Observations On 2.0
X_Stickman
Not good enough for a custom title. Join Date: 2003-04-15 Member: 15533Members, Constellation
Not good enough for a custom title. Join Date: 2003-04-15 Member: 15533Members, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">Now that we're used to it</div> Right, first some rules: This is not a balance thread, this is not a "X in 1.04 was better", this is observations on 2.0. Like what you have noticed that is different from 2.0, what you are pleased about etc, but don't turn this into another Balance thread. Actually, focus on what you have noticed people doing, not the gameplay mechanics (or at least, don't go in to much detail).
Here are some of the things i've noticed:
Marines seem to go around in squads more, and seem less inclined to go off and do their own thing.
Marines hardly ever win. (I know this is borderline balance discussion, but it's true). I've seen about 3 marine victories in all i think.
Some people are still stuck in the 1.04 mentality, shouting things like "Omg n00b gorg put sense first!!1111" and "OMG!!!11111111 5 GORGES11221319"
People seem to F4 and quit a LOT more often. Today i played a game where i was alien, we started losing and then all of a sudden, all but 3 of the alien team quit for various reasons. Thanks to a lot of good teamwork, we started to pull the game back (7 - 3 and we started WINNING), then some more people joined the aliens. The final team count was 2 on the marines, and 8 on the aliens. People seem to hate losing even more in 2.0
I get incredably angry trying to tell Lerks for the 50th time that Spores don't work on Heavy Armour, and it would be better to use Umbra so we can get in close. One the other day called me a stupid n00b for saying that.
I keep getting asked what the icon next to my name is (Constellation) <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
A lot of clans have quit and....
A lot of annoying people have started playing.
Well, that's about it for me really.
Here are some of the things i've noticed:
Marines seem to go around in squads more, and seem less inclined to go off and do their own thing.
Marines hardly ever win. (I know this is borderline balance discussion, but it's true). I've seen about 3 marine victories in all i think.
Some people are still stuck in the 1.04 mentality, shouting things like "Omg n00b gorg put sense first!!1111" and "OMG!!!11111111 5 GORGES11221319"
People seem to F4 and quit a LOT more often. Today i played a game where i was alien, we started losing and then all of a sudden, all but 3 of the alien team quit for various reasons. Thanks to a lot of good teamwork, we started to pull the game back (7 - 3 and we started WINNING), then some more people joined the aliens. The final team count was 2 on the marines, and 8 on the aliens. People seem to hate losing even more in 2.0
I get incredably angry trying to tell Lerks for the 50th time that Spores don't work on Heavy Armour, and it would be better to use Umbra so we can get in close. One the other day called me a stupid n00b for saying that.
I keep getting asked what the icon next to my name is (Constellation) <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
A lot of clans have quit and....
A lot of annoying people have started playing.
Well, that's about it for me really.
Comments
Only caveat is marine wins are increasing (on pubs), where they're figuring out how they can get by the standard alien expansion strategies. Which is making things more interesting.
Same happened to DoD, less regulars players left due to annoying ignorant people who joined when it went retail, NS is the future for HL
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I've observed something to this effect, but rather the players' are stuck in the early 2.0 mentality where, although all chambers are viable, they insist on sensory first - every round.
Also, In some pubs, I've observed alien greed - that is to say that no one is willing to go gorge and spend their precious res. The entire alien team stays skulks and attempts to get as many kills as they can to evolve to onos ( or whatever lifeform they like the most). As a commander in some pubs, I wondered why, after the gametimer had reached the 10:00 minute mark, why the res tower score was 6 vs 1. gg Alien greed.
I keep getting asked what the icon next to my name is (Constellation) <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes
that gets asked to me alot also, I have N/P telling ppl about it, but what I don't like are some ppl who bad mouth the constellation members.
Someone asked what that Icon next to my name was, before I answered him some player typed
"Hes just some loser who who sent in 5 bucks to the Dev team to get an Icon, ignor him."
How does donating to Flayra make me a loser, what person donates just to get the Icon? why should I be ignored....<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
I had never seen this guy before and I never want to see him again!
JERK!
People seem to F4 and quit a LOT more often.
I get incredably angry trying to tell Lerks for the 50th time that Spores don't work on Heavy Armour.
A lot of annoying people have started playing. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes, I've seen this quite a lot anymore... though, sensory isn't always the best chamber. Sure, it cloaks structures and allows you to use scent of fear. And you can run around cloaked... But the Cloaking ability (the one you have to evolve) I think is useless, you have to be standing still and nowhere near an observatory... anyway, I usually like movement first defence second sensory last. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
GG to the 4 gorges doing this on my team this morning <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> v2.0 managed to break NS out of the 1-gorge only syndrome, but it also effectively killed the timid "sit around and collect res" gorge. Some people still don't understand how greatly the RFK system can benefit the alien team. Don't play the shy gorge people...join the frontline and help kill marines!
Personally, I think scent of fear is the best upgrade out there, but it's easily countered by MT. I like to find groupd of marines and decimate them (I'm a skulk or gorge almost all the time). I also like to stay skulk for the 20 more res past the starting 25 (usually RFK points) and then gorge and drop a hive.
Most of all I like the abundance of new strategies that are prevalent in 2.0. It's like playing 1.0x all over again in the beginning (before it was clearly defined that the marines would jp/hmg rush, and the aliens defended against that)
I think the two railguns helped that along too. <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
I really thing NS will be the last good HL mod. The HL engine is too old, and that's starting to show. I almost wish that the NS team had waited, and then made NS for the UT2003 engine. Either way, I agree with pretty much all your points, although I rarely see the F4 problems.
I thought I was making people HAPPIER by F4ing when it was just the marine standoff in the spawn. Seriously, it gets annoying after about half an hour of wave after wave of aliens almost destroying the spawn.
People keep on commanding like it's 1.04.
Most commanders will always push for a second hive no matter what. They won't cap res just go for the hives.
I think some people need to realise just how good the gorg in combat is now. Spit is a powerful weapon now, and next to bite as a skulk, it is my favourite weapon as aliens. With cleverly placed OCs, and some decent hunting, a gorg is a very powerful unit, especialy with bile bomb. I took out 6 marines in one go today as a gorg <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> Never done it before (and probably never again), but i was still dancing around like a hyper active 6 year old on a trampoline <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
I think some people need to realise just how good the gorg in combat is now. Spit is a powerful weapon now, and next to bite as a skulk, it is my favourite weapon as aliens. With cleverly placed OCs, and some decent hunting, a gorg is a very powerful unit, especialy with bile bomb. I took out 6 marines in one go today as a gorg <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> Never done it before (and probably never again), but i was still dancing around like a hyper active 6 year old on a trampoline <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
"Gorge"
Yes, as has already been pointed out, marines are only as good as their comm, even more so that 1.04. On the other hand, a good comm needs decent marines who LISTEN and WORK TOGETHER.
Aliens have to, and I mean HAVE TO secure resources. I was playing on Eclipse earlier today as aliens. Marines very quickly secured EC and CC, and locked them down pretty good. But while they did that, we aliens took every resource node in the map not in those 2 hives. With that much res, and teamwork, we were victorious. One of the best 2.0 games I've played yet. Victory for the aliens depends on securing resources. Victory for the marines depends on KEEPING aliens from securing resources.
It's still hard to see what's happening when you start biting as skulk.
I've played more Gorge than anything else in 2.0. I've found it's not as intimidating as I once thought. In 1.04, I gorged maybe once. Due to the res system of 1.04, I was terrified of screwing things up for my team, so I never had a chance to learn to gorge. Now that I can gorge without hurting my team, I find I'm pretty good at it. I'm still terrified of comming though...
Lerk is fun and fearsome, but man, there sure are times I wish I could bite people...
Bilebombs = bunker busters. Especially coming from multiple gorges at once. People still try to take out turret farms with onos though. Oh well.
I miss babblers <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo--> R.I.P. little buddies: <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif'><!--endemo-->
<i>Edit: I just realized that I contradicted myself... I said I only gorged once, yet I said I missed babblers. I meant that I only gorged once or twice in early game in 1.04, but I LOVED to gorge at end-game when the res was flowing and babble the base. The sight of so many mindless skulk-drones running aimlessly about eating marines was great </i> <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
The players refuse to adapt.
The players refuse to learn.
Marines complain more than is really necessary.
Truly obnoxious people are going aliens because aliens win.
People who can't and indeed won't comm still somehow think that they're entitled to tell the comm that they know better. I'm not talking constructive criticism either.
If you didn't play from 1.04 onwards, you're a n00b.
If you did, you're still living in it.
Res towers are the only way to win with Kharaa. Defend the res towers, and cap new ones. Anything other than defend the hive. Because we can push the marines back with only one hive if we have all the res and they have HA, GL, shotties and turret farms all over the shop and are currently midtrain to hive 3.
<!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo-->
I don't understand where these people come from.
shotguns are more common, jetpacks aren't, and mines have also grown somewhat rare.
gotta agree on the aliens greed, instead of taking 50 res and putting up a hive players tend to go fade or continue building up for onos.
I keep getting asked what the icon next to my name is (Constellation) <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes
that gets asked to me alot also, I have N/P telling ppl about it, but what I don't like are some ppl who bad mouth the constellation members.
Someone asked what that Icon next to my name was, before I answered him some player typed
"Hes just some loser who who sent in 5 bucks to the Dev team to get an Icon, ignor him."
How does donating to Flayra make me a loser, what person donates just to get the Icon? why should I be ignored....<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
I had never seen this guy before and I never want to see him again!
JERK! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
wow that's quite stupid of him.
2.0 wouldnt have been possible without constellation donations.
NS2.0 killed my inner child.
I've also contacted Flay many times about sorting out payment, as I can't PayPal and I don't like mailing cash.
It's **** me off tbh, I keep contacting him wanting to give him money, and yet he _STILL_ ignores me, I know he's busy, but darnit!
Another time, in #natsel, he asks if anybody could host him an HLTV server, I offer, he asks for the details, I give them to him and then what? Nothing! Not a thank you, not an "OK!" - Not even a "Thanks anyway" - He just leaves. That's just plain rude.
<b>Edit:</b> And I still think that it should be 1 hive = lerk, 2 hives = fade, 3 hives = Onos. I can live with everything else, but the 1.04 system (I'm not stuck in the past Necrosis) was the best (In that sense)
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Anyone that says the aliens are weak, or that the game is totally balanced, obviously hasn't done any of the things I mentioned above. Aliens are soundly beating marines in 9 out of 10 competitive games, and this is due to a couple last minute changes we made at the end of our private beta. The game that had finally gotten balanced near the end, was no longer as fun as it should've been, so we took the risk and traded balance for fun. That's what 2.0 is. It's fun, but not balanced yet.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->When you watch a clan game and watch skulks just owning marines all game every game, there is definitely something wrong. Posting "OMG Flayz0r is listening to the whiners give it a couple weeks" is not only totally useless feedback, it's irritating.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I am getting tired of having to post these <a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=31&t=41193' target='_blank'>quotes</a> every time some monkey takes it into his head to (wrongly) state that 2.0 is balanced and that it is either the newbieness of the server, the commander, or players in general (who are somehow to stupid to figure out how to play a game in anything less than 2+ months) that are responsible for continuous unproportional marine loses instead of the obvious case of game imbalance that it is.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Truly obnoxious people are going aliens because aliens win.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->Ugh.... yes.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->If you didn't play from 1.04 onwards, you're a n00b.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->I'm so pathetic. I'm sorry. <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
Yes, I do hate sensory first. Although it can be used to really annoy marines, it's upgrades have no real "hitting power", i.e, celerity, regen, redemption, silence (yes, silence <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> ) and so sensory first nearly ALWAYS leads to a long endgame.
I keep getting asked what the icon next to my name is (Constellation) <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes
that gets asked to me alot also, I have N/P telling ppl about it, but what I don't like are some ppl who bad mouth the constellation members.
Someone asked what that Icon next to my name was, before I answered him some player typed
"Hes just some loser who who sent in 5 bucks to the Dev team to get an Icon, ignor him."
How does donating to Flayra make me a loser, what person donates just to get the Icon? why should I be ignored....<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
I had never seen this guy before and I never want to see him again!
JERK! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Things like this should be a bannable offense.
Yes, Constellation members shouldnt get special treatment, but they dont deserve to be singled out and rediculed because of it either...that is just wrong.. <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
btw, Im not a constellation member, Im simply not in the financial situation where i can donate money, worthy cause or not.
This feeling is amplified in 2.0, because teamwork is oh-so-important for the marines. That's why I like it, you CANNOT win on marines unless you use teamwork. That means people have to get out of their CS mentality of 'I-can-go-around-and-kill-everything-by-myself' if they want their guns, cuz they're not getting any guns from me.
Secondly, now on the servers its usually a pseudo-vote to pick first and second chamber. This means games dominated by new players or old players both get the chamber they NEED, rather than hamstringing themselves just because one players wants a certain chamber.