Lifeform timing hints (for rookies)
aeroripper
Join Date: 2005-02-25 Member: 42471NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
Join Date: 2005-02-25 Member: 42471NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, Constellation
I made a mockup some time ago with the idea of giving "lifeform timing hints" for aliens. Essentially, its primary use would be for rookies to notice when they have enough res to evolve to a higher lifeform. Figured with the renewed focus on rookie experience, this might be worth mentioning again:
https://trello-attachments.s3.amazonaws.com/53cc2295a512e30c4b5f296c/541c82f7270792c37b4d8c28/1024x579/edc056531548db2a5278a6a6645069e6/pres.png
https://trello-attachments.s3.amazonaws.com/53cc2295a512e30c4b5f296c/541c82f7270792c37b4d8c28/1024x579/edc056531548db2a5278a6a6645069e6/pres.png
Comments
Here's my implementation I thought of right away after reading this for brainstorm purposes:
I thought of an addition to the hive UI that all players would see, it could even disapear after the initial lifeform timings. Basically you could have a picture of a lerk and next to it it would be a timer starting at 5:00. When you get a 2nd res node it would update to the remaining time with 2 res nodes (2:30 if it was still at the beginning which is impossible) and so on. Same with fades and onos. This way you have your hive status and your teams general status! The clock updating with res noses would look a lottle confusing at first to rookies, but it's a straightforward calculation that shouldn't be hard to get.
This would really help lerks tame themselves for that crucial 30s before fades where they always suicide lol
I think both these would work great together.
edit: I didn't mean this as a rookie idea
(Where arguably, it needs to be more obvious that you already have 3 gorges)
Even I often go past the necessary Pres to purchase something before realizing it. A subtle popup in the same vein as upgrade research notifications, but in a different area.
Your image would be great as an animation that shrinks back towards the Pres number area.
That said, the implementation which you describe seems alright. I would suggest a teeny tiny indicator in the shape of the profile of each lifeform (or the highest costing available) to the right of the resource ticker or dots. Or even replace that weird resource symbol with the profile of the lifeform. I think the profile would work best as it's clean and simple, and it's already used on the Hive UI status.
Honestly, though, visuals are just that, visuals. You may want to do a distinct sound effect instead as then a player wouldn't have to look for it, or have their screen cluttered. They would just know. A little Gorge taunt or whatever, or a weird UI sound that's unused (I think there are many).
In addition: I think after playing the Overwatch beta (of which there was tons of talk and debate), I think this could be implemented with a lovely complementary system inside the buy menu:
You could probably extend this logic to Onos as well, but probably not Gorge as it is a support lifeform which exists as a solution to weird strategies, sometimes map based, and isn't really as much of a necessity.
You can also extend this logic as a function of player numbers. Starting with, of course, 6 players on a team is the standard competitive 2 Lerk, 2 Fade play.
That would help to prevent the all classics:
- Half the team goes gorge at min 0
- never knowing if someone is going to fade (even if you ask them!!)
- evolving Fade and a couple minutes later other 2 players evolve fade, having 0 players saving for onos...
Players of League of Legends have found a way to "bully" rookies into learning the meta and make them write their role and lane in text before the game start. If two players want the same it is usually solved in a childish way of "I said it first", but the point is that the argument is solved.
No one does that here. Doing that by text when your team is of 8 people or more could be chaotic but the icons could help a lot.
Maybe make it not possible to change the icon after the first minute of play, so people will be a little ashamed of not going with the lifeform that they announced unless it is really necessary.
@Zavaro The idea of "Too few/many lerks" seems nice. But the problem is that the meta of NS2 is very dependant of the number of players on the team. Things change a lot in each different server playercount
TL;DR: make an option in the scoreboard to select your lifeform. And when you get the pres for YOUR selected lifeform then is when it appears the "lifeform timing hint"
yeah I think that you have something like that in your server, but unfortunately I have never played there...
I'm just a simple european guy
Could you please explain the details of your implementation?
I normally don't wait for abilities for any lifeform unless I'm only 1 or two pres away (ESPECIALLY ONOS), but I know a lot of people do feel like they need to wait.
Yeah, I see how this would be an issue. I always go Lerk and Onos as soon as I can, but wait with fades until I can get celerity - or at least whatever other upgrade is available.
Dunno, make it configurable and default to base price + 1 up?
I won't refade with JPs up until I have res for celerity with it, unless we'll lose anyway if I don't try
Lots of classes in independent thinking and strict training in being rebellious
It's time to emotionally uninstall.
I like the idea of life form reminders but you got to be careful. You don't want every rookie going lerk.
Even the buy menu swapping positions of the gorge and skulk has resulted in no difference.. I still see 3/6 go gorge frequently.
People are going to choose what to do with their resources no matter what... best you could do is remind them that the choice exists and clearly explain the roles.
59% of games occur on rookie only servers where we don't play or observe very often.
If my fear is foundationless, so is the counter argument. We don't know how the buy menu change effected rookies.
You are a player who has a lot of experience with rookies, but you got most of that before the buy menu change.
I don't think a reminder would effect veterans much if at all, but it should effect rookies the most. I think my fear should at least be in consideration, but not a determinate of a decision. I stand by my point that lifeforms reminder should be implemented with greater care.
It would affect me every now and then. Also, you could counteract the problem by adding a little text "x res until fade/onos"
That's a nice idea, too.
ikr.
Countdown timers next to the lifeforms would be great. I did wonder though how it would work. Would it just be based on the current number of RTs you have (and jump up/down as appropriate, based on that?)... would it count down to when you have the minimum res, or when you have enough to afford upgrades as well?
It would also jump around based on if you spend res early... It seems like it could be very confusing to see.
Maybe implement it to dynamically adjust the timer whenever you click on an upgrade or not? , you could even forgo a numerical system and use something similar to parasite mechanic you recently put in @remi
Thank you for adding to my point. It would effect you sometimes, but not often. All I am really saying is that doing lifeform reminders needs to be done in an intelligent way. There are many ways to do it, and the developers need to find the best one. "X res until fade/onos" is just another way to go about doing this and it the kind of consideration that I think is needed.