Here is my suggestion for making P2P releases more viable. First of all, P2P network downloads are always significantly slower than even overrun download servers. And distributed file sharing only works at all when not only a few master peers push data onto the network, but when the growing number of clients add up to serve as a large download pool. Since it is just normal that people will shut down the network shares to actually get playing what they just downloaded, this will not work at all on a 1-day release. Additionally the slow P2P downloads won't be able to keep users from trying their luck at the official direct download sites.
Still a P2P network release can be done with certain prerequisites, and still enabling many people have the data available right on release date.
1) make a P2P install package, that contains the entire release in a secure encrypted format. 2) include a custom installer, that is capable of decrypting the package and install it with the proper decryption key, that the installer will try to download from the official release site. 3) release this encrypted package onto the P2P networks severall days before the actual release, so there is enough time to have the package propagate through the network 4) on the official release date, make the "decryption key" available, to enable the installer to edecrypt the package
This way people are encouraged to keep their shares open, as they can only use the downloaded package when the release time is met. On the other hand, they can instantly start installing and playing the package as soon as the decryption key is published. The official release site will only have to handle serving the small decryption information. Which should work even if thousands of clients try to fetch it at the same time. This way everyone who cared to join the P2P net soon enough will have a working installation instantly on release date. No need to wait in crowded direct download server queues. And the prerelease package will be sufficiently safe. High encryption could only be broken with sheer luck in such a limited preloading period of a few days, even by sophisticated experts and the most powerful super-computing equipment.
Maybe you P2P fans could now add your idea of how you'd see such a preloading release system.
his post is stunningly full of words, and its length is enough to capture the eye of a normal forum troll, so he must be commended for his deft use of long words and sentences.
As good ideas as that is Larson, I doubt it would happen. Someone would crack it and spread it out early, and it would require a lot of effort to encode it all, etc. Just not worth taking the chance.
<!--QuoteBegin--Comprox+Jul 3 2003, 10:19 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Comprox @ Jul 3 2003, 10:19 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> As good ideas as that is Larson, I doubt it would happen. Someone would crack it and spread it out early, and it would require a lot of effort to encode it all, etc. Just not worth taking the chance. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Encryption is mathematically proven to be unbreakable unless by sheer luck!
Just use PGP or any similar strong encryption system. You can neither "hack" nor "crack" it. Even a brute force attempt will not yield any result within a human's lifetime, except for a lucky shot that is so unlikely it actually never has been reported yet, if it had ever happened so far at all.
All industry strength encryption systems rely on such strong encryption systems, and none of them is yet proven to be breakable. There will be no server you could hack, and no program which might give away any helpful hints through a programming error.
Just keep the master key on secure CDR backups until just before you upload it onto the release server, there is absolutely no reason to expect any breach of the encryption, as no one can hack you computer to stand up, walk over to the shelf, take the CDR out of the vault, insert it into the drive and finally upload it to any ill-minded person.
Strong encryption is sufficiently safe to protect bank accounts, military data, criminal activities, weapons of mass destruction, business secrets, and your most private secret diaries. The event of an encryption breach is less likely than the return of the messiah!
Stop asking for it to be on bittorrent. Just seed it yourself when it comes out. I'll do it if no one else has it done by the time I've downloaded my copy. I'll probaly use bytemonsoon.
<!--QuoteBegin--Comprox+Jul 3 2003, 07:19 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Comprox @ Jul 3 2003, 07:19 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> As good ideas as that is Larson, I doubt it would happen. Someone would crack it and spread it out early, and it would require a lot of effort to encode it all, etc. Just not worth taking the chance. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Larson is right, actually. He's NOT saying leave the encryption key ANYWHERE near the installer. It literally takes a short string to unlock the fire, and the contents are actually encrypted. The packaging time would be trivial, and it could contain just the obvious media that's huge, like maps and textures, which would likely be finished and considered complete well before the final code-changes are done.
Basically, all the large **** that can be completed early is in this uber-large, key-encrypted file. Then on a certain day, you release a smaller installer that has the encryption key inside and the extra files like the DLL's and such.
Don't worry, what I will do is download NS on bittorrent, and leave it there for the community. Only problem is I'm in France so not always same timezone as you, and I won't touch NS 2.0 before the next month <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Cereal_KillR+Jul 3 2003, 12:35 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Cereal_KillR @ Jul 3 2003, 12:35 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Don't worry, what I will do is download NS on bittorrent, and leave it there for the community. Only problem is I'm in France so not always same timezone as you, and I won't touch NS 2.0 before the next month <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> All you have to do is seed it and the rest of it will take care of it self.. No worries. I'll do it guys..
The cool thing about BitTorrent is that you upload the file while you're still downloading it. Its not like Kazaa where you only upload full files.
I've gotten close to 100k/s On BitTorrent before- consider that most download sites, with the exception of line sites like FilePlanet and FileShack, will give crappy DL speeds as a result of too many people on them.
<!--QuoteBegin--Jammer+Jul 3 2003, 01:35 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Jammer @ Jul 3 2003, 01:35 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> The cool thing about BitTorrent is that you upload the file while you're still downloading it. Its not like Kazaa where you only upload full files. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> What is new about that ?
1) Bittorrent is signficantly simpler then something like kazaa. You install it (about 5 seconds) and it looks like a download window. People can handle download windows. Even "elite" rambos.
2) Bittorrent limits your connections based on your upload bandwidth. If you want fastest downloads, you either don't limint your upload or you set it appropriately. (Some connections do better with proper limits so that the upload isn't throttled by the download.)
3) Having an official tracker/seed ensures all of us that the file is real and not some spoof.
4) BT is written in python. There are commandline versions available for windows and linux that you could use on your server if you wanted to.
5) For the initial release it won't matter if people close BT as soon as they finish. With a hugely demanded file, there will be plenty of downloads going on while most people download. They will share with each other as they download and speeds should be excellent until the majority of the people have downloaded the update. When the official seed is the only full seed remaining, then it's basically like using normal download methods.
(I plan on using BT for some upcoming DLs on my own site for these same reasons. I simply can't afford to pay for huge bandwidth spikes and this is a great way to alleviate the problem.)
Props to Comprox for telling us he'll try to get an official BitTorrent tracker for NS 2.0's release <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I love BitTorrent. While I can only push 80KB/s upstream, on BT networks with lots of users I usually don't have any trouble maxing myself out at 350KB/s.
Course, because I have a monthly transfer cap, I can't afford to keep the window open after I finish, but I do set my upstream limit at 70KB/s so that I can at least pump that much into the network while I download.
Best way to share this over p2p is to use shareaza and magnet links and shareaza can download from Gnutella2, Edonkey2000, and BitTorrent.
Also magnet links can have http links in them to.
With shareaza theys no need for any tracker all you need is to post magnet link on the site.
this is a megnet link with out the http link. magnet:?xt=urn:bitprint:F3MF6YWEMNU64HTBA3NRATZVLO5N3NIR.D3HQZRKR3RQNVQHXLMWIF24WF32USIW5PCXBBWQ&dn=Shareaza1899.exe
has you can see you can have more than one http link with in a megnet link....
If the people at natural-selection dont what to run shareaza they can just post a magnet with http link with in it and the p2p Gnutella2 network will take the load.. Also Gnutella2 is faster than BitTorrent.
For more info go to <a href='http://www.shareaza.com' target='_blank'>http://www.shareaza.com</a> and magnet links are here <a href='http://www.sharelive.com' target='_blank'>http://www.sharelive.com</a>
<!--QuoteBegin--Larson+Jul 3 2003, 07:40 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Larson @ Jul 3 2003, 07:40 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> eDonkey, eMule, xMule, Overnet, etc... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> lol You do of course realize that those are all the same program ? hehe
moultanoCreator of ns_shiva.Join Date: 2002-12-14Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
<!--QuoteBegin--Larson+Jul 3 2003, 10:51 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Larson @ Jul 3 2003, 10:51 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Encryption is mathematically proven to be unbreakable unless by sheer luck! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Just to be a little trollish here, that isn't mathematically proven <i>yet</i>. I'm still holding out for p=np. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> God that would rock.
<!--QuoteBegin--moultano+Jul 4 2003, 08:55 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (moultano @ Jul 4 2003, 08:55 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Larson+Jul 3 2003, 10:51 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Larson @ Jul 3 2003, 10:51 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Encryption is mathematically proven to be unbreakable unless by sheer luck! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Just to be a little trollish here, that isn't mathematically proven <i>yet</i>. I'm still holding out for p=np. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> God that would rock. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> With that happening we could all pack our bags, as with only trivial problems left, we could better let some monkeys do the work... You won't have to worry about a hypothetical early decryption of a game data file then...
<!--QuoteBegin--romano+Jul 2 2003, 10:04 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (romano @ Jul 2 2003, 10:04 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If there is a Bittorrent release, it will be purely community driven. I don't see Flayra or the other devs going out of their way to setup a Bittorrent share, when they'll have all the headaches of setting up the normal mirrors already.
If you want a Bittorrent release, organize it. Get people together who will be willing to put the file up for sharing. Track down someone with uber bandwith willing to get the ball rolling. You have a month to get some people interested in it, so get cracking! <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Bingo - Romano wins the prize.
If they only allow NS 2.0 to be downloaded from like 2-3 sites, I will probably cry, eat a bottle of prozac and then fly to each of the devs houses and throw cupcakes at them. 1 site that had better not get NS is fileplanet. I hate them.
Hmm. Waiting 5 hours in line at Fileplanet will <b>not</b> be amusing. But hey, it's completely free, can't moan too much. Bitorrent sounds like a good solution. With my DSL coming next monday, it'd be a shame not to utilize the 256kb/s upload with no cap on 7/31!
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> I have a personal file server account at fileplanet.com <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> no waiting,no lines hehe <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> so I'll get it pretty fast,coupled with DAP- Download Accelerator Plus,I can get over 100meg files in about 4- 5 minutes.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->so I'll get it pretty fast,coupled with DAP- Download Accelerator Plus,I can get over 100meg files in about 4- 5 minutes<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Maybe getting it <b>too</b> fast will mean you'll be sitting in unoccupied servers, while the rest of us mugs download it!
Of cource I would leave my dl window open! I have 10 mbit, so I can play at the same time <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> hehehe
Your soooo lucky.... me just gots bad bad T-DSL... which is.... hmmm very stupid (24/h disconnect)......... and I even can't get cable....... hopefully I can get a upgrade on a 1mbit line in the near future.
<!--QuoteBegin--CommunistWithAGun+Jul 8 2003, 03:43 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (CommunistWithAGun @ Jul 8 2003, 03:43 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If they only allow NS 2.0 to be downloaded from like 2-3 sites, I will probably cry, eat a bottle of prozac and then fly to each of the devs houses and throw cupcakes at them. 1 site that had better not get NS is fileplanet. I hate them. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I will mirror it <a href='http://www.popgoestheweasel.net/nsfiles/' target='_blank'>here</a> as soon as its aviable to me.
Well ns v2.0 will be on <a href='http://www.GamePhilez.us' target='_blank'>http://www.GamePhilez.us</a> which is a p2p site thats hosts free game files like mods and stuff like that. Site is still been coded.
This is has a T3 p2p file server for all the files on the site. all links on the site are magnet links which are for shareaza runing on Gnutella2 network.
I'm sure as soon as someone gets their hands on 2.0, it'll be up and seeded on one of the big websites. I won't mention any names (I'm in fear of getting banned or something, since these sites unfortunately carry warez/mp3s/etc) but you should probably be able to find them no problem.
With the multitude of ways to get 2.0 I don't think it'll be a problem on The Big Day.
Comments
If you seed it, they will leech. (That's not a bad thing.) (:
First of all, P2P network downloads are always significantly slower than
even overrun download servers. And distributed file sharing only works at all
when not only a few master peers push data onto the network, but when
the growing number of clients add up to serve as a large download pool.
Since it is just normal that people will shut down the network shares to actually
get playing what they just downloaded, this will not work at all on a 1-day release.
Additionally the slow P2P downloads won't be able to keep users from trying their luck at the
official direct download sites.
Still a P2P network release can be done with certain prerequisites, and still
enabling many people have the data available right on release date.
1) make a P2P install package, that contains the entire release in a secure encrypted format.
2) include a custom installer, that is capable of decrypting the package and install it
with the proper decryption key, that the installer will try to download from the
official release site.
3) release this encrypted package onto the P2P networks severall days before the actual release,
so there is enough time to have the package propagate through the network
4) on the official release date, make the "decryption key" available, to enable the installer
to edecrypt the package
This way people are encouraged to keep their shares open, as they can only use the downloaded package
when the release time is met. On the other hand, they can instantly start installing and playing
the package as soon as the decryption key is published.
The official release site will only have to handle serving the small decryption information. Which should work even if thousands of clients try to fetch it at the same time.
This way everyone who cared to join the P2P net soon enough will have a working installation instantly on release date. No need to wait in crowded direct download server queues. And the prerelease package will be sufficiently safe. High encryption could only be broken with sheer luck in such a limited preloading period of a few days, even by sophisticated experts and the most powerful super-computing equipment.
Maybe you P2P fans could now add your idea of how you'd see such a preloading release system.
his post is stunningly full of words, and its length is enough to capture the eye of a normal forum troll, so he must be commended for his deft use of long words and sentences.
(its also a nice set of suggestions!)
LM
Encryption is mathematically proven to be unbreakable unless by sheer luck!
Just use PGP or any similar strong encryption system.
You can neither "hack" nor "crack" it. Even a brute force attempt will not yield
any result within a human's lifetime, except for a lucky shot that is so unlikely
it actually never has been reported yet, if it had ever happened so far at all.
All industry strength encryption systems rely on such strong encryption systems,
and none of them is yet proven to be breakable.
There will be no server you could hack, and no program which might give away
any helpful hints through a programming error.
Just keep the master key on secure CDR backups until just before you
upload it onto the release server, there is absolutely no reason to expect
any breach of the encryption, as no one can hack you computer to stand up,
walk over to the shelf, take the CDR out of the vault, insert it into the drive
and finally upload it to any ill-minded person.
Strong encryption is sufficiently safe to protect bank accounts, military data,
criminal activities, weapons of mass destruction, business secrets, and your
most private secret diaries. The event of an encryption breach is less likely
than the return of the messiah!
Larson is right, actually. He's NOT saying leave the encryption key ANYWHERE near the installer. It literally takes a short string to unlock the fire, and the contents are actually encrypted. The packaging time would be trivial, and it could contain just the obvious media that's huge, like maps and textures, which would likely be finished and considered complete well before the final code-changes are done.
Basically, all the large **** that can be completed early is in this uber-large, key-encrypted file. Then on a certain day, you release a smaller installer that has the encryption key inside and the extra files like the DLL's and such.
All you have to do is seed it and the rest of it will take care of it self.. No worries. I'll do it guys..
The cool thing about BitTorrent is that you upload the file while you're still downloading it. Its not like Kazaa where you only upload full files.
I've gotten close to 100k/s On BitTorrent before- consider that most download sites, with the exception of line sites like FilePlanet and FileShack, will give crappy DL speeds as a result of too many people on them.
What is new about that ?
eDonkey, eMule, xMule, Overnet, etc...
2) Bittorrent limits your connections based on your upload bandwidth. If you want fastest downloads, you either don't limint your upload or you set it appropriately. (Some connections do better with proper limits so that the upload isn't throttled by the download.)
3) Having an official tracker/seed ensures all of us that the file is real and not some spoof.
4) BT is written in python. There are commandline versions available for windows and linux that you could use on your server if you wanted to.
5) For the initial release it won't matter if people close BT as soon as they finish. With a hugely demanded file, there will be plenty of downloads going on while most people download. They will share with each other as they download and speeds should be excellent until the majority of the people have downloaded the update. When the official seed is the only full seed remaining, then it's basically like using normal download methods.
(I plan on using BT for some upcoming DLs on my own site for these same reasons. I simply can't afford to pay for huge bandwidth spikes and this is a great way to alleviate the problem.)
I love BitTorrent. While I can only push 80KB/s upstream, on BT networks with lots of users I usually don't have any trouble maxing myself out at 350KB/s.
Course, because I have a monthly transfer cap, I can't afford to keep the window open after I finish, but I do set my upstream limit at 70KB/s so that I can at least pump that much into the network while I download.
Also magnet links can have http links in them to.
With shareaza theys no need for any tracker all you need is to post magnet link on the site.
this is a megnet link with out the http link. magnet:?xt=urn:bitprint:F3MF6YWEMNU64HTBA3NRATZVLO5N3NIR.D3HQZRKR3RQNVQHXLMWIF24WF32USIW5PCXBBWQ&dn=Shareaza1899.exe
this is megnet link with http link
magnet:?xt=urn:bitprint:F3MF6YWEMNU64HTBA3NRATZVLO5N3NIR.D3HQZRKR3RQNVQHXLMWIF24WF32USIW5PCXBBWQ&dn=Shareaza1899.exe&xs=http://www.kiwiuk.net/Shareaza1899.exe&xs=http://homepage.ntlworld.com/david.allison33/Shareaza1899.exe&xs=http://webpages.charter.net/kevogod/files/Shareaza1899.exe
has you can see you can have more than one http link with in a megnet link....
If the people at natural-selection dont what to run shareaza they can just post a magnet with http link with in it and the p2p Gnutella2 network will take the load.. Also Gnutella2 is faster than BitTorrent.
For more info go to <a href='http://www.shareaza.com' target='_blank'>http://www.shareaza.com</a> and magnet links are here <a href='http://www.sharelive.com' target='_blank'>http://www.sharelive.com</a>
lol
You do of course realize that those are all the same program ?
hehe
Just to be a little trollish here, that isn't mathematically proven <i>yet</i>. I'm still holding out for p=np. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> God that would rock.
Just to be a little trollish here, that isn't mathematically proven <i>yet</i>. I'm still holding out for p=np. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> God that would rock. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
With that happening we could all pack our bags, as with only trivial problems left,
we could better let some monkeys do the work...
You won't have to worry about a hypothetical early decryption of a game data file then...
If you want a Bittorrent release, organize it. Get people together who will be willing to put the file up for sharing. Track down someone with uber bandwith willing to get the ball rolling. You have a month to get some people interested in it, so get cracking! <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bingo - Romano wins the prize.
Bitorrent sounds like a good solution. With my DSL coming next monday, it'd be a shame not to utilize the 256kb/s upload with no cap on 7/31!
Maybe getting it <b>too</b> fast will mean you'll be sitting in unoccupied servers, while the rest of us mugs download it!
I have 10 mbit, so I can play at the same time <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> hehehe
I will mirror it <a href='http://www.popgoestheweasel.net/nsfiles/' target='_blank'>here</a> as soon as its aviable to me.
This is has a T3 p2p file server for all the files on the site.
all links on the site are magnet links which are for shareaza runing on Gnutella2 network.
With the multitude of ways to get 2.0 I don't think it'll be a problem on The Big Day.