Gorge Problems
Maian
Join Date: 2003-02-27 Member: 14069Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Gold
Join Date: 2003-02-27 Member: 14069Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Gold
<div class="IPBDescription">help da poor cute fatty</div> <u>Combat problems</u>
The problems are pretty obvious here:
1) Gorge isn't fun to play.
2) You can't morph back to gorge when necessary - feels very frustrating.
3) Really lengthens games (similar problem with the welder)
4) Bilebomb isn't that useful.
<u>Classic problems</u>
1) Gorge is really lacking in combat abilities. Although it's a builder class, it would be much more fun if it could also participate easily in combat. Improving its combat abilities would result in more interesting alien forces and help fix the alien victory endgame problems. It would also solve Combat problems.
2) It's too easy for marines to devastate aliens in early game by destroying gorges. This wouldn't be a problem if the game ended soon after, but it doesn't - instead, the game drags on for too long until marines inevitable win. Either the game should somehow end quickly in a marine victory, or such a strategy shouldn't be as devastating.
3) Spit is a bit redundant since healspray can do the same job. In fact, it can even be better since a single healspray can heal allies and damage enemies simultaneously.
<u>Suggestions</u>
1) Make bilebomb deal some damage to marine armor. This does 2 things: improve bilebomb in Combat; and make HA trains more counterable.
2) Improve healspray somehow, so that a gorge can heal an onos faster than (or as fast as) an onos can regen (with the regen upgrade). Healspray should also be far less potent than spit in damaging enemies. These changes would make the gorge more useful in groups and make spit less redundant.
3) Slightly increase gorge speed. This would help the gorge keep up with alien forces. Increase RT build time a bit to compensate.
4) Decrease cost of gorge slightly, so that killing gorges is no longer as devastating. Increase RT and evo chamber costs slightly to compensate. These changes may be unnecessary, since the gorge's increased speed may improve its life expectancy.
5) In Combat mode, somehow allow players to change their upgrades. This would not only allow lerks, fades, and onos to morph into gorges, but make Combat games much more dynamic. Just make sure players can't change upgrades too easily - otherwise, games would last even longer.
The gorge should still have a less than 50% chance of solo-ing LMG marines, but it should provide an important support role, besides putting up a bunch of OCs and evo chambers (which are ultimately easily taken out by seige and grenades).
These suggestions may seemed biased toward aliens, but my intention is to just make the gorge more fun and introduce new alien tactics.
The problems are pretty obvious here:
1) Gorge isn't fun to play.
2) You can't morph back to gorge when necessary - feels very frustrating.
3) Really lengthens games (similar problem with the welder)
4) Bilebomb isn't that useful.
<u>Classic problems</u>
1) Gorge is really lacking in combat abilities. Although it's a builder class, it would be much more fun if it could also participate easily in combat. Improving its combat abilities would result in more interesting alien forces and help fix the alien victory endgame problems. It would also solve Combat problems.
2) It's too easy for marines to devastate aliens in early game by destroying gorges. This wouldn't be a problem if the game ended soon after, but it doesn't - instead, the game drags on for too long until marines inevitable win. Either the game should somehow end quickly in a marine victory, or such a strategy shouldn't be as devastating.
3) Spit is a bit redundant since healspray can do the same job. In fact, it can even be better since a single healspray can heal allies and damage enemies simultaneously.
<u>Suggestions</u>
1) Make bilebomb deal some damage to marine armor. This does 2 things: improve bilebomb in Combat; and make HA trains more counterable.
2) Improve healspray somehow, so that a gorge can heal an onos faster than (or as fast as) an onos can regen (with the regen upgrade). Healspray should also be far less potent than spit in damaging enemies. These changes would make the gorge more useful in groups and make spit less redundant.
3) Slightly increase gorge speed. This would help the gorge keep up with alien forces. Increase RT build time a bit to compensate.
4) Decrease cost of gorge slightly, so that killing gorges is no longer as devastating. Increase RT and evo chamber costs slightly to compensate. These changes may be unnecessary, since the gorge's increased speed may improve its life expectancy.
5) In Combat mode, somehow allow players to change their upgrades. This would not only allow lerks, fades, and onos to morph into gorges, but make Combat games much more dynamic. Just make sure players can't change upgrades too easily - otherwise, games would last even longer.
The gorge should still have a less than 50% chance of solo-ing LMG marines, but it should provide an important support role, besides putting up a bunch of OCs and evo chambers (which are ultimately easily taken out by seige and grenades).
These suggestions may seemed biased toward aliens, but my intention is to just make the gorge more fun and introduce new alien tactics.
Comments
I agree with this. Currently, Heavy Armor is very hard to deal with unless you have a few Onos or very skilled Fades. Spores become uneffective once they put on HA, and Gorges are pretty much worthless against them as well. It wouldn't have to do very much damage to thier armor, but I think it would increase their role as a good support class.
no fun?
i dont think so
if i go gorge in combat i always take 3rd and 4th ability, adren regen sent and what else i need
now you tell me that web is useless?!?!?
you can web the whole hive room, heck the whole level
this can stop solo-jper from killigng the hive, forces marines to spend 1 upgrade fpr welders and is generally a very good support
additionally with adren you can heal quite good
bile is effective against the armory, destroy it and they even need resupply, another upgrade not spent on weapon ups...
i always have plenty to do
only when your team isnt able to push back the marines it can become frustrating, when your skulks are constanly dieing to gl-spam
but then everything is useless
i agree with this too, i also think you should be able to make more webs in combat... <!--emo&::gorge::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/pudgy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='pudgy.gif' /><!--endemo-->
you can web the whole hive room, heck the whole level... <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What servers do you play on? More fittingly, how large are they? Where I play, there is always at least 1 person with a GL. And since GLs remove webs, and unweb webbed marines, gg gorge.
And, there is a limit you know. Incase no marine trips the webs(or they are otherwise removed), you might find yourself unable to web anything at all suddenly.
And trust me, a gorge who knows what he is doing can easily deal with a GL. Either that or I am just incredily leet, and I am guessing thar aint it <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Again, smart gorge = pleanty of web left over.
All it takes is one in the door way + SoF and you are set.
SoF Lets yah know where the rines are comming (combine a gorge look out with voice comm and you get some realy nasty things, suddenly the entire team has SoF <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->)
All in all, I don't think the gorge needs boosts atm.
Healspray takes too much energy. Without adrenaline, a gorge can barely fully heal another gorge (actually I'm not sure if it can), and even with adrenaline, a gorge will slowly run out of energy.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->gorge useless in combat?
no fun?
i dont think so<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's undeniable that gorges are the most boring alien to play. Placing chambers in classic spices them up a bit. But plenty to do in combat? Yeah if you like constantly healing the hive, which I find EXTREMELY BORING.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->now you tell me that web is useless?!?!?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I never said that anywhere. However, I think webs are too troublesome from the technical perspective - the max limits on webs gets very frustrating. Webs should be replaced with another ability that helps the gorge seige capabilities. Spit, or some other gorge ability, can be modified to be the gorge's anti-JP weapon. However, this would be a drastic change, which is both unlikely and unwise this late in the beta.
1) Make bilebomb deal some damage to marine armor. This does 2 things: improve bilebomb in Combat; and make HA trains more counterable.
2) Improve healspray somehow, so that a gorge can heal an onos faster than (or as fast as) an onos can regen (with the regen upgrade). Healspray should also be far less potent than spit in damaging enemies. These changes would make the gorge more useful in groups and make spit less redundant.
3) Slightly increase gorge speed. This would help the gorge keep up with alien forces. Increase RT build time a bit to compensate.
4) Decrease cost of gorge slightly, so that killing gorges is no longer as devastating. Increase RT and evo chamber costs slightly to compensate. These changes may be unnecessary, since the gorge's increased speed may improve its life expectancy.
5) In Combat mode, somehow allow players to change their upgrades. This would not only allow lerks, fades, and onos to morph into gorges, but make Combat games much more dynamic. Just make sure players can't change upgrades too easily - otherwise, games would last even longer.
The gorge should still have a less than 50% chance of solo-ing LMG marines, but it should provide an important support role, besides putting up a bunch of OCs and evo chambers (which are ultimately easily taken out by seige and grenades).
These suggestions may seemed biased toward aliens, but my intention is to just make the gorge more fun and introduce new alien tactics. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
1. Bilebomb dealing damage to marine armor is a horrible idea. Armor is the marine's lifeforce. Without it they are toast. Bilebomb has huge range and would be an immediate effect on marines. Also, you think it would counter HA trains but in actuality it would counter lighter marines and jetpacks the most as they have the least amount of armor.
2. Healspray should heal 13 hp + 3% of target's total HP.
3. Gorge speed is fine, keeping up with other aliens isn't too much of a problem if you bhop. Bhopping gorges can also outrun marines, so again it's all good.
4. I've always wondered what it'd be like to have a build of NS where gorges are free and all aliens start with 15 res.
5. Gorges do not belong in combat.
The problem with gorges is that I know I want to be on the front lines, killing stuff and keeping my teammates alive who are behind the lines. Gorges are utterly helpless in fights. As a gorge, I don't like just the slowed down gameplay that I would miss as a skulk who saves for a fade/hive.
Gorges need something to make them more action packed IMO.
But have it so it has a limited range (is that possible?), otherwise Gorge will become the anti-turret farms before the second hive is complete.
Web is king. Once you've figured out how to use it you can lock down a marine and slowly spit him to death.. or just wait til your friendly neighborhood skulk wanders by. Two marines will probably eat you for lunch.. but hey, you're only one alien, anyway.
And remember, spit damages structures too.. not as effectively as bilebomb.. but it still works. A careful gorge can, with patience, regeneration, and a well placed vent, take out turrets and a TF with only one hive.
My only beef with the gorge is it's cost. 10 res can take a looong time to get back, and you can't outrun marines (sure, maybe bhop works, but for the majority of folks who don't happen to have that mastered it doesn't help at all)
As for your first concern: combat, gorges aren't made for combat! They're a support unit, no more. Take the worker units in other RTSes for example. Course, you could, with some micro do some damage to the enemy team with a squad of workers, but for the most part, workers need to be protected while they profit your team in some way.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
2) It's too easy for marines to devastate aliens in early game by destroying gorges. This wouldn't be a problem if the game ended soon after, but it doesn't - instead, the game drags on for too long until marines inevitable win. Either the game should somehow end quickly in a marine victory, or such a strategy shouldn't be as devastating.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes... if they're dumb enough to grab an RT too far away from the hive.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->3) Spit is a bit redundant since healspray can do the same job. In fact, it can even be better since a single healspray can heal allies and damage enemies simultaneously.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I kinda agree here. Spit CAN take an a0-a1 marine with average aim headon if needed, but all the comm has to do is drop some meds, and one marine can take on as many as THREE gorges. No idea what you could replace it with though :\.
On the other hand, I like most of your suggestions. good idea <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->. While bilebomb damaging armor is probably a bad idea... doesn't spore do the same thing?
maybe the damage to teh armor is slightly more than a wielder can repair...
that wld be fun.. bombing a marine to reduce armor and weakening them ..serving as a support unit while teh attackers can rip the them.
Gorgeing is just as fun (well actualy considerably more fun) then comming imho.
If you have problems with web caps... LEARN HOW TO WEB.
Ok:
[MINIRANT]
People SERIOUSLY need to learn how to web.
Spaming an opening with 5 strands is pointless!
The rines will see it and promptly weld/GL it.
If you place one or two webs in strategic positions (like parts of the floor that they match with) the rines will never see it comming and walk RIGHT into your webs.
If JPs start being a problem you can place your strategic web furter fowards then your JP trap (a single thread across a door way or vent opening that they have to use). Yes, they probably will knowtice it, but so long as you put it down well they will either have to stop to GL it (giving other aliens time to come in) or have their welder out. So long as the welder is out they are skulk bait.
[/MINIRANT]
nay one who thinks webs are useles dosn't know how to use em is all.
I can generaly hold down around 3 rines
And it dosn't mater what they are, so a pudgy costs 5 levels (gorge, web(2), SoF, adren). And he can take on a lvl 10.
Yah, nade spam can be anoying, but rarely are rines smart enugh to actualy target the fatty.
This also aplies for you silly people that complain about long CO games. JUST KILL THE GORGE and the hive goes down REALY fast. Again, for some reason rines never get the idea of AIMING for the pudgy in combat.....
ALSO, gorges WERE taken out of combat and then put back in (twice actualy) for a good reason, they are needed.
So, I wouldn't mind if gorges got buffed up (b/c they are all I play in CO <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->) but I honestly don't think they need em. I also don't think that they need a nerf either.
(considering implementation, I think the only difficulty would be designing the menu)
The problems are pretty obvious here:
1) Gorge isn't fun to play.
2) You can't morph back to gorge when necessary - feels very frustrating.
3) Really lengthens games (similar problem with the welder)
4) Bilebomb isn't that useful.
<u>Classic problems</u>
1) Gorge is really lacking in combat abilities. Although it's a builder class, it would be much more fun if it could also participate easily in combat. Improving it's combat abilities would result in more interesting alien forces and help fix the alien victory endgame problems. It would also solve Combat problems.
2) It's too easy for marines to devastate aliens in early game by destroying gorges. This wouldn't be a problem if the game ended soon after, but it doesn't - instead, the game drags on for too long until marines inevitable win. Either the game should somehow end quickly in a marine victory, or such a strategy shouldn't be as devastating.
3) Spit is a bit redundant since healspray can do the same job. In fact, it can even be better since a single healspray can heal allies and damage enemies simultaneously.
<u>Suggestions</u>
1) Make bilebomb deal some damage to marine armor. This does 2 things: improve bilebomb in Combat; and make HA trains more counterable.
2) Improve healspray somehow, so that a gorge can heal an onos faster than (or as fast as) an onos can regen (with the regen upgrade). Healspray should also be far less potent than spit in damaging enemies. These changes would make the gorge more useful in groups and make spit less redundant.
3) Slightly increase gorge speed. This would help the gorge keep up with alien forces. Increase RT build time a bit to compensate.
4) Decrease cost of gorge slightly, so that killing gorges is no longer as devastating. Increase RT and evo chamber costs slightly to compensate. These changes may be unnecessary, since the gorge's increased speed may improve its life expectancy.
5) In Combat mode, somehow allow players to change their upgrades. This would not only allow lerks, fades, and onos to morph into gorges, but make Combat games much more dynamic. Just make sure players can't change upgrades too easily - otherwise, games would last even longer.
The gorge should still have a less than 50% chance of solo-ing LMG marines, but it should provide an important support role, besides putting up a bunch of OCs and evo chambers (which are ultimately easily taken out by seige and grenades).
These suggestions may seemed biased toward aliens, but my intention is to just make the gorge more fun and introduce new alien tactics. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Combat "Problems"
I'm not a huge fan of combat anyways, so unless I do my usual do-nothing-but-xenocide skulk routine, I have no problem with being gorge. Not only will bile decimate the armoury pretty quickly but helps in killing the CC. Webs of course help a lot and get Focus spit, that makes each kill feel super special.
Classic "Problems"
1) Gorges are suppose to lack in combat abilities, however a player with enough skills can take on 1on1 rines anytime. It just takes bunny hopping an overconfidence from the Rine.
2) Gorges are ment to stay near the hive early in the game, and go out a bit further with a friendly skulk or two near by, not leave the hive at the begining and go set up station accsess
3) Health spray does not do the same job. It takes what, 3 spits to kill a a0-a1 rine? While taking a good 5-7 seconds of H spray to kill same leveled rine.
Suggestions
1) It's been suggested since 2.0, and no, it would ruin the balance. And I dont know about you, but an HA train vs a Gorge and some back up = "Lets shoot the gorge first" = dead gorge
2) I've never found any problem in the year and a half of NS in the time it takes for an Onos to heal when it does its "hit and run" thing. If the onos healed faster, it would probably hurt the balance, as onos would be comin round that corner a lot faster
3) Gorges arent ment to be on the front lines until later in the game, when you have celerity. Thus redunant
4) This just doesnt make sense, as decreasing the price of a gorge, yet increasing the price of chambers/RTs would just keep everything the same
5) huh?
Conclusion: Gorges are fun and are an important support role.
1) Gorges are suppose to lack in combat abilities, however a player with enough skills can take on 1on1 rines anytime. It just takes bunny hopping an overconfidence from the Rine.
2) Gorges are ment to stay near the hive early in the game, and go out a bit further with a friendly skulk or two near by, not leave the hive at the begining and go set up station accsess
3) Health spray does not do the same job. It takes what, 3 spits to kill a a0-a1 rine? While taking a good 5-7 seconds of H spray to kill same leveled rine.
Suggestions
1) It's been suggested since 2.0, and no, it would ruin the balance. And I dont know about you, but an HA train vs a Gorge and some back up = "Lets shoot the gorge first" = dead gorge
2) I've never found any problem in the year and a half of NS in the time it takes for an Onos to heal when it does its "hit and run" thing. If the onos healed faster, it would probably hurt the balance, as onos would be comin round that corner a lot faster
3) Gorges arent ment to be on the front lines until later in the game, when you have celerity. Thus redunant
4) This just doesnt make sense, as decreasing the price of a gorge, yet increasing the price of chambers/RTs would just keep everything the same
5) huh?
Conclusion: Gorges are fun and are an important support role.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Criticizing Thrillhouses criticisms, butchering the English language whenever possible.
Classic Problems:
"1") Not so much in the latest beta. See "3".
"2") Can't disagree with that.
"3") They halved spit damage in the beta. It takes about 6 spits to kill an armor 0 marine now. Spit would be more fun if they put the damage back to where it was before, reduced the energy cost, or made the travel speed much faster. Right now, every single little spit glob counts in a one on one fight due to their damage/cost, while being extremely hard to aim due to their slow speed.
Suggestions
"1") The current bilebomb is great as it is. The range was very much improved since 2.01. It's a powerful tool now, if you manage to waddle into an unmanned marine outpost with adrenaline.
"2") If gorges could heal higher lifeforms more effectively, it would slightly reduce the need to get defense chambers early. The trick would be making it so that an improved healspray and regen wouldn't stack, because both at once might be too powerful. I would love to see defense chambers at the last hive be made more viable.
"3") I don't think gorges are meant to be on the front lines of combat, period. If you get celerity, you can't get adrenaline, which is necessary with the high energy cost of gorge attacks. Possible exception: immediately before aliens win.
"4") It wouldn't keep everything the same. It would actually be much worse for permagorges.
I don't want gorges to become too powerful, as I go marine often, but I would like to see them become slightly more useful to the alien team in between chamber drops. A boost to the effectiveness of healspray or spit would help. If I could support my team better as I waited for my res to slowly build up, I would have more fun as a gorge.
6 for level 0 armor, 11 for level 3 armor <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I propose some idea
-The gorge can do same thing of skull...climbing everywhere for give a advantage to gorge when he want run away or do some strategique healing points.
-The health spray heal more for different armor range and infeste the marine (same thing for the medic in TFC) but the infestation never kill target but he move more slowly and the hp drop for X%.(That's will be useful in co_map)
-The bilebomb damage only armor (that's stupide? no the gorge will be more strategique in co_map and they will be more useful when they help for a rush).
That's my idea for gorge but i believe the gorge is really useful in the game but with this suggestion (in this subject) they are more dangerous and they will able protect a place much better than before.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->1. Bilebomb dealing damage to marine armor is a horrible idea. Armor is the marine's lifeforce. Without it they are toast. Bilebomb has huge range and would be an immediate effect on marines. Also, you think it would counter HA trains but in actuality it would counter lighter marines and jetpacks the most as they have the least amount of armor.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, bilebomb should have some effect besides damaging structures. I can revise the idea so that it takes off a percentage of armor.
Alternative: bilebomb prevents welding for a couple seconds.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->3. Gorge speed is fine, keeping up with other aliens isn't too much of a problem if you bhop. Bhopping gorges can also outrun marines, so again it's all good.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What if those other aliens also bhop?
Thansal:
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->People SERIOUSLY need to learn how to web.
Spaming an opening with 5 strands is pointless!<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I know how to web. My teammates may not know. Should I be at fault for my teammates' newbieness?
.Thrillhouse.:
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I'm not a huge fan of combat anyways, so unless I do my usual do-nothing-but-xenocide skulk routine, I have no problem with being gorge. Not only will bile decimate the armoury pretty quickly but helps in killing the CC. Webs of course help a lot and get Focus spit, that makes each kill feel super special.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Any alien can decimate the armory quickly. Besides, taking out the armory is only effective when the majority of marines don't have resupply yet.
Bilebomb is far less useful in combat than in classic.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->1) Gorges are suppose to lack in combat abilities, however a player with enough skills can take on 1on1 rines anytime. It just takes bunny hopping an overconfidence from the Rine.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
By combat abilities, I mean abilities that allow the gorge to participate in combat. The gorge combat abilities are support, not direct, so of course the gorge should usually lose 1 on 1.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->2) Gorges are ment to stay near the hive early in the game, and go out a bit further with a friendly skulk or two near by, not leave the hive at the begining and go set up station accsess<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's not the point. I'm not disputing that the aliens are at fault or the marines have a valid strategy. It's that when aliens are doomed to lose, they should lose soon, not 20 minutes afterwards! There are other scenarios that cause the same situation (but outside scope of this topic): aliens fail to counter electricity strat, aliens lose 3rd hive to fully teched marines. Basically, if you're going to lose, you shouldn't be forced to play until you lose. F4-ing doesn't fix the problem, since it just causes frustration.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->3) Health spray does not do the same job. It takes what, 3 spits to kill a a0-a1 rine? While taking a good 5-7 seconds of H spray to kill same leveled rine.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Healspray is easy to aim (nearly always hits) and can both heal multiple allies and multiple enemies in a single spray.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->1) It's been suggested since 2.0, and no, it would ruin the balance. And I dont know about you, but an HA train vs a Gorge and some back up = "Lets shoot the gorge first" = dead gorge<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's why I also suggested increasing gorge speed. Suggestions 1 to 3 are geared toward making the gorge more combat-oriented.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->2) I've never found any problem in the year and a half of NS in the time it takes for an Onos to heal when it does its "hit and run" thing. If the onos healed faster, it would probably hurt the balance, as onos would be comin round that corner a lot faster<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It would actually help balance in classic. Combat is a different story, but that's another problem - the underlying problem is the different natures of Classic and Combat, and that's outside the scope of this thread.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->3) Gorges arent ment to be on the front lines until later in the game, when you have celerity. Thus redunant<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Why aren't gorges not meant to be in the front lines? What about lerks? People initially said that lerks are supposed to be 100% support, but that's definitely not the case now. Now the lerk is more fun to play. So should the gorge.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->4) This just doesnt make sense, as decreasing the price of a gorge, yet increasing the price of chambers/RTs would just keep everything the same<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not it won't be the same. Gorge would be ~5 res, RT ~17 res. It would be advantageous to temporary gorges. It's balanced out by being disadvantageous to longterm gorges.
Many people simply don't see the power of the gorge. Have you ever tried a cara/adren bilebomb rush on marine start with three or more gorges? I've actually won games against very good marine teams with that strategy. Bilebomb is very powerful and devastating against bases. In combat not so much, but you'd be suprised how much damage one gorge can do against the cc.
Healspray needs to be tweaked for higher lifeforms. It's the same problem as the beta 2 hive healing for skulks, healspray is just worthless for onos.
It's true that gorge in combat isn't fun for most people. (I say most because there are those who enjoy it) The problem with that is if the aliens don't have a gorge they will almost certainly lose an extended game.
I've always been a supporter of "hambone mode" in combat. That's where every life you get to respend your levels. I really think that employing this as the primary combat mode would solve a multitude of problems, among which would be the lack of a gorge.
You could do the same for combat, making gorges/skulk free so you could go back n forth. Then all the super xeno skulks could web too. Would help more people consider gorging.