period of time on their resume isn't good advertising, so they keep on fighting. working on fixes, rebalancing and pumping out content. They need to make NS2 as successful as possible, not only to generate immediate profits, but also to strengthen UW as a brand. I can only guess, and I'm not saying there was no "love" involved in the creative process, but if you think that it was the only reason, or even the main driving force behind it theres a good chance you'd be very disappointed.
Anyway, I don't want to start an argument here. I needed to vent stuff out, and I did. Everyone else has the right to their own opinion.
Comments
I don't really agree with this point of view. In my past experience veteran players did not universally choose to play against rookies, but were distributed relatively evenly. Some stacking happens, but it's not very common at all. Besides, without people on their team that know what they're doing the new players don't have anyone to ask for advice or any examples to follow. If anything I'll be playing a lot more than usual over the weekend so that I can help people pick up the game for the first time.
We have the new tutorial system in place for the first time, too. There's honestly a lot of little things that should add up to making this weekend run much better than those previous (and I wouldn't say those "failed," either).
Visit the steam forums more often. Especially after sales. Really disgruntled players cite this as their #1 reason they don't like the game.
And it's already happening:
"didnt happen to me but ultimately i didnt find the gameplay to be all that fun, would be nice to have some servers with nothing but weekenders cause the regular players just destroy us"
I don't know about, but what I heard, the last two sales were full of pub stomping. Partially explains why the new player retention rate was less than 20% at a very generous estimate. It's probably more like 10%.
The performance didnt increase, it get much worse! Also i got kind of "input lags" which means the screens move after i moved my mouse... It´s impossible to hit something anymore!
But yeah, please, guys, don't stack teams against brand new players. That's just mean.
I couldn't explain to the guy why we were doing this or he was already gone. Similar situation when I played alien and my team was not coordinated enough to push. Had to hit 2 ips alone at the same time, naturally resulting in spawn killing them until my team decided it was safe to go in.
In both cases I'm trying to end the game, not rank up kills. That being said, to those who play bf or cod this seems like a clear case of spawn killing.
As much as I'd love to see more people stick with this game, most of them are simply not cut out for these kind of hardcore games. Not saying the harsh ass kicking they receive in their first game is helping, it's really not.
No way to fix this I'm afraid unless you make rookie only servers where they end up getting an experience that's far away from what the game should be. No team work, clueless floor lerks and commanders who think it's tower defense.
The only thing that sort of comes close to a solution would be the mentor program. Actually having multiple mentors in every game being the commander and helping people out while making sure they do nothing that screws with the FPS gameplay.
A nice concept but not gonna work unless every veteran signs up and has the patience for it.
I'm always helping people out where I can, whether they listen or not is not always the case but I keep helping out wherever I can. But the moment I enter any sort of combat I will upset balance for the rookies. That being said I could do a lot more. I just don't always feel like taking a backseat role in such games. Commanding is nice and all but commanding rookies can get tiresome. Don't get me wrong some of them are great to play with and work with. But it can be tiresome when you end up in a game where nobody communicates back and saying their name along with an order followed with a waypoint and a please resulting in them running the other direction cause they be Casey Fucking Rayback.
No fixing the rookie unbalance I'm afraid. Just try not to stack wherever possible. Those games aren't half as bad if both teams have equal amount of veterans.
Vets are welcome to make use of our ELITE NS2 server or primary DFA server instead.
glad to hear!
This has been a fun journey since NS1!
This update is soo fun, these updates have been a nice evolution to see and be a part of.
killing a jetpacker earlier today while caught in my webs....priceless, he thought he could gl the hive-NOPE
I LOVE the new alien hive vision, I feel it's the best of both worlds.
Getting people to stick with a game that has problems like that was viable a few years ago, but nowadays people will instantly switch to their other five go-to games, games that are on sale, games that are free, or games that they bought but haven't tried yet.
"I've donated 1000$ to Unknown Worlds Entertainment and all I got is this lousy T-shirt"
The ability to have my steam avatar show up as decal on my shoulder pads.
None of that other stuff needed, just a custom decal on my SE Black Armour and I'm a happy little girl.
Would be worth ~40€ to me. The system is in place, let use it to it's full potential!
(I so much hoped that would be a standard feature sooner or later... gives the player models more "personality". Also clans could all display their logo, sponsor, etc.)
(http://www.wolfire.com/overgrowth)
The more of these players buying the game helping UWE to finance theyr stuff.
But why the hell are they doing the same mistakes again and again and again.
- We still have the 32 clusterfuck servers in the serverbrowser
- The serverperformance should show the average performnace of the last hour, not from that moment you cklick on refresh
- New "skill system" is start in right direction but in the current state it should renamed in "stats padding system"
And again, green rookies get slaugtered on rubberbanding 5 tick servers.
Thats the way to bring more players the game. NOT
This.. Working on server performance should be at the top on the to do list.
Games like TF2 where ISPs can host a good amount of servers on an average box specs, flood in the people!
Brilliant idea. It may be worth posting this in the steam forums as well. At lot of the newer players will be discussing the game on those forums this weekend and may not find this info buried in this post. (If you havent of course done it already!)
tl;dr? The less ranty and hopefully constructive advice is in bottom section.
I had to watch the "Reinforced program" video twice, just to make sure I wasn't imagining things.
In a world where NS2 sells like CoD, yes. In a world where NS2 sells like NS2, no. People don't need Unknownworlds telling them how "amazing" they are for adding free content. Especially since I'm sure UW is more than aware that any attempt at paid DLC at this point would split the already small player base and kill the game.Sure, for a single player game concurrent player count is mostly irrelevant. NS2 isn't a single player game though, in fact its strictly on-line multiplayer.
No, UW didn't need to add any more than they promised. But I don't believe for a second that the expansions ware strictly a labor of love and not a calculated move to bring in more players (and sell more copies).
What they did need to do however, was fix that which was broken (and to this day, in many ways, still is). A lions share of the patches ware necessary performance and bugfixes.
I'm going to take a moment to quote my favorite line from the official wiki:
Ah, brings a nostalgic tear to my eye when I remember that this is what greeted NS2 hopefuls on the preorder page back in 2009 (and no, its still not updated in the wiki).
Now back to my rant:
What I find rather amusing is the part about not wanting micro transactions, despite the "Reinforced" program being just that. A model, where you "buy" nothing or next to nothing.
Sure, if you want to call this compensation for providing a free service, I assume you intend to split profits from this venture (if any) with your volunteers, you know, all the guys and gals that use their free time and resources (electricity costs money, as you aptly pointed out in the video), to help you. Sounds fair, right?
Just to be clear, that isn't a serious suggestion, because I'm almost certain that these people wouldn't take a cent from you, even if you tried to shove it in their hands. Thats the kind of dedicated fanbase this game has, people that are willing to work for free, ignore glaring problems and defend any terrible decisions UW makes. I'm very disappointed... So very, very disappointed, that UW would exploit this dedication in such an ugly manner. Shame on you Unknownworlds Entertainment.
The sad part is that I really do like the UW team (they seem like a bunch of top lads, dedicated to keeping their company afloat), and I absolutely love the NS concept. Its just so heartbreaking to see UW consistently shoot itself in its collective foot.
Now, thats my rant done, now for something constructive:
Heres what I propose. You already have a framework in place for cosmetic changes to specific player models. Why not roll with it. If done right (no glowing skulk models), you could easily pull off cosmetic micro transactions. I'm sure loads of people would be willing to pay for a unique marine skin, special taunts, alternative command console voices etc. Premium cosmetic changes for a few bucks, for personal satisfaction or showing off.
At release, NS2 sold inordinately well. Like, seriously. For its price and its indie status, it sold unimaginable numbers of copies. UWE were perfectly within their rights to say "good game guys, lets all go buy yachts and fuck off, let these nerds play their games". But they didn't. You think all of this is just a calculated action to get more money? I'm 90% sure an EA analyst would have advised to cut almost all support for the game, and to pull almost all staff off the project immediately after the initial boom in sales.
UWE didn't. So yeah, pretty sure that makes it a labour of love.
I may have agreed if this was a single player title or at the very least had a single-player campaign. In short, if it was a game that didn't require an active userbase to continue selling. You think NS2 generated incredible profit with its initial sales? I highly doubt it, I also stress the word "profit". Writing their own engine, is bound to have been a huge investment and quite a gamble. Theres also the matter of brand awareness. NS2 and its popularity will have a massive impact on UWs next title, having a broken strictly multiplayer game that fizzled out after short period of time on their resume isn't good advertising, so they keep on fighting. working on fixes, rebalancing and pumping out content. They need to make NS2 as successful as possible, not only to generate immediate profits, but also to strengthen UW as a brand. I can only guess, and I'm not saying there was no "love" involved in the creative process, but if you think that it was the only reason, or even the main driving force behind it theres a good chance you'd be very disappointed.
Anyway, I don't want to start an argument here. I needed to vent stuff out, and I did. Everyone else has the right to their own opinion.