Multi Level Commanding
schkorpio
I can mspaint Join Date: 2003-05-23 Member: 16635Members
I can mspaint Join Date: 2003-05-23 Member: 16635Members
<div class="IPBDescription">to make makes more intricate</div>why limit the maps to a duke nukem 3d style layout - surely we could have a multi level maps where commander uses the mouse wheel to move between 2 or more levels?
yes it would require a bit more work from the mappers to flag where levels actually are.
or why not have it that the levels on a map are displayed next to each other for the commander, so that he/she can scroll left/right/up/down as they can now, but if you scroll far enough it will show the next level
yes it would require a bit more work from the mappers to flag where levels actually are.
or why not have it that the levels on a map are displayed next to each other for the commander, so that he/she can scroll left/right/up/down as they can now, but if you scroll far enough it will show the next level
Comments
Have you all ever played GRAW?
<img src="http://xzianthia.net/images/GRAWwaypoints.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
I especially love that you can make a chain of commands and even give a FoV direction. Granted it's be too hard and impractical to have individuals like this, but that's not at all true if it's per squad. For example, you could command different squad to take paths and one squad could lay down coverfire while another moves in for an objective. This form of much more precise commanding and time-space management is often vital to success, and would be great both for competitive and public play.
Make NS2 more squad oriented and promoting of teamwork and fluidity of non-verbal HUD commands via:<ul><li>Can "zoom" in/out a bit with the mousewheel when in commander mode</li><li>Can choose command types: ie: move, attack, cover, stop/guard, as well as the regular things that exist like clicking on a structure creates a "build structure" waypoint or a damaged building / weldable with a "weld target"</li><li>Can chain commands, indicating a series of steps or a particular path to be taken</li><li>Can indicate direction with by clicking to create waypoint and draging cursor in the direction of the desired FoV while clicked</li></ul>Commanding right now is inefficient and cumbersome to what it could be. This would progress things by light-years ahead of where they currently reside at kind of weak. (borderline just sucking) Please, <i>seriously</i> consider this.
[*]Can chain commands, indicating a series of steps or a particular path to be taken
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this would be very useful in showing newbies how to get around a map, for example going to a hive from marine start. instead of one far away waypoint which the nub is bound to get lost trying to get to, you could put one at every main crossroad/intersection. as soon as he steps on one mini waypoint, the next one lights up...
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Exactly! One of the many possible uses. I would just like to a system of improved controls. In fact, the Aegis Advanced Targeting and Logistics Systems which often links in UAV drones like the Cypher already do a function just like this now! And NS is supposedly set in the future? Pff! What a bunch of sucky, crappy, piece-of-**** intel system they must have if it's only capable of what current technology is capable of.
If you say this makes a comm's job harder you are dead wrong. Better management, better organization, ability (not requirement) to get more complex if needed, etc. all makes the logistics a <i>hell</i> of a lot easier for all the multitasking the commander already has to do. You don't have to explain things over the microphone all the time which actually makes you take time away from paying attention to other things and cover up you marine's ears which would otherwise be trying to listen for aliens incomming with your annoying voice.
In many ways this could make the commander's job more fun as now you can actually create real-time strategic movements on the fly and silently. When you need to med with precision you can mousewheel your zoom in a bit, or zoom out when you are trying to see if your soldiers are being flanked. Wouldn't it be fun to tell your artillery (GL-ers) to lay down cover fire while you have waypointed two seperate squads to flank a group of enemies with precision because you have given them all precise waypoints? And how helpful would that be as a marine to get this data visually with out a whole lot of annoying chatter so you can't hear that skulk hiding in the vent above? Imagine competitive play with a system like this, now you have a really fast, knowledgeable commander who can get a lot more strategic with his team.
Remember <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?s=7346547622553892864&showtopic=46029" target="_blank">SSTP</a>? Well now it'd be possible to actually waypoint that.
Great idea, being more precise in the command position would greatly improve the situation. Time for that command chair AI and UI to get a good clean update!
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I'm afraid you couldn't avoid tacky visual clutter with that method; there is already way too much sprite crap on the screen. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" />
It's not a bad suggestion at all, but I think I'd prefer it to work more like this:
<!--quoteo(post=1626607:date=May 14 2007, 01:23 AM:name=Buzzou)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Buzzou @ May 14 2007, 01:23 AM) [snapback]1626607[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->as soon as he steps on one mini waypoint, the next one lights up...
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But more specifically make it proximity triggered instead of the current exact location system.
The trick would be indicating direction. The mini-map the waypoint if it has been click-dragged to indicate direction would show a green or blue FoV coverage area. And perhaps on the main screen it'd show up on a directional compass.
Again you could do this for individual soldier if you want to, but when you bind a squad and switch between then with the slot 1-5 keys, you see the waypointing. Excellent for a quick reference on what you told which group to do. (and hold them accountable for it)
And while talking about it, color coding could really help organize things:
<b><!--coloro:#33CC00--><span style="color:#33CC00"><!--/coloro-->Green<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> for "move to / build target" waypoints
<!--coloro:#CC0000--><span style="color:#CC0000"><!--/coloro-->Red<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> for "attack target" waypoints
<!--coloro:#0000CC--><span style="color:#0000CC"><!--/coloro-->Blue<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> for "cover fire or defend building/soldier" waypoints
<!--coloro:#FFCC00--><span style="color:#FFCC00"><!--/coloro-->Yellow<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> for "weld/build target" waypoints</b>
You jump in chair. Press the select all soldiers key (default "m") and put a red <!--coloro:#CC0000--><span style="color:#CC0000"><!--/coloro-->attack target<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> wapoint at where you think the hive is for all, a green <!--coloro:#33CC00--><span style="color:#33CC00"><!--/coloro-->move to with a FoV direction<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> waypoint for squad 1 indicating they should keep and eye on the vent followed by gets a green <!--coloro:#33CC00--><span style="color:#33CC00"><!--/coloro-->build<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> waypoint for the RT you just dropped, and for the base monkey a blue <!--coloro:#0000CC--><span style="color:#0000CC"><!--/coloro-->defend target<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> waypoint on the IP followed buy a blue <!--coloro:#0000CC--><span style="color:#0000CC"><!--/coloro-->cover fire directional<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> waypoint saying that he should be peaking around that corner to watch for incomming to base. You hear alien heading towards squad 1 from behind so you press the slot 1 key to select squad 1 and issue a blue <!--coloro:#0000CC--><span style="color:#0000CC"><!--/coloro-->cover fire order with a direction<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--> and perhaps say "incomming". (this is much faster you see, and allows you marines to know exactly where to look and expect hostiles while allowing your whole team to be able to listen for the pitter-patter of skulk claws instead of your voice trying to explain what's where) That whole thing could just span 10 seconds of game time and you would not have time to chat all that and expect to have had the same level comprehension and effectiveness.
Note: <b>These new orders (waypoints) appear as the current one is accomplished, and the sprite clutter will disappear as they are "acknowledged" or accomplished.</b>
I think that being able to place different types of waypoints everywhere might be overwhelming for the new players as comms. Useful, yes. But it just seems...less user-friendly to me, really.
I think that being able to place different types of waypoints everywhere might be overwhelming for the new players as comms. Useful, yes. But it just seems...less user-friendly to me, really.
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I was trying to show complexity with that example, don't worry if ultra-basic is all you are competent or experienced enough handle it'll still be just as easy. It's actually more user-friendly and efficient. If you want to still be basic, just select all, press "F1" for the "<!--coloro:#33CC00--><span style="color:#33CC00"><!--/coloro-->move<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->" type of waypoint, and click to place, and press "F5" to execute. That is NOT hard -- gimme a break. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" /> And if you want to do more? You can; before you couldn't do jack.
What can a command actually "do" to interact with the world he's viewing right now in ol' NS?
select a structure, left click to drop
select a equip/resupply, left click to drop
select a building, click or press key start research
select an individual soldier or a group of soldiers, CTRL+<i>number</i> (number = slot 1 through slot 5; and it's buggy at times)
I was trying to show complexity with that example, don't worry if ultra-basic is all you are competent or experienced enough handle it'll still be just as easy. It's actually more user-friendly and efficient. If you want to still be basic, just select all, press "F1" for the "<!--coloro:#33CC00--><span style="color:#33CC00"><!--/coloro-->move<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->" type of waypoint, and click to place, and press "F5" to execute. That is NOT hard -- gimme a break. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tounge.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":p" border="0" alt="tounge.gif" /> And if you want to do more? You can; before you couldn't do jack.
What can a command actually "do" to interact with the world he's viewing right now in ol' NS?
select a structure, left click to drop
select a equip/resupply, left click to drop
select a building, click or press key start research
select an individual soldier or a group of soldiers, CTRL+<i>number</i> (number = slot 1 through slot 5; and it's buggy at times)
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Ohhhh....Whoops. I mis-read that. Badly.
Yeah, ok, after I'm done slapping myself in the face here, yeah. Good idea. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/confused-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="???" border="0" alt="confused-fix.gif" />
Yeah, ok, after I'm done slapping myself in the face here, yeah. Good idea. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/confused-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="???" border="0" alt="confused-fix.gif" />
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No worries. Thank you for your approval. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />