Focus Vs L3 Damage
bigtangringo
Join Date: 2004-01-31 Member: 25797Members
Join Date: 2004-01-31 Member: 25797Members
<div class="IPBDescription">In a word: unbalanced</div> <b>Summary:</b>
L3 damage is far superior to focus, particularly later in the game. In the average game I play atleast, almost everyone is 10th level except a few stragglers. The L3 damage which comes later in the game always comes into play.
<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'>Focus</span>
<b>Pro:</b><ul><li>Excellent for the beginning of the game. One bite = dead marine.</li><li>Much better attack damage</li><li>Cheap</li></ul>
<b>Con:</b><ul><li>"Spray and Pray" ceases to exist</li><li>Later in the game a marine can survive several bites, swipes, or gores.</li><li>Halved attack speed</li></ul>
<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'>L3 Damage</span>
<b>Pro:</b><ul><li>Unchanged RoF</li><li>Spray and Pray</li><li>Effective entire game</li><li>Highly increased damage</li></ul>
<b>Con:</b><ul><li>Semi-Expensive</li></ul>
<b>Suggestions:</b><ul><li>Heat regulator on HMGs</li><li>Replace pellets with slugs in Shotguns</li></ul>
L3 damage is far superior to focus, particularly later in the game. In the average game I play atleast, almost everyone is 10th level except a few stragglers. The L3 damage which comes later in the game always comes into play.
<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'>Focus</span>
<b>Pro:</b><ul><li>Excellent for the beginning of the game. One bite = dead marine.</li><li>Much better attack damage</li><li>Cheap</li></ul>
<b>Con:</b><ul><li>"Spray and Pray" ceases to exist</li><li>Later in the game a marine can survive several bites, swipes, or gores.</li><li>Halved attack speed</li></ul>
<span style='font-size:14pt;line-height:100%'>L3 Damage</span>
<b>Pro:</b><ul><li>Unchanged RoF</li><li>Spray and Pray</li><li>Effective entire game</li><li>Highly increased damage</li></ul>
<b>Con:</b><ul><li>Semi-Expensive</li></ul>
<b>Suggestions:</b><ul><li>Heat regulator on HMGs</li><li>Replace pellets with slugs in Shotguns</li></ul>
Comments
lvl3 weapons - 3 levels in combat / ams lab & 20+30+40=90res and 60+90+120=270sec research time
focus: 1lvl in combat for lvl3 focus, and 10x3 sensory chambers in combat.
Now excuse me, but how the hell do these two relate to each other? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo--> I fail to see any logic in the entire post of yours..
Shorter clips would be a more viable option, but I think it's balanced as they are. Also, I think you're writing from the perspective of a skulk? Pretty much every other class ('cept gorge) can battle a lev 3 HMG'er just fine -- lerks have umbra, fades have blink, and onos.. heh.
- L3 dmg marines die in one bite to lv. 3 focus bite
- L3 dmg marines take just as many hits to kill a 3 hive skulk as do lv. 0 weapons vs. a 1 hive skulk
Personally, I'd be happy if Focus had some small net benefit, either through a slightly faster ROF, slightly higher damage, or both. And I do mean "slightly" - not enough to make a difference on players, but enough to be a little more effective on structures, if only by a handful of attacks. Once people stop going down in one bite, the ability loses a lot of its charm, and this would be something.
[1] You loose about 15% damage over time if you pick focus, meaning that if you need 8 or more bites to kill something, focus is always a disadvantage.
The original posted fails to mention that Focus costs 1 point while Damage 3 costs 3(very few marines go all the way to damage 3). He also implies that Focus is no longer effective in the late game even though that is blatantly untrue.
Focus + skilled fade + blink + metabolize = pwnd HA.
I only get focus if I'll be playing as a lerk or fade, otherwise its for nubs :o
Focus + skilled fade + blink + metabolize = pwnd HA.
I only get focus if I'll be playing as a lerk or fade, otherwise its for nubs :o <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not in corridors and a lerk blocking its escape path <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
See, this is terrible logic, while in theory you do less damage over time, the main aspect of all aliens is <b>HIT AND RUNS</b> and for that reason focus owns hard
1.) Front-loaded damage. The damage over time is weighted towards Focus when you start attacking because that first attack has no delay. Let's say each attack does 50 damage without Focus. As soon as the first bite is done, Focus has done 100 damage while normal has done 50. On the next Focus bite Focus has done 200(2 bites) and normal has done 150(3 bites, and maybe halfway to the next one). With these completely arbitrary numbers, normal won't catch up to Focus damage(and thus, won't begin outdoing it) until approximately the third Focus bite. Against an LA, 2 focus bites is guaranteed death if I'm not mistaken, so it's only even sort of an issue against HAs. Obviously those numbers aren't accurate, they're just to show you the concept. Normal attacks don't outdo Focus' damage over time until a number of bites later, which means it's only a problem against structures, as intended.
2.) Accuracy. In order to keep up with Focus in the above scenario, you would have to be biting nonstop and hitting every one of them, an unreliable scenario when you take into account marine dodging and knockback. With normal attacks, any time you spend readjusting your aim is wasted time. With Focus, the damage is condensed into slower bites so you can take your time and be more likely to hit every one of them. This is a godsend for Fades, who often can only safely land one attack at a time.
Understand?
See, this is terrible logic, while in theory you do less damage over time, the main aspect of all aliens is <b>HIT AND RUNS</b> and for that reason focus owns hard <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Really -- cus see, I thought aliens had to attack structures and assault bases from time to time instead of just getting lots of ambush kills.
SOF is the only useful sense chamber for assault and only because it lets you see when all the marines have moved out.
Marine damage upgrades in contrast are ALWAYS useful.
I really don't understand what you guys are complaining about. Focus is just completely impossible to compare to Level 3 weapons in any way. It's like saying Regen isn't as effective as medpacks or that Redemption is worse than distress beacon. It doesn't make any sense.
There are reasons that sensory first = lose.
See, this is terrible logic, while in theory you do less damage over time, the main aspect of all aliens is <b>HIT AND RUNS</b> and for that reason focus owns hard <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Really -- cus see, I thought aliens had to attack structures and assault bases from time to time instead of just getting lots of ambush kills.
SOF is the only useful sense chamber for assault and only because it lets you see when all the marines have moved out.
Marine damage upgrades in contrast are ALWAYS useful. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh yeah, killing structures super fast vs. two times the effectiveness of killing marines is definatly worth it!
Yup. You got me beat [/sarcasm]
Sensory is not good at attacking structures, movement doesnt really give you any benift for attacking stuctures, except adren which is minor. Each chamber is designed for different playing styles. By making each one good at everything it defeats the point of having to chose your chamber.
Sensory is a very strong first chamber if used with the right style of play. Cloak-walking is the strongest ablitiy in the game (though easily countered it cost alot of money) Have you ever tried cloak walk rush a marine base? Ive never seen it stoped. (3 gorge and drop s chambers) all get cloaking, walk into marine base before they get an obs up and eat a marine with cordination and take out IP and amory. Then game is over or marines become extremly crippled).
Sensory is far from weak. Focus is amazing in the right hands.
(Easy way to counter the damage to buildings is to co-op with team and only have a few get focus)
the only decent coutner I see, is an observitory at every electified rez node. and everyt urret farm you have. but thats 20 reen rez vs every 10 rez. of aleens
the only decent coutner I see, is an observitory at every electified rez node. and everyt urret farm you have. but thats 20 reen rez vs every 10 rez. of aleens <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I couldn't have said it better myself. I mean, armor surely can't counter a cloaked skulk, can it? What about welders? Surely they are useless against focus when combined with medpacks. Surely electricity must *see* targets before hitting them.
And why on earth do you want turret farms?
One chomp and you're uncloaked.
Marines can easily scan and cloaking won't take out turrets OR electrified buildings which are fairly common in marine start.
I LOVE cloaking -- I did my part to contribute to marines hating "Cloakus" in combat -- but it's a DEFENSIVE playing style. Having adrenaline helps quite a bit in taking out strucures fast for gorges and allows for umbra+spore spam for attacking aliens.
Cloaking will let you get a few kills but won't help in taking out defenses, res nozzles, etc.
EDIT: And yes, armor DOES counter a cloaked skulk. Bite once, marine starts jumping and shooting. If you manage to hit him again before he kills you, he'll go flying giving him plenty of room to kill you before you get close. Armor upgrade = 3 hits. Also counters focus if you choose to get that instead.
"Front-loaded damage" certainly isn't a bad thing, but it's going to take just as long to kill a full L2 armor LA and above with focus as without - in other words, you're taking the same amount of bullets. Granted, one focus bite on an L2 or L3 means that he'll die in two regular bites, and there's definitely potential there, and I'm not saying that bigger chunks of damage don't greatly help hit-and-run - but fifteen percent's worth? Had it been tested with doubled/halved values, and somehow failed?
On a side note, focus with gorge is sort of neat.
Also, it should be mentioned that the potential for any focus bite from any alien class to 1-hit kill a marine under medspam who has been stripped of armor makes it invaluable for fighting Jetpackers. Taking a skulk as your point of reference, 1st Focus bite + medspam + 2nd focus bite = dead marine until he gets armor3. Even with armor3, 1st Focus bite + medspam + 2nd focus bite + medspam +3rd focus bite = dead marine. Without focus it looks more like Bite + Medspam + Bite + medspam + Bite + Medspam + Bite + Medspam = dead hive.
the only decent coutner I see, is an observitory at every electified rez node. and everyt urret farm you have. but thats 20 reen rez vs every 10 rez. of aleens <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
If they have sensories how would they be able to take down electrified nodes in the first place? Just use one observatory, and scan when your marines think there's cloaked aliens nearby.