<!--QuoteBegin--|ds|meatshield+Mar 2 2003, 07:49 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (|ds|meatshield @ Mar 2 2003, 07:49 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Firewater, I am genuinely curious. How the HECK to you get OCs and 6 DCs with TWO gorges before the the other team manages to JP/HMG rush you? and after all that you STILL have enough res for some to go lerk? WOW. Utterly amazing res management. Teach me how you do that please! The only way I can think of to do this is to NOT put up a second hiv at all during this time. And if you don't, and only focus on defneding one hive, the marines can expand with impunity to the other hives. All they have to do is camp the other hives with HMG/JP, while the commander spams medpacks if you attack him. Your strat sounds like the alien version of turtling, and turtling against marines I think is generally bad becuase mariens are only limited by resources, so more time=stronger marines. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> It is Alien turtling, however it is neccesary for us to secure the first hive completely before building the second one. This turtling strat gave us victories vs. 3 of the top Euro clans. After every jet pack assault (there was an avg of about 3 a scrim) we would counter attack and hit their nodes as best we could, but get back on defense before the next rush. When ever a team fails an attack, run it back to them and make them pay for their mistake, whether be taking out their resources, or taking them out of the game.
Why are clan games always played 6 vs 6 ? <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I just can't see why people can't play bigger games. Especially in NS, as so few players really limits the strategies than can be employed. I would have thought that clan games would be the ultimate strategy games as you can be guaranteed that your team will know and understand what your goals are. Six players a side just seems to limit the options a bit.
8 vs 8 sounds a bit better, as the marines would have more chance of going for a two hive lockdown as an alternative to a jet pack rush. I can certainly understand why jet pack rush becomes the only viable strategy with so few players to work with. Wouldn't the answer be to play bigger games?
As an aside, what is the normal size of a squad in a modern army? I was under the impression it was around 8-10 men in a squad(I'm going on some vague impression I have, so correct me if I am wrong). Right from my first days in CS I have always wondered why clan games have been played 6 on 6.
I remember getting together for a big Tribes2 scrim with CoFR vs OGrZ I think it was. I can't recall all the details. We just packed the whole server and played. I dont recall the exact server size, but it was a pretty huge game. Why not just break with tradition and have bigger games?
Hmm, so you lock down the 2nd hive with O and D, but don't build the 2nd hive until you have also locked down your first hive with more O and D? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Yep.
<!--QuoteBegin--Mustard+Mar 4 2003, 07:25 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mustard @ Mar 4 2003, 07:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Excuse my ignorance here and for being off topic.
Why are clan games always played 6 vs 6 ? <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I just can't see why people can't play bigger games. Especially in NS, as so few players really limits the strategies than can be employed. I would have thought that clan games would be the ultimate strategy games as you can be guaranteed that your team will know and understand what your goals are. Six players a side just seems to limit the options a bit.
8 vs 8 sounds a bit better, as the marines would have more chance of going for a two hive lockdown as an alternative to a jet pack rush. I can certainly understand why jet pack rush becomes the only viable strategy with so few players to work with. Wouldn't the answer be to play bigger games?
As an aside, what is the normal size of a squad in a modern army? I was under the impression it was around 8-10 men in a squad(I'm going on some vague impression I have, so correct me if I am wrong). Right from my first days in CS I have always wondered why clan games have been played 6 on 6.
I remember getting together for a big Tribes2 scrim with CoFR vs OGrZ I think it was. I can't recall all the details. We just packed the whole server and played. I dont recall the exact server size, but it was a pretty huge game. Why not just break with tradition and have bigger games? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> the CAL standard format is 6v6, so is OGL (even though OGL is a joke). I think the euro ladders run 6v6 also so thats why games are played 6v6.
Personally i would prefer 7v7 but hey they are not my rules so oh well.
ChurchMeatshield grunt-fodder // Has pre-ordered NS2Join Date: 2002-12-31Member: 11646Members, Constellation
now exactly why is OGL a joke anyway? Just wondering.
Now, what if the marines focus on playing a game of attrition? Instead of going for your hive they go for your defnesed first, whittling them away with their superior firepower and mobility (when JP come along anyway)? (and ofc ourse go for your res nodes as well)
matsoMaster of PatchesJoin Date: 2002-11-05Member: 7000Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, Squad Five Gold, Reinforced - Shadow, NS2 Community Developer
<!--QuoteBegin--Mustard+Mar 4 2003, 07:25 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mustard @ Mar 4 2003, 07:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Excuse my ignorance here and for being off topic.
Why are clan games always played 6 vs 6 ? <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Ever seen organized marines play an 8v8 game? It's called ALIEN SLAUGHTER. Even 6v6 games sees the marine win most of the time. With 8v8, the marines will be getting 25% more resources which means you get hit by the jetpackers at about 5-6 minutes instead of 7-8 minutes.
john made a funny!!! - yes two gorges are better than one in 1.04 - yes the marine jp hmg is tough to beat, but VERY possible and you have to prepare and react accordingly - yes the marines can tech of ONE node and get good tech before aliens can reach a second hive however all these strats will be useless come 1.1 get ready
<!--QuoteBegin--|ds|meatshield+Mar 5 2003, 10:34 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (|ds|meatshield @ Mar 5 2003, 10:34 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> now exactly why is OGL a joke anyway? Just wondering.
Now, what if the marines focus on playing a game of attrition? Instead of going for your hive they go for your defnesed first, whittling them away with their superior firepower and mobility (when JP come along anyway)? (and ofc ourse go for your res nodes as well) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, based on the CS ladder,OGL is a joke because of the ignorant admins, and the near worthless talent that it posesses. The teams on their think they are hot stuff, but would never even score a round at any major LAN. Its a pool of the newbiest teams in the United States, and those that take the league seriously are an embarassment to the online gaming community.
If the marines focus on the defenses that would be great, it would be easier to keep the hive alive.
I have never seen jp hmgs as a threat, I am very cowardly. Makes sense <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> Some people play for fun...even if the skill level is less its no fun playing deep blues.
Less than five minutes into the game, I can have JPs already researched with some nice weapons upgrades as well. Marines usually have quite a few RN near their base. UNLESS the skulks are CONSTANTLY rushing from many directions and clearing out any RTs they find, the marines can and will tech up very quickly if they're worth their pay.
And, my favorite saying for stopping a JP rush, "Every dead marine is one RP to respawn."
<!--QuoteBegin--Mustard+Mar 4 2003, 07:25 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mustard @ Mar 4 2003, 07:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> As an aside, what is the normal size of a squad in a modern army? I was under the impression it was around 8-10 men in a squad(I'm going on some vague impression I have, so correct me if I am wrong). Right from my first days in CS I have always wondered why clan games have been played 6 on 6. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> On the CS issue, counter-terrorism is not usually performed by the armed forces directly. (DEV GRU originated as SEAL Team 6 but became its own organization.) Additionally, Counter-Terrorism teams are usually outnumbered by terrorists, but their success comes in higher organization, better training, and assistance from whatever or whoever is under attack. (So, it'd be more realistic to have a team of five excellent CTs against a team of 15 ok Ts.)
A squad is five to six soldiers usually, I do believe. One has a support weapon (such as the M249 SAW, or for those of you who really want to use the improper CS name, the Para), and the rest are usually equipped with M16A2s with M203 40mm grenade launchers. This is the -standard- outfit. By no means are all squads equipped standard. Demolitions personnel usually get M4A1s as their duty brings them closer to the enemy, where the M4 really shines.
Single squads do not usually operate alone. Two or three squads are grouped together into one unit, but they're broken down into five soldiers so the group commanders can focus their efforts on less men at a time (You'll notice in NS, one commander and four marines is really easy to contain, but one commander with ten marines is considerably harder. So did the Army.)
ChurchMeatshield grunt-fodder // Has pre-ordered NS2Join Date: 2002-12-31Member: 11646Members, Constellation
<!--QuoteBegin--FireWater+Mar 5 2003, 07:33 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (FireWater @ Mar 5 2003, 07:33 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--|ds|meatshield+Mar 5 2003, 10:34 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (|ds|meatshield @ Mar 5 2003, 10:34 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> now exactly why is OGL a joke anyway? Just wondering.
Now, what if the marines focus on playing a game of attrition? Instead of going for your hive they go for your defnesed first, whittling them away with their superior firepower and mobility (when JP come along anyway)? (and ofc ourse go for your res nodes as well) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, based on the CS ladder,OGL is a joke because of the ignorant admins, and the near worthless talent that it posesses. The teams on their think they are hot stuff, but would never even score a round at any major LAN. Its a pool of the newbiest teams in the United States, and those that take the league seriously are an embarassment to the online gaming community.
If the marines focus on the defenses that would be great, it would be easier to keep the hive alive. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Right, but what if they can whittle down your defenses faster than you can put them back up?
<!--QuoteBegin--|ds|meatshield+Mar 6 2003, 05:13 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (|ds|meatshield @ Mar 6 2003, 05:13 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--FireWater+Mar 5 2003, 07:33 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (FireWater @ Mar 5 2003, 07:33 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--|ds|meatshield+Mar 5 2003, 10:34 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (|ds|meatshield @ Mar 5 2003, 10:34 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> now exactly why is OGL a joke anyway? Just wondering.
Now, what if the marines focus on playing a game of attrition? Instead of going for your hive they go for your defnesed first, whittling them away with their superior firepower and mobility (when JP come along anyway)? (and ofc ourse go for your res nodes as well) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, based on the CS ladder,OGL is a joke because of the ignorant admins, and the near worthless talent that it posesses. The teams on their think they are hot stuff, but would never even score a round at any major LAN. Its a pool of the newbiest teams in the United States, and those that take the league seriously are an embarassment to the online gaming community.
If the marines focus on the defenses that would be great, it would be easier to keep the hive alive. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Right, but what if they can whittle down your defenses faster than you can put them back up? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> then you lose... duh. I mean what answer do you want to hear ? That our strats are not perfect, that there is no answer for everything? Jeez figure out something on your own plz.
Comments
It is Alien turtling, however it is neccesary for us to secure the first hive completely before building the second one. This turtling strat gave us victories vs. 3 of the top Euro clans. After every jet pack assault (there was an avg of about 3 a scrim) we would counter attack and hit their nodes as best we could, but get back on defense before the next rush. When ever a team fails an attack, run it back to them and make them pay for their mistake, whether be taking out their resources, or taking them out of the game.
Hmm, so you lock down the 2nd hive with O and D, but don't build the 2nd hive until you have also locked down your first hive with more O and D?
Why are clan games always played 6 vs 6 ? <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I just can't see why people can't play bigger games. Especially in NS, as so few players really limits the strategies than can be employed. I would have thought that clan games would be the ultimate strategy games as you can be guaranteed that your team will know and understand what your goals are. Six players a side just seems to limit the options a bit.
8 vs 8 sounds a bit better, as the marines would have more chance of going for a two hive lockdown as an alternative to a jet pack rush. I can certainly understand why jet pack rush becomes the only viable strategy with so few players to work with. Wouldn't the answer be to play bigger games?
As an aside, what is the normal size of a squad in a modern army? I was under the impression it was around 8-10 men in a squad(I'm going on some vague impression I have, so correct me if I am wrong). Right from my first days in CS I have always wondered why clan games have been played 6 on 6.
I remember getting together for a big Tribes2 scrim with CoFR vs OGrZ I think it was. I can't recall all the details. We just packed the whole server and played. I dont recall the exact server size, but it was a pretty huge game. Why not just break with tradition and have bigger games?
Hmm, so you lock down the 2nd hive with O and D, but don't build the 2nd hive until you have also locked down your first hive with more O and D? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yep.
Why are clan games always played 6 vs 6 ? <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I just can't see why people can't play bigger games. Especially in NS, as so few players really limits the strategies than can be employed. I would have thought that clan games would be the ultimate strategy games as you can be guaranteed that your team will know and understand what your goals are. Six players a side just seems to limit the options a bit.
8 vs 8 sounds a bit better, as the marines would have more chance of going for a two hive lockdown as an alternative to a jet pack rush. I can certainly understand why jet pack rush becomes the only viable strategy with so few players to work with. Wouldn't the answer be to play bigger games?
As an aside, what is the normal size of a squad in a modern army? I was under the impression it was around 8-10 men in a squad(I'm going on some vague impression I have, so correct me if I am wrong). Right from my first days in CS I have always wondered why clan games have been played 6 on 6.
I remember getting together for a big Tribes2 scrim with CoFR vs OGrZ I think it was. I can't recall all the details. We just packed the whole server and played. I dont recall the exact server size, but it was a pretty huge game. Why not just break with tradition and have bigger games? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
the CAL standard format is 6v6, so is OGL (even though OGL is a joke). I think the euro ladders run 6v6 also so thats why games are played 6v6.
Personally i would prefer 7v7 but hey they are not my rules so oh well.
Now, what if the marines focus on playing a game of attrition? Instead of going for your hive they go for your defnesed first, whittling them away with their superior firepower and mobility (when JP come along anyway)? (and ofc ourse go for your res nodes as well)
Why are clan games always played 6 vs 6 ? <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ever seen organized marines play an 8v8 game? It's called ALIEN SLAUGHTER. Even 6v6 games sees the marine win most of the time. With 8v8, the marines will be getting 25% more resources which means you get hit by the jetpackers at about 5-6 minutes instead of 7-8 minutes.
Granted, that wasn't the original reason.
- yes two gorges are better than one in 1.04
- yes the marine jp hmg is tough to beat, but VERY possible and you have to prepare and react accordingly
- yes the marines can tech of ONE node and get good tech before aliens can reach a second hive
however all these strats will be useless come 1.1
get ready
Now, what if the marines focus on playing a game of attrition? Instead of going for your hive they go for your defnesed first, whittling them away with their superior firepower and mobility (when JP come along anyway)? (and ofc ourse go for your res nodes as well) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, based on the CS ladder,OGL is a joke because of the ignorant admins, and the near worthless talent that it posesses. The teams on their think they are hot stuff, but would never even score a round at any major LAN. Its a pool of the newbiest teams in the United States, and those that take the league seriously are an embarassment to the online gaming community.
If the marines focus on the defenses that would be great, it would be easier to keep the hive alive.
And, my favorite saying for stopping a JP rush, "Every dead marine is one RP to respawn."
On the CS issue, counter-terrorism is not usually performed by the armed forces directly. (DEV GRU originated as SEAL Team 6 but became its own organization.) Additionally, Counter-Terrorism teams are usually outnumbered by terrorists, but their success comes in higher organization, better training, and assistance from whatever or whoever is under attack. (So, it'd be more realistic to have a team of five excellent CTs against a team of 15 ok Ts.)
A squad is five to six soldiers usually, I do believe. One has a support weapon (such as the M249 SAW, or for those of you who really want to use the improper CS name, the Para), and the rest are usually equipped with M16A2s with M203 40mm grenade launchers. This is the -standard- outfit. By no means are all squads equipped standard. Demolitions personnel usually get M4A1s as their duty brings them closer to the enemy, where the M4 really shines.
Single squads do not usually operate alone. Two or three squads are grouped together into one unit, but they're broken down into five soldiers so the group commanders can focus their efforts on less men at a time (You'll notice in NS, one commander and four marines is really easy to contain, but one commander with ten marines is considerably harder. So did the Army.)
Rar. Hope that helps. ^-^
Now, what if the marines focus on playing a game of attrition? Instead of going for your hive they go for your defnesed first, whittling them away with their superior firepower and mobility (when JP come along anyway)? (and ofc ourse go for your res nodes as well) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, based on the CS ladder,OGL is a joke because of the ignorant admins, and the near worthless talent that it posesses. The teams on their think they are hot stuff, but would never even score a round at any major LAN. Its a pool of the newbiest teams in the United States, and those that take the league seriously are an embarassment to the online gaming community.
If the marines focus on the defenses that would be great, it would be easier to keep the hive alive. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Right, but what if they can whittle down your defenses faster than you can put them back up?
Now, what if the marines focus on playing a game of attrition? Instead of going for your hive they go for your defnesed first, whittling them away with their superior firepower and mobility (when JP come along anyway)? (and ofc ourse go for your res nodes as well) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, based on the CS ladder,OGL is a joke because of the ignorant admins, and the near worthless talent that it posesses. The teams on their think they are hot stuff, but would never even score a round at any major LAN. Its a pool of the newbiest teams in the United States, and those that take the league seriously are an embarassment to the online gaming community.
If the marines focus on the defenses that would be great, it would be easier to keep the hive alive. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Right, but what if they can whittle down your defenses faster than you can put them back up? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
then you lose... duh. I mean what answer do you want to hear ? That our strats are not perfect, that there is no answer for everything? Jeez figure out something on your own plz.