To Those That Feel Grenades Are Unbalanced...
Tiax
Join Date: 2003-05-28 Member: 16802Members
Join Date: 2003-05-28 Member: 16802Members
I see many complaints in servers and I see many suggetions for change. However grenades are not overpowered. Heres why:
While a GL can bypass umbra and explode in a radius it has a very slow reload time. (Granted there is currently an 'exploit' out that bypasses this, if its considered an exploit). Etherway, another major drawback of the GL is the fact that its long range only. Once an alien is biting at your heels you ether shoot and miss, shoot and blow both of you up, or do nothing.
Just the other day my whole team was onos except one gorge and they were crying about grenade spam. I went in as a silence/carapace skulk and took down all 5 grenade launcher people. There were no turrets as they were taken out by the gorges bilebomb (you seeing a pattern yet?)
Constant grenade spam was easy to get by, I just used leap and took minimal damage. From there the grenade people could do nothing to me except risk blowing themselves up. I took out the GL guys and both armories (armories dropped once GL's were down cause the onos's charged.)
Seems the only people I ever see complaining about grenades are the onos's. There are other things to evolve to and none are obsolete during the end game. If your team is all one type of alien then the marines will have an easy time countering it. Thus making any gun appear overpowered.
If your team is a mix of various things then the marines are forced to be mixed as well. Meaning there will be less 'spam'.
Comments, Thoughts, Stories?
While a GL can bypass umbra and explode in a radius it has a very slow reload time. (Granted there is currently an 'exploit' out that bypasses this, if its considered an exploit). Etherway, another major drawback of the GL is the fact that its long range only. Once an alien is biting at your heels you ether shoot and miss, shoot and blow both of you up, or do nothing.
Just the other day my whole team was onos except one gorge and they were crying about grenade spam. I went in as a silence/carapace skulk and took down all 5 grenade launcher people. There were no turrets as they were taken out by the gorges bilebomb (you seeing a pattern yet?)
Constant grenade spam was easy to get by, I just used leap and took minimal damage. From there the grenade people could do nothing to me except risk blowing themselves up. I took out the GL guys and both armories (armories dropped once GL's were down cause the onos's charged.)
Seems the only people I ever see complaining about grenades are the onos's. There are other things to evolve to and none are obsolete during the end game. If your team is all one type of alien then the marines will have an easy time countering it. Thus making any gun appear overpowered.
If your team is a mix of various things then the marines are forced to be mixed as well. Meaning there will be less 'spam'.
Comments, Thoughts, Stories?
Comments
Agreed, on Waste Handling, Onos have to crouch to get through, and if a Skulk leaps, he can be shredded by turret fire, and Gorges can't exunctly Bile bomb the place from 50 feet below them.
But people complain of it because it's used to spam base entrances and extending the game in a constant stalemate <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Which is why you rarely ever see a gl get out of thier base or even used at all unless its the endgame stalemate or he is taking down a hive
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
Just the other day my whole team was onos except one gorge and they were crying about grenade spam. I went in as a silence/carapace skulk and took down all 5 grenade launcher people. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Try doing that in an endgame stalemate where there are 5 gls accompanied by 3, ha's with shotties, if the marine team gives everybody gls and just spams they deserve to die(i havent seen this happen in any game i have played except for on one map where there is no way to leap into the base because theres only 2 tiny entrances to guard)
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Constant grenade spam was easy to get by, I just used leap and took minimal damage. From there the grenade people could do nothing to me except risk blowing themselves up. I took out the GL guys and both armories (armories dropped once GL's were down cause the onos's charged.) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Once again, try doing this in a game where the entire team doesnt have gls, it is impossible to survive even if you get past nade spam, you will quickly be shot by 5 marines with hmgs or shotties
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->There are other things to evolve to and none are obsolete during the end game. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
except for lerk, since the whole team will most likely be outfitted with ha's, and skulk if the stalemate is at a hive not a dbl res point because a skulk would be useless without xeno
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> If your team is a mix of various things then the marines are forced to be mixed as well. Meaning there will be less 'spam'. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Try playing in servers that have more than 5 people on a team
Its like a bilebomb where BBs can't get oo, it just takes longer, plus you can take marines with you when you xeanocide.
Sugesstion: change the GLs reload system to 1.04, make it reload faster but not being able to be charged by armory. The GLs slowpoke reload kind of **** me off all the time so i never use it really unless to scare off some gorges in vents.
Oh yeah i also have made some screens of that "fortress" in spec mode.
<a href='http://www.shark5060.net/forum/fricken/spambase1.jpg' target='_blank'>Pic1</a>
<a href='http://www.shark5060.net/forum/fricken/spambase2.jpg' target='_blank'>Pic2</a>
<a href='http://www.shark5060.net/forum/fricken/spambase3.jpg' target='_blank'>Pic3</a>
Its like a bilebomb where BBs can't get oo, it just takes longer, plus you can take marines with you when you xeanocide. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
If they're squirreled up in the last hive spamming grenades from multiple armories with heavy armor...Xenocide isn't an option.
Personally, I would remove the armory's ability to load ammo directly into the GL's clip. To compensate, the GL would have shotgun-style reloading, allowing the user to fire a partially-loaded clip. Not perfectly realistic, but it would give the GL some much-needed flexibilty in the heat of combat.
Its like a bilebomb where BBs can't get oo, it just takes longer, plus you can take marines with you when you xeanocide. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Xenocide is trying to get into marine start with the spammers.
Why can't everyone just face the fact that Tier 3 marines that are working together are almost impossible to beat if you are assualting them. Likewise with Tier 3 aliens...except Tier 3 aliens can't get into the same position.
This is the real key. If you can kill the turret farms, it's easy to get past GL spam. (Well, relatively easy) However, people are complaining about those times where you CAN'T kill the turret farms without standing either in front of the turrets (death) or IN the GL spam (death). If you haven't seen it, don't say "you are all just whining because in this OTHER situation I could do ______________ ".
But the problem is, i have NEVER seen any rine team actually turn it around and win after being holed up for 20-30 minutes gren spamming, i would rather have the spammming be taken away then waste my time waiting for them to give up and end the game
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Here is a little idea: how about if a weapon with no ammo is dropped, it is instantly disassembled. Means aliens have some chance of destroying marine arsenal, but still keeps some of the fun of grabbing dropped weapons in.
Unfortunately, does nothing to solve nade spam. Sorry, OP.
I dissagree with this point.
I've seen rines, on many MANY occasions, simply spam nades directly at a target around their feet. Yes, the explosion hurts the rine. But it kills the skulk. And since HA's are basically walking armour containers, all the HA needs is a quick weld and he's right as rain. The self damage from a grenade is pretty pathetic if you ask me. Rines aren't scared to take a little splash themselves, because it will hurt far less than an uncontrolled skulk. So they just nuke the poor thing at point blank, and forget about the 20 armour they lost because someone else will be around to weld them. What this does is turn the grenade launcher from a "long range only" weapon to a "any damn range you can hit from" weapon. Personally, I have NEVER seen a rine kill himself with his own grenade. Maybe if it happened a little more often, rines wouldn't be so wreckless with where they lobbed those suckers in small rooms <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
Anyways, just wanted to get that off my chest. Carry on! <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Because its not a fact. At some times maybe but ive broken the so called 'stalemates' many times. The best way to stop a stalemate is to not let it happen. At any rate I believe the reason im so successful at stopping stalemates is because I target structures and the marine res, not people.
I don't go in and bite up the marine, I go in and destroy a turret. One turret costs res to replace. You cost the marines res and they eventually lose (assuming of course its their last stand and they have one res node. If you let them secure 3 or more that good then the aliens have lost, not the marines <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Because its not a fact. At some times maybe but ive broken the so called 'stalemates' many times. The best way to stop a stalemate is to not let it happen. At any rate I believe the reason im so successful at stopping stalemates is because I target structures and the marine res, not people.
I don't go in and bite up the marine, I go in and destroy a turret. One turret costs res to replace. You cost the marines res and they eventually lose (assuming of course its their last stand and they have one res node. If you let them secure 3 or more that good then the aliens have lost, not the marines <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
You would be amazed how long rines can survive with just one res node....
But the problem is, i have NEVER seen any rine team actually turn it around and win after being holed up for 20-30 minutes gren spamming, i would rather have the spammming be taken away then waste my time waiting for them to give up and end the game <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have at least twice. The marines got enough res from their one node and RFK from turrets/gl spam that they pushed out and took the map.
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