Are Hpb's Getting Shafted?
Stoneburg
Join Date: 2002-11-11 Member: 8174Members
Join Date: 2002-11-11 Member: 8174Members
I usually play on a US server from Sweden so I've grown accustomed to a degree of lag. With 2.0 however, some things seem to have become slightly worse. I've been away from gaming for three months and would ordinarily chalk it up to lack of practise but I'm not so sure. I played CS and was performing at maybe 70-80% but in NS it's more like 40-50%. I've also talked to other HPB's about it and they seem to agree that 2.0 makes it harder for us. Here are a few examples:
Skulking seems more difficult. This is odd, since 2.0 actually powered up the skulk.. a lot. However, bites don't seem to land much, or not at all. I would say I am doing *worse* as a skulk now then in 1.04.
Redemption is the real pain though, here's a few examples. You know how Onos are basically invulnerable when they have redemption? I've seen Marine teams with shotguns/HMG's emptying at Onos simultaneously, only causing them to redeem. Well, I go Onos with redemption and here's what happens.
I'm attacking Marine Base which is empty. I'm taking down a turret with one other turret firing at me. 2 turrets total that is. A Marine spawns and starts firing at me. My health is at 200 something and I start thinking "Guess I'll be back at the hive in a few sec, lets see if I can finish this turret." I do finish the turret, and keel over dead. 2 turrets + 1 LMG Marine killed me. Didn't even get teleported back to die at the hive.
Then I am playing Hera and there's a Lerk at the entrance annoying me. I whip out the pistol and *blam* *blam* *blam*... *poof*. I can't believe it. The damn lerk got redempted. I ask him "Was that really a lerk with redemption?!" and he says "Yeah, I usually get redemption as a lerk to keep me safe". I check his ping and it's around 40-50.
Now I guess these could be just one-off incidents but so far I think my record is to have redemption work *once* before I get killed, no matter which race I am.
For the marines it only holds true to a smaller extent. Particularily with shotguns. When I am a skulk I die as soon as someone with a shotty looks at me, but I have put as many as 3 shotgun blasts into skulks without killing them myself. I know I am on target, I'm a rather avid CS player and there's nothing wrong with my aim.
Mostly this is when there's a lot of people around, which means I get choke, but still, the Lag Compensation allows me to play CS on US servers without *too* so either this is just me or there's something a bit "off" with NS 2.0 when it comes to lag comp or some other feautures.
Skulking seems more difficult. This is odd, since 2.0 actually powered up the skulk.. a lot. However, bites don't seem to land much, or not at all. I would say I am doing *worse* as a skulk now then in 1.04.
Redemption is the real pain though, here's a few examples. You know how Onos are basically invulnerable when they have redemption? I've seen Marine teams with shotguns/HMG's emptying at Onos simultaneously, only causing them to redeem. Well, I go Onos with redemption and here's what happens.
I'm attacking Marine Base which is empty. I'm taking down a turret with one other turret firing at me. 2 turrets total that is. A Marine spawns and starts firing at me. My health is at 200 something and I start thinking "Guess I'll be back at the hive in a few sec, lets see if I can finish this turret." I do finish the turret, and keel over dead. 2 turrets + 1 LMG Marine killed me. Didn't even get teleported back to die at the hive.
Then I am playing Hera and there's a Lerk at the entrance annoying me. I whip out the pistol and *blam* *blam* *blam*... *poof*. I can't believe it. The damn lerk got redempted. I ask him "Was that really a lerk with redemption?!" and he says "Yeah, I usually get redemption as a lerk to keep me safe". I check his ping and it's around 40-50.
Now I guess these could be just one-off incidents but so far I think my record is to have redemption work *once* before I get killed, no matter which race I am.
For the marines it only holds true to a smaller extent. Particularily with shotguns. When I am a skulk I die as soon as someone with a shotty looks at me, but I have put as many as 3 shotgun blasts into skulks without killing them myself. I know I am on target, I'm a rather avid CS player and there's nothing wrong with my aim.
Mostly this is when there's a lot of people around, which means I get choke, but still, the Lag Compensation allows me to play CS on US servers without *too* so either this is just me or there's something a bit "off" with NS 2.0 when it comes to lag comp or some other feautures.
Comments
Ever since 2.0 has been released, it's an entirely different story <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
Now, Folks that upgrade redemption get saved nearly every time, regardless of how quick they're killed. I figure this isn't really a large <i>problem</i> : just an incredible annoyance that makes the game continue forever when it by all rights shouldn't.
I'm sure we'll see changes in redemption-maybe an incredibly slight nerf to fix its seemingly-5% failure rate.
Regardless, Flayra will do the right thing for NS. He always has <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Yet sometimes redemption pulls you back with 200-250 health and that's when it's annoying. Remind you I always play at the same server same 120 ping. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
Smoke some dope before you play, then you wont notice, yaknow.
I have 10mbit fiber so I'm not too fond of the idea of getting DSL <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Anyway, seems like it is just me then. The bite range on the skulk didn't get nerfed, did it?
I'm averaging 200 ping, but honestly I was better with 3-400.
My CS scores are more or less the same as ever, but I'm really having trouble with 2.0..
/me shrugs
As marine its not too hard to kill a skulk or two as most of them are running in straight line after me.
As a skulk it's harder as some marines are kind of hard to kill but im doing good most of the time.
As a gorge I don't care about my ping.
It's when I'm lerk that it gets better because I'm fond of silence/cloaking/regen and I use spikes and primal scream.
Maybe you should try tweaking your connection a little with the console like I do with the following commands:
cl_updaterate(default 20): 5 when I lag so it unlags faster, 15 when playing and 20 when I'm in an optimal server.
cl_cmdrate(default 30) : 10 when I lag(cl_flushentitypacket or connection_problem), 20 when playing and 30 when it goes too well
rate(default 3500): should be between 3000-4500
I have scripted them so I can change them in game.
<a href='http://www.summerblue.net/games/cs_report/' target='_blank'>CS report</a>
The only problem I have as a HPB, (200-350) is hitting Marines in melee. Lag can make Fades very undesirable. Someone wanted me to leave a server one day, because my ping was like 250, and I was kicking butt! <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> Just cause someone's ping sucks doesn't mean <i>they</i> should suck. There was a female player who had 600 ping and was owning Marines in a game I was in 2 months ago...
Perhaps they were foolish enough to think that you were lagging the server.
<!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I know as a celerity skulk with bad ping i often rip apart marines who just cant keep up with the lagged teleporting alien, but the real annoyance is being redeemed with a bad ping and dieing at the hive, and worse still is if that happens with a rine in ur stomach as onos then u let him free in ur base.
- RD
Redemption is the real pain though, here's a few examples. You know how Onos are basically invulnerable when they have redemption? I've seen Marine teams with shotguns/HMG's emptying at Onos simultaneously, only causing them to redeem. Well, I go Onos with redemption and here's what happens.
I'm attacking Marine Base which is empty. I'm taking down a turret with one other turret firing at me. 2 turrets total that is. A Marine spawns and starts firing at me. My health is at 200 something and I start thinking "Guess I'll be back at the hive in a few sec, lets see if I can finish this turret." I do finish the turret, and keel over dead. 2 turrets + 1 LMG Marine killed me. Didn't even get teleported back to die at the hive.
Then I am playing Hera and there's a Lerk at the entrance annoying me. I whip out the pistol and *blam* *blam* *blam*... *poof*. I can't believe it. The damn lerk got redempted. I ask him "Was that really a lerk with redemption?!" and he says "Yeah, I usually get redemption as a lerk to keep me safe". I check his ping and it's around 40-50.
Now I guess these could be just one-off incidents but so far I think my record is to have redemption work *once* before I get killed, no matter which race I am.
For the marines it only holds true to a smaller extent. Particularily with shotguns. When I am a skulk I die as soon as someone with a shotty looks at me, but I have put as many as 3 shotgun blasts into skulks without killing them myself. I know I am on target, I'm a rather avid CS player and there's nothing wrong with my aim.
Mostly this is when there's a lot of people around, which means I get choke, but still, the Lag Compensation allows me to play CS on US servers without *too* so either this is just me or there's something a bit "off" with NS 2.0 when it comes to lag comp or some other feautures. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Really? With the skulk you just need to 'see' through the mouth when its biting (1/2 second sights)
Anyway, this has been a problem. I've also ran into the problem of getting redeemed and then dieing for some reason... As in taking 20 hp+7ap after I'm back at the hive... (Yes, I'm a hud-****.) I usually get a 100-150 ping cause I'm on a cable router. The shotgun deal is probably packet loss/flux on the server. With the onos bit, marines can only take down an onos if they have like 5 guys shooting at it WITH turrets... but then again they usually go get redeemed...
Perhaps they were foolish enough to think that you were lagging the server.
<!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh, God, I can't tell you how much that ideaology's **** me off. I really don't think my feeble computer and connection rate would have an effect on your superfast server, but I've been banned on a TFC server because they thought my 300 lag was screwing up the server.
Anyways, As a personal experiance, I find that occsionally it's really hard to bite off someone's head. The biggest headache I have is lagging out of a server, especially after just getting HA/Gun or if I'm in the comm chair.
Well I'm not a professionnal but if it was optimized, maybe it was for and optimized connection on an optimal server <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> . You can play with cl_updaterate 20 , cl_cmdrate 30 and rate 3500; its works fine if you can connect yourself at 52000bps v.92 modem with a very good isp. But if you connect yourself at 33666bps in a crowded server you WILL cl_flushentitypacket problem. That's why you must get down updaterate and cmdrate to ensure you don't have to many packets comming in your small connection. Adjusting rate accordingly will help also.
I connect myself consistantly at 48000bps(good for 56k) with a kind of good/medium isp not too crowded.
I have to set my rate between 3500-4200 because I connect myself good;
but I must get down my cl_updaterate and cl_cmdrate to 15/20 respectively because the server sends me to many packets at once and I choke/loss.
-----------<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'>PACKETS</span>
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I believe that a lot of the redempt-then-die stuff is really caused by lag compensation. The person who killed you shot the bullet when (to them) you were still there, even if (to you) you were back in the hive. The server does it's little trust-the-client thing and applies the damage to you anyway.
What sort of details do you want and where do you want me to send it?
The skulking has improved so I guess it was just me (I would say it is almost at 1.04 level now) but the rest is the same.