Fps = Redemption?

lagger · February 2003

<div class="IPBDescription">does fps effect redemption</div> In clan match's we have our gorgs get redemption so they can go combat and go back to hive after they soak up bullets, do minimal dmg, and heal allies as they rush toward paral. Although when i'm gorg i barely ever get redempted back unlike my fellow clan mates. So i wanted to ask if fps effected how fast you would be brought back to the hive like jping etc... cuz if so <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'> i dont like it hehehehe.

FlatlineUTD · February 2003

I don't think so... I usually run right at about 65 FPS, and this afternoon I was redempted 5 times (IE every time I needed it) in a single game as a Gorge.

Ahnteis · February 2003

I think redempt is calculated every time you get hit. If so, it isn't tied to FPS.

Zel · February 2003

ive seen myself warp back to home base a few seconds after all the fighting was over. say we won the battle all the marines are dead, but im in the red, then suddenly and unexpectedly, whoosh!

of course (maybe due to lag) i have also been killed by someone shooting at me AFTER i teleported back. and no marines were anywhere near the hive. some sort of delayed reaction....

Kitsune · February 2003

Redemption is apparently a percentage chance to be teleported home for every second that you're hurt beyond a certain level. While playing around with dropping Onos down a long fall, the impact usually dropped me down to 180 health. Once I instantly teleported, the other time I was standing around for a few seconds before teleporting. So a Kharaa with Redemption will inevitably be teleported whenever they're badly hurt. It's just a question of whether they'll be teleported before they're killed. I've also heard of people complaining in a game once or twice where they teleported, but died at the hive from the damage. Probably a lag issue there.

TeoH · February 2003

I've actually witnessed a clan mate's gorge teleport into the hive infront of me and instantly die. If i was to hazard a guess i'd say it has something to do with HL's dodgy hitscan anti-lag code, where you can score hits on players who as far as the server is concerned aren't in your line of sight, but due to lag at your end are still on your screen.

I'm thinking gorge teleports - player shooting at gorge is lagged - player shoots at gorge which is still on his screen due to lag delay - hitscan prediction code registers hits on the gorge - gorge dies in hive.

Shockeh · February 2003

The problem with that anti-lag code is it means sometimes people with choppy FPS actually do better than they should. Because for them, you're stood nice & still. So they pop 50 rounds into you, you're running around happily, you turn a corner, go about 10 metres down it then die for apparently no reason.

We & some friends couldn't figure this out until we on purpose held a net game, and made one of the clients a lousy 486. It's pretty annoying.

Long live Valve, and their code programmed by amputee chimps.

TeoH · February 2003

From my own experiences, choppy movement due to lag only seems to make aiming harder. If you have a high framerate and a poor connection, you're able to move yourself and your viewpoint around smoothly, but skulks warp down the corridoor in 5 meter incriments. You would think this might make it easier to aim at them but it really doesn't. Each transitional 'warp' only takes about half a second to complete, making it diffcult to lock your aim on the target and get any significant damage on its position before it warps again - the problem is you have no way of predicting the movement of the skulk because you aren't getting enough information about its movement, the next frame of the skulk could appear anywhere, and you then have only a very short period to aquire it and deal damage. Also if you're experienced in any other game, the tendancy when faced with this situation isnt to aim at the frozen image of a skulk, but to track and try to guess at where the skulk actually is, leading your shots infront of the image. In HL of course, this doesn't work.

On the other hand, when your connection really is terrible, and you get a very long frozen moment where you have time to target and waste a skulk, the skulk will get rather **** off at what appears to him to be instant death :/

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>
and made one of the clients a lousy 486.
</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>

um....

Ph0enix · February 2003

The netcode for HL makes it a fairly level playing field for people of different pings and lag. When someones totally out of kilter however it kinda breaks down, to the severe advantage of one of the players, like when a marine appears to suddenly pump 50 rounds into you in 1 second, or a skulk warps around and is totally un-killable.

BTW, the best way to kill something with redemption is with a shottie, for obvious reasons <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'>

GobyWan · February 2003

Low FPS makes things much, MUCH harder. I personally have never gotten over 20 FPS in NS and often I get less than 4 in a firefight or around a marine base, and that choppiness makes it both impossible to know what you're looking at and impossible to aim at someone who can see you fine.

The redemption thing is tied to the netcode though. Lag prediction, while attempting to put those with poor connections on an even field with others, actually gives them something of an advantage as long as their connection is consistent. I had a marine kill me from around a corner yesterday after I had run around it and used Leap to put 30 feet between us. That's laggeriffic.

lagger · February 2003

1 more queston, if you go below your redemption pnts on ur health, will it check every frame after your to low, or what? because even then it will f'ck it up <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'>

Cry_Havoc · February 2003

Perhaps you should learn how the lag compensation works before complaining that it somehow gives an unfair advantage to someone who is laggier. You may just as well be whining about someone who kills you with the same amount of lag as you have.

<img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'>

lagger · February 2003

Ummm, i did not mean to sound like i was whining about this problem/no problem at all, i just wanted to inquire knowledge about it since i'm not our clans gorge it effects us very little, and i dont use redemption that much.

Forlorn · February 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Shockwave @ Feb 3 2003, 09:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The problem with that anti-lag code is it means sometimes people with choppy FPS actually do better than they should. Because for them, you're stood nice & still. So they pop 50 rounds into you, you're running around happily, you turn a corner, go about 10 metres down it then die for apparently no reason.

We & some friends couldn't figure this out until we on purpose held a net game, and made one of the clients a lousy 486. It's pretty annoying.

Long live Valve, and their code programmed by amputee chimps.  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
I love it when people make it seem the lagging guy has the advantage.

Sure, I may move around in chops, BUT FOR ME SO DOES EVERYTHING ELSE!!!! I have no advantages what so ever, I have more disadvantages then your pampered **** on a nice broadband connection will ever have.

In addition to this, lets say I have a ping of 400; that means it will take .4 seconds for each of my bullets to regester. So if your a skulk with 10 ping and I am a marine with 400 ping, you not only have my reflexes to give you time, but almost a full half a second. You see, weapon prediction code works so that if you kill the person shooting you before his shots can regester, those shots will dissapear. WPC is good, but it does nothing to help against really good players who kill under the first .5 seconds.

TheGlow · February 2003

GEez, 20 fps max. I refuse playing if its under 40 in heavy combat. I never go under 60. How do you put up with it? My bro in laws comp has 20fps and I cant even kill a defense tower practically. Theres a point where the fun factor leaves and its just aggrevating. Like I play Street Fighter on kaillera. On my pc, im fine. I wreck people hard. On my bro in laws, frame rate skips ahoy and fireballs hitting me without me seeing ryu even throw it. You see it, too late, its already hit you.

Alitorious · February 2003

I'd just love to get at least 20 fps in most areas. I seem to average about 10fps in most corridors, and net_view says that the lowest it gets is 4.0 fps, but it sure seems like certain hives (Like ventilation on caged) make me average 2 or 3 fps. And that's with no battles going on. I'm useless in battles.

I really need to upgrade from a celeron 400...

Oh, and fps and lag/latency are somewhat seperate, I think. If one has a "l337" computer, but a crap connection, he might still be able to aim smoothly, while the world around him works in slow motion. I don't have anything near to a powerful computer, so I can't test this theory at all. It only seems to have a basis in "cl_flushentitypacket" (or whatever the error is) or temporary lost connections - I can still aim, even though all around me is frozen.

Hmm.... some other lag problems are when I sometimes turn around a corner, go halfway down this new hallway when I'm "teleported" back to the first hallway.

Fps = Redemption?

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