Swearing (and To A Lesser Extent, Racism)
X_Stickman
Not good enough for a custom title. Join Date: 2003-04-15 Member: 15533Members, Constellation
Not good enough for a custom title. Join Date: 2003-04-15 Member: 15533Members, Constellation
in Discussions
<div class="IPBDescription">*WHY* Is it offensive?</div> I've been thinking about it more and more recently. A swear word is just that, a word. What's so offensive about it? Why are little children prohibited from hearing swears? They're going to hear them sooner or later anyway, why hide them from the world?
Then i had an idea... If all swearing based censorship was just gotten rid of, in a few years (maybe one or two generations), swearing wouldn't even exist. Today's swears would just be words to use to amplify a point. People shouldn't be offended by a word, not at all. But they <b>will</b> if they're taught from birth that swearing is bad. And we all know that if someone is told not to do something, they invariably will do it. It's just nature. So censorship, in my opinion, leads to more swearing amoung young children (and people in general) than it would if censorship simply didn't exist. I can remember right back to year 4-5 in my old school (that's when i was about... 8-10 i think), and there was tons of swearing all over the place.
And racism. Why is "Black" offensive to some people, but "White" is a perfectly acceptable word? My thoughts are, if you find "Black" or other words (like the 'n' word) offensive, then it's <b>you</b> who is the racist, as <b>you're</b> the one that finds it an insult to be black/muslim/jew or whatever...
Anyway, i think that if censorship involving words (and nudity, probably) was gotten rid of completely, the world would become a generally better place. "Bad", "Offensive" and "Swear" words would fade away in importance, becomming simply "Words".
As that old saying goes: "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me." Why doesn't it apply to everything?
Your views?
Then i had an idea... If all swearing based censorship was just gotten rid of, in a few years (maybe one or two generations), swearing wouldn't even exist. Today's swears would just be words to use to amplify a point. People shouldn't be offended by a word, not at all. But they <b>will</b> if they're taught from birth that swearing is bad. And we all know that if someone is told not to do something, they invariably will do it. It's just nature. So censorship, in my opinion, leads to more swearing amoung young children (and people in general) than it would if censorship simply didn't exist. I can remember right back to year 4-5 in my old school (that's when i was about... 8-10 i think), and there was tons of swearing all over the place.
And racism. Why is "Black" offensive to some people, but "White" is a perfectly acceptable word? My thoughts are, if you find "Black" or other words (like the 'n' word) offensive, then it's <b>you</b> who is the racist, as <b>you're</b> the one that finds it an insult to be black/muslim/jew or whatever...
Anyway, i think that if censorship involving words (and nudity, probably) was gotten rid of completely, the world would become a generally better place. "Bad", "Offensive" and "Swear" words would fade away in importance, becomming simply "Words".
As that old saying goes: "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me." Why doesn't it apply to everything?
Your views?
Comments
I think people need their priorities straighted out sometimes... someone's sig once said something that kinda hits on it: "god forbid your children learn the word *** while they're busy blowing each other into chunks of bloodied meat"
but i dont want to go there for now, so im focusing on the swearing.
yes, swearings power comes from the censorship.
some people dont like swearing because it offends God/ your mother/ your posh friends.
some people (including myself) dont like swearing because its base, simple and unimaginative.
the language suffers when children grow up overusing these few meaningless words.
well, they have no specific meaning anyway. you can be much sharper with meaningful words, than if you simply rattle off a list of obscenaties.
still, i guess im only being idealistic (and hypocritical) as i still swear myself... though i try not to swear in an agressive context.
in conclusion, swearing has its moments, but is pretty stupid most of the time.
hammers are good when you use them to hit nails, but when you always carry one with you and smack other people with it, people tend to forget it's real use around you <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
I don't swear THAT often, and generaly reserv it for screaming at the top of my lungs when I am hurt (or REALY **** off, but that dosn't hapen that much)
As for the OTHER half of your argument.... Your steping to far and missing the point of racial slurs.
A slur is not a slur if the eprson using it dosn't intend it to be.
N**** is ussed SO heavily by the black population, It is not ment to be an insult (generaly).
Same thing goes for:
g*y
quere
f4g
etc etc etc, They are no longer an attack when ussed by members of that comunity (and often by people who understand that many g*ys use these words as sort of an empowerment thing)
However, when you get your KKK member screaming N***** at a bunch of balck kids, then there is offence ment and taken. B/c With that word the conotate every bad steryotype that goes along with it.
Words have power, mainly b/c each word has alot of things tied in with it.
i like the power behind swear words. it's nice to have a separate tier of words with those connotations.
RACISM... racism, racism, racism. without racism and other like ideas, the world would not be as diverse... and i don't bother myself with other people's opinions.
BUT.
racism often carries into decisions.
insults.
employment.
beating.
murders.
and THOSE are why i <i>hate</i> racism.
Different coultures make the world diverse.
Racism harms diversity, making those that are different fear and keep away from (or try and conform) to those of us who are part of the majority.
Raceism is bad, there is nothing good about it.
i didn't say racism was good.. do i even need to say that i didn't say.. confusion.
but yes, racism does make the world diverse. if every human being acknowledged that we were all equal, la di da, then where's the identity?
i dunno about you, but certain people hating me makes me appreciate the love more.
edit: without hate, violence, racism, prejudice..this world would be SO boring. and what reason would there be to appreciate peace, also?
moreover.. there would BE no peace. the opposite must exist, no?
edit2: to elaborate on that last note, a perfect world wouldn't be "love & peace", it would be zombification.
I swear somewhat. Usually to emphasise what I'm feeling, such as "Damn Vacuum" and "This stuff tastes like ****" etc.
Swears are like a pressure release valve. Excessive amounts of it, along with something to destroy with a base ball bat, certainly relieves the bottled up rage and anguish etc. It tells others how you feel, and can be expressive if used correctly.
If every second word is a swear, your not using them right. Your just swearing for swearings sake, and that is not right. Swearing because you nailed your hand to a desk, or your mother just died, or because you wish to express yourself is alright in my books.
G4y has lost it's true meaning over time. Originally it meant Happy. F4g also has lost it's original meaning, it used to mean thin long stick.
Words such as **** though... No. Unacceptable. That word was created for the sole purpose of denigrating an entire subset of humanity. When a white man uses that word, it can be misconstrued as an insult. When a black man uses the same word, it isnt as bad because of the unwritten rule of self insult. Once again, Insult is only ever in the eye of the beholder. Unless you know that those around you wont take offense to the word, never use it.
Imho, Racism is completely unacceptable. It goes on the basis that humanity is seperated, that all are inferior to some master race and that persons not of this master race are subspecies or seperate species not worthy to live.
Fact of the matter is, we are all one species, Mankind, we are all equal, and we all have the same rights as anyone else. Differential treatment on grounds of race is fallacious.
Racism has done nothing but bring pain, fear, intimidation, murder, anguish, intolerance and death to this world. Saying that it makes the world more diverse is an oxymoron, since racism seeks to destroy diversity through fear and hatred.
I have been the victim of racial slurs before. Because I'm from Australia I was told that I was descended from rapists murders and thieves. What this person forgot and omitted, was that he was American and had the SAME heritage. He also had no idea that I was the son of an immigrant. He was prejudiced, made assumptions and wholeheartedly believed that his word could never be wrong.
I rejected racism a long time ago. If there were a way to remove it from the world without hurting people, then I would do it gladly. It has no place in a modern, civilised society. Ever.
racism itself is AGAINST diversity.
but lo, what have we?
racists
and non-racists.
yet more diversity.
but i dont want to go there for now, so im focusing on the swearing.
yes, swearings power comes from the censorship.
some people dont like swearing because it offends God/ your mother/ your posh friends.
some people (including myself) dont like swearing because its base, simple and unimaginative.
the language suffers when children grow up overusing these few meaningless words.
well, they have no specific meaning anyway. you can be much sharper with meaningful words, than if you simply rattle off a list of obscenaties.
still, i guess im only being idealistic (and hypocritical) as i still swear myself... though i try not to swear in an agressive context.
in conclusion, swearing has its moments, but is pretty stupid most of the time. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Which is funny you say that, the word "F uck" actually is quite the usefull word, people use it as a verb, noun, adjective, etc. It may be "bad", but you gotta admit, it sure is **** versitile <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
The reason these words have a stigma attatched to them is because they depict things that would have been extremely taboo in older times. The stigma has remained, passed down by parent to child, but the actual thing being depicted has lost much of its impact. So now swear words are offensive because of hereditary stigma, and the real meaning of the word isn't necessary. Which is why we can use them to express just about anything and have it seen as offensive.
However, while sexual parts and sexual acts are no longer forbidden conversation between adults, you have a problem with the use of swearwords by children, because regardless of how you make use of the word, **** still means sexual intercourse. And sexual intercourse isnt something many parents want their children shouting about whenever they pick up a burning hot poptart.
teachers get mad when people say it
Actions are tied to words, and vice versa. I've always wondered what happens if the expected action don't follow the words, or expected words don't follow the action. Say, a white man treats every single black person he meets as equals with absolute respect, in all matters, since the moment he meets them, and it is widely known that he does this, yet he calls black people n*****, would people still peg him a racist? Personally, I wouldn't think so. But what if the line is a little more blurry? Could the same man be pegged as a racist if he used the same word but he doesn't treat black people with respect? What if he doesn't treat anyone with respect? It's easy to decide when something's on either side of the fence, but it's extremely difficult when it's sitting right on the fence.
What about being politically correct? Maybe being politically correct is just so that words are easier to swallow. "Black person" replaced "n*****". "Homosexual" replaced "f**". They really mean the same things don't they? All that changed is that a single word or two was replaced with more words or more technical words. What if a group of kids decides to start saying "mots" instead of "f***"? They'll look silly for doing so for a while, but what if it catches on? A word with no meaning previously (AFAIN) all of a sudden is the new no-no word that parents don't want their kids to say. Teoh raises a good point that most of the stigma of words with a negative connotation comes from previous generation which wants the newer generation to adopt THEIR standards. We end up with a compromise of sorts as the new standard which future generations WE'LL expect THEM to adopt. Political correctness is a fad of sorts for now, I wonder what's next.
#include <disclaimer.h>
Actions are tied to words, and vice versa. I've always wondered what happens if the expected action don't follow the words, or expected words don't follow the action. Say, a white man treats every single black person he meets as equals with absolute respect, in all matters, since the moment he meets them, and it is widely known that he does this, yet he calls black people n*****, would people still peg him a racist? Personally, I wouldn't think so. But what if the line is a little more blurry? Could the same man be pegged as a racist if he used the same word but he doesn't treat black people with respect? What if he doesn't treat anyone with respect? It's easy to decide when something's on either side of the fence, but it's extremely difficult when it's sitting right on the fence.
What about being politically correct? Maybe being politically correct is just so that words are easier to swallow. "Black person" replaced "n*****". "Homosexual" replaced "f**". They really mean the same things don't they? All that changed is that a single word or two was replaced with more words or more technical words. What if a group of kids decides to start saying "mots" instead of "f***"? They'll look silly for doing so for a while, but what if it catches on? A word with no meaning previously (AFAIN) all of a sudden is the new no-no word that parents don't want their kids to say. Teoh raises a good point that most of the stigma of words with a negative connotation comes from previous generation which wants the newer generation to adopt THEIR standards. We end up with a compromise of sorts as the new standard which future generations WE'LL expect THEM to adopt. Political correctness is a fad of sorts for now, I wonder what's next.
#include <disclaimer.h> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Mots that stupid mots,
Main Entry: mot
Pronunciation: 'mO
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural mots /'mO(z)/
Etymology: French, word, saying, from Late Latin muttum grunt -- more at MOTTO
Date: 1631
: a pithy or witty saying
racism itself is AGAINST diversity.
but lo, what have we?
racists
and non-racists.
yet more diversity. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
nobody answered this one.
who says yea and who says nay?
teachers get mad when people say it <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not in Middle School on up, my teachers even say damn themselves.
In fact, I once called my 4th grade teacher a "damn idiot". She sort of shrugged it off and told me to do w/e I was told to do (forgot what it was) or she would call my parents.
Bah, I ******* hated god**** Elemen-*******-tary ******* School, it sucked so much ******* ***.
I thought it might be intresting to add this to the mix. I found this quote from Abraham Lincoln.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races. I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will ever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality.
-- Abraham Lincoln, September 18, 1858<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
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