Sorry--took me a while to rethink about what u said Narwak. But basically, it boils down to: it's not "something' specific strategies that win you the game, but flex(ibility) that wins you the game. Nicely put. However, I rather suspect that at some point or another, NS is going to evolve to the point where it's one basic strategy verse another (kind of like chess openings), and whichever side can deal with and pose their own, greater threats to the enemy has greater leverage.
Also, Narf, just a question: What is your win/loss ratio as a commander? I asked Flatline this, along with this followup (since he happens to have a fairly high win/loss ratio): Do you think, given your skill level, that you should win about as many games as you lose when you commander (or have a good commander?) or, should it be 50/50 win lose with an average commander? something else?
NarfwakJoin Date: 2002-11-02Member: 5258Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica PT Lead, NS2 Community Developer
edited December 2002
I've never lost a map commanding on bast, and I've only lost once or twice commanding on other maps, mostly because I hadn't yet learned the map. I've gotten one or two draws - when the server craps out before the game can be finished. I lose as alien or soldier marine when bad things happen, which they will on occasion do.
All in all, I'd say I'm a pretty good commander, although I like smaller games more. In larger games, you really need to use squad tactics, but in pubs no one follows sophisticated tactics. I think Flatline is probably a better commander than I, as are others. I find what I really excel at is leading squads of marines on foot, and using chain of command systems.
I think a good commander should have a much higher than 50/50 record in public games. Fifty percent is an <b>F</b>ailure in my book.
You're win/loss ratio is really meaningless on pubs.
Mine is fairly high BUT, thats because I only command now when I know I've got a good 3 + people who'll do what I say, when I say.
I had one game where I even used typing 'kill' to get people back to base and everybody did it!
Was absolute magic, my connection died on me and everybody started doing their own thing, connection comes back up I go..
'OK sorry about that connection messed up where are you all.. arrg you're all over the place type 'kill' if your not next to a gate. And everybody re-spawns in base.. '
When you've got a good group of marines who do what you say (not a group of marines who are all 'teh uber') You SHOULD win on public servers because chances are the aliens aren't coordinated in any meaningfull way. Even if they are coordinated you can watch their behaviour and completly mess with their heads.
I've only lost afew games, and only two of them were due to me as a commander being out-played. (some were due to me being blatantly newbie and/or stupid though <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> )
This strategy is really good and has a natural feel to it. Normally on pub svrs i play the flex role, was doing it before i read about it here, but this formalises it nicely.
after a few games commanders will recognise your ability to respond to orders qucikly and follow a game plan and start to rely on you alot. it helps if you are a decent shot but you dont have to be the leetest player on your team to do this, you must be a quick thinker and a good strategist on the ground.
i see the flex role as protecting assets and hotspots already gained by the team and responding to any crisis, while the grunts go off and try to claim the next hotspot. once we have a few portals up i just jump from portal to portal checking everthing's ok - leaving the commander to fully suport the offensive manouvers without having to check back on things. this helps commanders a *lot*
This is a mindbogglingly OLD post, but i STILL remember it from waay back. so i'm bumping it. it's INCREDIBLY useful to have a flex rine. read the post, ignore the costs (yeah, i know 19 per turret :O ).
the general idea of the flex rine is something i still use. some call it the handyman or what not, but flex is more descriptive to me.
Yeah I just had the some flex-happy commander beat the living snot out of us yesterday, 3 games in a row... It <b>IS</b> bloody freaking brilliant... On top of it, even though we were getting some hefty kills, we couldn't crack any of his bases because of one JP/GL extremely good flex marine. So instead of relying on the grunts, he sieged us, because we outclassed the grunts in every way, but the flex outclassed us, so once that phase gate was up in the hives the grunts were trying to take, the comm sold all unnecessary phasegates for quicker, smoother travel... In one of the games, the comm never locked down one of the hives, he just sets up a siege and double, and pinged the hive every 3 minutes or so, saving his flex from one less unnecessary phasegate...
So all in all, this strategy is great and as an alien I just have to say it beats the tar out of some really good other aliens that I saw.
Ignore the build order parts. They're ancient, and were questionable to start with.
But yeah anything that helps you keep the troops in line is good.
This thread has been on the forums for almost as long as I have <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Comments
But basically, it boils down to: it's not "something' specific strategies that win you the game, but flex(ibility) that wins you the game. Nicely put. However, I rather suspect that at some point or another, NS is going to evolve to the point where it's one basic strategy verse another (kind of like chess openings), and whichever side can deal with and pose their own, greater threats to the enemy has greater leverage.
Also, Narf, just a question: What is your win/loss ratio as a commander? I asked Flatline this, along with this followup (since he happens to have a fairly high win/loss ratio): Do you think, given your skill level, that you should win about as many games as you lose when you commander (or have a good commander?) or, should it be 50/50 win lose with an average commander? something else?
All in all, I'd say I'm a pretty good commander, although I like smaller games more. In larger games, you really need to use squad tactics, but in pubs no one follows sophisticated tactics. I think Flatline is probably a better commander than I, as are others. I find what I really excel at is leading squads of marines on foot, and using chain of command systems.
I think a good commander should have a much higher than 50/50 record in public games. Fifty percent is an <b>F</b>ailure in my book.
Mine is fairly high BUT, thats because I only command now when I know I've got a good 3 + people who'll do what I say, when I say.
I had one game where I even used typing 'kill' to get people back to base and everybody did it!
Was absolute magic, my connection died on me and everybody started doing their own thing, connection comes back up I go..
'OK sorry about that connection messed up where are you all.. arrg you're all over the place type 'kill' if your not next to a gate.
And everybody re-spawns in base.. '
When you've got a good group of marines who do what you say (not a group of marines who are all 'teh uber') You SHOULD win on public servers because chances are the aliens aren't coordinated in any meaningfull way. Even if they are coordinated you can watch their behaviour and completly mess with their heads.
I've only lost afew games, and only two of them were due to me as a commander being out-played. (some were due to me being blatantly newbie and/or stupid though <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> )
BlueGhost
after a few games commanders will recognise your ability to respond to orders qucikly and follow a game plan and start to rely on you alot. it helps if you are a decent shot but you dont have to be the leetest player on your team to do this, you must be a quick thinker and a good strategist on the ground.
i see the flex role as protecting assets and hotspots already gained by the team and responding to any crisis, while the grunts go off and try to claim the next hotspot. once we have a few portals up i just jump from portal to portal checking everthing's ok - leaving the commander to fully suport the offensive manouvers without having to check back on things. this helps commanders a *lot*
the general idea of the flex rine is something i still use. some call it the handyman or what not, but flex is more descriptive to me.
So all in all, this strategy is great and as an alien I just have to say it beats the tar out of some really good other aliens that I saw.
But yeah anything that helps you keep the troops in line is good.
This thread has been on the forums for almost as long as I have <!--emo&:0--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wow.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wow.gif' /><!--endemo-->