New Alien Upgrade Style
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Join Date: 2007-08-27 Member: 62018
Join Date: 2007-08-27 Member: 62018
<div class="IPBDescription">(Quite Short - GREAT Idea)</div>Okay, in NS1. As we all know, you pick an upgrade, pop into a little egg, and it upgrades.
What im proposing is to make it a little more complex, and realistic.
For this example, the alien team has:
<!--coloro:#F4A460--><span style="color:#F4A460"><!--/coloro-->2 MC
3 DC
1 SC<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
I think its a bit silly having to egg to say, onos.
Then egg for Regen
Then egg for Celerity
Then egg for Cloaking
A bit silly?
What im proposing is, say you pick Celerity.
You wont go into an egg. A little progress bar will commence.
It will take about 20 seconds per chamber bar.
So to get maximum celerity, it will take 1 minute to <!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->FULLY <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->evolve.
<!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro-->BUT<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->,
As the evolution upgrades, you will gradually get faster and faster.
Alternatively, it could just gain the benefits as it peaks at each chamber. (You'll get what i mean below)
<img src="http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q190/jozsa/upgrades.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
This picture shows what i mean.
The above half is with the listed chambers from above.
Yellow Bar = Unused Trait
Green Bar = Used Trait
When you pick the upgrade, the title will change, and it will start the progress
So in this picture, the alien would doing the upgrades would currently have:
- Level 1 cloaking fully upgraded
- Regeneration upgrading, almost at Level 2 capacity.
- Celerity upgrading, about half of Level 1 capacity.
Also upgrading two things at once should slow down the speed.
- One at a time = 20 seconds / Chamber Bar (60 seconds for max)
- Two at a time = 25 seconds / Chamber Bar (75 seconds for max)
- Three at a time = 30 second / Chamber Bar (90 seconds for max)
In this way, if you spawn, pick all 3 upgrades, 1 minute later, you would have them all completely done.
Providing one doesn't finish earlier due to less chambers of that type, in which case the others would then speed up.
Also, on this example, say Regeneration finished, then a Defence Chamber died.
It would devolve back down to two chamber effect. Not instantly.
All of this would give the aliens more of a sense of '<!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro-->growth<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->'
Let me know what you all think?
I think its a great idea. And would love to see it implemented.
What im proposing is to make it a little more complex, and realistic.
For this example, the alien team has:
<!--coloro:#F4A460--><span style="color:#F4A460"><!--/coloro-->2 MC
3 DC
1 SC<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->
I think its a bit silly having to egg to say, onos.
Then egg for Regen
Then egg for Celerity
Then egg for Cloaking
A bit silly?
What im proposing is, say you pick Celerity.
You wont go into an egg. A little progress bar will commence.
It will take about 20 seconds per chamber bar.
So to get maximum celerity, it will take 1 minute to <!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->FULLY <!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->evolve.
<!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro-->BUT<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->,
As the evolution upgrades, you will gradually get faster and faster.
Alternatively, it could just gain the benefits as it peaks at each chamber. (You'll get what i mean below)
<img src="http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q190/jozsa/upgrades.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
This picture shows what i mean.
The above half is with the listed chambers from above.
Yellow Bar = Unused Trait
Green Bar = Used Trait
When you pick the upgrade, the title will change, and it will start the progress
So in this picture, the alien would doing the upgrades would currently have:
- Level 1 cloaking fully upgraded
- Regeneration upgrading, almost at Level 2 capacity.
- Celerity upgrading, about half of Level 1 capacity.
Also upgrading two things at once should slow down the speed.
- One at a time = 20 seconds / Chamber Bar (60 seconds for max)
- Two at a time = 25 seconds / Chamber Bar (75 seconds for max)
- Three at a time = 30 second / Chamber Bar (90 seconds for max)
In this way, if you spawn, pick all 3 upgrades, 1 minute later, you would have them all completely done.
Providing one doesn't finish earlier due to less chambers of that type, in which case the others would then speed up.
Also, on this example, say Regeneration finished, then a Defence Chamber died.
It would devolve back down to two chamber effect. Not instantly.
All of this would give the aliens more of a sense of '<!--coloro:#2E8B57--><span style="color:#2E8B57"><!--/coloro-->growth<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc-->'
Let me know what you all think?
I think its a great idea. And would love to see it implemented.
Comments
I don't see how upgrading a beings atributes is more "realistic", by using a progress bar vs. egging. Not that it has anything to do with "how things look" [actually seeing an egg], but I believe the process would be just as "realistic" either way. An alien could evolve by morphing their bodies, but that may/may not require gestating. Think about butterflies, dragon flies and snakes. Many species on Earth go into cocoons and shed their old bodies when they grow and/or change.
If anything, a more realistic way to show an alien upgrading [and I think a good idea] would be an egg sack that takes 15 seconds to slowly desolve after the alien has left it, OR a skin left over from the old alien body which withers away quickly. It would suggest evolution, and just like the movies, scare the hell out of people [seeing old skins laying around a chamber, or a freshly hatched egg desolving in a dark corner]. I think it could make moments a little more scary during a long pause where you have not seen an alien for a while.
Besides, I like smokin eggs. hehe It's like the cream filling inside the Twinkie!
Yes, i was thinking this myself as i wrote it.
I think different lifeforms should take longer to evolve the upgrades.
Skulk would only take 30 seconds maybe, for Level 3
...
Onos would take up to a good few minutes for Level 3
Plus yes, i think more hives should decrease the speed a little.
I think itd be smoother.
With that said though, I still think it's cool, and might be a good choice in NS2 to increase the Gradualistic-Intuitive feel of the game.
His mum said it was great <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
so the aliens wouldnt egg, but the upgrades just take effect slowly over time?
Imagine your in a scrim, your team has just got the 3 mcs and the lerks up. The lerk NEEDS the mcs almost immediately to be able to spore the marines a the alien rts adequately, the same for the fade when the 2nd hive has been dropped, a naked fade and a naked lerk arent much good at all. The time should be fro 1min to at most 20seconds imho.
But yeah this idea isnt bad tbh.
With that said though, I still think it's cool, and might be a good choice in NS2 to increase the Gradualistic-Intuitive feel of the game.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yeah, i didnt go into balance.
As i said in another reply,
Skulks would evolve things MUCH faster
(But even still, taking a while as a skulk would promote stalking/parasiting/getting into a good position before you attack)
Whereas Onos' could take a fair few minutes.
Why did you call your own idea great?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
His mum said it was great <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/nerd-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::nerdy::" border="0" alt="nerd-fix.gif" />
so the aliens wouldnt egg, but the upgrades just take effect slowly over time?
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Its true <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
Shes my only friend.
Imagine your in a scrim, your team has just got the 3 mcs and the lerks up. The lerk NEEDS the mcs almost immediately to be able to spore the marines a the alien rts adequately, the same for the fade when the 2nd hive has been dropped, a naked fade and a naked lerk arent much good at all. The time should be fro 1min to at most 20seconds imho.
But yeah this idea isnt bad tbh.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yep as i said, the times could easily be balanced.
Different Lifeforms = Diff times.
I'm just getting the concept across <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
I'm glad you like it!
I just really wanted to see some very unique Kharaa running around.
Next up, doesn't the idea imply that the hive barrier to chambers would be removed? Or what would be the point? At The Moment, the current assumption is one type of chamber per hive. If that were to change in some way, that makes your "growth" bar seem even better. I'm hoping there will be like 7 different chambers, then 2 chamber types per hive, so that chambers would be mixed up a lot from one match to the next. Variety is the spice of life.
The way chambers are handled does need to change, so I applaud the idea on that, it just needs some ironing out before I could vote "yes". I rather like the multiple eggs, so would there be a way to keep that and use "growth" bars?
But those can be adjusted later. The basic idea is very cool i think; because egging 4 times to go fade and then fully upgrade is silly-looking, and actually a detriment to gameplay IMO, escpecially in larger games where marines always seem to have the upper hand. Its time consuming; if you die as a fade with two upgrades, you could spend 2 minutes before your back out there as a fade again (assuming you have the res for another fade) by the time the spawn quene is cleared, you have evolved as fade, and then upgraded two or three times.
Atleast in this idea, after the inital gestating, your free to roam around when your upgrades are being processed.
This would look really cool with the extra visual factors that people are requesting; IE, if you can see the upgrade actually slowing comming into other players models. Like slowly having spikes form on the skulks back if there upgrading too focus.
Once a form has its three upgrades, and has waited for them to upgrade, they are permanent, and stay at the max level. However, you may elect to give up a trait for a new one. For instance, if you're an onos and you get regen, adren, and focus, and wait X time, then you have 3 level 3 abilities. Suppose you die. You re-gestate to onos, and keep the abilities. However, you decide that you want redemption instead of regen. You would press a button and ditch regeneration, and then begin to evolve redemption instead, and then wait for it to finish.
If you were killed in the middle of an upgrade, however, the progress would go to the next level down. For instance, if you have level 1 cloaking as a skulk and it's half way to level 2 and you get shotgunned, you have to wait for it to get to level 2 all the way from the level 1 mark. If you were killed before a level 1 max wa reached, you would have to re-select the upgrade.
I just really wanted to see some very unique Kharaa running around.
Next up, doesn't the idea imply that the hive barrier to chambers would be removed? Or what would be the point? At The Moment, the current assumption is one type of chamber per hive. If that were to change in some way, that makes your "growth" bar seem even better. I'm hoping there will be like 7 different chambers, then 2 chamber types per hive, so that chambers would be mixed up a lot from one match to the next. Variety is the spice of life.
The way chambers are handled does need to change, so I applaud the idea on that, it just needs some ironing out before I could vote "yes". I rather like the multiple eggs, so would there be a way to keep that and use "growth" bars?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Pretty easily actually.
Just have the spikes grow out of the model, as an independant thing.
In the same way a marine with a different gun, isnt a different marine model.
No. Hives and chambers still work together. I never said anything about hives. In this example, there are 3 hives... or was....
The little bar on the side wouldnt show up, until the chamber was built, so i dont understand your point about 7 chambers not working with it.
Itd work fine.
Not to mention youd still egg to gestate forms.
But those can be adjusted later. The basic idea is very cool i think; because egging 4 times to go fade and then fully upgrade is silly-looking, and actually a detriment to gameplay IMO, escpecially in larger games where marines always seem to have the upper hand. Its time consuming; if you die as a fade with two upgrades, you could spend 2 minutes before your back out there as a fade again (assuming you have the res for another fade) by the time the spawn quene is cleared, you have evolved as fade, and then upgraded two or three times.
Atleast in this idea, after the inital gestating, your free to roam around when your upgrades are being processed.
This would look really cool with the extra visual factors that people are requesting; IE, if you can see the upgrade actually slowing comming into other players models. Like slowly having spikes form on the skulks back if there upgrading too focus.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yep yep, im glad you like it.
And as ive said a few times.
Upgrade times would certainly need some playing with.
Read a few of my other replies for ideas.
Once a form has its three upgrades, and has waited for them to upgrade, they are permanent, and stay at the max level. However, you may elect to give up a trait for a new one. For instance, if you're an onos and you get regen, adren, and focus, and wait X time, then you have 3 level 3 abilities. Suppose you die. You re-gestate to onos, and keep the abilities. However, you decide that you want redemption instead of regen. You would press a button and ditch regeneration, and then begin to evolve redemption instead, and then wait for it to finish.
If you were killed in the middle of an upgrade, however, the progress would go to the next level down. For instance, if you have level 1 cloaking as a skulk and it's half way to level 2 and you get shotgunned, you have to wait for it to get to level 2 all the way from the level 1 mark. If you were killed before a level 1 max wa reached, you would have to re-select the upgrade.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
How would you stop players from continuously changing upgrades?
Itd actually be pretty easy?
Simple progress bar,
Say it goes from a value of 0 to 300
Call this x, which will increment on a regular basis, depending on time decided.
Celerity
Max Speed = Base Speed + 0.6x
Regen
Health Gained = 10 + ( MaxHealth / 10 ) * ( x / 150 )
and so on.
Shouldnt be a big deal.
They wouldn't get many bonuses if their stuff wasn't even level 1, now would they?
UW created the freaking commander interface in the HL1 engine. They can program anything.
Nuff said. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/marine.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::marine::" border="0" alt="marine.gif" /> Besides, if all of this LUA stuff there talking about is true, it would be even simpler than changing around the gestation times and stuff in NS1. They could do it on the fly.
Okay, but everyones saying 1 minute is too long for a gradual upgrade. Which isnt even that long.
Itd give aliens a big advantage.
ie. Lerks chagning from SoF gasses to focus biters
or Onos changing from Celerity Carapace to Adren Regen support stomper.
Nuff said. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/marine.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="::marine::" border="0" alt="marine.gif" /> Besides, if all of this LUA stuff there talking about is true, it would be even simpler than changing around the gestation times and stuff in NS1. They could do it on the fly.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agreed, it wouldnt be hard at all.
Heck, i suck at programming and i could probably do it.
Itd give aliens a big advantage.
ie. Lerks chagning from SoF gasses to focus biters
or Onos changing from Celerity Carapace to Adren Regen support stomper.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You still aren't getting it.
Lerks that change from SoF to focus biters? SoF would be gone, and he'd be waiting a while before his focus was anything to even consider a threat. In the time it would take for the alien to change effectively, the marines could recognize and counter.