American Culture
The_Finch
Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8498Members
Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8498Members
in Discussions
<div class="IPBDescription">Off-shoot of Euro opinion thread</div> Urza said,
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Ok, here are some points why I hate the american policy ( not americans:) )
1) Environment: America refused to sign the Kyoto treaty
2) War-crimes: The US is illegally imprisoning hundreds of people without giving them a reason why. The refusal to sign the ICC treaty
3) Anti-internationalism: Negligence of the Security council. Both remarks above.
4) Rough capitalism: fact is, millions of americans are suffering from malnutrition.
5) Aggressive foreign policy. Invading Iraq.
6) Forcing their will unto others. Sky marshalls. Genetically Modified Food. Etc.
7) Pro-Israel- policy. Funding and Backing Israel without any sign of criticism.
8) Conservatism. Not allowing **** people the same rights as other people. Etc.
<b>Next to that, all I know of American culture is horrible sitcoms and Mac Donalds. .</b>
O well, and Americans are just so patriotic and selfrighteous (generalization:))<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Out of curiousity, is that all that Europe sees of American culture? Sitcoms, McDonalds and Britney Spears?
In high school, I read European authors. Shakespeare, of course, Dickens, the Bronte sisters. My freshman year of college I started reading philosophy like Locke, Descartes, Hume, Hegel and Kant. I like to think that I'm familiar with some of the more major players in cultures from Western Europe, and I was more than slightly dismayed to see that all Urza knew of American culture was McDonalds and sitcoms.
Does anybody in Europe read American authors or listen to American music (I'm referring to music like Jazz and the Blues, not Britney Spears)?
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Ok, here are some points why I hate the american policy ( not americans:) )
1) Environment: America refused to sign the Kyoto treaty
2) War-crimes: The US is illegally imprisoning hundreds of people without giving them a reason why. The refusal to sign the ICC treaty
3) Anti-internationalism: Negligence of the Security council. Both remarks above.
4) Rough capitalism: fact is, millions of americans are suffering from malnutrition.
5) Aggressive foreign policy. Invading Iraq.
6) Forcing their will unto others. Sky marshalls. Genetically Modified Food. Etc.
7) Pro-Israel- policy. Funding and Backing Israel without any sign of criticism.
8) Conservatism. Not allowing **** people the same rights as other people. Etc.
<b>Next to that, all I know of American culture is horrible sitcoms and Mac Donalds. .</b>
O well, and Americans are just so patriotic and selfrighteous (generalization:))<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Out of curiousity, is that all that Europe sees of American culture? Sitcoms, McDonalds and Britney Spears?
In high school, I read European authors. Shakespeare, of course, Dickens, the Bronte sisters. My freshman year of college I started reading philosophy like Locke, Descartes, Hume, Hegel and Kant. I like to think that I'm familiar with some of the more major players in cultures from Western Europe, and I was more than slightly dismayed to see that all Urza knew of American culture was McDonalds and sitcoms.
Does anybody in Europe read American authors or listen to American music (I'm referring to music like Jazz and the Blues, not Britney Spears)?
Comments
It's hard to avoid from listening to music/watching movies/reading books that come from USA. And many of them are good too. Thought Urza has a point: McDonalds and most of the sitcoms really sucks(they show the few best around here, and even those suck) <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Edit: Is there many great American thinkers/philosophers/writers around? I'm probably just uninformed but at least I haven't heard of many. All I can think of is Tom Clancy and Stephen King, but they are hardly thought provoking(beyond the level of 'I bet the butler did it') <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> Europeans prolly just enjoy the entertainment industry of USA. It's shame really, that we get influenced by USA only on that way.
America is the celebrity in the bunch. Not to mean that's a good thing. Everybody always looks at America with prying eyes to see what she does. America is a very bright person, though makes her fair share of mistakes. Unfortunately, like a celebrity, only the mistakes are taken notice.
Like I'm sure there are people which despise Britney Spears in everything that she does, there are those that hate America in everything she does too.
My point being, I guess, is that unfortunately, no matter what anyone can say or do, there will always be those that hate America. All I can do for those people is pity them. I do not hate countries.. I hate people who have earned merit for my hatred.
Anyway, continue <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Perhaps my post is as much a warning about judging American culture based solely on what the hot thing is today. For example, Bill O'Reilly might have written a few books, but I doubt that he'll go down in the annals of American history as one of the great writers.
It's just that whenever I read something about somebody from France or Germany or England disparaging American culture, the writing inevitably contains something about McDonalds. I never see things about great American writers like William Faulkner, John Steinbeck or Edgar Allen Poe. Or anything about American poets like Walt Whitman or Emily Dickinson. None of these people are obscure. Faulkner and Steinbeck both won a Nobel prize. Poe didn't become popular until after his death, but is by no means unheard of.
I'm just curious, I guess. Recently, every discussion I've been in or article I've read about American culture has been negative. I'd like to change the idea that America is all fast food and pop music.
<a href='http://www.literature.org/authors/poe-edgar-allan/tell-tale-heart.html' target='_blank'>Poe's Tell-tale Heart</a>
<a href='http://www2.sjsu.edu/steinbeck/Works/Journalism/Nobel_Prize_Speech.htm' target='_blank'>Steinbeck's Nobel Prize Speech</a>
<a href='http://dept.english.upenn.edu/~afilreis/88/onroad.html' target='_blank'>Excerpt from Kerouac's "On The Road"</a>
For example, I'll take language. Most people in New Zealand used to speak English...uhhh. Hmmm ok, European English, and now we are largely beginning to speak American English. For example, Colour has become Color, or it is merely acceptable to interchange them. Armour=Armor, Honour=Honor, Sulpher=Sulfer etc etc. I also see more Americanised word usage creeping into New Zealand culture, often replacing the former British words.
This example may be out of date, or inaccurate (it is based on a study from a while back) but we soon changed the word we formally used for prams, from the more European push-chair, to the American stroller. Other words have similar changed or objects have had their names effectively altered.
In Children I imagine that in a few years I'll be marking essays that don't resemble the mish mashed European/American English I speak now, but will certainly be 100% Americanised.
Just a thought.
For example, I'll take language. Most people in New Zealand used to speak English...uhhh. Hmmm ok, European English, and now we are largely beginning to speak American English. For example, Colour has become Color, or it is merely acceptable to interchange them. Armour=Armor, Honour=Honor, Sulpher=Sulfer etc etc. I also see more Americanised word usage creeping into New Zealand culture, often replacing the former British words.
This example may be out of date, or inaccurate (it is based on a study from a while back) but we soon changed the word we formally used for prams, from the more European push-chair, to the American stroller. Other words have similar changed or objects have had their names effectively altered.
In Children I imagine that in a few years I'll be marking essays that don't resemble the mish mashed European/American English I speak now, but will certainly be 100% Americanised.
Just a thought. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
And let's not forget the greatest crime of them all
Football -- Soccer
Football -- Soccer <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Heh, in New Zealand we call Football Rugby, and Soccer, well Soccer is pretty much Soccer.
Now you reminded me however, the American term 'Soccer mom' is now beginning to be used in New Zealand too. Eventually it will just be a normal I suspect.
What sitcoms exactly do get aired over there? Please don't say "Friends." Ugh, I hate that show with a passion, maybe that's why the show is ending this year?
And on a side note, we can always fall back on our trump card and say "Fine, we won't help you guys out next time Germany invades the pants off of you guys."
Thats not it at all... Nobody likes a bully. Face it, if the world were a poker game, the US would be an 800lb gorilla who's stacking the deck, and not even botehring to hide it, cause like, what are you gonna do France? Not help me go rough up the kid in the corner for throwing a peanut at me? Ya mama's boy...
Theese companys go wherever they feel they can make $$$
But is this a sign a bad thing? Before communication was thought about or needed, people rarley had contact with other cites and villages other than where they lived. Then people started trading between towns and cities and soon you have countries.
I see the same thing happening on a larger global scale. Not only is America (one of the largest economic powers in the world) spreading it's culture and ideas and products to the rest of the world, but the rest of the world is influencing American culture and culture from every where.
Since New Zealand has been brought up as being influanced by america, America is also influanced by New Zealand.
Maori tribal tatoos are becoming increasingly popular in the states.
Languages from all over the world are spoken in just about every country due to the increase in transportation and communication technology.
Personally, I don't see Globalization as somthing that is bad.
Anyway, yea, I read some great american authors like Steinbeck and Poe, Twain, ehm, Catcher in the Rye (what's his name), and listen to non-britney american music. But I guess the problem is that is is nothing compared to the constant bombardment of old series: Jake and the Fatman, the bold and the beautiful, as the world turns, Grace under fire, strong medicine, dharma and greg, etc etc etc.
On globalization: I do not personally think that the maori community has influenced the US to the same extent as that the US influenced the maori.
And even less so being reminded of the fact.
Just remember that what goes around, comes around.
No, of course not. If you think that's true, I got a Brooklyn Bridge for sale. My point being you can't generalize. You can point and make fun of the American government all you want (since their actions actually SHOW what they are). However, the actions of 1 American do not represent the actions of 260 million Americans. Try to remember that.
<!--QuoteBegin-Dr.Suredeath+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dr.Suredeath)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Well, in my views, "self-righteous" pretty much sums up USA.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Winners? Like oh, say, North Vietnam?
Shut up! We did not lose Vietnam. It was a draw.
No it wasn't. They, whooped your hide reeeeal good!!
Bonus points if you get the referance, and you really should because it's a classic <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Winners? Like oh, say, North Vietnam?
Shut up! We did not lose Vietnam. It was a draw.
No it wasn't. They, whooped your hide reeeeal good!!
Bonus points if you get the referance, and you really should because it's a classic <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
A fish called wanda <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-Dr.Suredeath+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Dr.Suredeath)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Well, in my views, "self-righteous" pretty much sums up USA.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
You're getting me in trouble there <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Shut up! We did not lose Vietnam. It was a draw.
No it wasn't. They, whooped your hide reeeeal good!!
Bonus points if you get the referance, and you really should because it's a classic <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I may be wrong... But I do remember reading something about how it was our own media and government that lost us that war... If you're thinking of the Tet Offensive, we actually "won" that. Surprised definately... But we in the end prevailed.
And to Urza... You listed a Soap Opera or two... No one deserves those shown to them. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo-->
The funny thing here is that everyone talks as if there is some plan to Americanize the rest of the world... When in fact there isn't. Could it be that there are lots and lots and lots of people outside of the US that "want" ( for lack of a better term atm ) to be American? I mean, we don't really force our culture on anyone. If there's a MacDonalds someplace then people from that country are keeping it open, so some group obviously wants it there.
It's just bothersome to see how close this is coming to blaming America for.... for what? Being popular?
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->It's just bothersome to see how close this is coming to blaming America for.... for what? Being popular?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Think about jocks and nerds. Geeks hate jocks because they are more popular and they make fun of geeks. So it's partly justified dislike and partly just envy <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I can't say I blame them afterall. If I had to eat rice and noodles everyday for my life knowing that Americans can buy hamburgers for 1 US dollar, I'd probably turn terrorist too.. (or shoot myself.. whichever comes first).
Uh, are we talking about europeans or mid-eastern people? Terrorists and reasons behind their actions don't really have anything to do with this topic.
Sorry, but that is bullcrap.
Europeans dont hate Americans. They criticize, but they dont hate. And comparing Europeans with terrorist is some of the most absurd stuff I have ever seen.
Sorry, but that is bullcrap.
Europeans dont hate Americans. They criticize, but they dont hate. And comparing Europeans with terrorist is some of the most absurd stuff I have ever seen. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
So, the response to generalising all Europeans as hating Americans is to generalise all Europeans as criticising Americans? I just want to be clear on this...
<!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' /><!--endemo-->
So far, this topic is not impressing the mods, folks. Let's get it together or it will join it's cousins in the lock bin.
the two alone are pretty bad, combine them, deadly. im serious, i was crossing the street one day and had to dive, literally <i>dive</i> to prevent from being killed/incapacitated.
the SUV itself is the epitome of mother natures greatest opposing force. the materials it takes to make the massive beast is amazing. not to mention it is a black hole for oil, a un-regenetable fossil fuel. with demand for big cars will undoutedly come demand for roads. yes, lets clear all the forests and put lovely tar in their place so we have smooth driving in our off-road SUV.
the cell phone is fairly annoying, too. i wouldn't mind them as much if it wasn't for the people that <i>use</i> the device and make it so godawful. every time your at a graduatin ceremony or church or where ever and its realy kinda quiet and solem...*beep* *beep* *beep*! .....come on. honestly. if your always talking on the phone, how could you forget it was there and not turn it off?
oh yeah, and; britney and her clones are all a product of MTV and their irrational views on music. and mcdonalds is sick. read fast food nation and you'll never eat there again. the true burger joint (i think) i famous daves <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->. those burgers aren't processed or anything. just fried up and ready for 4oz. of Rich-n-Sassy. and the true music is all underground. we don't expect foreigners to know who aesop rock, mr. lif, doseone, nosdam, rjd2, sole, blueprint or El-P are. most of us don't either.
<span style='color:gray'><span style='font-size:8pt;line-height:100%'>*if some1 posted anything pertaining to this right above me, not my fault. there could be a whole nother page in the time this took me.</span></span>
I can't say I blame them afterall. If I had to eat rice and noodles everyday for my life knowing that Americans can buy hamburgers for 1 US dollar, I'd probably turn terrorist too.. (or shoot myself.. whichever comes first). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Heh, USA has no rights bragging about cheap, delicious food.