I love this game but the Sea Dragon is a bit too much for my taste ..

ZardZard France Join Date: 2016-08-12 Member: 221226Members
I think this game is unique and really well made. The team studied extensively aquatic life, biomes, colour patterns, etc... The result is a believable alien ecosystem, that could have evolved on earth with the right parameters. That realism makes this game so good, why ? Because it's immersive. You really feel like an intruder in an uncharted, living and breathing world.

Now that sea dragon.. Well that's another story. Throwing fire with his mouth like a high fantasy dragon ? And... underwater ? That monster also happens to be stuck in a cave.. how does it even feed ? All those things require too much suspension of incredulity for me. I don't know if other people share my opinion but I would have preferred to have a believable giant sea creature. Its size doesn't seem absurd to me, I can believe it. But throwing fire like a magical being, that's really killing it for me.
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Comments

  • CaptagearCaptagear Join Date: 2016-08-28 Member: 221804Members
    "spits magma rocks and incendiary matter when prey is fleeing" not fire ;)
  • ZardZard France Join Date: 2016-08-12 Member: 221226Members
    Captagear wrote: »
    "spits magma rocks and incendiary matter when prey is fleeing" not fire ;)

    Well, I'm not sure that sounds more believable
  • CaptagearCaptagear Join Date: 2016-08-28 Member: 221804Members
    I don't know, will have to see in game for myself before I form an opinion. :)
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    edited September 2016
    I think the biggest concern would indeed be "how does it even feed ?"

    It's like 2.5x the size of a blue whale (krill vacuum cleaner). The size itself ain't an issue, I mean it is an oceanic planet. But where's the damn food, it looks carnivorous, but not a krill type filtration machine the blue whale is... So what exactly is it feeding on?


    maybe it has a kitchen in it's home we've not seen yet and is just pretending to be just another animal
  • EnglishInfidelEnglishInfidel Canada Join Date: 2016-07-04 Member: 219533Members
    I'm with you @Zard, but for me it's the all together too human-like arms that make me cringe.

    I know, evolution, and alien evolution at that, but it's just weird.

    By the way, big fan of Burial myself. B)
  • ZardZard France Join Date: 2016-08-12 Member: 221226Members
    Obraxis wrote: »
    We based the 'fire' off molten metal, which looks similar to fire when underwater.

    Thanks, I see what you mean but in my opinion that's not really more credible to have a creature expel such materials. I'm sure you wanted this creature to be as scary as possible (which by its size is already terrifying) but that might be too fantastic for me. I think the Reaper exemplifies extremely well what would be a nightmarish sea creature while being totally believable. Crabsquids are also amazing in that department

    Well it's still a great game for me and I can only congratulate Unknown Worlds for the accomplishment. But this sea dragon just feels somewhat out of place compared to the realistic feeling of the game which imo is its strongest point. Just my feedback though
  • LocketWraithLocketWraith Join Date: 2016-08-26 Member: 221733Members
    You have to admit, The Sea Dragon is pretty badass.
  • RainstormRainstorm Montreal (Quebec) Join Date: 2015-12-15 Member: 210003Members
    If ya think the Sea Dragon is a tad weeee bit extreme, wait till ya come across the Sea Emperor!
    That thing may not barf molten lava but it'll surely make you reclaim that body fluid :smiley:
    Dont forget to turn on that chemical taste neutralizer :wink:
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    Can we just stop for a second and remember that this is a game? Its a Sea DRAGON. Where else would you stick it besides the place with all the lava and fire???
  • KaybeKaybe Join Date: 2016-09-19 Member: 222425Members
    A couple of quick notes:

    The dinosaurs were really quite massive and lived in an environment that was much hotter and more humid than present day Earth. Granted, that's air vs water heat.

    Second: Are you sure it's a naturally evolved creature? Does it even need to eat in the conventional sense? Maybe there is a story behind it?
  • AstromancerAstromancer Texas Join Date: 2016-05-13 Member: 216713Members
    To pretty much everyone here trying to make a "realistic" point. This is a sci-fi game, not an "ultra realistic physics game"
  • ShuryCZShuryCZ Czech Republic Join Date: 2015-07-07 Member: 206047Members
    Anyway... The warpers are under the radar of "this is not realistic". Hell, they can teleport! From what I have heard, to open "worm-holes", an unimaginable amount of energy would be required. These fellas do it without breaking a sweat :D
  • DagothUrDagothUr Florida Join Date: 2016-07-12 Member: 220125Members
    To pretty much everyone here trying to make a "realistic" point. This is a sci-fi game, not an "ultra realistic physics game"

    You're right, and that's why I plan on defeating the Sea Dragon by kiting it with Magic Missile spells from atop my flying carpet, while my Ring of Fire resistance protects me from it's attacks.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    DagothUr wrote: »
    To pretty much everyone here trying to make a "realistic" point. This is a sci-fi game, not an "ultra realistic physics game"

    You're right, and that's why I plan on defeating the Sea Dragon by kiting it with Magic Missile spells from atop my flying carpet, while my Ring of Fire resistance protects me from it's attacks.

    'It's not ultra-realistic, so it has to be an MMORPG!!!" Seriously? I know it may be sarcasm, but the underlying point is still there.
  • LonnehartLonnehart Guam Join Date: 2016-06-20 Member: 218816Members
    Well... it is an alien planet. You can't expect the lifeforms to behave like the ones on Earth.
  • RalijRalij US Join Date: 2016-05-20 Member: 217092Members
    To pretty much everyone here trying to make a "realistic" point. This is a sci-fi game, not an "ultra realistic physics game"

    Sci-fi requires an element of realism or believability with explainable physics/chemistry/whatever to back it up. If it doesn't it falls under science fantasy and not science fiction. Personally, the molten metal spewing sea lizard doesn't bother me in the least, but I tend to have a preference for fantasy over science fiction anyway.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    sayerulz wrote: »
    Lonnehart wrote: »
    Well... it is an alien planet. You can't expect the lifeforms to behave like the ones on Earth.

    But you can expect them to obey the laws of physics.

    Perhaps the SD has much stronger bones and thrives in heat like some bacteria.
  • sayerulzsayerulz oregon Join Date: 2015-04-15 Member: 203493Members
    sayerulz wrote: »
    Lonnehart wrote: »
    Well... it is an alien planet. You can't expect the lifeforms to behave like the ones on Earth.

    But you can expect them to obey the laws of physics.

    Perhaps the SD has much stronger bones and thrives in heat like some bacteria.

    I defer to dagothUR's excellent explanation of why that's not how that works.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    edited September 2016
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    Lonnehart wrote: »
    Well... it is an alien planet. You can't expect the lifeforms to behave like the ones on Earth.

    But you can expect them to obey the laws of physics.

    Perhaps the SD has much stronger bones and thrives in heat like some bacteria.

    I defer to dagothUR's excellent explanation of why that's not how that works.

    Which is literally what I was arguing against. He said it would die due to its size and the heat. I said, perhaps it thrives in heat, like some Extremophile bacteria, such as a Thermophlie, an organism that can thrive at temperatures between 45–122 °C. And yes, I know it's not bacteria, but it could've evolved those traits. And I refer to my previous post, where I ask why it even matters. Its the Dragon. It goes in the place with the lava.
  • sayerulzsayerulz oregon Join Date: 2015-04-15 Member: 203493Members
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    Lonnehart wrote: »
    Well... it is an alien planet. You can't expect the lifeforms to behave like the ones on Earth.

    But you can expect them to obey the laws of physics.

    Perhaps the SD has much stronger bones and thrives in heat like some bacteria.

    I defer to dagothUR's excellent explanation of why that's not how that works.

    Which is literally what I was arguing against. He said it would die due to its size and the heat. I said, perhaps it thrives in heat, like some Extremophile bacteria, such as a Thermophlie, an organism that can thrive at temperatures between 45–122 °C. And yes, I know it's not bacteria, but it could've evolved those traits. And I refer to my previous post, where I ask why it even matters. Its the Dragon. It goes in the place with the lava.

    And where does it get it's food? It's jaw is clearly meant for attacking things not too far off it's own size, and yet there is nothing anywhere near it that even approaches that size.

    Also, if you ask me, any decent fantasy does not have dragons living in a volcano just because they breath fire.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    Lonnehart wrote: »
    Well... it is an alien planet. You can't expect the lifeforms to behave like the ones on Earth.

    But you can expect them to obey the laws of physics.

    Perhaps the SD has much stronger bones and thrives in heat like some bacteria.

    I defer to dagothUR's excellent explanation of why that's not how that works.

    Which is literally what I was arguing against. He said it would die due to its size and the heat. I said, perhaps it thrives in heat, like some Extremophile bacteria, such as a Thermophlie, an organism that can thrive at temperatures between 45–122 °C. And yes, I know it's not bacteria, but it could've evolved those traits. And I refer to my previous post, where I ask why it even matters. Its the Dragon. It goes in the place with the lava.

    And where does it get it's food? It's jaw is clearly meant for attacking things not too far off it's own size, and yet there is nothing anywhere near it that even approaches that size.

    Also, if you ask me, any decent fantasy does not have dragons living in a volcano just because they breath fire.

    Maybe the swarms of creatures in the ILZ? It could just have those giant teeth for defense. Most fantasies have dragons in volcanoes because they like heat. Sound familiar? Not all dragons even breathe fire, so yes, it has nothing to do with that. It does have something to with the fact that its the Sea DRAGON, and if it were anywhere else people would wonder why it isn't in the Lava biome.
  • RalijRalij US Join Date: 2016-05-20 Member: 217092Members
    Fantasy gets away with it because its fantasy. The only reasoning you need in a fantasy setting is: because magic.

    Couldn't the Dragon eat the lava lizard things? Or those small energy suckers that cling all over your cyclops? It's teeth are pretty clearly carnivorous so that probably rules out feeding on chemicals and an symbiotic relationship with bacteria is rather unlikely for something that size.

    I wonder if there is a reason that there seem to be only bacteria and other tiny organisms that can survive extreme heat and nothing larger? Surely, if it just had to do with skeleton structure or internal combustion there would be a potential evolutionary workaround given its worked around ever other environmental block. I guess the rules wouldn't necessarily apply, but there needs to be some sort of bridge between the two for it to work.
  • sayerulzsayerulz oregon Join Date: 2015-04-15 Member: 203493Members
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    Lonnehart wrote: »
    Well... it is an alien planet. You can't expect the lifeforms to behave like the ones on Earth.

    But you can expect them to obey the laws of physics.

    Perhaps the SD has much stronger bones and thrives in heat like some bacteria.

    I defer to dagothUR's excellent explanation of why that's not how that works.

    Which is literally what I was arguing against. He said it would die due to its size and the heat. I said, perhaps it thrives in heat, like some Extremophile bacteria, such as a Thermophlie, an organism that can thrive at temperatures between 45–122 °C. And yes, I know it's not bacteria, but it could've evolved those traits. And I refer to my previous post, where I ask why it even matters. Its the Dragon. It goes in the place with the lava.

    And where does it get it's food? It's jaw is clearly meant for attacking things not too far off it's own size, and yet there is nothing anywhere near it that even approaches that size.

    Also, if you ask me, any decent fantasy does not have dragons living in a volcano just because they breath fire.

    Maybe the swarms of creatures in the ILZ? It could just have those giant teeth for defense. Most fantasies have dragons in volcanoes because they like heat. Sound familiar? Not all dragons even breathe fire, so yes, it has nothing to do with that. It does have something to with the fact that its the Sea DRAGON, and if it were anywhere else people would wonder why it isn't in the Lava biome.

    I think, perhaps, that we have been reading different fantasy. But if the teeth are for defense, then defense from WHAT? There's NOTHING down there big enough for teeth like that to be necessary or even effective. Try killing a housefly with a broadsword and you will have some idea of how useful teeth like that are down there.
  • dealwithitdogdealwithitdog Texas Join Date: 2016-06-09 Member: 218343Members
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    Lonnehart wrote: »
    Well... it is an alien planet. You can't expect the lifeforms to behave like the ones on Earth.

    But you can expect them to obey the laws of physics.

    Perhaps the SD has much stronger bones and thrives in heat like some bacteria.

    I defer to dagothUR's excellent explanation of why that's not how that works.

    Which is literally what I was arguing against. He said it would die due to its size and the heat. I said, perhaps it thrives in heat, like some Extremophile bacteria, such as a Thermophlie, an organism that can thrive at temperatures between 45–122 °C. And yes, I know it's not bacteria, but it could've evolved those traits. And I refer to my previous post, where I ask why it even matters. Its the Dragon. It goes in the place with the lava.

    And where does it get it's food? It's jaw is clearly meant for attacking things not too far off it's own size, and yet there is nothing anywhere near it that even approaches that size.

    Also, if you ask me, any decent fantasy does not have dragons living in a volcano just because they breath fire.

    Maybe the swarms of creatures in the ILZ? It could just have those giant teeth for defense. Most fantasies have dragons in volcanoes because they like heat. Sound familiar? Not all dragons even breathe fire, so yes, it has nothing to do with that. It does have something to with the fact that its the Sea DRAGON, and if it were anywhere else people would wonder why it isn't in the Lava biome.

    I think, perhaps, that we have been reading different fantasy. But if the teeth are for defense, then defense from WHAT? There's NOTHING down there big enough for teeth like that to be necessary or even effective. Try killing a housefly with a broadsword and you will have some idea of how useful teeth like that are down there.

    Perhaps, oh I dunno, the OTHER massive Sea Dragon with huge teeth? They could be territorial, and if one encroaches on the other's territory, they fight for it.
  • sayerulzsayerulz oregon Join Date: 2015-04-15 Member: 203493Members
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    sayerulz wrote: »
    Lonnehart wrote: »
    Well... it is an alien planet. You can't expect the lifeforms to behave like the ones on Earth.

    But you can expect them to obey the laws of physics.

    Perhaps the SD has much stronger bones and thrives in heat like some bacteria.

    I defer to dagothUR's excellent explanation of why that's not how that works.

    Which is literally what I was arguing against. He said it would die due to its size and the heat. I said, perhaps it thrives in heat, like some Extremophile bacteria, such as a Thermophlie, an organism that can thrive at temperatures between 45–122 °C. And yes, I know it's not bacteria, but it could've evolved those traits. And I refer to my previous post, where I ask why it even matters. Its the Dragon. It goes in the place with the lava.

    And where does it get it's food? It's jaw is clearly meant for attacking things not too far off it's own size, and yet there is nothing anywhere near it that even approaches that size.

    Also, if you ask me, any decent fantasy does not have dragons living in a volcano just because they breath fire.

    Maybe the swarms of creatures in the ILZ? It could just have those giant teeth for defense. Most fantasies have dragons in volcanoes because they like heat. Sound familiar? Not all dragons even breathe fire, so yes, it has nothing to do with that. It does have something to with the fact that its the Sea DRAGON, and if it were anywhere else people would wonder why it isn't in the Lava biome.

    I think, perhaps, that we have been reading different fantasy. But if the teeth are for defense, then defense from WHAT? There's NOTHING down there big enough for teeth like that to be necessary or even effective. Try killing a housefly with a broadsword and you will have some idea of how useful teeth like that are down there.

    Perhaps, oh I dunno, the OTHER massive Sea Dragon with huge teeth? They could be territorial, and if one encroaches on the other's territory, they fight for it.

    Territorial behavior has some requirements for it to be at all practical. Primarily, food needs to be abundant and concentrated in certain areas. If food is spread evenly everywhere, there is simply no point in fighting over territory. One stretch of sea is as good as another, so if your competitor is one place, you simply go somewhere else. Territorial behavior will also not evolve if there is very little food available. Fighting members of your own species takes a lot of energy, energy that could be better used hunting what little prey is available. Fighting over food can be a positive evolutionary trait because it helps ensure that the strongest, toughest, and smartest examples of a species survive. However, if survival itself is a challenge for a species, having them fight amongst themselves will only serve to deplete their numbers and waste precious resources.

    The sea dragons live in an environment where food is both scarce and spread over a large area. Such extravagant adaptations that serve only for combat with their own species will not serve them well in such a place as that.
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