Things That Are Not Fun In Ns
Hakujin
Join Date: 2003-05-09 Member: 16157Members, Constellation
Join Date: 2003-05-09 Member: 16157Members, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">no "deal with it" replies, please</div> I have been playing NS since 1.04, and can honestly say that it is my favorite game. However, certain elements of it are just not fun. I have heard many arguments on the I&S and Constellation forums about these items, but at the end of the day I simply think that the following game elements are NOT FUN.
<span style='font-size:17pt;line-height:100%'><u>I. Motion Tracking</u></span>
The aliens' spend most of their life as a skulk. Skulks rely on ambushes and misdirection (eg, baiting) for 90% of their kills. Of course, smart marines iwll use their ears to detect running aliens, but smart skulks can walk into position. Motion tracking completely removes this advantage. A one-time, 35 res upgrade takes all of the fear and tactical planning out of the game and instead turns it into an action game.
<i>Proposed Changes</i>
Remove the tracking circles from the game. Replace them with an audio proximity alert à la Aliens. Perhaps have 5 levels of proximity, each connected to a higher pitched whine. Run a distance check every 2 seconds and if a moving alien is detected play the wav. appropriate for the distance. This system would allow motion tracking to warn players but still maintain the SUSPENSE and tactical elements of skulk vs. LA gaemplay.
<span style='font-size:17pt;line-height:100%'><u> II. Electrification</u></span>
This upgrade renders 90% of aliens (skulks) ineffective. It also requires no intervention from marine players to be effective. The response to this is, "Use teamwork! Gorges and skulks can take down an electrified res tower." My answer is: no they can't. It takes 2 gorges and three skulks to take down an electrified res tower in a resonable amount of time. That means the alien team is 5 MEMBERS SHORT for those 2-3 minutes. In that amount of time marines can put up 2-3 electrified res towers in other locations.
<i>Proposed Changes</i>
Remove electrficiation from turret factories. Give electrification on res towers a cooldown period: when attacked, a RT electrifies for 15 seconds. After that, it has a 15 second cooldown period where skulks can attack it. This is fair to marine players (it gives them time to repond to the attack) and is fair to aliens (skulks can impact resources like vanilla marines can)
<span style='font-size:17pt;line-height:100%'><u>III. Onos</u></span>
Two factors prevent Onii from being an effective class: 1) they can be physically blocked easily 2) there is no real way to balance their health and armor between the various marines weapons (lmg, shotty, GL, hmg) and hive/chamber levels. An onos with carapace has 1900 effective hitpoints. A level 1 HMG does 2500 damage in a single clip. At level 3 it does 3250 damage.
<i>Proposed Changes</i>
a) Make the Onos invincible from the front and reduce its health / armor. This would allow an onos to protect itself and teammates. This would also be consistent with its role as "base breaker"; it could lead an attacking force down a hallway, deflecting shots until the aliens were close enough to break cover and attack. Marines could still counter this by intelligent use of ambushes (the onos would have lower health / armor) and mines. I realize this has parallels to CS's Riot Shield but the inspiration for this idea actually came from an Aliens action figure: <a href='http://www.combsnet.com/afx/aliensAF/al_rhino1.jpg' target='_blank'>Rhino Alien</a>
b) Add a 1 second stun and large knockback to Onos attacks. This would allow Onii to punch through marine lines instead of being blocked and instantly killed.
<span style='font-size:17pt;line-height:100%'><u>I. Motion Tracking</u></span>
The aliens' spend most of their life as a skulk. Skulks rely on ambushes and misdirection (eg, baiting) for 90% of their kills. Of course, smart marines iwll use their ears to detect running aliens, but smart skulks can walk into position. Motion tracking completely removes this advantage. A one-time, 35 res upgrade takes all of the fear and tactical planning out of the game and instead turns it into an action game.
<i>Proposed Changes</i>
Remove the tracking circles from the game. Replace them with an audio proximity alert à la Aliens. Perhaps have 5 levels of proximity, each connected to a higher pitched whine. Run a distance check every 2 seconds and if a moving alien is detected play the wav. appropriate for the distance. This system would allow motion tracking to warn players but still maintain the SUSPENSE and tactical elements of skulk vs. LA gaemplay.
<span style='font-size:17pt;line-height:100%'><u> II. Electrification</u></span>
This upgrade renders 90% of aliens (skulks) ineffective. It also requires no intervention from marine players to be effective. The response to this is, "Use teamwork! Gorges and skulks can take down an electrified res tower." My answer is: no they can't. It takes 2 gorges and three skulks to take down an electrified res tower in a resonable amount of time. That means the alien team is 5 MEMBERS SHORT for those 2-3 minutes. In that amount of time marines can put up 2-3 electrified res towers in other locations.
<i>Proposed Changes</i>
Remove electrficiation from turret factories. Give electrification on res towers a cooldown period: when attacked, a RT electrifies for 15 seconds. After that, it has a 15 second cooldown period where skulks can attack it. This is fair to marine players (it gives them time to repond to the attack) and is fair to aliens (skulks can impact resources like vanilla marines can)
<span style='font-size:17pt;line-height:100%'><u>III. Onos</u></span>
Two factors prevent Onii from being an effective class: 1) they can be physically blocked easily 2) there is no real way to balance their health and armor between the various marines weapons (lmg, shotty, GL, hmg) and hive/chamber levels. An onos with carapace has 1900 effective hitpoints. A level 1 HMG does 2500 damage in a single clip. At level 3 it does 3250 damage.
<i>Proposed Changes</i>
a) Make the Onos invincible from the front and reduce its health / armor. This would allow an onos to protect itself and teammates. This would also be consistent with its role as "base breaker"; it could lead an attacking force down a hallway, deflecting shots until the aliens were close enough to break cover and attack. Marines could still counter this by intelligent use of ambushes (the onos would have lower health / armor) and mines. I realize this has parallels to CS's Riot Shield but the inspiration for this idea actually came from an Aliens action figure: <a href='http://www.combsnet.com/afx/aliensAF/al_rhino1.jpg' target='_blank'>Rhino Alien</a>
b) Add a 1 second stun and large knockback to Onos attacks. This would allow Onii to punch through marine lines instead of being blocked and instantly killed.
Comments
Alien beep has been a mod before. It is incredibly annoying to marines. Also remember, aliens have their counter to motion in the form of sensory chambers. Why nerf mt when their is already a counter? Motion tracking is fine as it is. Buff the counter, sensory, which is still not useful as a first chamber.
2) Re. Electrification
Do this, but I want a 10 - 15 res electrify cost then. Its far too useless as it is, as electric nodes die once regen fades come along a few minutes into the game.
3) Re. Onos
An onos can already do this with intelligent use of stomp. Frankly no onos should fear a heavy train as long as it support by umbra and perhaps a gorge. Maybe the fact that HMGs ARE powerful and that UMBRA does nullify bullet weapons to an extent is why umbra was put in the game?
-[Ars]M&Ms
Visit the ArsClan gaming servers and our forums at www.arsclan.net
Also, I wouldn't say MT is super cheap, you can just use your sound to detect aliens just as easily. Rushing MT at the start of a game is extremlly risky and expensive to do and generally isn't worth it in my experience.
Electficication is bad? Huh? It takes about 4 min for an elec RT to pay itself off, please, elec RT's are barely worth it right now IMO, if anything they could stand to be more useful, actually, please don't, I really dislike fighting electricity as opposed to human players. Electricity, basically, is fine.
Your onos changes:
no thanks
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->II. Electrification
This upgrade renders 90% of aliens (skulks) ineffective.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
...No. It nullifies the skulk and lerk (and the gorge without bilebomb.) That's nowhere near 90%... more like 40 or 60. Eh.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Make the Onos invincible from the front and reduce its health / armor. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No...No...No. No aaaaaand NO! What is to stop onos from retreating while still facing the marines? The onos would never die, ever.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Add a 1 second stun and large knockback to Onos attacks. This would allow Onii to punch through marine lines instead of being blocked and instantly killed. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So whenever the onos gores, the marine he is attacking will fly all the way across the room? While this might be fun if the onos was completely invincible like you suggested it still wouldn't be practible or realistic.
--Edit--
All the issues you brought up are perfectly fine in game...to me anyways.
Alien beep has been a mod before. It is incredibly annoying to marines. Also remember, aliens have their counter to motion in the form of sensory chambers. Why nerf mt when their is already a counter? Motion tracking is fine as it is. Buff the counter, sensory, which is still not useful as a first chamber.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Good point. To make sensory viable, we have to make all chambers useful and possible. How about this? Remove the hive:chamber type lock. Allow aliens to build any number of any type of chamber at any time? Of course, aliens personal upgrades would be limited to one / hive but NOT limited to one / chamber. This way aliens could deploy early sensory AND mid-game defense / movement. Aliens are supposed to be able to evovle "on the fly" to respond to threats; why are they locked into one chamber / hive?
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Forlorn said:
Electficication is bad? Huh? It takes about 4 min for an elec RT to pay itself off, please, elec RT's are barely worth it right now IMO, if anything they could stand to be more useful, actually, please don't, I really dislike fighting electricity as opposed to human players. Electricity, basically, is fine.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your response overlooks the most important reason it is overpowered. Taking and holding a res, even if it takes 3 minutes to pay off, is important because it prevents the enemy from ever taking it. And, after 3 minutes, marines start earning res. There is no early counter to elecrification and by the time aliens can counter it the game is over.
Your response to Onos and umbra was spot on though. I stand corrected. It still bothers me that it takes 105 res and two aliens to counter a (25+30/x)+15 res weapon.
Your response to the huge gameplay issue I feel is present is, "the sound would be annoying?" Try to be constructive.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->...No. It nullifies the skulk and lerk (and the gorge without bilebomb.) That's nowhere near 90%... more like 40 or 60. Eh.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Skulk + Lerk +1 hive gorge is NOT 90% of the alien team up until the 6 minute mark? I'm not talking about combat - I am talking about classic. Why did you write, "eh?" Are you Canadian?
Electficication is bad? Huh? It takes about 4 min for an elec RT to pay itself off, please, elec RT's are barely worth it right now IMO, if anything they could stand to be more useful, actually, please don't, I really dislike fighting electricity as opposed to human players. Electricity, basically, is fine.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Your response overlooks the most important reason it is overpowered. Taking and holding a res, even if it takes 3 minutes to pay off, is important because it prevents the enemy from ever taking it. And, after 3 minutes, marines start earning res. There is no early counter to elecrification and by the time aliens can counter it the game is over.
Your response to Onos and umbra was spot on though. I stand corrected. It still bothers me that it takes 105 res and two aliens to counter a (25+30/x)+15 res weapon. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I hope you realize that you make no sense.
When a marine electrifies an RT, he slows down his rate of tech for a super tough node in exchange.
Therefore, the fact that electricity will keep the node for a long time is a moot point, as you won't be able to effectively use the res you get from it in time. If you do the math, electricity is only useful in certain situations when you need the extra defense.
If marines have enough res to electrify and get upgrades, then you would have lost no matter what and that's what I like to call being owned. Electricity isn't overpowering when you get owned, it's just a way of the marines telling you there's zero chance for comeback. Try harder next game.
Try harder next game.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nice personal attack.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Cxwf said:
I would point out that it doesn't take an entire team to take out elec res nodes. 30 seconds into the game, a single Gorge + Skulk can kill an elec res node in around a minute.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
People say that but it just isn't true. Here is the math: 1 skulk can do 5 bites for 375 damage before having to be healed. It takes 2 seconds to bite and then 4 seconds to be healed. So, in total, the skulk is doing 375 damage/ 6 seconds. This alone would require 96 seconds to take downa 6000hp RT. However, one gorge will not have enough energy to heal every 4/6 seconds. Alternating gorges could eliminate this problem but that requires AAA teamwork. On the other hand, an additional skulk provide a marginal return in damage because the RT can attack both at once which doubles the gorges' healing requirements. If you REALLY try to do this (especially on a pub) you will see that it takes either 3 skulks + 2 gorges + 1 minute + adrenaline OR 1 skulk + 1 gorge + 2.5 minutes.
<span style='font-size:17pt;line-height:100%'><u>I. Motion Tracking</u></span>
The aliens' spend most of their life as a skulk. Skulks rely on ambushes and misdirection (eg, baiting) for 90% of their kills. Of course, smart marines iwll use their ears to detect running aliens, but smart skulks can walk into position. Motion tracking completely removes this advantage. A one-time, 35 res upgrade takes all of the fear and tactical planning out of the game and instead turns it into an action game.
<i>Proposed Changes</i>
Remove the tracking circles from the game. Replace them with an audio proximity alert à la Aliens. Perhaps have 5 levels of proximity, each connected to a higher pitched whine. Run a distance check every 2 seconds and if a moving alien is detected play the wav. appropriate for the distance. This system would allow motion tracking to warn players but still maintain the SUSPENSE and tactical elements of skulk vs. LA gaemplay.
<span style='font-size:17pt;line-height:100%'><u> II. Electrification</u></span>
This upgrade renders 90% of aliens (skulks) ineffective. It also requires no intervention from marine players to be effective. The response to this is, "Use teamwork! Gorges and skulks can take down an electrified res tower." My answer is: no they can't. It takes 2 gorges and three skulks to take down an electrified res tower in a resonable amount of time. That means the alien team is 5 MEMBERS SHORT for those 2-3 minutes. In that amount of time marines can put up 2-3 electrified res towers in other locations.
<i>Proposed Changes</i>
Remove electrficiation from turret factories. Give electrification on res towers a cooldown period: when attacked, a RT electrifies for 15 seconds. After that, it has a 15 second cooldown period where skulks can attack it. This is fair to marine players (it gives them time to repond to the attack) and is fair to aliens (skulks can impact resources like vanilla marines can)
<span style='font-size:17pt;line-height:100%'><u>III. Onos</u></span>
Two factors prevent Onii from being an effective class: 1) they can be physically blocked easily 2) there is no real way to balance their health and armor between the various marines weapons (lmg, shotty, GL, hmg) and hive/chamber levels. An onos with carapace has 1900 effective hitpoints. A level 1 HMG does 2500 damage in a single clip. At level 3 it does 3250 damage.
<i>Proposed Changes</i>
a) Make the Onos invincible from the front and reduce its health / armor. This would allow an onos to protect itself and teammates. This would also be consistent with its role as "base breaker"; it could lead an attacking force down a hallway, deflecting shots until the aliens were close enough to break cover and attack. Marines could still counter this by intelligent use of ambushes (the onos would have lower health / armor) and mines. I realize this has parallels to CS's Riot Shield but the inspiration for this idea actually came from an Aliens action figure: <a href='http://www.combsnet.com/afx/aliensAF/al_rhino1.jpg' target='_blank'>Rhino Alien</a>
b) Add a 1 second stun and large knockback to Onos attacks. This would allow Onii to punch through marine lines instead of being blocked and instantly killed. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
re:motion tracking, well you have CLOAK, remember that? no dont say u cant run and use cloak, because u said a smart skulk can walk into position, and cloak stays when u walk
other than that, DEAL with it, its not gonna be changed or removed because of one persons bad experience
re:electricity, "This upgrade renders 90% of aliens (skulks) ineffective. It also requires no intervention from marine players to be effective" DUH the point was so that skulks cant kill an RT by themselves. omg where have u been.
and yes a gorge can take down an rt, bile bomb does like 200 dmg per bomb and if a marine comes and kills you, well same thing happens when a marine is knifing an rt and a skulk comes. DEAL with it...
Re:onos, "This would allow Onii to punch through marine lines instead of being blocked and instantly killed."
okay, 1 clip of hmg can pwn an onos, okay so devour that 1 rine, prob solved no? BUT if ur gonna be fighting a team of 10 marines as 1 onos, you deserve to die and be called a nubcake.
from what ive read, you just play as aliens all the time, time to play marines yes? I want to see you try to guard every RT without electricity, or let aliens have cloaking/SOF and you not have MT, yeah okay you go try that. until then DEAL with these "problems"
yes i am aware of that "please dont post DEAL WITH IT."
only reason why i still said it was because your views are soo one-sided and petty
i also think the onos idea from Hakujin may work. as it is, 1 sec stun is a bit small. it should at least be 1.5 secs. an onos with adren is not enough to stun a HA train without the help of another onos.
if they don't change that, at least try the head plate thing. i'm sure most of you have seen or tried the riot shield. even with it, the weilder can still be killed without too much trouble. a lone rine won't be able to kill an onos with that, but he wouldn't as it is right now. so the change wouldn't be too bad. that is, if they lower his health and/or armor.
i also play aliens alot and see the elec thing as unfair. but i've never been comm, so i can't complain.
okay your an onos, your going to the rine base, you walk in and they all have hmg and ur health is dying fast, so u decide to retreat for the moment, but whats that? a gorge was trying to heal you, and ended up blocking your exit? no problem, just jump over him right? uh oh, ur too fat and big to make it, and you walk REALLY slow while ur crouch-jumped. So the gorge still blocks you, then BAM you were killed, and the gorge got away safetly. talk about bs and waste of 81 res huh? heheheh
The other two, I agree. Electrification may be balanced in the game, but its hell annoying (did you guys even read the title before commenting on balance?). Id rather stab myself in the eye before I swipe down a electrified res node by my lonesome.
Onos, yes, very mindless and not fun.
On the marine side, they've got something thats the mother of not-fun-ness...being commander.
I think motion tracking would be fine if sensory chambers were used. Sensory counters motion tracking.
So the best solution is to make sensory viable.
<u><span style='font-size:12pt;line-height:100%'>Electricity</span></u>
<b>Problem 1:</b>
It is either too strong or too weak, so it's a very hard but specific counter. It's killer against skulks (and thus makes them apparently overpowered early game), but is much less useful against fades and onos. There's nothing wrong with this, except that enough things already counter the skulk (shotgun, HMG, electricity, turrets, GL), making them quite frustrating to play later on. They may be low tech, but even hive 2 skulks should take part in base assaults.
<b>Problem 2:</b>
Sensory chambers are discouraged, since no sensory ability aids against electricity. It's obvious why defense chambers are good. Movement chambers can help gorges healspray.
<b>Fixing problem 1:</b>
-Electricity only zaps one enemy at a time.
-Electricity briefly stuns the enemy.
This does 3 things:
1) Makes electricity more vulnerable to coordinated attacks (skulk/gorge groups).
2) Makes electricity more effective against fades and onos, where brief stuns would more effective than a relatively paltry amount of damage
3) Makes it easier for the skulk to participate in base assaults - if another alien soaks up the electricity and turret damage, the skulk can survive longer.
I understand that fades and onos are the counter. However, my rationale is this: electricity is too effective early on, so if I make it less effective early game, it should be improved late game. Onos and fade will still counter electricity, but electricity will be useful when combined with other weapons. Along the same lines, electricity will still counter skulks, but skulk will be useful against electricity when with other skulks and a gorge. The counter system remains - it's just "softened".
It also makes sense, assuming aliens also have an electric nervous system like humans do.
<b>Fixing problem 2:</b>
-Aliens within cloaking range of a sensory chamber gain some sort of "umbra" against electricity. A percentage of electric attacks on the "e-umbra" alien are blocked. 1 SC = 50% chance. 2 SC = 75% chance. 3 SC = 87.5% chance, and so forth.
This makes sensory much more appealing as a 1st hive chamber, and give aliens another way to counter early electricity.
<u><span style='font-size:12pt;line-height:100%'>Onos</span></u>
What I'd like:
1) Onos can "walk" over skulks, lerks, and gorges.
2) Half devour time. This would kill 2 birds with 1 stone: less frustrating for the devoured, and the devourer would be more effective against HA.
3) Make charge useful.
I do usually play alien. As a result, I think I am fairly well qualified to comment on what is or is not fun to an alien player. Balance, etc. Not the topic. The purpose of the game is for both teams to have fun. I find the 3 things listed in the OP to be extremely NOT FUN for the alien players, and I tried to explain why to the best of my ability.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Umbraed Monkey said:
I think the minimap-only MT is a great solution.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, it seems that no one wants to go for the proximity alert noise. That's fine. I would love to try minimap-only MT. Anything but the in-game circles, please!
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Good point. To make sensory viable, we have to make all chambers useful and possible. How about this? Remove the hive:chamber type lock. Allow aliens to build any number of any type of chamber at any time? Of course, aliens personal upgrades would be limited to one / hive but NOT limited to one / chamber. This way aliens could deploy early sensory AND mid-game defense / movement. Aliens are supposed to be able to evovle "on the fly" to respond to threats; why are they locked into one chamber / hive?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I would be interested to hear people's feedback on this.
Remember, everyone takes a basic reading comprehension class in school for a reason!
okay, 1 clip of hmg can pwn an onos, okay so devour that 1 rine, prob solved no? BUT if ur gonna be fighting a team of 10 marines as 1 onos, you deserve to die and be called a nubcake. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
When, pray tell, is any respectable marine alone with an hmg? By the time they have hmg's, they'll have weapon upgrades. A couple upgraded LMG's can tear through an onos with the same ease of one marine with an hmg. The onos is the tank, and he's bloody huge, it's supposed to be designed to take fire, while other aliens do dirty work. If you're in a group, most likely with other skulks as the pub games go, guess who's gonna get shot first? little dog, or man eating death elephant? Durr hurr hurr.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Good point. To make sensory viable, we have to make all chambers useful and possible. How about this? Remove the hive:chamber type lock. Allow aliens to build any number of any type of chamber at any time? Of course, aliens personal upgrades would be limited to one / hive but NOT limited to one / chamber. This way aliens could deploy early sensory AND mid-game defense / movement. Aliens are supposed to be able to evovle "on the fly" to respond to threats; why are they locked into one chamber / hive?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I would be interested to hear people's feedback on this. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Haha, there's plenty of feedback on that idea. Just ask Forlorn <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' /><!--endemo--> Most of the responses to that idea in the CM forums were positive. AFAIK, it was the same in teh vet forums.
Remember, everyone takes a basic reading comprehension class in school for a reason! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
You are an angry and confrontational person.
I think the minimap-only MT is a great solution.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, it seems that no one wants to go for the proximity alert noise. That's fine. I would love to try minimap-only MT. Anything but the in-game circles, please! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Its just that if youve ever tried the metamod plugin, youll understand why we dont like it. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Electrification is also far too powerful, requiring large investment to counter (Fades/Onos). Marines, especially marines with MT, have no problem knocking out an enemy RT with level 1 LMG. Meanwhile, a single electrified resource node, placed in a strategic location near the Alien's front lines, can severely hamper alien progress by forcing them to seek other RTs in far away locations. Furthermore, electrified resource nodes are extremely powerful in large games (20 players+). A single resource tower becomes invincible, regardless of how many Skulks charge at it, with a simple click of a Marine CO button and 35 res. Meanwhile, the marine team has no problem smashing any Alien RTs unless they are heavily protected by Alien PLAYERS.
I really like the 15 second cool down idea posted by Hakujin, although that sounds like it'd be hard to code. I would rather remove RT electrification altogether, while solving the MT problem at the same time: Let Marines know what structures are under attack automatically through a hive-like vision system that alerts them to attacked structures (or the full screen map + sound alerts). First off, this would greatly reduce voice spam, and Marine COs would have less responsibilities. Second, this would grant Marine players more independence. There is far too little room for independent action on the Marine side of things, the Marines are just too far reliant on the Commander to do *anything*. By at least letting Marines see that RTs are under attack through a hive-vision-like system, they have the ability to organise and defend areas without being told to. (Of course I've always believed the Comm should be nothing more than a strategical decision maker, not a tactical one. All battlefield-related situations should be dealt with adequately by the Marines, and the Marines alone, if you ask me. From medpaks, ammo supplies, "structure/ally is under attack" alerts, even waypoints.. all of it should be handled by Marines, not the Comm.)
Same deal with electricity , sure its annoying to deal with as a skulk , but for the cost it should be a decent guarentee until the more expensive 2nd hive or fades with 3 Dcs comes along. perhaps the skluks should like kill the marines before they put up the RTs?
Onos are fine atm regardless of how quickly they die, they do not cost 100 ress anymore and a smart onos player should be able to prevail vs a single HMG unless he is WTHpwnd . No amount of coding can save vs stupidty or lack of skill sadly. really in the end of the day Teamwork is still the key, no more rambo onos i win from 1.04.
This statement alone pretty much shows that you're not qualified to make any statements about the game's fun aspect. Reason for this is that alien team is not the <i>only</i> team out there with players wanting to have fun. If you consider old "every player is stronger then a dosen of enemies" concept "fun", I would suggest sven coop mod instead of natural selection.
I'm quite certain that majority of NS players considers a game "fun" when it's a truly even game, both side hammering against eachother with relatively even odds. This <i>requires</i> fine tuned balance first, and evething else comes after. You just stated yourself that to you, fun has nothing to do with balance - you simply want to own the other team no matter how good they are and how cheap of a lifeform you use. If that is what you like, it's fine by me - I'm not trying to complain about the personal tastes here. But NS is not the mod that will suit your tastes, as majority of the fanbase here has very different tastes from yours. As such I would suggest you move along to another mod and stop trolling and insulting people that provide you with personal feedback, taking it as "personal attacks". Or stick around, try the other team and find that the old single-player style "I pwn everything that shows up in my crosshairs" concept is not the only way you can have lots of fun in a first-person shooter.
Remember, everyone takes a basic reading comprehension class in school for a reason! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You are an angry and confrontational person. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
And you dodge the subject.
Nice!
Also motion tracking is a major eqquipment for "savage animal like or bug like colonial alien blasting space marine" check the hand book everyone haves them.
Electric is fine either bomb it or place an oc there to kill it.
This statement alone pretty much shows that you're not qualified to make any statements about the game's fun aspect. Reason for this is that alien team is not the <i>only</i> team out there with players wanting to have fun. If you consider old "every player is stronger then a dosen of enemies" concept "fun", I would suggest sven coop mod instead of natural selection.
I'm quite certain that majority of NS players considers a game "fun" when it's a truly even game, both side hammering against eachother with relatively even odds. This <i>requires</i> fine tuned balance first, and evething else comes after. You just stated yourself that to you, fun has nothing to do with balance - you simply want to own the other team no matter how good they are and how cheap of a lifeform you use. If that is what you like, it's fine by me - I'm not trying to complain about the personal tastes here. But NS is not the mod that will suit your tastes, as majority of the fanbase here has very different tastes from yours. As such I would suggest you move along to another mod and stop trolling and insulting people that provide you with personal feedback, taking it as "personal attacks". Or stick around, try the other team and find that the old single-player style "I pwn everything that shows up in my crosshairs" concept is not the only way you can have lots of fun in a first-person shooter. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
However, balance not <i>imply</i> fun. How about playing a game where each side had only 1 unit and that unit was the same. Balanced? Yeah. Fun? Hell no. While balance is <i>required</i> for the game to be fun, it is not the only factor.
I think game design should be focused on introducing fun elements first, then balancing later. After all, that's how most professional game developers do it - they delay balancing until late beta and post release.