Why Focus?
Calldown
Join Date: 2003-02-12 Member: 13478Members, Constellation
Join Date: 2003-02-12 Member: 13478Members, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription"><my views on focus></div> Hey,
With the idea of provoking more Combat/Classic discussion than just "omgz0rs thsi beild is teh hax!!!111oneone" I figured I'd pose this question -
<b>Why focus?</b>
I've noticed more and more - at least in Combat - that perma-skulks grab focus. Personally, I think this is fundamentally useless. Why?
<b>1) You can get in more damage on buildings without it.</b>
Can't remember numbers for the life of me, but I do recall that No-Focus Damage over Time is greater than Focus DoT.
<b>2) Easier to combat multiple HA's without Focus than with it.</b>
This might just be a personal thing with me - but it's easier. With Focus, you might only be able to get in 1 or 2 bites before you're wasted. I find without Focus, I have more time to dodge *and* get in bites.
<b>3) Onos and Lerk to some extent nerfed with Focus.</b>
The Onos for sure is nerfed when he has Focus - why get Focus when you already do huge amounts of damage? The lerk as well in my opinion - though I can see that varying depending on how much you love swooping. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
The only upsides I can see to Focus is extreme early game (before A1), Fade hit and runs and gorges. Any one care to fill me in on others?
-calldown
With the idea of provoking more Combat/Classic discussion than just "omgz0rs thsi beild is teh hax!!!111oneone" I figured I'd pose this question -
<b>Why focus?</b>
I've noticed more and more - at least in Combat - that perma-skulks grab focus. Personally, I think this is fundamentally useless. Why?
<b>1) You can get in more damage on buildings without it.</b>
Can't remember numbers for the life of me, but I do recall that No-Focus Damage over Time is greater than Focus DoT.
<b>2) Easier to combat multiple HA's without Focus than with it.</b>
This might just be a personal thing with me - but it's easier. With Focus, you might only be able to get in 1 or 2 bites before you're wasted. I find without Focus, I have more time to dodge *and* get in bites.
<b>3) Onos and Lerk to some extent nerfed with Focus.</b>
The Onos for sure is nerfed when he has Focus - why get Focus when you already do huge amounts of damage? The lerk as well in my opinion - though I can see that varying depending on how much you love swooping. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
The only upsides I can see to Focus is extreme early game (before A1), Fade hit and runs and gorges. Any one care to fill me in on others?
-calldown
Comments
Fast-moving lifeforms, ie. Fades and Lerks, use focus so they dont have to just stand next to a marine attacking and getting shot. A Fade can blink-slash 2 times to kill light marines and jetpackers, 4 times for Heavies. Lerks can swoop in, get a bite, and fly away, without having to take lots of damage. Lerks also get primal scream, which can overcome the speed reduction of focus.
The Onos might as well stand next to marines goring, since he can't run away. Gorges are the same, not to mention spit only does 50 damage with focus.
Skulks benefit from it since they die so easily. However, I suspect most skulks use it for easy kills against unarmored marines. Skulk bites can send marines flying AWAY from the skulk, making that second bite harder to get. Later in the game, focus isn't nearly as useful, since rapidly biting a marine messes up his aim, allowing you to survive a little longer.
In classic:
Focus isn't good in classic. You have to get sensory chambers to use it. It doesn't work great against buildings. On higher lifeforms, scent of fear is more useful than focus. They need to avoid large numbers of marines to win fights, as well as to take down rambos building phasegates by the hive.
Focus can only work if the comm completely forgets to get armor upgrades.
All attacks are considerd to be with lvl 3 focus.
Skulk bites to kill lvl 0 armor LA rine-1
lvl1-3 rine-2
lvl0-2 HA rine-4
lvl3 HA rine-5
Lerk bites to kill lvl 0-2 armor LA rine-2
lvl 3 rine-3
lvl 0-1 HA rine-5
lvl 2-3 HA rine-6
Fade swipes to kill lvl 0 armor LA rine-1
lvl 1-3 rine-2
lvl 0-2 HA rine-4
lvl 3 HA rine-5
It can, but I find it even more annoying when I'm in the perfect position for the second bite - after clearing his armor with Focus - and can't get it due to the RoF timer. Usually following this I'm smoked in the head with a SG and left as a dirty smear on the floor.
-calldown
It can, but I find it even more annoying when I'm in the perfect position for the second bite - after clearing his armor with Focus - and can't get it due to the RoF timer. Usually following this I'm smoked in the head with a SG and left as a dirty smear on the floor.
-calldown <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
But without focus, the second bite would not have killed him anyway.
Plus, if you get jumped while gnawing on something, you have a full energy bar.
Add in resupply, and armor 1, they'll not have enough resupplies before you land that second bite in.
Not to mention early game, 1 bite kills are warranted.
and i dont even know why marines get resupply... i find it to be a waste
leap-bite
any la or jp will die in a single leap bite combo, and as long as you fight in strafing run style (usaly powered by leap &/or celerity) you get in, get your kill and get out, or get in get a bite and get out, rinse and repeat till they are dead.
you simply have to remember not to sit on them for the second bite but move and then get the second bite.
but as i said leap bit in, leap out, Also in combat at least, it is almost nesisary for killing jp, cus they have to land and they will be resuplied if the fist bite doesnt do it.
Oh and i prefer my lerk and ono without focus, and i have never tried a gorge with one.
oni with focuse is sort of pointless.
and i dont even know why marines get resupply... i find it to be a waste <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I agree.
The only possible thing good about it is the gas mask, and fighting non-focus skulks... But considering most get focus by level 2 or 3, it's useless. The spores drain your armor, and so then you'll be dying anyways.
Catylst is much more useful in my opinion. (of the two upgrades in that category)
focus adds 50% of dmg, only decreasing RoF by 33%, so u should be doing more dmg over time no matter what. U are also left with more energy for leaping/blinking.
lvl 0 armor rine: 100 health 25 armor.
skulk bite does 75, with focus they die after one bite.
lvl 1 armor rine: 100 health 45 armor.
skulk bite does 75, after the first bite with focus they have 40 health left and 0 armor. Which, if you do the math, is a loss of 150 net health(assuming each point of lvl 1 rine armor still soaks 2 points of damage)
Based on this, it seems that focus increases the damage by 100%, but as the the RoF reduction I don't know.
Also, based on this math and experience, it is irritating that a rine with resupply and lvl 2 armor, takes 3 bites as a lerk with focus.
2 bites = 240 damage
rine with lvl 2 armor, 230 health (net) + 50 from a resupply = takes another bite >.<!
focus adds 50% of dmg, only decreasing RoF by 33%, so u should be doing more dmg over time no matter what. U are also left with more energy for leaping/blinking. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
His facts are totally right, focus is a trade - more damage per bite, less damage over time. Hence taking focus is always a significant nerf on your base assaulting capabilities, which is why most self-respecting fades/oni will take cloaking or SoF instead.
True, and I suppose you can make the "free first bite" argument as well, but I tend to find ( and yes I know this is a personal observation and holds no weight <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->) that when you're biting like a maniac against a heavy you tend to last longer.
Why?
Screen jiggling. Their screen is bouncing around like a 12 year-old loaded on amphetamines and their HMG is painting their teammates like a nouveau artist exploring the darker sides of color.
Yes, the numbers might show that you get more bites in. However, if you can close the distance, I still think you have a better chance of surviving ( at least 1v1 ) a HA/HMG as a nonfocus vs. focus.
Second thought: Wouldn't it be better to *not* get Focus - simply more practice for early-game skulking? (Though as sweet as the feeling is when you get the leapbite decapitation. <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo--> )
-calldown
focus adds 50% of dmg, only decreasing RoF by 33%, so u should be doing more dmg over time no matter what. U are also left with more energy for leaping/blinking. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
His facts are totally right, focus is a trade - more damage per bite, less damage over time. Hence taking focus is always a significant nerf on your base assaulting capabilities, which is why most self-respecting fades/oni will take cloaking or SoF instead. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
How? someone explain to me how 50% dmg increase and 33% RoF decrease makes up for a nerf in damage over time(base assualting capabilities)? I don't get it.
This is not true.
Its does double damage, but you your bite rate is slowed by more than 2, so you do less damage over time.
(if the manual says otherwise its lying, it normally is! Fades doing 90 damage??)
focus adds 50% of dmg, only decreasing RoF by 33%, so u should be doing more dmg over time no matter what. U are also left with more energy for leaping/blinking. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
His facts are totally right, focus is a trade - more damage per bite, less damage over time. Hence taking focus is always a significant nerf on your base assaulting capabilities, which is why most self-respecting fades/oni will take cloaking or SoF instead. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
How? someone explain to me how 50% dmg increase and 33% RoF decrease makes up for a nerf in damage over time(base assualting capabilities)? I don't get it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's because your facts are incorrect. If I remeber correctly, it was 33% damage increase and 50% attack speed descrease per sensory chamber, up to 100% damage increase and 150% attack speed descrease at lvl3/
um i dont know the numbers, however i do knoe this a 50% increas in damage and a 33% loss in RoF gives equal damage over time...
obsever my leet math skillz
150% damage is 3/2, 66% damage is 2/3: 3/2 x 2/3 = 1
so im inclined to think the RoF is decreased by more than 33% because i have noticed a damage over time decreas wilst munching a building. (though definatly not a 75% reduction)
however damage over time is almost completely irelavent to combat
though i must say that in combat i don't get focus but thats becasue i almost always go this route
2=leap
3=xeno
4=save (unless not getting many xeno kills then i get cara to get more xeno kills)
5=save
6=save
7=save
8=onos
9= cara (unless i already got it then i go onos now)
10=adren or regen (depending on other aliens)
or if our hive gets under attack i usually get stuck as this
2=leap
3=xeno
4="hive is under attack" gorge
5=adren
6=cara
7=regen
8=cel
9=SoF
10=sil
the last two really don't really matter much
i guess i prefer the run along walls to them,jump at them,turn real quick,and bite
-easier kills
-forces marines to upgrade armor early
-pisses off people when they die from 1 bite