Huh? A Bot?!?
NinjaStitch
Join Date: 2003-05-25 Member: 16703Members
Join Date: 2003-05-25 Member: 16703Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Are bots OK with you guys?</div> <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo-->
I downloaded Natural Selection a month ago and at first, I didn't know what was going on! Who are the TSA? Where did these cool looking marines come from? AND WHAT THE HECK WAS THAT THING I SAW RUNNING AROUND TAKING UP HALF THE HALLWAYS IN THE MAP (ns_eclipse)?!? I think it was this, actually >::onos::<. But thanks to many friendly players on-line, I was trained by them to become a pretty good soldier! (The Kharaa, well, I never did like being an alien but sometimes "Ah, WHAT THE HECK! Let's look nasty!"
Anyway, that's not the point. The main reason for this topic is 'Are bots official for Natural Selection?' If Not, PLEASE DO! It's the best solution for those of us who cannot get on-line very often, and highly recommended for practice! But what do YOU, the player, think about this? Are bots OK for Natural Selection?
Message from Marine at Hera Station 06...
"Have you been chased by an ONOS lately? I have..."
I downloaded Natural Selection a month ago and at first, I didn't know what was going on! Who are the TSA? Where did these cool looking marines come from? AND WHAT THE HECK WAS THAT THING I SAW RUNNING AROUND TAKING UP HALF THE HALLWAYS IN THE MAP (ns_eclipse)?!? I think it was this, actually >::onos::<. But thanks to many friendly players on-line, I was trained by them to become a pretty good soldier! (The Kharaa, well, I never did like being an alien but sometimes "Ah, WHAT THE HECK! Let's look nasty!"
Anyway, that's not the point. The main reason for this topic is 'Are bots official for Natural Selection?' If Not, PLEASE DO! It's the best solution for those of us who cannot get on-line very often, and highly recommended for practice! But what do YOU, the player, think about this? Are bots OK for Natural Selection?
Message from Marine at Hera Station 06...
"Have you been chased by an ONOS lately? I have..."
Comments
As for the bot question: while no bots are officially made by the NS team, two bot programs I know of are in the works/have been released. There's pros and cons to both.
<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'><a href='http://homepage.ntlworld.com/pat.murphy/rcbot/' target='_blank'>RCBot</a></span>
<b>Pros:</b>
1st bots made for NS (first release just days or hours after NS' release, if I remember correctly)
Works for both teams, TSA and Kharaa
Can have a commander
<b>Cons:</b>
Needs inprovement in areas because it's a bit of a jack-of-all-trades
Using RCBot as a TSA Commander isn't as smart as a human (duh)
Will get stuck rather badly if you use substandard waypoint files made for the bot
<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'><a href='http://whichbot.sourceforge.net/' target='_blank'>WhichBot</a></span>
<b>Pros:</b>
Open source (source code freely available to all for editing or learning)
Amazing AI (running in packs, etc.) for skulks and fades...
<b>Cons:</b>
...but since all AI coding so far has been for skulks and fades, WhichBot can't play as other classes (particularly important is it's inability to do Gorge)
The bots from Rocket CrowBot were like on-line players!!!
As a gift for your help, here is a 'RISK SHOT' I took while fighting the Kharaa (controlled by the bots!)
Oh...er...these guys used to be Onos but they did a little plastic surgery. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
thx marik
levels like bast, hera, etc
If by that you mean they run off ramboing as soon as you get in your comm chair and ignore all instructions you give them in favour of shouting: "I don't see a res tower at that place where I demanded you place one!" then yes. <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo-->
If by that you mean they run off ramboing as soon as you get in your comm chair and ignore all instructions you give them in favour of shouting: "I don't see a res tower at that place where I demanded you place one!" then yes. <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--><!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Have you tried <b>bot_wait_for_orders 1</b> and <b>bot_build_whining 0</b>?
Well look what I found, a new looking Onos which is now called ZERG ULTRALISK!!!
When the bots took control of this monster, they wiped my gang out in 3 minutes flat!!!! Because I made the waypoints for the map ns_eclipse (I keep mentioning this map because it's my top favorite!) the bots were so smart that one of them in the Kharaa side cloaked itself in a dark corner and jumped at me when I passed by it! (Talk about A.I.!).
Oh yeah, th@ annoying kid, you asked for waypoints on the maps you listed? You got the right Waypointer, ME!!! Give me the green light and I'll get started. (You're right, these maps have either dodgy waypoints or no waypoints at all. If you want to know how to place them yourself, post it here with your e-mail address and I'll send you an instruction note FOR FREE! YEP, NOT A PENNY TO PAY!!!)
Oh and one more thing, I got the Zerg Ultralisk by downloading it. It replaces the Onos in the Kharaa side, if anyone wants it just type it in the search and you should find it straight away.
Keep running, YEEEEEEHAAAAAA!!!
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Visit my website on www.anipix626.8m.com
or visit my totally NAtural Selection Review Site on www.ns626.8m.com
OK, gang. If you have any questions or problems with the bots, there is a new topic for it called. The Bot Man (by NinjaStitch)
...we're not done yet...
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Special Delivery for th@ annoying kid!
Well, I promised help for you so here you go...(this is a pretty long instruction page, but worth the time! J (
Start up a network game like any other network game on the map you found no use of its waypoints (ns_eclipse is the best map to start from, this is the only map I know so far that have the bots going 97.9%), and make sure you don't have any bots running around during this operation. They'll be a nuisance if you do, and more than annoying.
I recommend Rocket CrowBot for this operation and usage of bots, they seem to understand the waypoints a hell lot better than other bot programs. If you don?t have this bot program, GET IT ON THE DOUBLE!
AND MAKE SURE YOU TOOK THE MARINES SIDE WHILE DOING YOUR WAYPOINTS!!! The Kharaa is not important while creating waypoints since both the Marines and the Aliens will follow the same waypoints.
RIGHT! Get your fingers (and patience) ready, bring the console down and type (waypoint on) and (pathwaypoint on) without the brackets. You should notice Blue and Yellow Sticks scattered all over the place. If there are existing waypoints in the map, GET RID OF THEM! "how?". Thought you'd ask that, stand or crouch (depending on the type of waypoint) right in the waypoint and bring down the console to type (waypoint delete). Yeah, I know its a pain in the neck due to the number of waypoints there are in the level but believe me, its worth it! And if you got one of those ?Come on, son. We?re going out!? DON?T PANIC! You can save you?re A.I. creation by typing (waypoint save). Yeah, Yeah. Altogether now, ?Without?the?brackets?.
Now to get to know the color sticks : Blue means normal waypoints (Walking or running), Yellow means climbing (ladders, grabables etc...) and White means crouch (you'll need this more for the Kharaa) Yes, which also means you should switch between sides but I don't recommend giving waypoints in areas where you definitely don't want the Marines to go to. To start creating your waypoints (yes men, this is it. The final frontier.) Start at your comms base and bring down the console and type (waypoint add) without the brackets, push the console back up and take a few steps back. See the blue stick? That is the waypoint you just created! (Major applause in the background). To create a crouch waypoint, crouch and while still crouched bring down the console and type (waypoint add) without the brackets. See the little White stick? That's the crouch waypoint you just created, yipee! Get rid of the Crouch waypoint since you don't need it yet. Grabbing a ladder and typing (waypoint add) without the brackets, notice the Yellow stick? This is the so called ?grab the ladder? waypoint, YIPPIKAYA! But make sure you have the ?grab the ladder? waypoints at the bottom and top of the ladder, otherwise the Marines will commit suicide by seeing the next ?Blue? waypoint which is WAAAAY down there L. To make another waypoint connecting to the previous one, take a walk (but make it a short one) say 3 meters and create another waypoint. When you do this, you?ll notice a white line between the two waypoints. That means when the bots start at waypoint A he will obviously look for waypoint B, he could also have a multi decision between going from waypoint A to waypoint B or C. Meaning if you were to create the waypoints for the map (ns_eclipse) you would make one at comms, to the middle of the Marine Spawn hall then to either side of the doors. Making the waypoints lead to both sides of the doors will tell the bot to randomly choose the side it decides to go. There are a few notes to take down while creating waypoints for any map:
1. When making waypoints, make sure you have your paths from one waypoint to another visibly clear for the bots. Otherwise they?ll end up banging their heads on the wall L.
2. Make sure the line comes up when you stand from one waypoint to another, if you don?t check this up the bot will only look for a visible line. Not much of an attack for the aliens as well if this happens.
3. Make waypoints leading to every hive and every corner and every single damn spot in the map. You want A.I.? Give it to them.
4. When Making waypoints for ladders, as I said before, make sure it exists at the bottom and the top of the ladder. Otherwise, well, you know what happens. Bot : ?Here I goOOOOOOO?? and the bot was never heard of again.
5. Make waypoints going round the structures available to the bots. If you don?t do this, then there?s a chance to see a heap load of bots crashing into the same wall for the next god knows how many hours!
6. SAVE YOUR WAYPOINTS WHILE CREATING VERY OFTEN. I mean, anything can happen. Power cuts off, out of time, dinner time, Onos found its way to your bedroom somehow (Nah, not likely to happen).
Well I hope this is enough for you. But if not, then please don?t hesitate to ask for more information. I love co-operative gaming especially Human players against CPU players. I support Natural Selection 101%. Keep the community alive and happy waypointing. J
Don?t forget to download the bot program Rocket CrowBot!
...more ammo, more Ka-Booms...
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can you send me your waypoint file for eclipse?
I am sure that yours is done right, which means good players!!!!!
SephirothIII, if your an Anime/Manga fan then GOOD FOR YOU! I'm a MAJOR fan of Anime/Manga!
I can't find my waypoint files, where does the program usually store it? (I can't believe I mastered waypointing and I don't know where the file is!!!)
...SephirothIII disliked the answer and this was the result...
<!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--emo&::siege::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/siege.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='siege.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--emo&::sentry::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/turret.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='turret.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif'><!--endemo--> --I..but...AIEEEE!!
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Waypoints are currently stored in maps folder in NS.
I will change directory structure of the bot in the futeure, I don't really like it <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
OFCOURSE! I should have known better, well that'll teach me I guess. But SephirothIII, for which map?
...So, how are the dorks we sent for our mission in the mines?...
er...only one made it back
/
<!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> ---?!?
Nothing will stop me killing you fatty!!!
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WOAH! HUGE DEMAND UNDERWAY!! This will take some time to post it to your E-mails so please, Marines, standby and I'll get them to you as soon as I can! REMEMBER THAT THIS IS FOR ROCKET CROWBOT AND ROCKET CROWBOT ONLY!!! Try the ns_eclipse map as a test for the bots and see if you satisfied with it, if so then the whole set will be given to you guys. If not then..well..I tried! NATURAL SELECTION FOREVER!!! <!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif'><!--endemo-->
Oh yeah, How do you post a file up on this forum? If not possible than I need you e-mail addresses. <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
...er..heh heh..buddies?...
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Oh! Here we go gang. Try this waypointed map (ns_eclipse) and see what you think!
...hmm these alien species have some intelligence...
<!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::lerk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/lerk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='lerk.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::lerk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/lerk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='lerk.gif'><!--endemo--> ---you think?
<!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif'><!--endemo-->
Nothing can stop me taking down this seige cannon!!!
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<!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo-->
well, nothing except me xcept me
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no more hijacking of thread
starting
now
sorry if you think your being used, but your acually doing a great service! that and I tried to do wps, but got confused @o@
Don't worry about that, gang. That's what I'm here for, I'm making sure everyone gets the results they want from the bots. OK then, TIME TO WAYPOINT THE OTHERS!!
You should also try the 'Aliens' skin (which really is From the movie!) I posted on the forum 'Models And Skins', very easy to spot on the forum!
...who's next?...
<!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::onos::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tiny.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tiny.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::lerk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/lerk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='lerk.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo--> ---ME, ME!!!
I noticed that they still get stuck in maintenance hive and the aliens didn't go gorge!! Do you know how to fix this?? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
Hey I also had a problem at the start which I fixed but worth letting people know.
I copied the above file to my maps folder, launched NS but every time eclipse started, it would load show the ready room then kick immediately back to windows. Had to then kill process hl.exe before it would restart. The file that I downloaded was defaulted to READ-ONLY, once I unchecked this in properties I was rocking!!!
All that was left was his head
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Strange...if you placed this extra in the command line of the half-life launch icon '-game -ns -console', you should suddenly zoom right into Natural Selection and not Half-Life itself. Once there, load up a LAN game in the map ns_eclipse. You'll get the usual greeting of the MOD but soon after three messages come up to tell you that Rocket CrowBot is now active and it will tell you how to add/kick bots.
And you say they don't gorge? They're suppose to gorge...AIEEE! Tell you what guys, I have a re-make of this waypoint file for the map and according to the test so far the Kharaa got to the Onos level so quickly that my team didn't even have the heavy armour yet. Let alone the jet pack! I'll post it up here as soon as I'm sure it's good to go. I was also working on the map ns_bast and found out something rather..nasty. The bots seem to have trouble with switches, if the bot pushes the switch for the big door in the lower level it pushes it again and walks through. He became a pancake when the door shut on him in between. This problem I tried to fix but it seems the bots were programmed to act like an idiot when it comes to switches, better inform the team about this but I'm sure they already know.
Oh and try this, 4 Marines against 10 kharaa's and you take the Marines side. Can you feel your hair rising already? he he ha ha ha HA...HAAAA HA HA HA...HAAAAAAAAACHOOOO!! (Bad cold, sorry.)
...I wanna be a marine...
<!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> ---YOU? A MARINE?!? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
Heal Me Fatty!!!
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if you want to get waypointing done MUCH faster, bind keys
for fast deletion of waypointing, type in the console bind <!--c1--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1--><key> "waypoint delete"<!--c2--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
You may be able to get away with just deleting the .rcw file. try it, im not sure
for fast placing, type <!--c1--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->bind <key> "waypoint add"<!--c2--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
for fast saving, type <!--c1--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->bind <key>"waypoint save"<!--c2--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
all you have to do then is run around the level and press the waypoint add key wherever you want a waypoint. its that simple and soo much faster
keep up the good work
Thanx z.x. bogglestiensky, I'll give these commands a go!
Todays update for waypointing (er..this thing on..is it..OK here we go).
Well folks, I was right. The bots were having a good time pressing the switches like maniacs! I sent an E-mail to the Rocket CrowBot team so I'm hoping for an answer, bots must go on. One day our connection will be real bad for a small period of time, this is where the bots come in.
Here is a shot result (risky one too!) of the new waypointed file in progres. Hey dritz, look at this one. It ecolved into this form in 6 minutes!!! (I'm using the Aliens Skin by the way, incase you ask yourself "WHAT THE HECK IS THAT?!?")
...sir, another one just took out out resource tower...
Sir, did you hear me?
/
<!--emo&::marine::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/marine.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='marine.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> ---duh..what's a resource tower?
Had a good game on eclipse yesterday 6 vs 6, locked down eclipse then seiged the other two hives just as fades attacked. Shame I had full gun upgrades!!!
Comm: Chase That Fade Down
Grunt: But he's soooo cute!!!!!
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