Gl Kills Through Walls?
EvenFlow
Join Date: 2002-12-18 Member: 11046Members
Join Date: 2002-12-18 Member: 11046Members
I have checked the bug report forum and didn't pick this up, it's also difficult to try and test it by yourself. I've had it happen to me once where I was killed by exploding grenades on the otherside of a wall and there seems to be a rise in similar complaints on the server I play on, anyone else had this problem ?
Comments
This is any GLers best friend, or worst enemy if he doesn't get out of the way quick enough (which happens quite often with the GL's ridiculously short fuse).
It is a feature, not a bug.
Or maybe it's a buggy feature.
Or maybe I should take my medicine.
Oh look! A kitty!
Nades effect would "crawl" along surfaces even when other perpendicular surfaces should have protect you (i.e. : floors and walls).
As far as i remember, this was a bug and would combine with map design (allies spawn area in dod_avalanche was well knowed for is nade buggy design).
I'd be all for a mixture of the "bug" where for example the grenade causes maximum damage through the whole of the vent but not through the walls.
They can be fixed... don't know how, but they can. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
This is any GLers best friend, or worst enemy if he doesn't get out of the way quick enough (which happens quite often with the GL's ridiculously short fuse).
It is a feature, not a bug.
Or maybe it's a buggy feature.
Or maybe I should take my medicine.
Oh look! A kitty! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's not volumetric. Volumetric means that something fills a volume, regardless of shape. Grenades just do a radius damage, not checking for intervening cover like walls.
If grenades did volumetric damage, then detonating one in, for example, the marine-spawn vent in Eclipse, it would expand and fill the entire vent. Which it doesn't.
Yet another pet peeve of mine... GRENADES ARE NOT VOLUMETRIC.
It like woah in Beijing!
The other one i have noticed is huge blast radius nades going off (occasionally) and nailing me from quite far off (also noticed it with some mine kills). Its really annoying when you know the inevitable nade or mine is going to hit your mate and your sitting back to watch him blow and finding yourself getting nailed.
- RD
I wonder why..
[edit] The post above mine is incorrect. NS explosions != CS explosions. It's easy to dodge nade explosions just by being barely around a wall, or on a different plane than the nade. This occurs only in very cramped conditions, at least that I've observed.
Volumetrics make sense. I like the bug. Keep it. It gives people another reason to use nades and nade launchers. If you threw a nade into a sturdy vent or hole in real life, there would be a massive shockwave obliterating everything in it's path down and up the vent, where-as if you just tossed it in the middle of a large room, the effects at the edges would be minimal, as expected, and would only really kill stuff if you got the nades really close to the target. It makes sense and it's pretty cool to finally see more accurate real life physics in the Halflife engine.
Now if we could do something about Onii having no inertia or appreciable body mass...</span>
I could have sworn I heard somewhere that they can CODE volumetrics, but it takes up a bunch of space to do it ... which I guess in retrospect means that this applies to ALL volumetrics, in which case I wouldn't have a leg to stand on in my arguement.
I guess I respectfully withdraw my claim.
>:[ My passionately burning hatred for your very souls remains unquenched. But moving on..
I just thought that maybe it was easier to code the volumetrics for what is basically an invisible shockwave in the case of grenades. This would be as opposed to the <b>obviously</b> intensive CPU usage that would be required for a flamethrower, which equates out into a visual, directed volumetric pressure, sort of. It makes sense that a flamethrower would take up too much code to be accessable to all audiences. But grenade explosions? How complex can that be? I'll admit right now that my knowledge of coding goes no further than the abstract conceptual point of view. Maybe I'm optimistic. It's just that simple point-of-explosion volumetrics sound like they wouldn't be too far a stretch, and without alienating lower end PC users with heaps of code too.
WFTs the deal here? I'd love to hear more from some authorities about this. I know I've been saved from explosions by closing any number of nearby toggle-operated doors. Those things aren't that thick, and somehow they save my bacon. Am I just not looking at my exact HP hard enough to see it take a small bump from the explosion behind the door?? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /><!--endemo--> Clarification helps everybody.</span>
Yeah, the 'nade had to go in exactly the right place. And allegedly they fixed the really bad bugs for dod 1.0 (though they broke almost everything else, but that's just my opinion <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->)
They do happen in NS: you can be killed through the floor in the reactor room on ns_tanith by a grenade blast in the vent underneath, for example.
While it's not common enough to warrant doing anything about it - most people don't know what they are so deliberate abuse of it isn't a problem, it's still annoying if that little soundless explosion kills you. <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I've had a look at the Half-Life SDK, so assuming the grenades in NS work the same way, this is what's happening:
When the grenade explodes, it traces 32 units down (to try and find the floor). If it doesn't hit anything, this is where the explosion will occur.
If it does hit a surface, it then "pulls out" a bit. The distance depends on how much damage the grenade does; here's the exact line of code:
<!--c1--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>CODE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='CODE'><!--ec1-->pev->origin = pTrace->vecEndPos + (pTrace->vecPlaneNormal * (pev->dmg - 24) * 0.6);<!--c2--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--ec2-->
Plugging in the damage an NS grenade does (125), we find that it pulls out 60.6 units. Given that most vents are 48 units tall, this could easily place the grenade outside the map (in the void). The default RadiusDamage() code takes into account line-of-sight, so player's who are behind a wall/door aren't hurt, but it may be possible for an explosion in the void to "see" a player even though they're hidden from the grenade.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The default RadiusDamage() code takes into account line-of-sight, so player's who are behind a wall/door aren't hurt, but it may be possible for an explosion in the void to "see" a player even though they're hidden from the grenade.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
May? How about "it will"? There's absolutely no external visblocking brushes when in the void. If you're in the void, you can theoretically (the engine won't show them for you, but the server doesn't know, nor does it care what you can and can't see) see EVERYTHING, and therefore, players, structures, etc. Chances are, in the void, it ALSO can't count traditional units (out on a limb here) causing the lack of damage falloff as well.